Bionicle 2015 Discussion

[Dorek]

So Eurobricks is also giving away tickets to NYCC oooooh what could it meeeeeean.

(probably nothing)

[Aethersprite]

So Eurobricks is also giving away tickets to NYCC oooooh what could it meeeeeean.

(probably nothing)

BZP has 12 tickets to give out, while EB only has 6! OMG! Bionicle confirmed! /sarcasm

On a more serious note, perhaps it's due to the fact that EB reserved some for its (many more) admins, who knows. But it's nice to see other Lego sites get invited as well, perhaps we were all mistaken and BZP just happened to announce its giveaway earlier than other sites. (FBTB doesn't seem to have gotten them, though...)

[DuckBricks]

I assume that the small Spiders shoot the price up by about 2-3 Euro, as the equivalents of this year's mini-Heroes. Seems like we went from 2008's "ensure there's inner conflict inside each wave" (3 Toa vs 3 Makuta, Heroes and Villains mixed, etc) to 2014 "ensure there's conflict inside each set (Beasts vs mini-Heroes, Defenders vs Skull Spiders, etc..) as it's been the norm in System sets for years. I guess it eats up some of the main model's budget, especially on the Defenders. Still better than the awful piece-to-quantity ratio of 2008-2010 (it got only slightly better with the 1.0 Heroes).

Yeah... I guess that's LEGO's way of assuring that if a child only buys one set, he/she can still battle with 2 opponents...

[Jakura Nuva]

Yeah... I guess that's LEGO's way of assuring that if a child only buys one set, he/she can still battle with 2 opponents...

You say that like its a bad thing! Personally, I enjoy sets like that. It ensures that I don't have to buy more than one, and that's something I hope they'll feature in more sets in the future.

It seems strange, though - you'd think Lego wouldn't do that, so they could sell more products.

I count 33 pieces on the Jungle Protector, at least.

BTW, how the heck can you count the pieces? Whatever program you're using to view these, I need to know.

[Mesonak]

BTW, how the heck can you count the pieces? Whatever program you're using to view these, I need to know.

The Protectors aren't exactly rocket science as far as discerning their complexity is concerned (except the Earth and Ice ones).

[Jakura Nuva]

The Protectors aren't exactly rocket science as far as discerning their complexity is concerned (except the Earth and Ice ones).

Eh... my iPad doesn't do it justice. Thanks for the image, though :P

[Aanchir]

While after almost four years Ninjago may have surpassed BIONICLE, I highly doubt about Legends of Chima.

It's a mystery the reason LEGO is so reluctant to make public the sales numbers of its franchises.

It's no mystery at all. What incentive could they possibly have for giving their competitors explicit tips on what works and what doesn't? It's not like they have any public shareholders who have to be kept in the loop. And as much as we fans would LIKE to know how our favorite themes compare to one another, none of us need to, and I imagine none of us are going to stop being fans just because the LEGO Group keeps that information from us.

Nothing is being made more expensive. $10 for smaller sets and $20 for Titans has been the standard ever since 2012. The only price "increase" we're getting is the Toa probably being priced $15, but that's not really an increase because the Legends of Chima CHI figures as well as the recent Invasion from Below sets all are priced at that point.

Such is the trade-off of a higher piece count. :P

Actually the small sets in 2012 were just $9 each. Though that's not a big difference.

Multiples of $4 wouldn't make sense to me. Stepping back to $8 for the Defenders? That could be plausible. After all, the 2011 heroes were around that price, and the Defenders don't look TOO much more complex than those.

But stepping back to $12 for the mid-size sets? Mid-size sets were $13 for five years before they were bumped up to $15 dollars. So I can't see the LEGO Group dropping them to below their 2008 price. If they found that $13 was too expensive for typical buyers, they'd have dropped those sets' price years ago, but instead they actually raised it as of this year.

I'm a bit conflicted about the price points as well. The new Toa appear to be roughly Toa Metru sized, or maybe Toa Inika sized in the case of the larger ones. I would kind of prefer them to be Toa Mata or Toa Nuva sized like the smaller Breakout and Brain Attack heroes, mostly for sentimental reasons. I thought it was really cool when the 2.0 and 3.0 heroes reset things to around those proportions, and was not super-thrilled with how tall the mid-size heroes of the Breakout series ended up. Still, higher price counts should hopefully come with greater complexity and greater piece counts, not just greater height.

Also, I was initially worried that with larger Toa, it would be difficult for any villain sets to really measure up effectively. Hero Factory and BIONICLE generally had very few sets higher than the $20 price point, except for larger vehicles, and we haven't even seen a lot of those since Hero Factory came around. But the larger number of sets for BIONICLE's initial wave gives me some hope that it will end up like a lot of other LEGO themes, with the summer wave bringing an assortment of sets at higher price points to supplement the smaller sets from the first half of the year.

Truly, when Witch Doctor was first released, I was not terribly fond of him. I felt his towering height was overkill compared to the Toa Mata sized heroes, and that his elaborate design would not do a lot to provide a template for future CCBS titans. Even though I now recognize that Witch Doctor was a beautiful set, I guess I wasn't entirely wrong on either count. But with taller Toa comes the possibility of larger and more elaborate sets once again, and the possibility excites me.

Edited September 2, 2014 by Aanchir

[Clone 01354 Productions]

I have given up trying to figure out the image. Every time someone says they see something new, i can't find it. And some things, like the "Mata Nui spirit" are just plain dumb. Analyzing this photo is a dead horse. We have killed the horse, brought him back to life, and then beat him to death again. I think that we have analyzed every aspect of the photo, so why don't we talk about the things that are still important: the story.

The defining factor of Bionicle was its deep story; do we think that the story will be dumbed down? Will it be made simpler, and more action-oriented, rather than focus on morals and lessons? I really hope not....from what I hear (I don't watch the shows), Ninjago has a pretty good story, so I hope that Lego will keep Bionicle the way we once knew it: story oriented. And who will be the main villain; I think we have all agreed, reluctantly or not, on a reboot, so will they still use Makuta? (Or Teridax; I hate how they made Makuta a species name, so that the line "I am the Makuta" is now "I am a Makuta.")

[DOTM Shockwave]

Speaking of that image, I'm currently looking at it, and it might be my mind seeing what it wants to see, but I see Lewa's Miru resembling the Phantoka verison of the mask.

[Clone 01354 Productions]

I thought it actually resembled Onua Mata's mask.

[dviddy]

BZP has 12 tickets to give out, while EB only has 6! OMG! Bionicle confirmed! /sarcasm

On a more serious note, perhaps it's due to the fact that EB reserved some for its (many more) admins, who knows. But it's nice to see other Lego sites get invited as well, perhaps we were all mistaken and BZP just happened to announce its giveaway earlier than other sites. (FBTB doesn't seem to have gotten them, though...)

BZP received more than the other sites (yes, I said sites, there are two more), and received them earlier than the other sites. I can confirm this. Though EB saying they have six is interesting, we were told it would be five.

[SneakySqeaky]

I think those of us in the states can expect the $9.99-$14.99 for the Protectors and Toa respectively as we've been getting the past couple years. Nothing seen so far appears to warrant the titan price point of $24.99

I count 33 pieces on the Jungle Protector, at least. Based on nowadays prices for small sets, $10 for the Protectors seems likely to me. I don't see them reverting to the old prices without downsizing piece counts accordingly, and I doubt any of us want that. :P

I do agree with $15 Lewa, Gali, Pohatu, however.

Well, if Lewa, Gali, and Pohatu are all $15, than the other three have to be $20

What if lego pulls the "3 dollars more" stunt like they did with the Chima Ultrabuilds? They have much of the same part counts as HF but they're a few bucks more. That's probably why it looks like my TRU Still has a full stock of them. Shelf warmers indeed. Hope lego doesn't pull that stunt with Bionicle cause its a familiar popular theme. :(

[Jetrax99]

What if lego pulls the "3 dollars more" stunt like they did with the Chima Ultrabuilds? They have much of the same part counts as HF but they're a few bucks more. That's probably why it looks like my TRU Still has a full stock of them. Shelf warmers indeed. Hope lego doesn't pull that stunt with Bionicle cause its a familiar popular theme. :(

Interestingly, my local Barnes and Noble sells the old Chima ultras for $14.95, same with HF sets. Add the tax and it's an even $16. Got Flyer Beast and Stormer Freeze Machine there.

Edited September 2, 2014 by Jetrax99

[Aethersprite]

BZP received more than the other sites (yes, I said sites, there are two more), and received them earlier than the other sites. I can confirm this. Though EB saying they have six is interesting, we were told it would be five.

I see, that's good to know. Well, I guess it's more of a courtesy to give out tickets in multiples of two so the winners can invite their plus ones, it'd be pretty sad having to go alone!

I have given up trying to figure out the image. Every time someone says they see something new, i can't find it. And some things, like the "Mata Nui spirit" are just plain dumb. Analyzing this photo is a dead horse. We have killed the horse, brought him back to life, and then beat him to death again. I think that we have analyzed every aspect of the photo, so why don't we talk about the things that are still important: the story.

The defining factor of Bionicle was its deep story; do we think that the story will be dumbed down? Will it be made simpler, and more action-oriented, rather than focus on morals and lessons? I really hope not....from what I hear (I don't watch the shows), Ninjago has a pretty good story, so I hope that Lego will keep Bionicle the way we once knew it: story oriented. And who will be the main villain; I think we have all agreed, reluctantly or not, on a reboot, so will they still use Makuta? (Or Teridax; I hate how they made Makuta a species name, so that the line "I am the Makuta" is now "I am a Makuta.")

Lego's themes have always been sets first, story secondary. The story exists to garner interest and to sell the sets, not the other way around. I guess this is one of the reasons Bionicle was cut, the story got too convoluted that it put people off (thus discouraging them to buy the sets), making the story's existence counterintuitive.

Edited September 2, 2014 by Lockon Stratos

[Chro]

I have given up trying to figure out the image. Every time someone says they see something new, i can't find it. And some things, like the "Mata Nui spirit" are just plain dumb. Analyzing this photo is a dead horse. We have killed the horse, brought him back to life, and then beat him to death again. I think that we have analyzed every aspect of the photo, so why don't we talk about the things that are still important: the story.

We've done that. It always cycles back. Usually the discussion of story goes straight to "reboot vs. continuation", then people cite the leaked set images as evidence, and we're back on the topic of the sets... this is the problem with having good leaks so early. XD

[Logan McOwen]

I recently built this little emulation of the Protector build, just to get a feel for this size of figure. I must say, I adore it! Can't wait for these sets to come out!

There's also a couple more pics of them on my Flickr.

EDIT: 'them' for gender neutrality's sake

Edited September 2, 2014 by LewiMOC

[Kalhiki]

Hey, that's pretty nice. The Defenders seem like they'll be fun little sets.

And now that I see that, I don't really mind the Toa being tall. I remember in LoMN, the Matoran were, like, up to a Toa's knee. So short guys and Tall Toa are fine.

[Aanchir]

What if lego pulls the "3 dollars more" stunt like they did with the Chima Ultrabuilds? They have much of the same part counts as HF but they're a few bucks more. That's probably why it looks like my TRU Still has a full stock of them. Shelf warmers indeed. Hope lego doesn't pull that stunt with Bionicle cause its a familiar popular theme. :(

As of this year, the Chima constraction sets cost exactly the same as Hero Factory sets of similar size ($15 for the mid-size characters, $20 for the large characters). The difference is that the Super Heroes and Chima constraction sets have ALWAYS been priced at $15 previously, whereas mid-size Hero Factory characters had previously been priced at $13 (a price that had actually stayed exactly the same since the Phantoka of 2008). So for two years, there was a price difference of $2.

[Shakar]

Nice one, LewiMOC! I didn't realize how good those proportions look IRL. I'm happy to see the XT4 torso finally getting used on a whole group of small characters.

And I agree on the Toa. I was ok with the Heroes being relatively small, it was a nice change of pace, but Toa have always been really tall compared to Matoran. I think it fit the "mysterious saviours from far away" theme they were often accompanied by fairly well.

I guess the size difference is justified by the heroes' relationship with the people they have to protect. Heroes are essentially cops: they're slightly bigger and (much) stronger, but civilians see them everyday, they're part of their society. Toa are something much more rare for Matoran to witness, they're like giants to them (..giant alien demigod elemental spirits) and thus it's fair to potray them as such

EDIT: alien as in "way different from what they (Matoran) are used to". Better clear that up.

Edited September 2, 2014 by Shakar

[Clone 01354 Productions]

^That Defender can't be more than $8; I know the real one will have more pieces, but still. This is the basic size, and the basic amount of pieces, so I think that we can all get a pretty good idea of prices.....with Lewa, Gali, and Pohatu close by.....

[Aanchir]

Nice one, LewiMOC! I didn't realize how good those proportions look IRL. I'm happy to see the XT4 torso finally getting used on a whole group of small characters.

And I agree on the Toa. I was ok with the Heroes being relatively small, it was a nice change of pace, but Toa have always been really tall compared to Matoran. I think it fit the "mysterious saviours from far away" theme they were often accompanied by fairly well.

I guess the size difference is justified by the heroes' relationship with the people they have to protect. Heroes are essentially cops: they're slightly bigger and (much) stronger, but civilians see them everyday, they're part of their society. Toa are something much more rare for Matoran to witness, they're like giants to them (..giant alien demigod elemental spirits) and thus it's fair to potray them as such

EDIT: alien as in "way different from what they (Matoran) are used to". Better clear that up.

I definitely agree that Toa should be much taller than Matoran, but I think most of the people who are worried about the size of the sets would prefer both the Toa AND Matoran to be smaller than what we've seen in the leaked photos.

[Vinyl Scratch]

You know, something's bothering me. Looking at Lewa, I can't recognize what the black things are, I can see a Black Phantom chest piece, and the obvious green Miru, but what are the black things at each side of the head/mask/helmet/thing? Shoulder armour?

[Lord-Vorahk]

They;re shoulder guards.

[Shakar]

Yeah... I guess that's LEGO's way of assuring that if a child only buys one set, he/she can still battle with 2 opponents...

That's definitely the reason, yes. If this trend continues, I'm curious to see how creative they can get. I suggested elsewhere they could remake the Bohrok and turn the Krana into minifigs (while keeping their organic and alien look), but that' just speculation on my part (Bohrok are certainly some of the things I'd like to see again).

^That Defender can't be more than $8; I know the real one will have more pieces, but still. This is the basic size, and the basic amount of pieces, so I think that we can all get a pretty good idea of prices.....with Lewa, Gali, and Pohatu close by.....

Well, compared to Lewi's Defender the sets aren't very different- they just have more complex weapons and some armour (the new add-on piece) on their shoulders and torso, and of course there's the Skull Spider. 10 EUR/USD is too much, I agree.

I definitely agree that Toa should be much taller than Matoran, but I think most of the people who are worried about the size of the sets would prefer both the Toa AND Matoran to be smaller than what we've seen in the leaked photos.

That makes sense I guess. I'm not sure if making the Defenders/Matoran smaller would make sense, but I guess I just don't fall into the group you mentioned. AFAIC, the small Heroes were very fun and refreshing, but after 3 years and half (not counting 2014) I really want to see the CCBS expand, in builds and pieces, towards bigger humanoids on average (and yes, even to Witch Doctor-scale characters- the CCBS is a lot more mature now).

You know, something's bothering me. Looking at Lewa, I can't recognize what the black things are, I can see a Black Phantom chest piece, and the obvious green Miru, but what are the black things at each side of the head/mask/helmet/thing? Shoulder armour?

I pointed that out a few pages ago, actually. My guess (and dear everything I hope I'm wrong) is that it's...hair. I can't imagine Lego making such a specialized piece (and for something so odd, too), so I hope it's just shoulder armour (odd for only him to use a new piece like that, but I can't complain).

[arc]

I don't know what your talking about, lewa with his classic smile and an overgrown mullet would be awesome!