LOTR & The Hobbit 2013 Set Discussion

[Fives]

The only problem with that theory is, if you include Orthanc as part of wave 2 for LotR, it was actually bigger price and piece wise than the first wave. It had fewer sets sure, but it's not like anything else about it was smaller. And as for the Hobbit sets, we currently have a (rumored) list of 5 sets. That is only 1 less than the first wave and we could still easily get a store exclusive not yet named. Generally the first flagshi/intro sets are larger so having a second wave for each line almost as big as the first should bode fairly well I would think. I mean heck, look at the new Castle theme, it only had 5 sets total.

I forgot there were 5 sets rumoured. For some reason I thought it was four. That gives me more hope. And there is a chance that there could be a 6th set, perhaps a TRU or Target exclusive, lurking around somewhere.

[namioik]

I forgot there were 5 sets rumoured. For some reason I thought it was four. That gives me more hope. And there is a chance that there could be a 6th set, perhaps a TRU or Target exclusive, lurking around somewhere.

....I thought there was only 4..

79011 Dol Guldur Ambush £19.99

79012 Mirkwood Elf Army £29.99

79013 Lake Town Chase £49.99

79014 Dol Guldur Battle £69.99

Where is the fifth set then?

Edited September 27, 2013 by namioik

[Fives]

....I thought there was only 4..

79011 Dol Guldur Ambush £19.99

79012 Mirkwood Elf Army £29.99

79013 Lake Town Chase £49.99

79014 Dol Guldur Battle £69.99

Where is the fifth set then?

That's what I'm saying. I don't remember a fifth set named, but there might be.

[Deathleech]

Ya, there are only four sets currently rumored, my bad.

[Fives]

Ya, there are only four sets currently rumored, my bad.

Well, let's hope that LEGO is keeping something hidden from us. Perhaps they'll pull the same trick they did with Orthanc. Have four smaller sets, with a smaller flagship set, and have a big megablocks exclusive. But the possibility of that is slim. I doubt LEGO would produce two large exclusives based within the same universe. Yet, they do consider LOTR and The Hobbit as two separate themes, so the possibility still exists.

[BrickBob Studpants]

If I remember correctly, the exact same rumor haunted us last year around that time with the argument/evidence being the same (poor sales as reported by a store manager). Maybe it's true this time around, but I certainly hope not as TLG has some unfinished work here as many already have pointed out (*cough* Gondor *cough*)

@Fives: I agree, that possibility is really slim. TLG hasn't announced the January D2C set yet, but I expect it to be Marvel based in order to compensate for the Arkham set we got this year

[Deathleech]

When there is no official news it seems people get bored and suddenly the rumors start flying. Watch, if there is an advertisement in the Hobbit instruction books saying more LotR sets coming summer 2014 I am sure all these people will suddenly be saying their "Lego store managers" have been having trouble stocking the LotR sets since they are flying off shelves so well.

I'm not saying the rumors may not be true, it's just hard to believe much of anything without any actual proof or evidence, and without a good track record.

[SMC]

I don't think there will be more than 4 hobbit sets because we have the 2 sets from the first wave, so film 1 has 4 sets and film 2 has 6 sets, if anything we are missing things from the first film like the trolls or radagast.

[wesker]

Isn't it too soon for us to be hearing anything about the next LOTR wave? The earliest rumours we got last year was November and those sets turned out to be fake. We usually don't anything solid about mid-year sets until late December.

[SMC]

yeah but we might hear that there will be a 3rd wave in the hobbit instructions

[Niku]

Yesterday while playing lotr video games, came to my mind the idea that for the Gondor Fountain Guards they could use the Roman piece to simulate the wings on the helmet. Just saying it could be given use to.

[Mutant Orc]

A new piece would be nicer rather than recolouring that one.

Hmph. I'm dying for news!

[Infernum]

I agree a new piece would be better, but I agree about the add-on concept.

[deskp]

The new Trailer for the movie has been rated, wich means it's done and will be released relatively soon (within a week most likely)

Last year 3 of the sets were fully revealeed/presented on the website BEFORE the 26th october, wich means the first set was revealed less than 2 weeks into october (right????) If they do something like this again, we can expect real pictures pretty soon.

How it went last year: http://thebrickblogger.com/2012/10/lego-the-hobbit-website-now-open/

[Legoman123]

I really hope one of the sets that's yet to

Be reviled is Radagast's house. I know it's unlikely as it's from the first hobbit film, but never the less I would just really love it if we did. I would also love the blue wizards but that won't happen. :-(

[SMC]

Radagast and the trolls are what we missed from the first film, think we are all need news, just one set to talk about would be good.

[Faefrost]

....I thought there was only 4..

79011 Dol Guldur Ambush £19.99

79012 Mirkwood Elf Army £29.99

79013 Lake Town Chase £49.99

79014 Dol Guldur Battle £69.99

Where is the fifth set then?

When the Lake Town Chase was revealed at SDCC there was an MTV interview showing off the set. In it the Lego person was asked how many sets there were. The answer I believe was 5 or 6, leaving some speculation that there us probably a yet unseen exclusive floating around somewhere out there. The official list we have seen comes from the retailer catalog and does not include store exclusives or D2C.

[Faefrost]

It would be awesome if Lego could stagger the info for new sets leading up to them being available at retailers. Maybe release info and pictures for one set every month for 3-4 months before hand (this would vary depending how big a wave is obviously)? They could even keep some sets secret like the ones they think will be super popular, or the flagship sets. I know they have to be careful not to reveal any movie spoilers, but that shouldn't be an issue seeing their recent license releases...

This would at least give us something to talk about. Instead it seems we get bombarded with all the new set info all at once (from this theme and others)

In this case TLG has no choice in the matter whatsoever. This is a license tied to an upcoming movie release. The licensor has total control over when any info or images are to be released. TLG has absolute hard dates on everything from New Line and WB.

Well this fits to the story my LEGO Seller has told me. He says that in general the LotR sets are selling very slowly in his store, but also in other stores. He is guessing that there is a gap of response at the childrens level (6-14 years). May be the song of your bird is correct and TLC only finishes the promotion of the movie and the contract.

Take those type stories with a grain of salt. Things will vary around the world. In this case much of this seems to be coming from Germany. Licensed sets and themes traditionally are slow sellers in Germany. Harry Potter didn't do well there, etc. but the licensed themes do orders of magnitude better in North America and parts of Asia. It's possible the theme is so so sales wise? But I think it falls pretty much within the parameters of its predecessor HP.

ok so this is brothering me why would there not be a 3rd wave, reason to think there will be:

- They paid for the license so why would they not use it

- There is interest because of the hobbit films

- There will be a summer gap of no new sets

- Wave 2 did not have the most iconic sets we are missing (balrog, mount doom)

- No Gondor at all, if it was the last wave would they not have given us one Gondor set that if it was the last wave people would pick up every one they could find for arm builders

- Lego is making more sets for AFOL because of our spending power

- Orthanc shows lego has faith in LOTR

- In orthanc why not call the ent treebeard as it would help sell the set unless we were getting a treebeard.

There are a few assumptions there that we do not know are true. The core being the length of the license and how many waves were planned. Remember when TLG paid for the license it was to coincide with 2 movies. With a strong possibility that it would end or come up for renewal after that second movie. How splitting two movies into three effected the Hobbit license, the LotR license, TLG's established plans, or even their ongoing interest in the property is any bodies guess at this point. It's possible that both licenses may end in the spring, a few months after the second movie, having been tied to a date rather than the story or theatricals released scenes. Did New Line want more money when it became 3 films? Did TLG expect give backs after New Line screwed up their release and marketing plans? Are both sides currently happy with the other and happy with the property and product? What sacrifices or major changes is TLG having to engineer to their long term product and shelf space plans in order to accommodate the third movie? (And this is not a minor point. Keep in mind the second wave of Alien Conquest was cancelled, not because of poor sales of the first, but because at the last minute they ran out of available retail space due to licensed product changes.)

The point is we don't know. Above and beyond fans love of the property, these are business and legal decisions. And there have been some weird curveballs thrown at this one from the licensor.

[Faefrost]

Can't sat that TLG has covered themselves in glory with the sets they chose to make, the first series was fine, the second wave of LOTR as well designed as they were hardly made sense in a marketable pitch, kids would've probably embraced the coflict at Minas Tirith more than a pirate ambush and the council of Elrond made little sense except to get Arwen and Elrond in mainstream release.

Doing something from Gondor, nazgul and the battle at Pelanor fields and perhaps Lothlorien may have been easier to sell rather than 2 more FOTR sets that aren't all that significant from a child's perspective.

But let's remember that while Lego's choices for key subjects seem erratic strange or downright absurd to the more hardcore Tolkien fan base, they do actually have a great deal of experience in what makes a very good, very sellable, Lego set. I would be willing to bet that the much derided Pirate Ambush may eventually be discovered to have been one of the themes top sellers. Just because, while a so so LotR's scene, it is an utterly fantastic Lego set that oozes playability at every point. Plus it has a cross theme appeal to more traditional Lego fans. (I know it's not scientific or probably even accurate, but in the non Lego owned retail outlets by me I don't see many ships left on the shelves and have never seen one at discount. I see lots of the "black wall of blackness and more black" sets still around. )

[Darth Malgus]

But let's remember that while Lego's choices for key subjects seem erratic strange or downright absurd to the more hardcore Tolkien fan base, they do actually have a great deal of experience in what makes a very good, very sellable, Lego set. I would be willing to bet that the much derided Pirate Ambush may eventually be discovered to have been one of the themes top sellers. Just because, while a so so LotR's scene, it is an utterly fantastic Lego set that oozes playability at every point. Plus it has a cross theme appeal to more traditional Lego fans. (I know it's not scientific or probably even accurate, but in the non Lego owned retail outlets by me I don't see many ships left on the shelves and have never seen one at discount. I see lots of the "black wall of blackness and more black" sets still around. )

Not saying that the sets weren't good just saying that if kids pitch is their aim I think they missed the boat on this wave, it seems to be very collector driven, yes the boat has a playability that the others don't I built these with my 6 year old and can tell you that the other 3 held no interest for him, however a Gondorian bp or something from the last battle of middle earth may have been nice.

[Fives]

Perhaps the reason this years LOTR and Hobbit waves are smaller is because they were originally regular sized waves (6-7 sets) to be realesed over two years. TLG could have more sets designed and ready to go into production and are just waiting for the films to come out. So even though we only got 4 LOTR sets and an exclusive this year, next year may see the same amount of sets that could've originally been part of the 2013 wave. And the same may be the case for The Hobbit.

[Deathleech]

But let's remember that while Lego's choices for key subjects seem erratic strange or downright absurd to the more hardcore Tolkien fan base, they do actually have a great deal of experience in what makes a very good, very sellable, Lego set. I would be willing to bet that the much derided Pirate Ambush may eventually be discovered to have been one of the themes top sellers. Just because, while a so so LotR's scene, it is an utterly fantastic Lego set that oozes playability at every point. Plus it has a cross theme appeal to more traditional Lego fans. (I know it's not scientific or probably even accurate, but in the non Lego owned retail outlets by me I don't see many ships left on the shelves and have never seen one at discount. I see lots of the "black wall of blackness and more black" sets still around. )

I think Lego could get the best of both worlds. People love modular sets so why not do a Gondor themed one? Osgiliath and ruins, different sections of Minas Tirith like the gate, citadel, etc. It would have just as many play features as the pirate ship (if not more), what with all the catapults, break away walls, battering rams, ladders, figure flippers, flick fire missiles, etc. Not only that, it would also appeal to die hard LotR fans AND castle/modular set fans.

Don't get me wrong, I am sure this is EXACTLY why Lego made the Pirate Ship Ambush into a set, the designer even says its because kids love pirate ships. If the sets really aren't selling well though, they obviously are doing something wrong. There is a large Tolkien fan base which seem to be eating the sets up but Lego has done next to nothing to sell the sets to kids. I doubt most of the sets even look that interesting to them outside a few selections. Heck I was even uninterested in a few and I LOVE both Lego and Tolkien.

With the first wave I bought two every set the day they came out plus 5 Orc Forge and 20 Uruk-hai Army. With the second wave I bought two of everything except Black Gates which I bought 3 of total and I waited several months to get them. If Lego were to release a few battle packs and a Witch King and Mumakil set, as well as Minas Torith or Gondor I could easily see myself getting two of everything and dozens upon dozens of battle packs, plus 3+ Witch King and Oliphant sets just for extra Fel Beasts and Oliphants alone (if molded or made with some specific new molded pieces).

[Darth Punk]

Probably in general this time of year is slow for selling many toys. Kids back in school and such. And I imagine when the next hobbit movie comes out that will rekindle interest in the whole LoTR/Hobbit line. Especially if we see more foreshadowing of the LoTR which is highly likely.

I agree the second wave has been less than thrilling and there are still many scenes left that people would go crazy over if made into sets.

Most stores make the majority of their money during the Christmas season so I doubt the fate of the LoTR hangs by a thread during a normally slow period of the year. The only thing I see that would scuttle a third wave is if the second hobbit move tanks.

[The_Chosen_1]

I also like to keep in mind the fact that the Tower of Orthanc stayed on S@H's list of 25 best sellers for well over a month after its release, which is pretty good for any set (let alone a $200 D2C set). I hope that's a sign that the theme is doing well.

[Deathleech]

I also like to keep in mind the fact that the Tower of Orthanc stayed on S@H's list of 25 best sellers for well over a month after its release, which is pretty good for any set (let alone a $200 D2C set). I hope that's a sign that the theme is doing well.

And it's currently sold out directly from Amazon after only a few weeks, you can only get it through third parties on Amazon right now.