Hi everyone,

I guess this is my first topic here - I actually registered to post in this section ;).

I have been looking into train setups to keep my hands working on something. It would have to be something that I can tear down easily, so I suppose Lego is an obvious answer ;). I've looked at something like an h0 scale (00 scale for my UK friends) layout, but that gets very expensive very quickly, and I dont really want to commit that much space to it. I would love to keep my living room very open to support my photography.

So I am moving on to Lego. This way I can build whatever I want on the layout. On h0 scale I was looking at building a station and turntable to play around with, so I guess Lego will face a similar scenario.

I have been looking at the BR Class 08 shunter. Sensitive eyes be warned, I also use 3d printed parts if I have to, or if the model really calls for it.

Just a bit of information. The hump on top isn't in the real life model, it's there to make room for the power functions. The model will be powered by 2 M motors and the battery box is hiding just behind the radiator. The IR receiver can just about be seen in the cab.

The model is 7 bricks wide and 20 bricks long. I've started out building the model to scale, which works out at 1:46,5 for 7 studs wide and this model. If you don't count the hump on top, the height of the model is correct to this scale. The length is to a slightly smaller scale at 1:55 - that will help in the corners. Actually this is done on other model scales as well. In any case, I think it looks pretty good.

The main challenge here is to house all the power functions.

As you can see, the model is filled from front to back with these functions and I'm still worried about routing all the wires. I might get away with one M motor but I'm not sure. It's going to be used as a shunter so I would expect pulling a "broken" loco and a few carriages is a common task for it. The best part (i think) will be the wheels as they are 26mm in size to be correct to the scale. Also, the chassis is in between the wheels and the rods as it is in real life.

I'm just about at the point of ordering a number of parts, but I'm doubting which tracks to use. Lego tracks are an obvious choice, but I don't like the tight curves or the geometry of the points. Honestly I'm wondering if I can run it on regular 0-gauge track since I will be 3d printing the wheels any way.

I did run into pictures of Lego sitting on 0-gauge tracks. Does anyone have experience with that combination?

welcome to Train Tech Dutchdoughnut! What tool did you use?! Looks quite well! Very interesting, what printer do you have access to?

I'm using Inventor 2010, because I can make .stl files to upload to the 3d printer service. I do believe other (free) tools can do the same.

The downside is that I have to copy each existing Lego brick to build a new library. Ah well ;).

The 3d printer service is Shapeways. I don't have my own printer, that would be very expensive for me ;).

That's a nice looking shunter.

It's a nice design sofar but it looks like you'll be doing a lot of 3D printing...

For wheels, have you looked at Big Ben Bricks? They do drivers in a number of sizes. For the coupling rods you could have a look at the other Ben (Zephyr in the post above, see the link in his sig).

Lego curves are tight but ME Models have completed their Kickstarter project and are now starting up production for wider curves. A common trick to get trains around tight curves is using blind drivers in the middle. Have a look at models in Flickr groups Lego Trains and Lego Train Ideas.

The only person I know to run his trains on O-gauge every now and then is Bricktrix.

If you are worried about pulling power, rather than adding an extra motor, just change the gearing so that the engine runs half as fast. That way you will get the same 'pulling power' as two motors. Its basically what the real thing does - it has a very slow top speed (15mph) due to it having a double reduction gear drive, but can shift trains almost as heavy as its full size companions!

Edited July 27, 201410 yr by Heppeng

It's a nice design sofar but it looks like you'll be doing a lot of 3D printing...

For wheels, have you looked at Big Ben Bricks? They do drivers in a number of sizes. For the coupling rods you could have a look at the other Ben (Zephyr in the post above, see the link in his sig).

Lego curves are tight but ME Models have completed their Kickstarter project and are now starting up production for wider curves. A common trick to get trains around tight curves is using blind drivers in the middle. Have a look at models in Flickr groups Lego Trains and Lego Train Ideas.

The only person I know to run his trains on O-gauge every now and then is Bricktrix.

I've seen Big Ben Bricks, but at that time I wasn't sure at all about what diameter to use. I'm now thinking of 26mm diameter wheels, Big Ben's medium drivers are very close to that so definately worth a look! Either way, I'll change the middle axle to run blind drivers :).

Bookmarked the Lego Flickr groups ;).

About the tracks, Im torn between a few options. The ME models tracks look good, really good! So that is definately an option. I'm also thinking I could do flex track with a wooden baseplate, to keep them at a certain diameter and finish the outside with Lego pieces of course. I guess I'd need to try some things!

If you are worried about pulling power, rather than adding an extra motor, just change the gearing so that the engine runs half as fast. That way you will get the same 'pulling power' as two motors. Its basically what the real thing does - it has a very slow top speed (15mph) due to it having a double reduction gear drive, but can shift trains almost as heavy as its full size companions!

This is a view of the underside and the mechanics. I didn't bother to model the gears that much, but I am planning on a 12/20 gearing I think. It's all Lego standard parts, and I dont see too much room to alter that. I do have the gears and one M motor laying around and I've built the gears just to try the torque and speed. It does seem fine to me; but I was using standard 16mm Lego wheels. I'll probably run the MOC on one M motor at first, and add the second if needed. I'm reserving room for the second motor just in case ;).

The only person I know to run his trains on O-gauge every now and then is Bricktrix.

I've contemplated O gauge every now and then. I can see a few potential complications. First, you can't use the lower friction lego wheel sets. So you will have to deal with more friction drag. Second, it may be more difficult to ensure your wheels stay the correct spacing for the gauge (especially if it winds up being an unusual distance in lego dimensions). Probably doable, but just a little more work. Googling O scale lego train turns up this interesting video where they swap out the wheels on the HE... though at $25/truck it starts to make lego trains look inexpensive.

Several folks have built G gauge lego models, but there are not any links off the top of my head.

I even stumbled on a few HO model trains, though none that look very train like. But I did stumble on this official looking Lego ad featuring HO trains from the 1960's.

I've seen Big Ben Bricks, but at that time I wasn't sure at all about what diameter to use. I'm now thinking of 26mm diameter wheels, Big Ben's medium drivers are very close to that so definately worth a look! Either way, I'll change the middle axle to run blind drivers :).

Just note that BBB wheels do not have a groove for the drive band. There are ways of adding it (somewhere on EB is a thread discussing how, but I don't know where at the moment). If you plan on pulling any sort of weight, you will need that long before adding a second motor will be of any help.

Also, from looking at your renderings, it looks like you are doing an impressive job with your cad from scratch. However, you should check out LDraw if you have not done so already. It might save you some time (though you will still have to cad up your custom parts).

I can confirm that BBB medium driver wheels are completely useless at pulling pretty much anything. I even get wheelspin when there's nothing attached to the train...

But I did stumble on this official looking Lego ad featuring HO trains from the 1960's.

As far as I understand it, the original intention for Lego was as a scenery builder for HO trainsets (I would say model railways, but it's rather obvious from the resulting lego designs that that these were intended as a toy, not a serious modelling tool, lol).

Dutchiedoughnut, is there any chance of seeing your frames? I'd quite like to make my own 'Gronk' at some point, but have been largely put off by there being no real way (I can see) of pulling off a decent looking set of outside frames and connecting rods within the limited space available with Lego.

Redimus,

I will post some pictures of my frame lateron. They are 3d printed models at 4x1. I'm not too sure about their height.

I can upload them to my 3d printing service so that you can use them as well?

My class 08 is 7 wide, and the connecting rods just about fit in that envelope. I think the model, with Lego standard connecting rods, will most likely be 8 wide.

My guess is that 2 M motors is overkill. You're much more likely to spin the drivers than stall an M motor. Depends on how much tractive effort you can get from ballast and traction tyres.

You might also gear the axles together, rather than relying on the con rods. Slop in the con rods can cause binding (in my limited experience with Lego steam trains).

I have made a Class 8 with BBB Medium wheels. It is about the right size, I don't scale things as much as you have though, I just go by what looks right. I can also confrm quite a bit of wheel spin.

Most of the engines I have used BBB wheels for are bigger and have either more weght, or are powered from a tender with standard LEGO wheels so the wheel spin is not so much as issue.

I think my own Class 8 is in the gallery on here if you want to look. It is also 7 studs wide.

If you get the pieces printed in ABS, you could use acetone smoothing to give the parts a closer surface finish to standard Lego pieces. Just be careful, because acetone vapor is nasty stuff and probably shouldn't be inhaled unless you really hate the lining of your airways!

I am actually completely in love with the inner lining of my airways! I can only print the bricks in colors that I don't want the model to be in, so I will have to do some painting. So I guess I will have to sand them a tiny bit, use primer and color. I'm also thinking of having the model weathered to make it more realistic, but I guess I'll decide when it's built.

I was asked for the frames that hold the wheels:

I really like your idea to make the parts you print more like standard pieces so you could use them in other models aswell! Like your wheel holders, which look more realistic to me than Lego's ( especially the "suspension" which looks more modern on the Lego version)

I was asked for the frames that hold the wheels:

The current design you have forces the axle to pass through four holes, which greatly increases the odds that the axle will bind up and not turn smoothly. I'd vouch for either greatly enlarging the holes on the inner frame, or removing them entirely (just don't have the frame descend that far). Alternatively, keep the inside holes, but don't have the outside ones fully enclose the axle (the design used on the outside frames of the PF train motor).

What 3D printer / Shapeways option will this be printed on? Most 3D printers can't hope to get anywhere close to Lego's tolerances.

Edited August 8, 201410 yr by jtlan

The current design you have forces the axle to pass through four holes, which greatly increases the odds that the axle will bind up and not turn smoothly. I'd vouch for either greatly enlarging the holes on the inner frame, or removing them entirely (just don't have the frame descend that far). Alternatively, keep the inside holes, but don't have the outside ones fully enclose the axle (the design used on the outside frames of the PF train motor).

What 3D printer / Shapeways option will this be printed on? Most 3D printers can't hope to get anywhere close to Lego's tolerances.

In general I agree about the binding, but I feel I need to to get the proper force distribution (these walls are rather small). If I do have binding I can just drill out the outer holes, and it would be easy enough to not have the frame descend that far, as you say.

I will be using "Blue strong and flexible polished". I have some other parts which seem to work OK - in fact they are a bit tight. But I do expect that fitting problems will be my biggest problem.

It's worth pointing out that it's not a loco that is intended to run a million miles an hour long distances, so shouldn't be as big an issue as say the drag caused by the technic axles in the HE set.

It's definately just a shunter :). I'll be ordering the parts shortly so I'm excited!

Right now I'm hijacking my own thread with another experiment. It's a steam railcar (number 93) as it's running in Didcot.

I like how it's turning out, I like the general look of it as it compares very well to the real thing I think. There are also buckets of space inside and it's nearly as spacious as the real thing. It is 7 wide, with the interior space being 6 wide - quite enough space to spend on seating arrangement. I do have to come up with something special for the battery box. There is no conceiled space to put it in! The infrared receiver goes where the boiler is on the real thing. I am thinking of cheating here, lol.

Here is an update, I suppose I was on a roll today:

In the picture above it looks a bit like a boat, but with the added roof that is now sorted. The interior is also sorted and I think 14 minifigs can find easy spaces (including a driver and stoker). The IR receiver is doing a stand in for the boiler at the moment.

Here is a view of the real thing:

Very nice, but not really lego if you are going to 3d print these parts. In saying that they would look nice 3d printed.

Yeah the walls especially are more based on the LEGO system rather than being actual Lego. It's all still held together by studs though.

If you look at the trains from Carl Greatrix (Duq mentioned them), you see that if you are inventive enough, you don't have to 3D print but can make them out of LEGO. My students (uh, actually former students since I now work at another school), made a LEGO trains compatible cover around the color sensors they use under trains. It turned out to be quite difficult even with our own (Felix) 3D printer. The ABS is not as exact as you would think when you print, so if you say 7,75 mm you might get maybe 7,9 mm (or the other way around).

Link: Carl Greatrix

Forgive the crappy upload quality ;)

This is a model I had printed quite a while ago. I'm not very pleased with the look anymore, but the quality and fit are nice. They also fit my lego's rather tightly, so I am reasonably confident in the quality of the 3d printed materials themselves.

The steam railcar features rather a lot of 3d printed blocks though. If I go with standard Lego blocks (except for the windows), and add the lines as decals I can use standard parts mostly. I do like the look of the panelling, but I´m sure I will reconsider once I get the quote...