Phil-B259

I agree on this - A darkish Green colour would have been a better 'fit' as it were - if you go and look at photos of the Orient Express (or VOSE) in real life the locos always tended to be different colours from the coaches. However once again I stress that OEs heavy involvement in this set seems to be driven from a marketing angle - so to them I can see how they would turn round and reject a loco not in the same colour as the coaches regardless of how non-prototypical that might be. With the HE & 4470 I kept to 6 wide* (though with the the latter coaches I extended them lengthwise by 4 studs) - and yes I admit my mods do look a little ridiculous close up. However like I said above my mind is better able to cope with stuff like 1 stud wide corridors than the inclusion of un-prototypical layouts just to make the interiors fully minifigure accessible as it were. Toys are just that Toys - its the attention to authenticity which actually turns a toy into a model! *Going 8 or 10 wide would of course allow for finer detail - but I want to be able to run them alongside my other 6-wide Lego issued trains. Again inconsistency in size just doesn't look right when running trains together - I wouldn't mix HO gauge model railways with British OO gauge (even though they run on the same track) because the size difference between the two scales would be too distracting.

Guilt as charged on this - I rebuilt my HE cars to try and make them more prototypical inside and yes because they are only 6 wide the corridor past the toilet is only one stud wide... I also rebuilt / added extra carriages top the legendary 7740 with the kitchen at the side of the carriage not across the end (with a similar 1 stud wide corridor) for realism But I justify that by saying how many real world cars have just one seat in them - yet thats all most Lego cars have had! Lego has always involved compromises because to make it work as a toy compression is needed, so where space is lacking its creating the impression that counts for me. After all my HE doesn't run round with all the roofs removed so the fact that the corridor is too small for a minifigure to be posed in it doesn't matter that much - the point is it looks like its there from the outside and the interior layout, although much compressed is grounded in reality.....

Admittedly its personal view but if a train is to be a train it should be prototypical in its configuration - and that INCLUDES the carriage interiors not just the exteriors or that the loco be powered!. So in that sense yes I agree with the statement that the division of OE which approved / guided development of this set don't know anything about trains* But, at the same time I don't expect them too because in my view they regard this as a Marketing / Advertising Tool! - and as such the OE folk who were involved with the Lego design were most likely not rail specialists or necessarily enthusiasts In the minds of OE the Lego set exists to promote their brand of luxury travel with a heavy focus on luxury! In effect the fact its a train is not that important - but putting as much of the luxurious interior on display is. And I admit the interior detail is superb and really does a good job of capturing what luxury train travel looks like so cannot fault OEs input in respect of that. * and perhaps if more Lego Trains fans were able to accept that then they might be a bit more realistic about what this set actually is. Agreed Its one of the nice things about the latest Modular Museum that you have a toilet in it! Sounds silly I know but I kinda feel that even Logo should be vaguely realistic.... However I have I plan to rebuild my modulars in future to include such things though and were I to get this set I would need at least two OE sets so I could remedy the highlighted issues

As ever you are completely ignoring that this is a licensed product - and ANYTHING involving the words 'Orient Express will be! Selling just the carriages would most likely to have been vetoed by the OE! They would no doubt want a locomotive included so as to give off an 'authentic train set vibe' about the set. And given the original Lego Ideas submission was quite explicit in that it was a model of the Orient Express then Lego could not have made that idea into reality without obtain a licence from owners of the OE brand. As such the choice is simply the model e have got or no model at all - so stop coming up with nonsense suggestions about what was realistically possible in this case. If you want straightforward carriages with no licencing hang ups then try submitting something to Lego Ideas and see how you get on. If there really is that huge demand we keep being told about for separate locos, carriages etc then we would expect them to regularly end up in the top 10 when it comes to votes. The fact that don't do so at the moment speaks volumes about the importance of 'trains' in terms of the Lego fanbase as a whole... As to the set itself, I actually quite like the set BUT... I can't overlook the fact the restaurant car doesn't have a kitchen (or an accompanying kitchen car) to prepare the meals Having a sleeping car where the bedrooms taking up the whole width of the car and no corridor between is ridiculousness for anyone who knows anything about trains... Both of these issues are far more important than whinges over the look / size / lack of motorisation of the locomotive!

Ta - surprised you haven't have heard much about it, though I guess as the VOSE doesn't normally go that way exposure would be less. However the point about those links I put was precisely that they were mostly touristy / holiday ones! You type Orient Express / Venice Simpson Orient Express into any search engine and the majority of results are all about booking holidays / taking trips on the train - virtually none of them are about technical or railway enthusiast aspects! If the railway angle was the most important aspect of the Orient Express then that would be the thing which brings up the most results - but it isn't! That should tell you just how low interest in railways is in the general population - and Lego know that! Interestingly trying the same exercise for the 'Super Chief' mainly brings up links relating to motorcycles..... *I have since deleted them because the computer I'm using didn't post them properly rather than anything sinster.

Oh don't get me wrong - with a Paris - Venice ticket costing in the region of £4000 per cabin its not exactly a cheap way to travel (hence why it tends to be viewed as a 'once in a lifetime' trip for most folk and only the very wealthy can use it more than once). However that in itself adds a certain mystique around the brand plus makes those who are able to afford it feel special. Those are the vibes which Lego and the Orient Express are seeking to exploit - particularly the OE group who will be trying to grab a slice of that market which the VOSE have been cultivating so successfully and for Lego who can effectively say to folks 'OK you might not have been able to go on it yet but you can at least imagine....)

Where do you live? If you say 'Orient Express' to most folk they will be thinking of the VOSE - or The Venice Simplon Orient Express has been running as a luxury train from Paris to Venice since 1982 and in its time has regulatory topped polls as one of the most spectacular / romantic train trips you can do in Europe and very much a 'once in a lifetime' thing for many. Its well advertised and well known by lots of folk who have ZERO interest in trains. Now granted this is a totally separate company and has nothing to do with to the Orient Express group behind the Lego collaboration* - but I doubt the general public care in the slightest about that. If you say 'Orient Express to a member of the public then most folk will be thinking of the VOSE * VOSE = https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venice-Simplon_Orient_Express And with respect to the VOSE its very much about a luxury experience - not the fact its a train which matters! If you do a goggle search what comes up is not pages of railway related stuff but rather pages form luxury travel providers offering trips on the VOSE...

Not so much 'Orient express enthusiasts' but rather people who like the Orient express because of what it represents. If you ask what most non-railway people what do they associate the words "Orient Express with they will most probably cite murders, luxury travel, films books, 1930s decor, 1930s fashion, etc the railway element is very minor and is effectively secondary to the prime interest. Please remember that Lego is marketing this set at the general population at large NOT just lego train enthusiasts - and the general population at large really couldn't care less what train enthusiasts think And yes, these sorts of folk DO outnumber the people who like model trains once you step away from forums like this!

It could but its sales potential would have been lower! There will be a large number of people who couldn't care less about railways and especially couldn't give a toss about Lego trains but who would potentially be attracted by the set specifically because of the IP tie in! That could be because they liked the films, liked the book, have travelled on it, want to travel it in future, like the 1930s period in terms of decor / fashion etc That is in addition to those adults who like having Lego models on display around their property because they look nice. The number of Lego train enthusiasts is pretty small (despite what some on these boards like to think) and Lego know that a train simply pandering to that segment will not be a profitable proposition.

Because the Orient express brand have licensed them to do so! It makes no difference whether the medium is Lego or a ready to run model loco made by Hornby, Bachman, Atlas, etc they ALL need to have secured express permission of the owner of the real life intellectual property to reproduce that in model form. You want to make a model of a train with the DB logo on it (regardless on whether its Lego or not - guess what? you need express permission from Deuche Bahn to do so. In fact a couple of decades ago Union Pacific Railroad in the USA caused a massive problem when they suddenly* started charging huge sums of money for model railway manufacturers to use their liveries & logos and threatening to sue anyone who didn't pay up! However its also true that in most cases said rights owners are usually content to issue a licence to reproduce their intellectual property free of charge or for a minimal fee - recognising that model railways manufacturers returns are actually quite modest compared to the wider toy industry plus a 'poor' model doesn't actually reflect too badly on them nor the public perception of them due to the relatively low levels of public participation in the hobby (compared to other things people do as 'hobbies') Lego is a rather different matter - not only is the brand far more globally recognised and in terms of profitability makes way more in turnover each year than many of the traditional model railway manufacturers do in a decade, it also is something far more people globally are likely to interact with and as a consequence the perceived risks to the rights holders reputation will be seen to be much more significant. Therefore the its quite likely that the rights owners to the 'Orient Express' IP will have not only charged a hefty fee, they will also have wanted far more involvement in the venture than they will do with the respect of a traditional model railway manufacturer who has been turning out HO / N gauge models of their coaches for many years. *(After a few months and much lobbying by manufacturers / railway modellers UP did in the end give way and significantly lower what they charge).

No they couldn't Please remember Lego could only make this set in the first place because the holders of the rights to the brand "Orient Express" let them do so - and as Lego have explained in this case those right holders were VERY involved in the design of the set seeing it as a way to showcase THE CARRIAGES which are used on the real train. The rights holders didn't care that much about the locomotive - because as has been highlighted the owners of the "Orient Express" have never owned a single locomotive throughout the trains entire existence, they merely hire them as required from the countries the train travels through, all it needed to do was look OK when put in front of the carriages

Don't talk nonsense... The loco does have a smokebox! (its the black bit at the front of the boiler) - what it doesn't have is smoke deflectors bolted to the side of the smokebox which makes it less noticiblle Now just in case it was a typo (and also because i have seen some posts on the subject of fireboxes) this loco does indeed also have a firebox. The 'square' Belpare firebox is a later innovation and many powerful locomotives (including the Flying Scotsman) used the earlier round top firebox type - as featured on this design.

Except they DON'T Model railway companies know the growth area in the hobby is actually in highly detailed and expensive models for adult collectors which sell for high prices - NOT the 'cheap models for kids element. OK some might churn out a range of sets, but overall they are not exactly money spinners and usually feature older tooling that is past its best. Yes there are are also some things like Markin's 'My World' range for youngsters but thats a rare exception in the hobby as a whole. Meanwhile you have to acept the reality that demographically speaking model trains have not bee 'cool' or 'must have' toys for over 60 years now while even things like Thomas the Tank engine are now pitching their shows / products squarely at pre-school kids. The conclusion which Lego draw from this is that there is zero point in offering much more than a couple of token train sets in their kids range - but as with many true model railway companies there is money to be made from Adult collectors who buy expensive models for display. Thomas the tank engine stuff requires the paying of huge sums of money to Matel in licence fees! Yes Lego also have to pay huge sums to the likes of Warner Bros so they can make Harry Potter themed sets but the financial returns make it worthwhile. As such a huge range of TTE products is unrealistic - particularly as the demographic in terms of audience for Thomas has now dropped firmly into the pre-school market (i.e. Duplo territory).

You mean Buffers not bumpers! Such things are universal on locomotives, wagons and loco hauled coaching stock throughout Europe (the spiritual home of Lego) and as such having them along with the coupler is entirely reasonable (and prototypical) for many builds. Granted having a stand alone coupler would be useful for American or Multiple unit / high speed builds, but as the latter are fixed formation trains a technic based coupling solution might well be possible.

Actually there is a benefit! Many real life railways have invested in bi-mode traction which has can use electrification or an on board power source - traditionally diesel. Newer developments have also seen batteries replace / augment said on board diesel engines that get recharged when the train is receiving external power. There are also some schemes in development which are based around a fast charge boast being given to batteries at intermediate station stops or where the train terminates. The key point about all the above is it means you don't have to spend a fortune electrifying every bit of railway to get the benefits.... ... Now one of the things which has been cited as a problem with the Lego 9V range was the expensiveness of the track, something that limited the amount of pieces it was viable to produce. Plastic is cheaper to make but you then need a bulky battery module on the train which has to be easily accessible for it to be removed when it needs new batteries / charging. However if you take the current real railway developments on board then you could have a smaller battery which gets recharged on a special 'charging track' piece - which could be manufactured as a single design leaving the rest of the track to be made totally from plastic.