def Posted October 30, 2014 Author Posted October 30, 2014 Player feedback added to the end of the first post.
Richila Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 Thank you Speedy, hosting the game and writing the evaluations was a lot of work. Reading the evaluations was really informative. I would also like to thank you for all the teaching that went on on the Deadboard.
Lind Whisperer Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 Lind Whisperer - I'm really on the fence about your participation. You were somewhat aggressive about how others were playing, but in numerous places, showed that you didn't fully grasp the rules. I think especially in your situation, you needed to be humble. Still have an opinion, but be nicer about it, especially when you're technically a n00b. I debated about explaining why mandatory voting was important, since I worried it may peg you as a townie, but it was an important thing to point out. You were voting with the bandwagon, and were not in any way obligated to do so! Just vote for anybody else, and you will no longer be part of the bandwagon. I've had disagreements on the phrase "throwing away your vote" in other games, since a vote for someone that definitely won't be lynched is a way to make an easy decision and not weigh in with the group (or push for a non-lynch). After that, you never joined the Deadboard, which would have been a place to figure out better ways to approach the game. You really should have spent a lot of time on the Deadboard. I encourage you to continue, but you need to take in a lot more strategy and concepts about the game. Pass, with major reservations. I'm really sorry I didn't post on the Deadboard. Somehow the little red square PM notification didn't display for your message, and I haven't had a reason to open my PM folder otherwise, so I wasn't aware of the Deadboard even existing until now. I agree that my voting was too much on the bandwagon. I was more afraid to vote for someone else and be wrong, than I was of going along with the crowd. Yet another lesson that I've learned. Thank you very much for hosting me.
mostlytechnic Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 Thanks again for hosting. Too bad I was gone night one, but I guess that's a compliment in a way. Actually, turned out sorta good I was out because life got much busier than I expected during the game, so it was convenient to participate on the deadboard but not have the pressure of paying attention quite as hard as if I was still in. You know, with as popular as all the "vote someone off" reality shows are, I'm surprised no one has made a reality tv of a mafia game. Probably too complicated for the average reality show watcher I guess
Lady K Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 Thanks for the feedback. Each game I keep trying to improve and do something different. This one I was trying out more PMs to more people, but I was unintentionally quieter in the thread. We did have a three town PM going at one point, which was good. To all the newbies, just keep playing. It's worth it every time.
Yzalirk Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 Thanks, I guess, for the feedback? I can't tell whether you meant it in a good way or in a bad way...
Mencot Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 Thanks Def for the feedback. All these games have teach me something and I am improving, slowly but still improving. I would appreciate it and find it very helpful, if you Def could give me some pointers on how to improve my playing style? Ofcourse everybody has their own style but some hints would be good. Sorry to Adventure1 that I trusted you less then Jluck in PM and it was too late when I realized that it maybe was Jluck that was the one fooling. But as experience from past games has shown, one should not be too trusting when speaking only with vanilla towns and I will be more experience in this area after this game also. Don´t trust the wrong person
Duvors Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 Good work everyone, and congratulations to everyone who survived, I hope we see more of you all in future.
Lady K Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 No problem Mencot. This was my first time as vanilla town, I wasn't sure what to do so I thought reaching out and trusting your miller claim could start town working together. On the same thought, sorry Xenophobic Monoxide for not talikg more to you in PM. When you asked me right away what, if any, roles I had I figured you for scum. I should have talked to you a little more. Oh well, lessons learned for next time.
TheLazyChicken Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 Umm, thanks for the feedback. I wasn't really aware that I wasn't being so helpful on the first few days. I knew I wasn't being helpful on day 1 because I first wanted to see who said what and post my suspicions later throughout the game so I wouldn't get lynched on the first few days. I guess it didn't really work because most of my suspicions were wrong 80%.
Xenophobic Monoxide Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 Honestly though, while I agree about your review of me (I had real-life issues at the time)... What is this bias? From host: Xenophobic - You should never have been lynched. You were up for lynch against Brickelodeon, and scum voted against you to save her. In fact, Jluck and Brickelodeon had been killed and came up scum. Did you bring that up when you were up for lynch? Nope. You, of anyone playing, should have been acutely aware of that, because you were town, and there was no lynch that day... You were town, and you just let them vote you out, no argument, just a "What can I do?" That was true, but still bad. Not a matter of failing to succeed, but failing to try. That is the key to this whole thing. Your effort. Fail. Please try again. Later.. Lord Duvors - You were really active at one point and I had a favourable review of you, then dropped out and never defended yourself. And never took part on the Deadboard, that I remember. Pass, with reservations. You pretty much said the exact same thing to Lord Duvors as you said to me (in less words)... and you let him pass? I don't understand your logic.
def Posted October 30, 2014 Author Posted October 30, 2014 Thanks, I guess, for the feedback? I can't tell whether you meant it in a good way or in a bad way... Everyone's feedback is meant to be good. You didn't have a great game. Do you think you played well? Take that info, and build on it next time. If you have something you want to call attention to that you think I might have missed, by all means. Umm, thanks for the feedback. I wasn't really aware that I wasn't being so helpful on the first few days. I knew I wasn't being helpful on day 1 because I first wanted to see who said what and post my suspicions later throughout the game so I wouldn't get lynched on the first few days. I guess it didn't really work because most of my suspicions were wrong 80%. Again, looking back, do you think you were? Why did others accuse you so much? You were a vanilla townie, so why would you really worry about being lynched? Better you than the doctor day one. You win with your team, not if you survive, so play fearlessly from day one! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Somewhere in the game, I think with the Pirate Dave lynch, somebody said that if he and someone else were scum, they wanted to lynch Dave first because he was more experienced and therefore more dangerous. Both were town. This was just insane logic. They never considered the flip side: he would be one of the most useful to town alive. Town lynched two of the most experienced players in the first two days. This ended up really hurting the team. If they'd been more conservative rather than witch-hunty, the game would have been smoother. If somebody is over-active in the first few days, let them live, see what they do before you lynch them. Day one especially, lynch somebody lazy or hiding. They are unlikely to do anything much in the long run. Honestly though, while I agree about your review of me (I had real-life issues at the time)... What is this bias? From host: Xenophobic - You should never have been lynched. You were up for lynch against Brickelodeon, and scum voted against you to save her. In fact, Jluck and Brickelodeon had been killed and came up scum. Did you bring that up when you were up for lynch? Nope. You, of anyone playing, should have been acutely aware of that, because you were town, and there was no lynch that day... You were town, and you just let them vote you out, no argument, just a "What can I do?" That was true, but still bad. Not a matter of failing to succeed, but failing to try. That is the key to this whole thing. Your effort. Fail. Please try again. Later.. Lord Duvors - You were really active at one point and I had a favourable review of you, then dropped out and never defended yourself. And never took part on the Deadboard, that I remember. Pass, with reservations. You pretty much said the exact same thing to Lord Duvors as you said to me (in less words)... and you let him pass? I don't understand your logic. Lord Duvors had a few good days, and was actually not online when he was lynched. You didn't have a good period, and when it came time to defend yourself, you publicly gave up. So I PM'ed you telling you to defend yourself, then you waited 24 hours and then told me that you couldn't because of "double-posting," a rule you had invented and logically makes no sense. I think you need another mafia school, since the ability isn't there, and I don't think the 'try' attitude was either. As I said in the review, prove me wrong with your next game.
Xenophobic Monoxide Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 then told me that you couldn't because of "double-posting," a rule you had invented and logically makes no sense. No offense, but have you ever been to a forum other than this one?
def Posted October 30, 2014 Author Posted October 30, 2014 I would appreciate it and find it very helpful, if you Def could give me some pointers on how to improve my playing style? I would simply dial back the confidence a bit. This is two games in a row I saw you speaking like you knew what was going on, and you were wrong, plus you got duped by the scum. Using a lot more 'maybe' and 'possibly' instead of 'I'm sure' and 'I bet' would lower friction with the Daves in the game, and keep you from being duped. Just don't trust yourself so quickly. No offense, but have you ever been to a forum other than this one? Of course. And played mafia on two other forums. Never heard that rule there either. You still didn't defend yourself whatsoever, and needed the host to prod you to do so. What did you do that made you deserving of a pass?
Xenophobic Monoxide Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 Of course. And played mafia on two other forums. Never heard that rule there either. You still didn't defend yourself whatsoever, and needed the host to prod you to do so. What did you do that made you deserving of a pass? You've never seen "no double-posting" anywhere? That rule is on almost every internet forum. It's not always in the rules, but it's enforced when it happens. As to your second question, nothing. I was just playing casually (as I usually do if I'm a townie) and I really didn't care if I won or lost.
def Posted October 30, 2014 Author Posted October 30, 2014 You've never seen "no double-posting" anywhere? That rule is on almost every internet forum. It's not always in the rules, but it's enforced when it happens. As to your second question, nothing. I was just playing casually (as I usually do if I'm a townie) and I really didn't care if I won or lost. I'll take a look. But by 'almost always,' it's strange I've never seen it on the three I have experience with. All the same, if you don't really care when you're playing, well, nobody would want you on their team. That's pretty much why we have mafia school, to weed this sort of attitude out. You seem to be offended, and there is no reason to be. You didn't play well, have admitted you weren't trying, and logically, aren't going to get positive feedback. That makes sense, right?
Xenophobic Monoxide Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 I'll take a look. But by 'almost always,' it's strange I've never seen it on the three I have experience with. All the same, if you don't really care when you're playing, well, nobody would want you on their team. That's pretty much why we have mafia school, to weed this sort of attitude out. You seem to be offended, and there is no reason to be. You didn't play well, have admitted you weren't trying, and logically, aren't going to get positive feedback. That makes sense, right? I know, it's a flaw I've been trying to get rid of it. Thanks to you, I think it will be gone by the next time I play a mafia school. You're a good teacher, and I respect you. I apologize if I seem offended, I just had a small misunderstanding after reading the reports.
def Posted October 30, 2014 Author Posted October 30, 2014 I did a google search of 'no double posting mafia rule' and this is the first page: More 'almost' than 'always,' it seems.
Yzalirk Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) Everyone's feedback is meant to be good. You didn't have a great game. Do you think you played well? Take that info, and build on it next time. If you have something you want to call attention to that you think I might have missed, by all means. I did get lazy towards the end but what do you expect, there was only a few of us. There wasn't much to add at the time since everyone else was fairly quite as well. But from the beginning, yeah, I'll admit I wasn't a "team player" and was kind of an a-hole, which I apologize for, but being a new player I didn't expect people to say what they did. If I had know, I probably would have fought back but when everyone votes against you, it's tough to make a recovery from it. Overall, I think I did pretty damn good strategically but as a team player, not so much. I did make it to the finally and I did get the Godfather lynched so that should be taken into consideration. It's still a learning process and playing it hands-on is the best way to learn. So I do thank you for having me in and I do hope to make it quite far in future games and be a good team player as well. Edited October 30, 2014 by Goliath
TheLazyChicken Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 Again, looking back, do you think you were? Why did others accuse you so much? You were a vanilla townie, so why would you really worry about being lynched? Better you than the doctor day one. You win with your team, not if you survive, so play fearlessly from day one! Now that I think about it, you are right, it wouldn't have hurt town so much because I was vanilla and didn't have a role. Thanks for clearing that up a bit more.
Scaevola Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 Thank you Speedy, a very fair assessment. I'll be certain to participate some more in the thread in future games.
def Posted October 30, 2014 Author Posted October 30, 2014 I don't think there's any perfect way to criticize, and certainly I'm less tactful than many, but in all cases, it's not a personal thing. Just keep playing, and see where it goes. My first game was a major flame out, and Tammo and Trumpet King had major blunders against me in their earliest games, and both went on to be multiple hosts and solid players. If you put in a lot of effort, the potential to make an megablocks of yourself increases, but you also have something to learn from. It really is a way to become a better player.
mostlytechnic Posted October 31, 2014 Posted October 31, 2014 No problem Mencot. This was my first time as vanilla town, I wasn't sure what to do so I thought reaching out and trusting your miller claim could start town working together. On the same thought, sorry Xenophobic Monoxide for not talikg more to you in PM. When you asked me right away what, if any, roles I had I figured you for scum. I should have talked to you a little more. Oh well, lessons learned for next time. Ah, sounds like you made the right calls to me. Be VERY VERY wary of PM discussions and trusting people. The scum use PMs to their great advantage, even making up entire fake PM chains to use after scum die to "prove" the remaining scum are town, etc. Based on the day posts, I would not have trusted Xen one bit in PM (heck, half the deadboard had Xen as the last scum). I did get lazy towards the end but what do you expect, there was only a few of us. There wasn't much to add at the time since everyone else was fairly quite as well. But from the beginning, yeah, I'll admit I wasn't a "team player" and was kind of an a-hole, which I apologize for, but being a new player I didn't expect people to say what they did. If I had know, I probably would have fought back but when everyone votes against you, it's tough to make a recovery from it. Overall, I think I did pretty damn good strategically but as a team player, not so much. I did make it to the finally and I did get the Godfather lynched so that should be taken into consideration. It's still a learning process and playing it hands-on is the best way to learn. From what I've seen the only times there's real problems in mafia are when players take anything personally. It's all a game, and a game wrapped in roleplaying at that. But yeah, it's super easy to panic when the noose is headed for your neck. I've been there! And like Speedy said to Chicken, making it to the end is not the goal. It's great, but it would've been better for you to be lynched day 1 than jamesn since he's had a night role. I was killed on night 1 but this game was still a win for me since the town won. Team play is way more important than how many days you can survive. So much so that the only thing better (from the town's perspective) than a vanilla town getting lynched is a scum getting lynched. It's better for a vanilla to get lynched than to have no lynch! The voting patterns become critical later in the game. It's how I picked out stick as the final scum.
Brickelodeon Posted October 31, 2014 Posted October 31, 2014 Thanks for the feedback Def. You are right that my enthusiasm greatly exceeds my skill. Hopefully that will change with time!
jluck Posted October 31, 2014 Posted October 31, 2014 Thanks for hosting def, and thanks all for playing! I agree that we can't take anything personal, it's weird to straight out lie to people that your otherwise friendly with, but it's part of what makes this game so fun! We can lead someone on all game and then have it turned back on us one game later, it all comes around
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