conductorjoe Posted July 9, 2007 Posted July 9, 2007 I did that once on a forum I used to run and I had to shut it down within a couple days. I mean really, what is the actual point of religious discussion between people of different beliefs? "Hi, I'm a Christian. Hi, I'm a Jew. Hi, I'm an atheist." It always ends up either a bunch of pointless discussion like that, or something worse. People inevitably start arguing. It simply doesn't work... Jinzoningen, you're contradicting yourself here-you're saying that a religious forum would not work because of people being disrespectful and argumentative, yet that is exactly what you yourself are doing, more so than anyone else in this topic. It's kind of funny seeing someone put down people who "think they are so right" when you yourself share this viewpoint. As others have said, forums like that are simply potential arguments. The only good purpose I have ever seen religious discussion do online(besides on a religious website) is an "agree to disagree" kind of thing that really has no place on Eurobricks.
Hinckley Posted July 9, 2007 Posted July 9, 2007 Jinzoningen, you're contradicting yourself here-you're saying that a religious forum would not work because of people being disrespectful and argumentative, yet that is exactly what you yourself are doing, more so than anyone else in this topic. It's kind of funny seeing someone put down people who "think they are so right" when you yourself share this viewpoint. Are you sure you are talking about Jinzoningen?
conductorjoe Posted July 9, 2007 Posted July 9, 2007 (edited) Yes sir. Edited July 9, 2007 by conductorjoe
Hinckley Posted July 9, 2007 Posted July 9, 2007 Yes sir. Okay, well I'm just curious. I'm not trying to stir up the pot or anything here, but let's look through his three posts in this topic and can you please tell me where he's being a. contradictive or b. argumentative... Well, that in itself isn't reason enough to not discuss things. Alot of what we talk about is very personal.The real problem is alot of religions just can't seem to keep things on a personal, individual level... trying to grow outside the boundaries it should stay in... trying to forcefully assimilate the rest of the world... consume everyone and everything around it like it's Tetsuo at the end of the movie Akira. Then, to get defensive and or violent when someone unintimidated places a mirror in front of it. That's why it can't be. Religion, beliefs, politics and the like, though often stated otherwise, are REALLY immature subjects. As for the request for "lifestyle" discussion... I see not too much of a problem in that. I have a feeling this thread is already starting to be a discussion on religion ;-)O-oh! Just merely getting a head start on it if this new forum is a yes, or simply illustrating the inevitable downside should it in fact, as it seems, be a no. X-D The problem with religion on a forum is the same as it is in real life.A handful of missionaries can fly to a jungle to preach to the "savages" of their god, only to find the savages have a god that says praise is in the form of consuming their flesh. Hey, it's happened. One can talk respect and understanding all they want, but in the end, it's a bunch of people thinking they're right, backed by this creator of all things... arguing with a bunch of people thinking they're right, backed by their creator of all things. Oh yes. Conflict unavoidable. Resolution impossible. Sorry to be so persistent, I just would like some clarification. I, personally don't see anything wrong with Jinzoningen's posts and I believe your description of his actions are inaccurate. Thanks. :-)
conductorjoe Posted July 9, 2007 Posted July 9, 2007 (edited) "The problem with religion on a forum is the same as it is in real life. A handful of missionaries can fly to a jungle to preach to the "savages" of their god, only to find the savages have a god that says praise is in the form of consuming their flesh. Hey, it's happened. One can talk respect and understanding all they want, but in the end, it's a bunch of people thinking they're right, backed by this creator of all things... arguing with a bunch of people thinking they're right, backed by their creator of all things. Oh yes. Conflict unavoidable. Resolution impossible." Contradictory: "Arguing with a bunch of people thinking they're right" He is doing the same thing-"Religion is wrong and I am right". Is it not true that Jinzo himself is implying that he is right and they are wrong? It is argumentative for a simple reason: His statements are insulting to people who are actually "religious"-his "a bunch of people thinking they're right" statement is a huge generalization. Backed up by what? His own personal opinion? Edited July 9, 2007 by conductorjoe
Hinckley Posted July 9, 2007 Posted July 9, 2007 It is argumentative for a simple reason: His statements are insulting to people who are actually "religious"-his "a bunch of people thinking they're right" statement is a huge generalization. Backed up by what? His own personal opinion? Oh sorry. :-$ I interpreted Jinzoningen's post differently. All I hear him saying is "it simply doesn't work" which sounds a little familiar... It simply doesn't work... I don't see anything wrong with him saying "a bucnh of people thinking they're right." He doesn't seem to me to mean all religious people. It's very similar to your opinion that all the religious conversations in your forum were a bunch of pointless discussion That why I was surprised you meant Jinzoningen because I thought your views were very similar. Sorry about the confusion.
conductorjoe Posted July 9, 2007 Posted July 9, 2007 (edited) I never said that was what happened on my forum, I gave that as an example of a possible outcome. I did not say that that is what will happen-I said that is a possibility. Which is undeniably true. Who else would his a "a bunch of people thinking they are right" statement be directed to? There is only one group of people that think that way (at least in a spiritual context), they are "fundamentalists", which means you believe in the absolute truth of your religion and the falseness of others. Of course it could also apply to atheists thinking that they are right in their thinking that there is no God or anything. Thus adding atheists to the list of people possibly offended by his statement. Edited July 9, 2007 by conductorjoe
Hinckley Posted July 9, 2007 Posted July 9, 2007 I never said that was what happened on my forum, I gave that as an example of a possible outcome. I did not say that that is what will happen-I said that is a possibility. Which is undeniably true.Who else would his a "a bunch of people thinking they are right" statement be directed to? There is only one group of people that think that way (at least in a spiritual context), they are "fundamentalists", which means you believe in the absolute truth of your religion and the falseness of others. do not think in the "they are wrong and we are right" mindset that Jinzo spoke of. If they did, that would make them religious. Of course it could also apply to atheists thinking that they are right in their thinking that there is no God or anything. Thus adding atheists to the list of people possibly offended by his statement. 8-| oh, now i see...i guess...um...do you like LEGOs?...I do. I think I'm gonna go talk about LEGO somewhere... Thanks. Later.
Piranha Posted July 9, 2007 Posted July 9, 2007 (edited) lol ver funny Sir Dillion :-D Nice little 300 joke Hmm if the universe was created for hinckley here is what else I would do After climbing the summit of everst I seek the advise of a tibeten monk I ask "what is the meaning of life" He replies "to please hinckley39" :-P X-D Piranha Edited July 9, 2007 by Piranha
Siegfried Posted July 9, 2007 Posted July 9, 2007 Hmm if the universe was created for hinckley here is what else I would doAfter climbing the summit of everst I seek the advise of a tibeten monk I ask "what is the meaning of life" He replies "to please hinckley39" :-P X-D You've been there too eh? Bit cold but it sure killed some time over the weekend.
Sir Dillon Posted July 10, 2007 Posted July 10, 2007 Who else would his a "a bunch of people thinking they are right" statement be directed to? There is only one group of people that think that way (at least in a spiritual context), they are "fundamentalists", which means you believe in the absolute truth of your religion and the falseness of others. Of course it could also apply to atheists thinking that they are right in their thinking that there is no God or anything. Thus adding atheists to the list of people possibly offended by his statement. Well, you as a Christian, believe that your religion is the correct one to follow, correct? A Muslim believes that Islam is the correct religion, and so on. While you may not be trying to force your 'right' religion on others, you still think that you're right. Thus, you have a bunch of people thinking they are right.
Starwars4J Posted July 10, 2007 Posted July 10, 2007 Well, you as a Christian, believe that your religion is the correct one to follow, correct? A Muslim believes that Islam is the correct religion, and so on. While you may not be trying to force your 'right' religion on others, you still think that you're right. Thus, you have a bunch of people thinking they are right. Well I guess that's what he was trying to distinguish, when he mentioned fundies. For example I believe my beliefs are right (otherwise why would I believe them?). They don't necessarily follow with any mainstream religion of course, but they work for me. I believe them, I live my life according to my beliefs (which naturally include what I believe to be right and wrong), but I by no means believe that I know I'm right. For example I have no idea if Christianity is right, or Judaism, or Islam, or even if the Native Americans had it right! We could all be wrong at the same time, or we could all be right at the same time. I don't believe that it's possible to know everything, and to know which is ultimately right, so why don't we all just live our lives believing what we want to believe, and letting everyone else believe what they want? :-)
Sir Dillon Posted July 10, 2007 Posted July 10, 2007 Well I guess that's what he was trying to distinguish, when he mentioned fundies. For example I believe my beliefs are right (otherwise why would I believe them?). They don't necessarily follow with any mainstream religion of course, but they work for me. I believe them, I live my life according to my beliefs (which naturally include what I believe to be right and wrong), but I by no means believe that I know I'm right. For example I have no idea if Christianity is right, or Judaism, or Islam, or even if the Native Americans had it right! We could all be wrong at the same time, or we could all be right at the same time. I don't believe that it's possible to know everything, and to know which is ultimately right, so why don't we all just live our lives believing what we want to believe, and letting everyone else believe what they want? :-) I like that view on things. Personally, what I believe, I feel is 'right', which is the reason I believe it. Because I feel that I'm right, I tend to think that beliefs other than mine aren't right, but I'm not going to go around telling people they are wrong. And like you said, I don't 'know' that I'm right. I feel that if we had a debate forum, people could get carried away to the point they start telling people that their beliefs are wrong, which is one reason for things getting nasty.
Starwars4J Posted July 10, 2007 Posted July 10, 2007 I like that view on things. Personally, what I believe, I feel is 'right', which is the reason I believe it. Because I feel that I'm right, I tend to think that beliefs other than mine aren't right, but I'm going to go around telling people they are wrong. And like you said, I don't 'know' that I'm right. I feel that if we had a debate forum, people could get carried away to the point they start telling people that their beliefs are wrong, which is one reason for things getting nasty. I agree completely. Too many people are caught up in their own beliefs to consider that they might not be true. That just leads to "I'm right and you're wrong" nonsense...
Siegfried Posted July 10, 2007 Posted July 10, 2007 I agree completely with Sir Dillon and Starwars4Js discussion above. The simple truth with beliefs is that there is no right or wrong. But facts are another matter and most beliefs can't be proved or dis-proved.
Sir Dillon Posted July 10, 2007 Posted July 10, 2007 I agree completely. Too many people are caught up in their own beliefs to consider that they might not be true. That just leads to "I'm right and you're wrong" nonsense... Well that, and that 99% of the time, not matter how much you debate with someone, they aren't going to change what they believe, and neither are you. Just a note, I left out a key 'not' in my last post... :-$ it's fixed now.
JINZONINGEN73 Posted July 10, 2007 Posted July 10, 2007 Jinzoningen, you're contradicting yourself here-you're saying that a religious forum would not work because of people being disrespectful and argumentative, yet that is exactly what you yourself are doing, more so than anyone else in this topic. On a good note, I'll restrain myself from using physical violence, brainwashing through indoctrination, fear, banishment, ostracizing, or undeserved guilt from normal human functions in my pursuit of having others understand my position on said matter. ;-) It's kind of funny seeing someone put down people who "think they are so right" when you yourself share this viewpoint. Even were my response to have been a simple "Yes" or No", they would have been me thinking I was right. However, I do tend to use visually descriptive wording to allow comprehension of my thoughts to as wide an audience as possible.
Vader Posted July 10, 2007 Posted July 10, 2007 Ok guys I think this subject has more than run its course, already we have seen how easy it is to misinturpt different member
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