Bionicle 2015 Discussion

[Quisoves Pugnat]

Not a guess; we were directly told by multiple people that it is a "soft" reboot. The reason being they are strongly hinting towards connections to the old storyline (potentially involving the Vahi). They dropped major hints to the Vahi being only "half a mask" and the story will involve its "completion." We're probably looking at the following:

-Toa from the Mataverse and are transported through time to an alternate timeline/dimension via Vahi

-They crash land on Okoto

-They lose their memories

-REBOOT

They will likely only delve into this territory in order to leave it ambiguous for the fans. There may be some kind of payoff involving the Vahi but I don't expect we'll ever be returning to the old universe. They stressed the concise, direct form of storytelling they wish to go for in the panel when they were mentioning how they'll no longer use a lot of old terminology. This whole deal will just likely be used as a bridging gap for fans; for all intents and purposes, it is a reboot.

Fascinating. So they named the Vahi? Or did they simply say "Mask of Time?"

I'm puzzled by how this can be considered a soft reboot by any standards. Even if they do go the Abramsverse route, that's pretty close to a hard reboot.

Makuta, a mask maker in the manner of Arthahka or Karzahni and brother to Ekimu? Lewa, Toa of Plantlife and Air? The Mask of Creation, the work of Ekimu? Given the apparent contradiction between the term used and what has been confirmed so far, I'll assume that they have a very different definition of "soft reboot."

Edited October 10, 2014 by Quisoves Pugnat

[Dorek]

Considering how differently everybody uses "reboot", I dunno. I'd like to hear Greg's take on it, and what BZP's interviews yield as well.

[DuckBricks]

And, after having been busy elsewhere, I finally find out that it's a reboot.

My reaction and thoughts?

I'm going to be saving a lot of money this year.

It's not that it's a bad plot, it's that it's a very one-wave plot. The original Bionicle story was a deep mystery, that could support it over all the years, even for a final pair of waves after it had been revealed. This is very much a one-wave plot. It's a good story, but it's no more Bionicle than Hero Factory was. Sure, they both have masks, and robots(?) named Toa, but Bionicle had an aura to it, a background that interacted with the characters and was as much a part of the story as they were, whereas this is rather flat, to be honest. I know that's going to come off as Gen1ing, but the fact is, it's true. Here are the plots:

Bionicle: There were once six Toa, who washed up on a mysterious island in mysterious canisters. It was their duty to protect the island's inhabitants from the dark one known as the Makuta, until such a time as the Great Spirit would rise again...

2015 Bionicle: There were two brothers who made masks. One was better liked, and because he was jealous, the other broke their promises, and made an evil mask. They killed each other. Now, it's up to you to go out, and collect all of their masks from the toy shelves of your nearest department store!

It's not that it's a bad story, it's that it's a story that's been told over and over again. It has some originality, and by itself, it'd be an okay story. But Bionicle demands a better story than that. This was the franchise that came up with a giant robot having capsules of medicine healing him that contained smaller robots. That's not just something you make up on the spot, that's a brilliant idea that deserved a brilliant telling. Which it got.

2015 is not a bad story, but it isn't really comparable to the old one on any level.

We still have no idea where Te Toa came from...

Thus the shrug.

It appears Pohatu's weapons are called Jetarangs. Oh. Well then.

And Tahu has... ADRENALINE MODE!!! Get ready for Omega Tahu!

[Still Raindrop]

Lego: "Hey kids, get ready to have your heads hurt! The Toa are time copies of Toa from a different universe created when the Vahi--a mask of Time created by Vakama--um, who was a Toa of Metru Nui--um, which was inside of a robot--who, um, was Mata Nui--who was the brother of Makuta--but, um, not this Makuta, but this Makuta is a copy of that Makuta---You know what kids? Reboot time."

Well, yeah, when you put it like that, of course it's confusing.

First, as Mesonak hinted at, the connection isn't likely to play a very huge role. In addition, look at the Star Trek reboot (since that seems to be the most apt). I'm a fan of the three Star Trek shows from the 90s*: The Next Generation, Deep Space Nine (which is my personal favorite), and Voyager. Those three shows developed a lot of older lore and built a very complex and well-thought-out universe. This is the universe from which Spock Prime came in the reboot: a universe shaped by the Borg, the Dominion War, the Bajoran wormhole, exploration of other quadrants, etc.

How much of that was mentioned in the reboot? None of it. People don't have to know the old shows to enjoy the movie (in fact, I think that enjoyment of the old shows decreases enjoyment of the reboot in this case--but that's a discussion for another time, as it doesn't appear that Bionicle will make the same mistakes from what we've seen). My sister-in-law (who is much younger than my wife and me) liked the reboots, but she didn't even know that there were previous series. If there are, in fact, ties to the old universe, I doubt that Lego will go out of its way to needlessly complicate the new Bionicle, just like Abrams didn't go out of his way to needlessly complicate the rebooted Star Trek.

*Yeah, I know TNG started in 1987 and Voyager ended in 2001, but the majority of episodes from the three shows were in the 90s.

Edited October 10, 2014 by Mariko

[dviddy]

You know, would it have killed Lego to say today whether this is a reboot or not?! "Hey look at this. Now speculate for three more months!!"

By the way, I REALLY hope that we get something like the Mata Nui Online Game. I played it recently...... . I mean, they already have the same animations, so......And wouldn't it be great if it was released, like, NOW?!

I just wish we could corroborate that somehow. BZP is being mum on the issue other than having previously said it was a reboot; surely they interviewed the panelists? I imagine it will be made clearer in the next few days, either online or from statements at NYCC, but it's two competing sources against each other otherwise.

LEGO used the term "reboot" no less than a dozen times during the panel. Not once in an interview we did with them, nor in the panel, nor at the event, did any designer, story lead, advance artist, etc, use the term "soft" so I don't know what TTV is reporting (and I overheard a good chunk of their interviews too). It seems more like speculation on their parts. TLG reps did mention the mask of time being only half a mask and the full mask being a plot point, and we were shown an image of the "Temple of Time" during the panel. I'm 100% certain the Toa in this line will not be the same characters from the original sent through time shenanigans by the Vahi. Again, it seems more like TTV conflating the "we are appealing to old fans via easter eggs and references, and the line is a reboot in the way NuTrek was" with "they are connected". I and the other BZP staff took "like the new Star Trek" to mean more "so the old universe is unaffected and still exists, we didn't wipe it out to reboot the line a la DC 52."

On that point, I want to mention that I and two other BZP staff members have been under NDA for a large part of 2014 regarding the return of BIONICLE, where our contact told us it would be a solid reboot back in July.

(Also they sent me a bunch of pre-release parts which is why I knew the way the masks attached but I was being clever about it.)

[Dorek]

LEGO used the term "reboot" no less than a dozen times during the panel. Not once in an interview we did with them, nor in the panel, nor at the event, did any designer, story lead, advance artist, etc, use the term "soft" so I don't know what TTV is reporting (and I overheard a good chunk of their interviews too). It seems more like speculation on their parts. TLG reps did mention the mask of time being only half a mask and the full mask being a plot point, and we were shown an image of the "Temple of Time" during the panel. I'm 100% certain the Toa in this line will not be the same characters from the original sent through time shenanigans by the Vahi. Again, it seems more like TTV conflating the "we are appealing to old fans via easter eggs and references, and the line is a reboot in the way NuTrek was" with "they are connected". I and the other BZP staff took "like the new Star Trek" to mean more "so the old universe is unaffected and still exists, we didn't wipe it out to reboot the line a la DC 52."

On that point, I want to mention that I and two other BZP staff members have been under NDA for a large part of 2014 regarding the return of BIONICLE, where our contact told us it would be a solid reboot back in July.

(Also they sent me a bunch of pre-release parts which is why I knew the way the masks attached but I was being clever about it.)

Thanks a lot for the information, Deevs. I'm not accusing TTV of lying or anything like that, I just wanted to hear what BZP's take on it was and what their experiences with the panel were. You've provided a great deal of insight, and I appreciate it a lot.

(also I KNEW you had some of those masks you clever shrew. I'm jelly of the transparent red version.)

[DuckBricks]

This legend video seems more akin to the original Turaga's tale with rocks... It's just the basis of the legend, not the main storyline... So previous comparisons between the original main bionicle storyline with Toa washing up and this are like comparing apples to oranges...

[CabooseBM]

Aw what? Onua's not a lady? Well, pack it up guys, I couldn't work my mojo hard enough, decommission the hype train, the dream is dead. =P

Joking aside, this is all really exciting, isn't it? It seems LEGO is doing all the right things to get me interested. I love the Legend video, and the animation style is lovely. The stills we've seen are all super charming! I think this a really perfect marriage of style and set accuracy, and I think the CCBS is partially to thank for that.

I hope Pohatu has trans-yellow, and the packaging seems to agree with that, but at the same time trans lime green(Or whatever.) has more useful parts associated with it, and we haven't gotten bones in that color either.

[Aethersprite]

Thanks for the info, DV! Will BZP be putting up a full report of the panel? I'm interested to know what went down. Also, did you have the opportunity to mess with the parts? While I'm loving the new mask connection, I'm afraid it's going to be loose. Does it come off easily?

Anyway, on the new story: While all the new names are going to take a while to get used to, this is a nice direction that Bionicle is taking! I have a ton of questions, but I'm sure they'll be answered in time. In particular, though: Are Ekium and Makuta supposed to be Protectors, or are they an entire different species entirely?

Additionally, it's nice to see that they're keeping the 'Toa' term! Although it seems that a lot other terms are being dropped, like calling masks Kanohi and giving the masks individual names.

[Logan McOwen]

I doodled a MOC of Ekimu last night after a lengthy Skype (or should I say, hype) call with fellow bonkle nerds.

Whaddya think guys, gals and otherwise?

[Mandate]

Doesn't look like Ekimu at all, really. 3M trans-dark azure (or just azure? sorry, I never bother with specific colors.) should be used on the shoulder-joints, the hammer (I believe) uses a piece similar to the new 6-cannon. Forgotten what it was called. Might be better to wait for the sets to come out before trying to MOC these guys.

[demitri]

how do we get gold chrome masks?

random include or mask pack?

[Mesonak]

Apologies for any misunderstandings as a result of any messages of ours! It was a pretty crazy day today, so I'm sorry if any of our info that we were meant to be relaying got crossed with our opinions. I've spoken to the others to help me refresh my memory in an attempt to clear up this misunderstanding; here's what happened.We inquired as to whether it was a reboot or not, and Jordan Paxton said the following (DIRECT QUOTE):

"I don't want to say it's a reboot, because there are certainly elements that connect to the old story." Afterwards, we inquired as to whether these "elements" included the Toa, and whether they were the same Toa from the old storyline. He replied to that with the answer regarding the Mask of Time being "half a mask." Obviously this lends some credence leads credence to the belief that this will be a "soft reboot" of sorts, DEPENDING ON YOUR USAGE OF THE TERM, where elements from the old story still come into play and have an effect. Hence why, in our tweets, we used that terminology. I know we captured the Vahi bit on one of our interviews (provided it recorded okay), whereas the Toa question I believe was off-recording. However, we wouldn't really have any reason to lie. :P

(Also they sent me a bunch of pre-release parts which is why I knew the way the masks attached but I was being clever about it.)

That's pretty fantastic! That trans-red Hau is a sight to behold. Very cool that you were able to get that stuff.

Edited October 10, 2014 by Mesonak

[Jacen Torq]

I'm sure this will come in handy if the previous story does come into play at all.

Edited October 10, 2014 by Jacen Torq

[Mandate]

So, I just finished unboxing and building Tahu Nuva (yup, mint-condition, $15 :D) and I must say.

I LIKE THIS BONKLE

So it's safe to say if the new Bonklez are anything like the originals, it's a guaranteed buy for EVERY Toa. I feel like I've missed out on my Childhood (well, actually, I did, but that's not the point )

EDIT:

oh lol. The Facebook comments

Hey look, they decided to reboot hero factory!

I wish they would stop making things just bigger and less versatile. The fun of Bionicle and Lego was that the pieces were versatile and adaptable, not super-specific and only usable in one rare circumstance.

*insert meme*

Edited October 10, 2014 by JayWalker

[Dorek]

Hey man, nostalgia is powerful. It can make you forget the small things, like facts.

[Gatanui]

LEGO used the term "reboot" no less than a dozen times during the panel. Not once in an interview we did with them, nor in the panel, nor at the event, did any designer, story lead, advance artist, etc, use the term "soft" so I don't know what TTV is reporting (and I overheard a good chunk of their interviews too). It seems more like speculation on their parts. TLG reps did mention the mask of time being only half a mask and the full mask being a plot point, and we were shown an image of the "Temple of Time" during the panel. I'm 100% certain the Toa in this line will not be the same characters from the original sent through time shenanigans by the Vahi. Again, it seems more like TTV conflating the "we are appealing to old fans via easter eggs and references, and the line is a reboot in the way NuTrek was" with "they are connected". I and the other BZP staff took "like the new Star Trek" to mean more "so the old universe is unaffected and still exists, we didn't wipe it out to reboot the line a la DC 52."

On that point, I want to mention that I and two other BZP staff members have been under NDA for a large part of 2014 regarding the return of BIONICLE, where our contact told us it would be a solid reboot back in July.

(Also they sent me a bunch of pre-release parts which is why I knew the way the masks attached but I was being clever about it.)

So I was partly right about you having the sets already. :P You're making me jealous! Why did you get those pieces early and why did LEGO tell you so early about it? Or can't you tell us the reason yet?

-Gata

[Mandate]

So I was partly right about you having the sets already. :P You're making me jealous! Why did you get those pieces early and why did LEGO tell you so early about it? Or can't you tell us the reason yet?

-Gata

I would love to make some Star Wars jokes, but it would be too far on the verge of bullying.

It was probably to test the new elements, see how the fanbase reacted to them. Which begs the question, do the new shooters work well?

[Timeline15]

I doodled a MOC of Ekimu last night after a lengthy Skype (or should I say, hype) call with fellow bonkle nerds.

I think you did the torso really well, and nice work on mimicking the animation style. I would recommend using the trans blue from the ice sets as opposed to mata blue though.

[Shakar]

So from DV's pics, I can say that:

1)The new Hau and the Akaku are close to the original ones in size, but the new Pakari is pretty tiny. Then again the 2001 Pakari WAS pretty tall.

2)Onua's weapons are titanium metallic, not silver. So there's more variety than I thought: silver (Gali, Tahu, Lewa, Kopaka), titanium metallic (Onua,

Pohatu, Lewa), gold (Tahu) and white (Kopaka). Reminds me of the Inika weapons which is, yes, a very good thing.

3)The fire/ice blade is freaking HUGE. Man I missed oversized weapons!

[Chro]

And Tahu has... ADRENALINE MODE!!!

The Toa all have that.

Hey man, nostalgia is powerful. It can make you forget the small things, like facts.

So true.

[GK733]

Vader, did you get the gearbox piece? Also I know the hands are attached by Glatorian joints but how they are attached to the body of protector of fire and earth. And apparently also on Ekimu and Makuta?

[Pate-keetongu]

I'm not reading the full topic, as I don't believe my hype is near as big as yours guys! But these seem to be quite a cool series of sets, and the reboot story looks interesting and is far enough from the old, overloaded thing. I'd wish to see what's going on with the "villagers" now. The Toa descriptions look quite good, especially Pohatu (who is the leader, what? Surprising and cool.) and Onua.

And yes, the sets.

Onua will be a buy from me, as he has some sweet parts - the glorious new mask, big black chest armor (Hopefully with stickers! I want it without printing), new steampunk-ish add-ons, and those claw/hammer/shovel pieces. Darn, I might even keep it build for a day or two to remember the times when I was a little lad and Onua was around 30% of the size of this new guy. I have to say that the color scheme is bad though, gold and silver don't look good together and I could live without trans-purple.

I might even get Pohatu, the mask looks excellent, and the boomerangs are neat. But in other hand the piece count is not good at all and there's plenty of boring silvery parts... At least trans-yellow is cool, could be used in some odd Classic Space/Blacktron mechs. Is the main color reddish brown or dark orange?

Kopaka in nice too, but 25€ price tag will be big enough to keep me far. Wish I could get the mask somewhere though, liking it a lot.

Don't like Tahu. Gold and silver are terrible balanced, extra swords look like a joke and body armor as a shin guard never works. Mask is alright I guess, but meh.

Lewa has a solid and good color scheme, but is otherwise such a boring figure. There's some nice uses of those claw pieces, but the mask is a bit dull and there's simply no interesting parts. I could say the same thing about Gali. I find the lack of recolors disturbing.

I like rahi-esque battle function on LORD OF SKULL SPIDERS, but that doesn't give much for a builder. I have enough angled liftarms and Glatorian neck already.

[Timeline15]

The Toa descriptions look quite good, especially Pohatu (who is the leader, what? Surprising and cool.)

I think the description meant he's always the first to charge into battle, rather than being the actual leader of the team. I really hope they don't make Tahu out to be some young rookie or something, the description sounds like he could be like his old self, or like this.

[Shakar]

I took another look at the Toa group shot, and Onua's weapons definitely look silver. DV, did you get those pieces in titanium metallic only? It's a bit odd that you got them in another colour but not in the one they appear in sets. I think I'd prefer silver but titanium metallic is ok too.