Bionicle 2015 Discussion

[GK733]

There's another reason that I think makes a Gen2 Takanuva ill-conceived. Takanuva was designed as a counterpart to Makuta, a diabolical entity with a strong motif of decay, corruption, and darkness. Gen2's Makuta seems far more defined by his covetousness. He wears the Mask of Control, he forged a mask with all the elements, and he's been described as "the Mask Hoarder."

Barring a major change in the emphasis and portrayal of Makuta, a Toa of Light would come rather out of left field.

That's another thing. Then again he/she could be the toa of time.

[TwistLaw]

Ekimu is Mata Nui, Takanuva and Arthaka all rolled up in a single character.

This clearly means we'll so none of them in G2, at least not as we used to know them.

[CabooseBM]

I think LEGO could only afford the one male voice actor. That's why her voice is so manly. What annoys me most is that Gali has done...little to nothing in the animations. I think that's worse than her manly voice. Since we are also on this subject, I wonder why there couldn't be more female characters adapted for the six toa....I could very well have seen Lewa and Kopaka as female characters. Anyway, that's just my opinion. I would love them all the same.

*chants* O-nu-a! O-nu-a!

=P

[DuckBricks]

*chants* O-nu-a! O-nu-a!

=P

As much as I want that (Onya for the win! ), I can imagine the fanbase uproar that would get....

[CabooseBM]

As much as I want that (Onya for the win! ), I can imagine the fanbase uproar that would get....

It's so funny, the importance people attach to genders that aren't their own!

[MakutaOfWar]

I have no problem with the genders the way they are(except when all voices are male), but I definitely want a more balanced gender ratio in the future. I also don't understand people's view of "feminine" look. Like geez people, there are skinny dude's in the world and muscular ladies, stop stereotyping. ;-;

And to those who say- "Boys are the targeted audience" take a look at this 70's letter from Lego, I do hope this still stands today. http://i.imgur.com/XmlDUox.jpg

Edited September 10, 2015 by MakutaOfWar

[DuckBricks]

It's so funny, the importance people attach to genders that aren't their own!

I wasn't saying I personally held that opinion, but I was saying that the majority of the fanbase most likely would.

[dviddy]

And to those who say- "Boys are the targeted audience" take a look at this 70's letter from Lego, I do hope this still stands today. http://i.imgur.com/XmlDUox.jpg

Unfortunately, LEGO as a whole, is targeted to boys, and it was partly on purpose. One of the major shifts in LEGO's marketing that (awkwardly) helped them create a better sales portfolio was to shift their gender-neutral advertisements to a boys-oriented market in the 90s and early 2000s. While they've shifted again slightly (the change in LEGO's market situation allows for more freedom to play with these sort of things), the marketing history that started with the beginning of the modern information age has sort of solidified as well. I think it'll change, but it's going to take time.

[CabooseBM]

I wasn't saying I personally held that opinion, but I was saying that the majority of the fanbase most likely would.

Oh no! That absolutely was not targeted at you! And I apologize for the misconception, I too was commenting on the inherent silliness of the fanbase.

[Fulcrumfan91]

It's so funny, the importance people attach to genders that aren't their own!

Agreed.

[TwistLaw]

Unfortunately, LEGO as a whole, is targeted to boys, and it was partly on purpose. One of the major shifts in LEGO's marketing that (awkwardly) helped them create a better sales portfolio was to shift their gender-neutral advertisements to a boys-oriented market in the 90s and early 2000s. While they've shifted again slightly (the change in LEGO's market situation allows for more freedom to play with these sort of things), the marketing history that started with the beginning of the modern information age has sort of solidified as well. I think it'll change, but it's going to take time.

Further, small proof of this: in this forum we're all males. Each one of us.

As they say where I come from, this is a sausage fest.

[Kalhiki]

Further, small proof of this: in this forum we're all males. Each one of us.

As they say where I come from, this is a sausage fest.

Woah, hold your horses, we're not all dudes. There's some gals here.

Edited September 10, 2015 by Kalhiki

[TwistLaw]

Woah, hold your horses, we're not all dudes. There's some gals here.

In the action figures section? I doubt there are more than three. But I guess we're going off topic, so I'll cut it.

[TheDesuComplex]

Further, small proof of this: in this forum we're all males. Each one of us.

As they say where I come from, this is a sausage fest.

Woah, hold your horses, we're not all dudes. There's some gals here.

While it is a gross oversimplification to say that every user of this forum is male, I must say that I haven't seen any users specifically with the 'Lady' tag. That tag is optional, so it makes sense that there might be some lurkers or users that choose not to get it for whatever reason. Speaking on Bionicle and Constraction, though, I imagine that the vast majority of fans are male because the marketing is oriented towards boys.

[Scarilian]

Changing a pre-established characters gender or race (In this case what element they represent) is a little lazy in my view.. With Lewa''s element it atleast had a slightly better reasoning behind it and he still keeps the aspects of a Toa of Air so it boils down to simply being a title change.

A female Takanuva or making Takanuva anything other than a Toa of Light would seem forced - if anything they already have Ekimu seemingly serving as the opposite of Makuta and given the other list of names we got, there is a possibility he may even get a Toa-sized form in 2016 - so the role of Takanuva seems filled. That is not saying we could'nt get a G2 Takanuva, but simply that we already have characters established who could fill the role.

Ekimu is Mata Nui, Takanuva and Arthaka all rolled up in a single character.

This clearly means we'll so none of them in G2, at least not as we used to know them.

He has very minor aspects of those characters. A lot of what made the other characters who they were was more than just a small selection their actions or their abilities. While Ekimu could fill there role he doesnt necessarily mean we'll not see the characters return.

I have no problem with the genders the way they are(except when all voices are male), but I definitely want a more balanced gender ratio in the future. I also don't understand people's view of "feminine" look. Like geez people, there are skinny dude's in the world and muscular ladies, stop stereotyping. ;-;

I think this implies a bigger problem, a lot of people believe that male characters only appeal to males and females to female. Bionicle does not need an influx of females to appeal to the female demographic. One of the main ideas with Lego as you demonstrated via your image was that a toyline can appeal to boys and girls, that doesnt mean they need to throw in a bunch of girls to appeal - it means that gender constrictions placed by those thinking only females appeal to females and only males appeal to males are nonsense. Throwing in more females would'nt change people's mindsets about whether girls can buy toys that are stereotypically viewed as things for males.

Elves for example could be considered female targetted, however it does have a large portion of male fans. Ninjago has quite a sizeable female fanbase despite having few female main characters. Adding more females is not necessary, just make a good story and good toys and then you'll get both male and female fans.

Gender roles also have little meaning in the Bionicle universe and the designs of the official female characters (Other than Roodaka) have never been what could be considered stereotyping. There is nothing overly female about Gali's design - especially not to the point she is stereotypically female. Unless you somehow view the slightly altered CCBS shell placement on her legs as being femine, as every other aspect is replicated on other sets... :L

Edited September 10, 2015 by Scarilian

[TheOneVeyronian]

Further, small proof of this: in this forum we're all males. Each one of us.

As they say where I come from, this is a sausage fest.

I'm actually female, so no we are definitely not all males here. I just don't like pink and cutesy dolls so I appear more manly than I really am

But I got to be honest, this matter of gender in Bionicle has come up time and time again and to be honest I find it a little boring. Yes Bionicle's target market is primarily boys and LEGO seems to think that female characters don't appeal to boys, when in actual fact I've seen plenty of boys enjoy Gali and other female Bionicle characters. Yes, as a female I would like to see more female characters but to be honest, I'm quite happy that female characters exist at all in a very male-centric line, even if they can sometimes be under-represented (see lack of Skull Villain pairing for Gali then subsequent less-focus-on-Gali in the summer animations so far for instance).

[TwistLaw]

I'm actually female, so no we are definitely not all males here. I just don't like pink and cutesy dolls so I appear more manly than I really am

But I got to be honest, this matter of gender in Bionicle has come up time and time again and to be honest I find it a little boring. Yes Bionicle's target market is primarily boys and LEGO seems to think that female characters don't appeal to boys, when in actual fact I've seen plenty of boys enjoy Gali and other female Bionicle characters. Yes, as a female I would like to see more female characters but to be honest, I'm quite happy that female characters exist at all in a very male-centric line, even if they can sometimes be under-represented (see lack of Skull Villain pairing for Gali then subsequent less-focus-on-Gali in the summer animations so far for instance).

As a female, how does the existence of Roodaka make you feel? She's literally a walking stereotype, a femme fatale with heels and imposing breast.

[Tahu]

Omg what?

I personally wish there would be more girl Bionicle fan! If not only for Gali ( Or Korgot ) , but then maybe not Bionicle fan girls wouldn't find it so childish. It seemed like you don't want girl fans. But we do need them! They have the rights to join us! Gender doesn't matter!

[davidr]

Please, keep this discussion somewhere else.

[Aanchir]

I think it would be good for themes like Bionicle and Ninjago to have more female characters, but not just for the benefit of girls who like or potentially could like those series. It's also important for boys to know that girls and women can be interesting characters or even role models, and that they can be interesting or admirable without fitting some one-size-fits-all "action girl" archetype.

This isn't just a gender issue, but an issue with "token characters" in general. When a series has only one woman, or only one disabled character, or only one non-white character (though that particular issue generally doesn't come up in Bionicle, which lacks human races in general), those characters often end up standing in for that whole category of people, whether or not that's the author's intent. And thus they can give audiences an inaccurate sense that real people in that category should look or act a particular way, just because that's what they see in those particular characters and they don't have any other characters in the same world to offer a "counterpoint".

This also can tie the hands of writers, which is part of what leads to the stereotypical "action girl". If you're too afraid of offending boys to have more than one girl, but also don't want to offend girls by making that girl character seem weak or vulnerable, it's easy for her to turn into a one-note character whose sole purpose is showing she's not dumb, she's not weak, she's not vulnerable, etc. And suddenly it starts to seem like she's not allowed to have any flaws that would make her genuinely relatable. Whereas if you have multiple female characters with different personalities (Avatar: The Last Airbender is a good example of a kids' action series with diverse male AND female characters), you can show that girls can have strengths and weaknesses without making it seem like they have those strengths and weaknesses BECAUSE they're girls.

In kids' media, thinking about what lessons kids take with them is particularly significant because kids learn about the world from whatever they can get their hands on, even if it's a work of fiction meant purely for entertainment. And biases kids pick up in childhood can be difficult for them to let go of as adults.

[mysteriouspi]

Stuff

I'm in full agreement. I'm glad they didn't change the gender of any Toa on the current team (because they already existed. Sort of). But if we get a new Toa team, I'd be thrilled for at least two to be female. Bonus points if neither of them is a Toa of Water.

[TheOneVeyronian]

As a female, how does the existence of Roodaka make you feel? She's literally a walking stereotype, a femme fatale with heels and imposing breast.

I did think if it was really necesssary for the designers to give her heels, long "hair" and *ahem* big breasts. A little OTT if you ask me, but it did make for a nice Titan build.

But really the discussion of genders in Bionicle belongs in a different topic. I was pretty sure there was one made a while ago, but I can't seem to find it

[arc]

I did think if it was really necesssary for the designers to give her heels, long "hair" and *ahem* big breasts. A little OTT if you ask me, but it did make for a nice Titan build.

But really the discussion of genders in Bionicle belongs in a different topic. I was pretty sure there was one made a while ago, but I can't seem to find it

took some digging, but i have uncovered it. I also apparently posted in it there a little over a year ago (it's been that long already?) And my thoughts haven't changed much.

Although one thing I'd like to stress is female villains. In g1 even the water characters (vezok, takadox, etc) ended up being male as well. Leaving things really unbalanced. I mean we did get roodaka as people have said, but also like people have said that one wasn't the best.

http://www.eurobricks.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=97825&st=100#entry1944175

Edited September 10, 2015 by arc

[TwistLaw]

Wouldn't reviving a year old thread considered necroposting?

Edited September 10, 2015 by TwistLaw

[arc]

Wouldn't reviving a year old thread considered necroposting?

well I'm not a mod of course, but makes more sense to me than to start another thread for the same topic.