Bionicle 2016 Story Discussion & Rumors

[Vinyl Scratch]

could Dimension hopping Vezon as one year's Big bad be the best way to link the two continuities subtly? to newcomers he will just be one of many villains G2 introduced with a necromancer a hunter and a mad mask maker among them so a dimensional overlord wont be that out of place. if they keep his original eccentric mad personality Vezon can drop hints to G1 as silly quips that denote his universe hopping nature ("so you're this world's Toa of stone eh?" Vezon said to Pohatu. "you're grumpier than the last guy, and what big feet he had!") .

casual fans will just see a silly villain while those who love to look up story would be rewarded with secret knowledge as they find out those comments about their favorite Masters were true in an older continuity and it allows the latest continuity to do its own thing as that reality hopper was just one of many baddies in this particular franchise.

Big bad absolutely not.

...

But I want to see Vezon now. It's a great idea.

[ToaDraco]

could Dimension hopping Vezon as one year's Big bad be the best way to link the two continuities subtly? to newcomers he will just be one of many villains G2 introduced with a necromancer a hunter and a mad mask maker among them so a dimensional overlord wont be that out of place. if they keep his original eccentric mad personality Vezon can drop hints to G1 as silly quips that denote his universe hopping nature ("so you're this world's Toa of stone eh?" Vezon said to Pohatu. "you're grumpier than the last guy, and what big feet he had!") .

casual fans will just see a silly villain while those who love to look up story would be rewarded with secret knowledge as they find out those comments about their favorite Masters were true in an older continuity and it allows the latest continuity to do its own thing as that reality hopper was just one of many baddies in this particular franchise.

I like that idea and I think it could work.

[MakutaOfWar]

You know, now that I'm thinking about it I'm drawing comparisons of G1 and G2 with this whole legendary-mask hunt thing they've got going on this year and next year. Kind of reminds me of 2006 and 07', a set of Toa characters, a couple of groups of villains, all hunting for powerful masks. Did the Piraka and Barraki work for any higher ups? I can't remember :s

[Shakar]

Piraka unwittingly worked for Makuta, only Zaktan was aware of it. The Barraki were indipendent, which is kinda what I'm hoping to see in Umarak rather than him being another servant of Makuta's. Or at least him having some thoughts about betraying his master.

And speaking of Umarak, I do kind of hope his background is the Jungle Region. It's always been the part of Okoto I've been interested in the most, it just sounds really odd and mysterious (far more so than Le-Wahi ever felt, actually):

This region is full of large trees, savage wildlife, giant vines, and mysterious green flames. The most ancient Protector Ruins, overgrown and forgotten, are located here. Mysterious swamps, suspended islands supported by the roots of gigantic trees, and other wonders can also be found in the region. Deep in the densest jungles, hidden Jungle Tribe villages are found. The Temple of Time, the most sacred place of the islanders, is also be found there.

Maybe Umarak is some sort of powerful and evil forest spirit hailing from that region.

[MakutaOfWar]

The scenery looks almost like one of those described "suspended islands", I'm just curious why on two of the retailer catalogue pictures the sets are promoted in a fire-like region.

[xboxtravis7992]

could Dimension hopping Vezon as one year's Big bad be the best way to link the two continuities subtly? to newcomers he will just be one of many villains G2 introduced with a necromancer a hunter and a mad mask maker among them so a dimensional overlord wont be that out of place. if they keep his original eccentric mad personality Vezon can drop hints to G1 as silly quips that denote his universe hopping nature ("so you're this world's Toa of stone eh?" Vezon said to Pohatu. "you're grumpier than the last guy, and what big feet he had!") .

casual fans will just see a silly villain while those who love to look up story would be rewarded with secret knowledge as they find out those comments about their favorite Masters were true in an older continuity and it allows the latest continuity to do its own thing as that reality hopper was just one of many baddies in this particular franchise.

Actually not that bad of an idea compared to some crazy G1-G2 theories I have read, I like that it has a cameo of an old character yet doesn't imply the Toa Okoto are the SAME Toa as before, or that G2 is a sub universe of G1.

[Dorek]

Maybe Umurak isn't allied with Makuta in the beginning, but then after they meet, he gets upgraded to "the destroyer"? I wouldn't mind if he's independent, but I don't want Makuta to sit out a whole year, especially since his mask seems to be involved. Despite how much I loved 2002, I did have a slight issue with it based on the fact that the Bohrok came out of nowhere, and was later glad to see how they tied into the whole mythology. So I'd like for Makuta to have something to do with the story, even if it's arguing with Umurak over possession of his mask.

Yes, but the reasons that you seem to think it would be a problem still apply, no?

Yes and no? Star Trek could easily have gone south. Look at what happened with the new Terminator; a quasi-soft-reboot involving convoluted mechanics already established. Didn't work out so well.

This is patently not true. The idea of alternate universes in Star Trek goes back to the Original Series, starting in "the Alternative Factor." The Terran Empire-alternate universe, introduced in "Mirror, Mirror" became a recurring feature of Deep Space Nine.

I'm not a Trekkie, so I'll defer judgment on that =P. But doesn't that mean they had to ignore certain universe mechanics in order to craft this new story?

Again, who cares? Is the universe somehow less appealing, because it's divergent? Are kids really going to lose any love for it for so abstract a reason?

Kids won't care at all, since they won't care about the old story in any way (again, not an absolute truth, I'm just speaking in terms of the audience that BIONICLE is aimed at, which is set-buying kids). But people who understand the old story (the intended recipients of this linking, no?) would definitely view it differently.

Also, said confirmation, was, I believe, only given in BZP's "Ask Greg" topic. That is to say, it's something that Farshtey said, not the story, and rather obscure, to boot. Besides, Greg prescribes to a sort of Word of Demigod, whereby what he says is an assumption, liable to change, ala his claim that time-travel in the MU was impossible, or instances where he forgets a previous answer and contradicts himself.

Both the time travel statement and the prime universe statement predate the Ask Greg topic and are very much part of the canon. The idea of time travel is as old as the Vahi itself, and the sorting out of divergency in the AU's was actually something I asked about =P.

Oh, I'm quite aware that some folks want a connection. I was wondering what made you think that they were a minority, when I had seen no evidence to suggest that.

You think they're in the majority? That sounds more like something you'd have to prove. Poll it!

In all seriousness, understanding part of something does not require an understanding of the whole. If I want to keep a pet, I'll have to know how to ensure it survives happily, but I won't need to be an expert on its anatomy. When I see a cockatiel fly, I can appreciate that it is flying, whilst still wondering about the aerodynamics necessary for it to do so. Not every question about a thing needs to be answered, let alone at once.

Again, look at the new Star Trek, with its Old Spock. Do you appreciate his part in the plot more for knowing about the Original Series? Of course!

But does not being familiar with it ruin your enjoyment of the movie. I should hope not.

It all boils down to "who's your audience". With the new Trek movie, it was an assorted subsection of old fans who were happy to see the series back regardless and new fans who had a vague understanding of the themes and characters through absorbed pop culture. BIONICLE has already successfully re-introduced itself to a new audience (as well as an old one, but again, they aren't the targets) without relying on the previous continuity. So who would connecting these universes be for?

Vezon, for instance, is kind of a bad example. Would old fans find it cute? Maybe. Would that really entice the younger audience if they were to look it up? "Hey, that guy seems funny, where was he from? Oh... he was a murdering schizophrenic psychopath... um... and he can travel dimensions because he's fused to a mask of power? Wait, they aren't called masks of power, they're called Kanohi?"

Whether or not the majority of the old fans want to see the universes connected (a dubious claim, but I'll wait until I see some numbers), they aren't the target. They're the audience that STOPPED buying toys and eventually fell out of love with the story because it collapsed on itself. Not to mention they're fragmented anyway! I love seeing the term "genwunners" because they weren't uniform even when Gen1 was still a thing. It's not worth LEGO's time and effort to try and satisfy a subsection of a subsection of the population, especially since it can't be a guaranteed crowd pleaser no matter what they do. This is why a reboot was the best, and really, only choice. It's take it or leave it; the only thing holding you back from enjoying it is yourself.

[VBBN]

I just really don't see how returning to an old location makes it a G1-G2 crossover in any sense of the word. I bring up Transformer comparison quite often and again it makes sense here, Transformers is constantly rebooting the theme with the the same characters and rewriting them from their previous selves, usually offering no connection to the past shows/stories other than design cues (which obviously we have seen with this year's Toa and of course the Nuva symbols on next years), and they re-use old locations like Cybertron with no issue. You could say that Mata Nui being a physical being makes it more than just a location, but let's not forget that at one point Cybertron itself was a transformer (Primus)- it's very logical to re-use an old location, just the same as it is to use old characters with completely new stories.

Some people read farther into this than they should be without much proof to go off of for any true speculation.

[DuplexBeGreat]

I'd rather they bring back a few characters from G1's middle years (such as Roodaka or Brutaka), but without making any explicit connections to G1. Just like we have new versions of the same Toa, we'd get new versions of other classic characters. There's no need to even remotely hint that there's "another world" as long as they introduce them properly (heck, they could even take the Skull Grinder approach and give them no introduction at all other than "this is one of Makuta's many servants"), so I think it would be a nice way to please older fans without confusing younger ones.

[Dorek]

I just really don't see how returning to an old location makes it a G1-G2 crossover in any sense of the word. I bring up Transformer comparison quite often and again it makes sense here, Transformers is constantly rebooting the theme with the the same characters and rewriting them from their previous selves, usually offering no connection to the past shows/stories other than design cues (which obviously we have seen with this year's Toa and of course the Nuva symbols on next years), and they re-use old locations like Cybertron with no issue. You could say that Mata Nui being a physical being makes it more than just a location, but let's not forget that at one point Cybertron itself was a transformer (Primus)- it's very logical to re-use an old location, just the same as it is to use old characters with completely new stories.

Some people read farther into this than they should be without much proof to go off of for any true speculation.

Right, I definitely don't see this as any sort of crossover proof. It just happened to ignite a recurring dialogue that I'm getting pretty tired with. The similarities we've seen ARE the acknowledgement of the previous generation; paying respect without being slavishly beholden.

Does make me wonder if those Nuva symbols we saw in the concept art were actually teasers for 2016, or if the use in the new sets just evolved from them.

I'd rather they bring back a few characters from G1's middle years (such as Roodaka or Brutaka), but without making any explicit connections to G1. Just like we have new versions of the same Toa, we'd get new versions of other classic characters. There's no need to even remotely hint that there's "another world" as long as they introduce them properly (heck, they could even take the Skull Grinder approach and give them no introduction at all other than "this is one of Makuta's many servants"), so I think it would be a nice way to please older fans without confusing younger ones.

I was kinda hoping Umarak would have been named "Barraki" or "Piraka" or something along those lines; a "he said the thing!" moment for older fans, while still being a serviceable name for a new character. But Umarak is cool too =P.

[Dr_Chronos]

This belongs here the most I suppose. Graphic Novel #2 will be available on February 23, 2016. I'm glad this one gets a release date early into the year.

Edited October 17, 2015 by Dr_Chronos

[The Outsider]

I just really don't see how returning to an old location makes it a G1-G2 crossover in any sense of the word. I bring up Transformer comparison quite often and again it makes sense here, Transformers is constantly rebooting the theme with the the same characters and rewriting them from their previous selves, usually offering no connection to the past shows/stories other than design cues (which obviously we have seen with this year's Toa and of course the Nuva symbols on next years), and they re-use old locations like Cybertron with no issue. You could say that Mata Nui being a physical being makes it more than just a location, but let's not forget that at one point Cybertron itself was a transformer (Primus)- it's very logical to re-use an old location, just the same as it is to use old characters with completely new stories.

Some people read farther into this than they should be without much proof to go off of for any true speculation.

Now that you mention it, Transformers is probably the best example of a well-handed multiverse: most of the crossovers and intercontinuity connections are fanclub-exclusive stories (the only exceptions I can think of are Universe, the Cybertron comis and Regeneration One), which are mostly accessible only to the older fans who are more interested in this stuff and don't interfere with the main series, while the new fans can enjoy their shows and toys without fussing over this.

That being said, I hope BIONICLE never connects G1 and G2; the two are far too different, both in terms of style and how each world works.

As for returning to Mata Nui (or, more precisely, a G2 version of Mata Nui), as much as I'd like that, it may be a bad idea. First because Okoto feels too underexplored, and I'd like to see more of it, but mostly because Okoto already takes many cues from Mata Nui, so it would feel like redoing the same idea over and over even though Mata Nui came first (or even worse, some G2 fans who don't know a thing about G1 might accuse Mata Nui of being a bad Okoto copy).

I'd rather they bring back a few characters from G1's middle years (such as Roodaka or Brutaka), but without making any explicit connections to G1. Just like we have new versions of the same Toa, we'd get new versions of other classic characters. There's no need to even remotely hint that there's "another world" as long as they introduce them properly (heck, they could even take the Skull Grinder approach and give them no introduction at all other than "this is one of Makuta's many servants"), so I think it would be a nice way to please older fans without confusing younger ones.

I'd like that too, though the story-obsessed fanboy in me would probably like a bit more characterization (like where they came from and why they serve Makuta).

This belongs here the most I suppose. Graphic Novel #2 will be available on February 23, 2016. I'm glad this one gets an release date early into the year.

Neat! Do you think this will be only 2016-related or will it have a bit of Revenge of the Skull Spiders?

Edited October 17, 2015 by The Outsider

[Dorek]

Didn't we know the graphic novel releases then? Or does something else release on that day too? I know we've seen that date before.

[DuplexBeGreat]

I'd like that too, though the story-obsessed fanboy in me would probably like a bit more characterization (like where they came from and why they serve Makuta).

Yeah, same, I just don't think they'd actually do that at the rate they're going. We'll see what they do with Umarak, but for now the best I would hope for in this situation is a minor reference to Roodaka being a "master of treachery" or Brutaka being an "ancient being who once served the light".

[Toa-Nuva]

Didn't we know the graphic novel releases then? Or does something else release on that day too? I know we've seen that date before.

You're right, we have known that release date ever since the GN was first discovered on Amazon. (I looked up an old blog post about that discovery that I wrote back in June, and it does mention that release date.)

[Dr_Chronos]

You're right, we have known that release date ever since the GN was first discovered on Amazon. (I looked up an old blog post about that discovery that I wrote back in June, and it does mention that release date.)

Sorry then! My bad, I thought that was new information.

[MakutaOfWar]

So how do you guys want the Netflix series to play out?

[YellowCorvette]

So how do you guys want the Netflix series to play out?

Of course I want more great action scenes and better dialogue for the characters in the Netflix series for sure.

[ToaDraco]

I want it to feel more like the Miramax Bionicle films. They felt epic and had the right balance of humor and serious moments, not to mention a fantastic soundtrack. Great fight scenes, dialogue and soundtrack are key to having a great series for me. It would also be nice if the story was expanded on a little more but we have no idea how long the episodes will be. I'm hoping they will be comparable to the Hero Factory videos at the very least.

[Tazakk]

Three Graphic Novels now!

They sure are greenlighting a lot of stuff, considering only a single book has come out so far.

[Dorek]

Sweet, third GN. So that's three of each, plus the activity book. None too shabby.

[Dr_Chronos]

Three Graphic Novels now!

They sure are greenlighting a lot of stuff, considering only a single book has come out so far.

Wow! It's great to see that next year will have plenty of reading material.

[GK733]

Wow! It's great to see that next year will have plenty of reading material.

And hopefully outside of USA too... The kindle thing sucks.

[YellowCorvette]

And hopefully outside of USA too... The kindle thing sucks.

Agree with you too. Hope the reading material can be available at where am I live now.

[GK733]

Dunno if this been brought up. But it seems that the island between fire and jungle don't count it to belong in either of them

http://www.lego.com/fi-fi/bionicle/okoto

Could this distant island be Umarak's hiding place?