JINZONINGEN73 Posted February 22, 2008 Posted February 22, 2008 QUOTEMy point being that it isn't right to assume that if LEGO tries something it will fail. QUOTE Jinzo: Portrait of a Japanophile! It's just not an art style I find even remotely appealing. But who knows, maybe the 'target group' would love it.... The point is, that at this moment, there IS a target group for such things. And Lego, instead of doing it right, went and had some... wretchedly "novice" attempts at emulating that style. They failed, and Exo-Force has been canceled. I'm saying, if they're going to do it, they need to not do it half-assed. In other words, get some real sushi chefs instead of just tossing some rice and seaweed paper in a bowl. Japanese doing character and build design for Bionicle? No thanks. There are enough big-eyed sweat-drop people in the world. I would much rather not see Bionicle go anime. Why, you're absolutely right. Long live piles of silver weapons haphazardly slapped on things that are jumbled to begin with! Or, you know, one could make Bionicle actually look really good and give the characters character. Drop production in poopy gimmick launchers and spend those resources on neat armor for the shoulders, waist, shins, ankles... Have sets be more poseable than they are, like turning waists and junk. If I'm a japanophile, what's the definition for one that thinks the current figures are good looking? Is there even a definition? It's hard to place a name, for the figures themselves are... well, whatever they are. They don't have any long-running standard short of -must have giant, moc-unfriendly parts -must have weirdass launchers, etc etc... Quote
Kahgarak Posted February 22, 2008 Posted February 22, 2008 ...Did anyone notice that the Mistika canister lids have the Kanohi Ignika on one side? Quote
Tohst Posted February 22, 2008 Posted February 22, 2008 If I'm a japanophile, what's the definition for one that thinks the current figures are good looking? Is there even a definition? It's hard to place a name, for the figures themselves are... well, whatever they are. They don't have any long-running standard short of -must have giant, moc-unfriendly parts -must have weirdass launchers, etc etc... I think the term is Farshtiphile. :-) And can I say, if next year they market 'weirdass launchers' Bionicle will get no money from me. ;-) -Tohst Quote
Zarkan Posted February 22, 2008 Posted February 22, 2008 Why, you're absolutely right. Long live piles of silver weapons haphazardly slapped on things that are jumbled to begin with!Or, you know, one could make Bionicle actually look really good and give the characters character. Drop production in poopy gimmick launchers and spend those resources on neat armor for the shoulders, waist, shins, ankles... Have sets be more poseable than they are, like turning waists and junk. Hey, I don't like the current sets this summer, but I wouldn't want to have japanamation guys working on Bionicle either, because I never thought Bionicle ever remotely resembled anime, so I don't believe they would actually make it look great. :-/ I think the term is Farshtiphile. No, that's a common misconception around these parts. Greg has nothing to do with set design, and it's not exactly possible to speak out against it either, since he and every other story team member are under the control of the ultimate overlord of Bionicle, TLC. |-/ Proof: I dislike the set designs this summer (with the exception of Bitil and Takanuva), but I still really like Greg, because no matter what I think of the sets, I like the writing of bionicle, and the writing makes the characters look a lot better in my head. ;-) Quote
Trexxen Posted February 22, 2008 Posted February 22, 2008 (edited) You know, I'm curious. Every time a debate about how good/bad the new sets are (I think they're alright, if only for the fact that most of them will be dumped straight into my MOCing bin - so far, every set I've seen over $20 in summer 08 is amazing, though) comes along, someone drops Greg's name. Why? He has said time and time again that he has no say in the set design; he has to work with what he's given. If the new sets consist of a group of people with tubes and a group of fish-looking creatures, the story has to go underwater. If they consist of a crapload of jetpacks slapped onto some cookie cutter bodies, guess where the story goes next? I think he's actually starting to take more freedom, to be honest - the Toa Mistika are covered in jets, too, but they're going into a swamp. My point is, though, that the focus groups are the problem here, not Greg. And yeah, I'm defending him. I like the story direction. =P Meanwhile, as I said earlier - the canister sets look to be decent for some parts, especially Tahu Nuva, but in the end, I think I'll open them upside down over my box-o-parts. Vultraz...I'm skipping him completely. Eww. Takanuva will be my first summer set bought, as were Maxilos and Spinax in 07 and Vezon and Fenrakk in 07. The vehicles...well, Jetrax and Axalara are must haves. I may skip out on Rockoh, but if I do, it's only because all of the other lines are so appealing. (Hence the reason I'm skipping Gorast - those Indy sets are <3) ~Trexxen (Edit: Ninja'd. Grevious beat me to it XD) Edited February 22, 2008 by Trexxen Quote
Tohst Posted February 22, 2008 Posted February 22, 2008 No, that's a common misconception around these parts. Greg has nothing to do with set design, and it's not exactly possible to speak out against it either, since he and every other story team member are under the control of the ultimate overlord of Bionicle, TLC. |-/ That's a fair point. And I used his name as a moniker like that not because he does set design but because as the main representative between the fandom and the design team he is the mouthpiece to defend their decisions. I've said before I think he is in a tough position sometime because as the representative of the Lego company he has to stay positive and agree with every decision they make. Even if he vehemently disagrees behind closed doors he must toe the line, so to speak, in public. Having said that, my thoughts about his writing and some of his fan interactions aside, since he is the figurehead that must say Lego is always right, I think Farstiphle fits as description. Anything else is just too long. I mean, try it. Yes I'm a 'PostToaMetruNoGearEveryWeaponMustBeProtodermisLaunchersMakeMeHappyLoveTheNew MasksWhoCaresIfTheyDontLookLikeTheyDidIn2001WeShouldBeHappyJustUsingTheSameNames i Phile'. I'm sure there is lots of folk that would just jump to BionicleIsCrapiPhile. But I don't believe that. -Tohst Quote
Zee toa of sonics Posted February 22, 2008 Posted February 22, 2008 makuta:10/10 toa:3/10 vehicles:22/10 titan:9/10 and gali is the worst she basically looks like -zee *skull* Quote
Shakar Posted February 22, 2008 Posted February 22, 2008 Look, I don't hate "Gali" Mistake-a (thanks to Seranikai from BZP). As Gali, she it sucks. As a Toa, it is barely decent. As a set by itself I say it's quite good. I'm going to use that mask as the head of a Dark Hunter I have in my mind! I'm also going to make a Krika-based DH: they'll be a couple similar to Ndhiki (Krika) and Krekka ("GalI"). Shakar Quote
Visorak-kal Posted February 22, 2008 Posted February 22, 2008 I agree, Shakar. I have a feeling that we all (myself included, mind you) may be judging these sets based on what they are NOT, rather than what they are. Tahu, on his own, looks good, as does Onua. Gali would make a great villain, lol. And the Makuta Mistika are not bad in reality. My only worry is that BIONICLE may be headed in a downgraded direction. Look at Krika, for example; his arms and limbs have less points of articulation than we have had in recent years. they are pre-bent like the Mata's and Bohrok's, rather than articulated like the Inika, Piraka or Mahri. Yet we are being charged 3 dollars more than usual, at least in the U.S. VK Quote
Jetrax99 Posted February 22, 2008 Posted February 22, 2008 (edited) Ok, I know everyone's entitled to their opinion, but why are so many people complaining about the sets. Edited February 22, 2008 by Jetrax99 Quote
Icesaber Posted February 22, 2008 Posted February 22, 2008 Ok, I know everyone's entitled to their opinion, but why are so many people complaining aboutthe sets. Because most of them are crappy designs that the designers took no time on and (in the case of the Toa) have no resemblance to their former selves. That could be it... Anyways, I don't get why TLC went with dark bley. If you get rid of brown because it's too dull, why use dark bley, an equally dull color, instead of brighter colors, like Metru green, or better yet, Mata green? Quote
Visorak-kal Posted February 22, 2008 Posted February 22, 2008 (edited) Ok, I know everyone's entitled to their opinion, but why are so many people complaining aboutthe sets. Thank you for asking so respectfully, Jetrax99. The answer is really simple; many here and on BZP just don't like them. I myself, who have been a thorough BIONICLE fan for many years, have not been a fan of all the sets. I don't like Rockoh T3, for example, because I believe its design is too cluttered and many of the weapons look slapped on in angles that do not appeal to me. The general concensus, though, is the lack of resemblance between the new Nuva and their 2001-2002 forms in addition to the usage of the same body types on Toa for the last three years. Because most of them are crappy designs that the designers took no time on and (in the case of the Toa) have no resemblance to their former selves. That could be it... The no resemblance comment is understandable, but the rest of what you say is unfounded. Whether or not you or myself like a design has no bearing on whether or not it is a good design. And there is no way anyone could know how long the designers spent on these sets. A lot of time is spent on sets by LEGO designers (as GregF has stated multiple times, they go through levels and levels of focus group testing), and it is insulting to say that they took no time on a set. I'm sure you didn't mean it that way, though. :-) New news by the way, guys! In a recent BZP post, GregF explained some of the Nuva's lack of resemblance! It was a response to Black Six I believe, the BZP Admin. He said that firstly, resemblance was not a priority for the set designers as there is no nostalgia market. Secondly, though, he explained that older Nuva prototypes did look more like the original sets, but they were shot down in the focus testing. "Shot Down" BTW are the exact words he used. These focus groups are shooting down our flying Nuva like they were tin cans! The accursed focus groups! Why must they torture us so! :'-( VK Edited February 22, 2008 by Visorak-kal Quote
-ReVenge- Posted February 23, 2008 Posted February 23, 2008 (edited) These focus groups are shooting down our flying Nuva like they were tin cans!The accursed focus groups! Why must they torture us so! :'-( VK This is exactly why I hate little kids. ----------------------------- It seems they like ugly bugs, ugly "girls", and guns. Damn them. >:-( Edited February 23, 2008 by -ReVenge- Quote
Spartan_01 Posted February 23, 2008 Posted February 23, 2008 I knew it. Its those darn focus groups. They hate us. I reckon lego should make a line similar to Bionicle, only the target age group will be 14+. Then the sets could actually be good. We could get rid of Ghost Blasters and other shooters, crappy weapons, and terrible looking sets. Or lego could shift Bionicle onto an older target audience, which would be even better. If it where up to us, the Mistika Nuva would be way more awesome. Quote
-ReVenge- Posted February 23, 2008 Posted February 23, 2008 I knew it. Its those darn focus groups. They hate us. I reckon lego should make a line similar to Bionicle, only the target age group will be 14+. Then the sets could actually be good. We could get rid of Ghost Blasters and other shooters, crappy weapons, and terrible looking sets. Or lego could shift Bionicle onto an older target audience, which would be even better. If it where up to us, the Mistika Nuva would be way more awesome. I second that motion. However, LEGO only ever cares about financial success, so they'd never go with your idea. Plus, 14+ people make up only about one thousand out of the millions of Bionicle fans, unfortunately... Quote
Makuta'sdarkslave Posted February 23, 2008 Posted February 23, 2008 I feel another review coming on, and this one's got ALL the characters (save the Phantoka, who seem kind of out-of-date to me right now).\ Axalara T9: Well, Lewa's come a long way from being in the sky... Seriously, why the hell is on a vehicel, when just last month he had jet boosters on his arms? But it's a good set nonetheless. Jetrax T6: WHY IS ANTROZ A TOA!?!Sorry, but the truth ust be spoken, and that mask looks WAY more like Tahu's new Hau then it doe Antroz' mask. Too many blades slapped on it too, that seems a problem... Rockoh T3: I like the one with a white visor instead, ugly head is now revealed again. The vehicel is fat and chuuby, with barely any weapons, not very good here... Vultraz: Ok, well, you can hold and shoot it like a gun, but the problem is, too small and kinda useless looking. Basically he's a dmented Antroz/Radiak hybrid. Ugh. Takanuva: Jeez, from gold a white, to black and white, and now GRAY AND WHITE? WILL YOU PEOPLES PLEASE MAKE UP YOUR F***ING MINDS!? Okay, now that that's over, he's nice, the lighting makes it look like the Takadox head/shoulder armor is gunmetal. That'd help my big gunmetal MoC I'm working on. Prettly nice. Onua: Finally! He is perfected! Onua seems to look more like the Toa from the last two of three years, then he did in 01 and 03, his gun, "wings" and shoulder shield all looks good on him, but still, a Krahkaan *sigh*. Bitil: Like Gorast, his colors blend a lot more than the yellow and some black here nad there we saw before. He eems to have a right nipple, sorry but ti's true, look over at it! If that's true though, why is there only one? We may never know. Cool arm spikes. Gorast: Blending colors, nice, four arms, nice. Mosquito body, ni- what? Why is thie girl a MOSQUITO?! Once again, try telling her she's a girl. Evil looking female canine, I'll give her that. Krika: He looks like an older man from this angle, and yet, somehow, has a cute little face... He's in a crouching position here, but I think it's nice all the same. Gali: Ah, thus some beuty returns to her. As it appears, the left eye thing flips down, and the thing on her Blaster is better looking, the targeting system, you know? Too musch silver though. Damn. Tahu: He hasn't changed at all since the last pic. That is all. Nynrah Ghost Blasters: I don't know if that's how you say it, but screw it, anyways, whatever-the-hell-they-are-called's ammo, is basically just a Cordak missile with a new head. Seriously! Just look at it! It seems okay, but how wtill it hod out? Can it hold it's own? We will find out soon enough... DONE!! Quote
-ReVenge- Posted February 23, 2008 Posted February 23, 2008 Gorast: Blending colors, nice, four arms, nice. Mosquito body, ni- what? Why is thie girl a MOSQUITO?! Once again, try telling her she's a girl. Evil looking female canine, I'll give her that.Gali: Ah, thus some beuty returns to her. As it appears, the left eye thing flips down, and the thing on her Blaster is better looking, the targeting system, you know? Too musch silver though. Damn. Nynrah Ghost Blasters: I don't know if that's how you say it, but screw it, anyways, whatever-the-hell-they-are-called's ammo, is basically just a Cordak missile with a new head. Seriously! Just look at it! It seems okay, but how wtill it hod out? Can it hold it's own? We will find out soon enough... DONE!! 1. Because female mosquitoes are the ones who bite. The male mosquitoes will never suck blood from you. 2. Wait...what pictures show Gali's eye piece being flippable? 3. I agree, the nynrah ghost blasters are ghastly (no pun intended). Also, nynrah sound like nimrod... Quote
Makuta'sdarkslave Posted February 23, 2008 Posted February 23, 2008 (edited) 1. Because female mosquitoes are the ones who bite. The male mosquitoes will never suck blood from you. 2. Wait...what pictures show Gali's eye piece being flippable? 3. I agree, the nynrah ghost blasters are ghastly (no pun intended). Also, nynrah sound like nimrod... I'm not saying it shows it is flippable, but it looks a lot like it in the new pics, with is being plastic, having a round piece at the bottom, giving it the look as if it can fip down. I don't know. Go figure. I know only female mosquitos bite, I learned that way back in the day (which was a thursday, by the way), but still, she seems more like she should be something else. I don't know. I see the resemblance between the two names. Nice. Edited February 23, 2008 by Makuta'sdarkslave Quote
Jetrax99 Posted February 23, 2008 Posted February 23, 2008 Those of you complaining about the new sets(what you call ugly, I call it excellent)must have forgotten the MOCing value of the pieces. Quote
JINZONINGEN73 Posted February 23, 2008 Posted February 23, 2008 No, you're right. There are quite a good few pieces to moc with. But it's not the bodies, it's the accent pieces. And those can be cheaply acquired on Brickshelf sometimes. To say it best: Trexxen post Yesterday, 12:35 PM Meanwhile, as I said earlier - the canister sets look to be decent for some parts, especially Tahu Nuva, but in the end, I think I'll open them upside down over my box-o-parts. The facts still remain, they're illogically goofy in body design, they don't look like who they should, their ships are phallic symbols of slapped-on silliness, their air bladder weapons are childishly goofy in appearance, and the "skeletons" to each figure need to quit glutting our parts bins with their moc-unfriendliness. And... they'll probably do well in sales anyways to newbies. :-P Quote
Pigbrick Posted February 23, 2008 Posted February 23, 2008 In a recent BZP post, GregF explained some of the Nuva's lack of resemblance! It was a response to Black Six I believe, the BZP Admin. He said that firstly, resemblance was not a priority for the set designers as there is no nostalgia market. Secondly, though, he explained that older Nuva prototypes did look more like the original sets, but they were shot down in the focus testing. "Shot Down" BTW are the exact words he used. These focus groups are shooting down our flying Nuva like they were tin cans! No nostalgia market? Is this only for Lego because it seems other toy companies are doing fine by having remakes of old characters. I'm talking about you, Transformers Classics! And Masterpiece... and all of the G-1 reissues... But my biggest question is why did the Nuva prototypes got shot done by having a resemblence to there older selfs? If these focus groups are new to Bionicle what made them dislike the oldie look to this new... stuff? I'm surprise it matter to them! Life Quote
Dark_Avenger Posted February 23, 2008 Posted February 23, 2008 Transformers and GI Joe are much older than Bionicle, so even though they both have a large market with kids to this day, they keep a sizeable market in the older audience that grew up with these toys. Bionicle doesn't have this luxary - even though there is an audience of people who got into it back in 2001 (many of us here fit this profile), it's way too small to try appealing too. Unfortunately for us, the most prominent buyer range for Bionicle are young boys who, apparently, would probably rather have LEGO not even produce the action figures any more and just sell canisters full of big projectile weapons. Quote
Zarkan Posted February 23, 2008 Posted February 23, 2008 (edited) But it's not the bodies, it's the accent pieces. Well, as usual, I'm the one coming out and disagreeing. To tell you the truth, I frequently use pieces like Piraka bodies and feet in my creations, because they are good base pieces to build on with other pieces. Yeah, I know, I don't post creations on here a lot, but that's because I'm lazy and hate waiting long periods to upload pictures that I had to resize manualy. Just a few days ago, I build a revamped Nuparu Mahri using Piraka feet pieces as his shoulder armor and back armor, but it turned out just fine, IMO. ;-) The facts still remain, they're illogically goofy in body design, they don't look like who they should, their ships are phallic symbols of slapped-on silliness, their air bladder weapons are childishly goofy in appearance, and the "skeletons" to each figure need to quit glutting our parts bins with their moc-unfriendliness. Hm, I dunno what you mean by illogical in body design, but of course I agree that they don't look like themselves. And again, I don't see why Piraka bodies are useless. I hear people lament how Toa Mata bodies are amazing as parts, and yet I don't see why they love them and hate other types of bodies. *wacko* Transformers and GI Joe are much older than Bionicle, so even though they both have a large market with kids to this day, they keep a sizeable market in the older audience that grew up with these toys. Bionicle doesn't have this luxary - even though there is an audience of people who got into it back in 2001 (many of us here fit this profile), it's way too small to try appealing too. Unfortunately for us, the most prominent buyer range for Bionicle are young boys who, apparently, would probably rather have LEGO not even produce the action figures any more and just sell canisters full of big projectile weapons. That'll probably be the next step - in 2009, instead of Toa and vilians, we get canisters with all the parts you need to build your own handheld launcher, complete with scope and some lame projectile to fire. :-| Edited February 23, 2008 by Grevious Quote
Icesaber Posted February 23, 2008 Posted February 23, 2008 That'll probably be the next step - in 2009, instead of Toa and vilians, we get canisters with all the parts you need to build your own handheld launcher, complete with scope and some lame projectile to fire. :-| I'm afraid that it might be very true. If Bionicle continues down the road it's traveling, then pretty soon all canisters will have only sniper rifles and machine guns that are bigger than their heads. Quote
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