2LegoOrNot2Lego... Posted October 8, 2015 Author Posted October 8, 2015 Very nice model. Just like your other trucks. I like how every details is carefully designed. Even things we do not see on the final model, but only during the building process. A nice chassis, a nice building experience, this is as important as the final model itself, and you nailed it. Bravo ! I miss some studs though. To bring some character and texture to the vehicle. Like this one for example : http://www.brickshel...y.cgi?i=6232974 One question on the brown truck : The very slight slope (with "stair effect") on the hood does not add much visually speaking. I am pretty sure you could have made that part totally flat. From there, with a simplified construction on the top, couldn't you have use SNIR on the sides ? On the very top, dark red 4x1 curved slopes would also be welcome. :) Thank you very much for the thorough comment/feedback and for those kind words! I assume you build it interpreting what you wrote... The building process is indeed as important as the finished model. Especially with LEGO that is so true, after all it is a building system and I use that for truck modeling... So I am glad that you notice the effort I have put in! About the studs you miss, I don't... It is not that I hate studs absolutely not, but having things tiled suites me better. BTW, there are some studs visible... Not as many as the White and Blue truck with Red chassis, you are right about that... For that I do not agree with you. It does add more realism, after all the real life truck's hood isn't flat either. Is is not much that is slopes, but it does and that is captured. You lost me on the SNIR part though... As far as I know I did use this technique on the sides, please enlighten me! Those Dark Red 4x1 curved slopes should be on top of the side spoilers? Is that what you mean? For now I am not sure what you mean exactly. Quote
Anio Posted October 8, 2015 Posted October 8, 2015 I assume you build it interpreting what you wrote... Sadly, I didn't. :( But we are on the same boat when it comes to MOCing and designing a Lego model. ;) I noticed this for quite a while with your MOCs. And I love that. So few builders care about that kind of things. Is is not much that is slopes, but it does and that is captured. Yes, I know. My point is that maybe ignoring this very slight slope enables to capture another aspect better ? You lost me on the SNIR part though... As far as I know I did use this technique on the sides, please enlighten me! Those Dark Red 4x1 curved slopes should be on top of the side spoilers? Is that what you mean? For now I am not sure what you mean exactly. Red area for the SNIR. Green for the slope. :) Quote
Kiwi_Builder Posted October 8, 2015 Posted October 8, 2015 :laugh: Are you that close to State Highway 1 All great news, your parts availability and the colors you choose. Just great and I am looking forward to see it completed. Will you post pics of it? Probably you will That trailer is going to be lovely as well. The one in the picture has soft sides with straps, what are your plans on this? Any ideas yet? Does this TNL have other trailers, like flatbeds or so? Would probably be lighter in weight...! I'll post pics of it for sure Yeah that's a 5-axle curtainsider B-Train which is a pretty common configuration for intercity freight. I will change it slightly to be 6-axle to make use of the HPMV (High Productivity Motor Vehicle) permits which means it can legally carry a higher weight on selected routes and be two metres longer than a standard B-train. HPMV unit above TNL run all sorts of combinations, curtainsider rigid truck and full trailer, hardsider B-Train and yes flatbeds. However I will still build the curtainsider because I haven't seen it done before in this scale, let alone probably not even in Lego so I'm going to be a madman and give it a shot I think that a box trailer like this looks more impressive as a finished combination because of the extra vertical size on it, that and I have planned on building a curtainsider for many years now so it's about time I did it The hardest part of it will no doubt be attaching the curtain to the top and having it be able slide the length of the trailer to open it. My best guess for how to do this is to use axles running the length of the trailer and connected and either end only to prevent the curtain from being stopped from sliding. The main problem is that the longest single axle is 32 studs, the lead trailer will be approx. 49 studs long (not including second trailer connection area at rear) and the rear trailer will be even longer at 83 studs. One possibility is to run a non-Lego axle between each end that is cut to the right length and fits inside of an axle hole, otherwise I would have to make the entire length of it out of the two stud axle connectors because if I only used them where axles needed to be connected then the curtain would catch. Quote
2LegoOrNot2Lego... Posted October 9, 2015 Author Posted October 9, 2015 (edited) But we are on the same boat when it comes to MOCing and designing a Lego model. ;) I noticed this for quite a while with your MOCs. And I love that. So few builders care about that kind of things. Yes, I know. My point is that maybe ignoring this very slight slope enables to capture another aspect better ? Red area for the SNIR. Green for the slope. :) Okay, always nice to discover fellow truck builders Yep, details are so important, it really makes or breaks a model as far as I am concerned! Also the inside details, as you already wrote in your first comment...it all is there and it all should be there!!! Probably I have some great news...I have captured both! The thing is that the hood is already SNIR... You did not notice it obviously, but it really is So I have captured the both the slight slope of the hood and used SNIR for its sites... That curved slope was used on exactly that spot you marked. Finally removed it after trying many solutions. The one that is on this final model is the best, sorry... I'll post pics of it for sure Yeah that's a 5-axle curtainsider B-Train which is a pretty common configuration for intercity freight. I will change it slightly to be 6-axle to make use of the HPMV (High Productivity Motor Vehicle) permits which means it can legally carry a higher weight on selected routes and be two metres longer than a standard B-train. TNL run all sorts of combinations, curtainsider rigid truck and full trailer, hardsider B-Train and yes flatbeds. However I will still build the curtainsider because I haven't seen it done before in this scale, let alone probably not even in Lego so I'm going to be a madman and give it a shot I think that a box trailer like this looks more impressive as a finished combination because of the extra vertical size on it, that and I have planned on building a curtainsider for many years now so it's about time I did it The hardest part of it will no doubt be attaching the curtain to the top and having it be able slide the length of the trailer to open it. My best guess for how to do this is to use axles running the length of the trailer and connected and either end only to prevent the curtain from being stopped from sliding. The main problem is that the longest single axle is 32 studs, the lead trailer will be approx. 49 studs long (not including second trailer connection area at rear) and the rear trailer will be even longer at 83 studs. One possibility is to run a non-Lego axle between each end that is cut to the right length and fits inside of an axle hole, otherwise I would have to make the entire length of it out of the two stud axle connectors because if I only used them where axles needed to be connected then the curtain would catch. Looking forward to see pics of this "going to be" beauty! Absolutely agree with you that the "volume" will make it impressive! Nice to see that a wish comes true, finally you can start with the build of a curtain sider... You will face some challenges as you describe and what about the roof? It will have no support, do you think that will hold? That is possible the only option to use a non LEGO axle. Both the 32L axle and the entire length out of connectors is not sturdy enough I'm afraid. Having an aluminum tube might be used, still light in weight, but amazingly strong! You don't even have to attach it to the top, just to both ends of the trailer, that's it. Edited October 9, 2015 by 2LegoOrNot2Lego... Quote
Kiwi_Builder Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 Looking forward to see pics of this "going to be" beauty! Absolutely agree with you that the "volume" will make it impressive! Nice to see that a wish comes true, finally you can start with the build of a curtain sider... You will face some challenges as you describe and what about the roof? It will have no support, do you think that will hold? That is possible the only option to use a non LEGO axle. Both the 32L axle and the entire length out of connectors is not sturdy enough I'm afraid. Having an aluminum tube might be used, still light in weight, but amazingly strong! You don't even have to attach it to the top, just to both ends of the trailer, that's it. This is why it's good to share plans and ideas, I didn't even think about the roof's structural soundness I'll have a chat to a man I know who teaches metalwork about the best options and whether it will be strong enough for the roof weight. I should be able to do some load tests with an aluminium tube next week. How much does the roof on your box trailer weigh, how long is it in studs and how is it built (As in say two layers of 6x16 plates stuck on top of each other or something)? I should be building the Scania in the next week or two when the parts arrive, then when it's done I'll start work on the trailers. Quote
2LegoOrNot2Lego... Posted October 9, 2015 Author Posted October 9, 2015 This is why it's good to share plans and ideas, I didn't even think about the roof's structural soundness I'll have a chat to a man I know who teaches metalwork about the best options and whether it will be strong enough for the roof weight. I should be able to do some load tests with an aluminium tube next week. How much does the roof on your box trailer weigh, how long is it in studs and how is it built (As in say two layers of 6x16 plates stuck on top of each other or something)? I should be building the Scania in the next week or two when the parts arrive, then when it's done I'll start work on the trailers. Yes I guess, we can't know it all by ourselves... You didn't think of it and for it was the first thing that popped up... What is a good thing by the way, that is why there are so many people on the globe About the Scania, you are building it directly in the TNL colors? Or do you start with it as it is in the instructions? Building the reefer made me discover a couple of things. Because of the side walls there was almost no need for a chassis. The roof is kept as light weighted as possible. The box itself makes the trailer extremely sturdy. For you things are going to be different! You will need a chassis, like for example my trailers Tr3 and Tr10. Also do you have to look for ways to make the roof strong enough. The roof on my reefer is basically a single plate layer with some additions, that is all. You may want to give it some sort of ribs to make it sturdy...! Quote
Anio Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 Probably I have some great news...I have captured both! The thing is that the hood is already SNIR... You did not notice it obviously, but it really is So I have captured the both the slight slope of the hood and used SNIR for its sites... The thing is that simple half stud offsets are not SNIR. At least not in the idea of what I think SNIR is. You can find good examples of SNIR on the nose of 7191/10240 and on the side of 10248. Quote
Kiwi_Builder Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 Yes I guess, we can't know it all by ourselves... You didn't think of it and for it was the first thing that popped up... What is a good thing by the way, that is why there are so many people on the globe About the Scania, you are building it directly in the TNL colors? Or do you start with it as it is in the instructions? Building the reefer made me discover a couple of things. Because of the side walls there was almost no need for a chassis. The roof is kept as light weighted as possible. The box itself makes the trailer extremely sturdy. For you things are going to be different! You will need a chassis, like for example my trailers Tr3 and Tr10. Also do you have to look for ways to make the roof strong enough. The roof on my reefer is basically a single plate layer with some additions, that is all. You may want to give it some sort of ribs to make it sturdy...! I'll start out in instruction colours and go from there. I'll work out what I want the end bodywork to look like and what parts it will require and order/find the parts required from there. I will probably have two or three layers of beams with pin holes for the chassis, cross-joined regularly. The interesting part will be on the lead trailer it has a step to fit the height of the truck's fifth wheel which is often a structurally weak area so I'll have to play around with that. The roof will have 6x[something] plates placed long sides next to each other with a frame connecting the joints with another layer of plates on top. I'll demonstrate this when I put it together on LDD. I'll use the smaller wheels used on the 42024 skip truck on the trailers as the real ones are smaller than the trucks' ones. Quote
2LegoOrNot2Lego... Posted October 9, 2015 Author Posted October 9, 2015 The thing is that simple half stud offsets are not SNIR. At least not in the idea of what I think SNIR is. You can find good examples of SNIR on the nose of 7191/10240 and on the side of 10248. Okay, now I see, sorry for misunderstanding... Yep, I gave that a thought as well. I prefer to have all my models the same approach. This Scania has flat topped fenders so what you suggest would absolutely make sense. My other projects, for example the Mack Granite, are not suited for SMIR you refer to. So I stick to my weapon of choice: half stud offsets... Nevertheless I agree with you that it would have been nice, even though I doubt this will work for a openable hood... You might want to give it try someday to build it like that... I'll start out in instruction colours and go from there. I'll work out what I want the end bodywork to look like and what parts it will require and order/find the parts required from there. I will probably have two or three layers of beams with pin holes for the chassis, cross-joined regularly. The interesting part will be on the lead trailer it has a step to fit the height of the truck's fifth wheel which is often a structurally weak area so I'll have to play around with that. The roof will have 6x[something] plates placed long sides next to each other with a frame connecting the joints with another layer of plates on top. I'll demonstrate this when I put it together on LDD. I'll use the smaller wheels used on the 42024 skip truck on the trailers as the real ones are smaller than the trucks' ones. That is kind of a strange way to save money... :laugh: Nevertheless I do understand your approach. Building it in instructions colors and rebuild it in your preferred colors... As I mentioned the chassis' of my trailers are constructed with two layers of Technic Brick with two layers of plates in between. One more layer of plates on both top and bottom to secure. That will work for sure, but off course you might prefer beams and probably work as well! Yep, I know all about it... The chassis is indeed lowered partially to fit the fifth wheel. I build a Super B once, you might have seen as well. What I basically did was merging both the chassis of the trailer with the chassis of the truck. That is at least a point to start from... Your roof constructions sounds promising, looking forward to the LDD stuff! Quote
Lucio Switch Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 I have nothing to add to what it's already said in the comments. Awesome MOC as always, you never disappoint me. I'm just waiting the video for give a thumbs up! Quote
2LegoOrNot2Lego... Posted October 9, 2015 Author Posted October 9, 2015 I have nothing to add to what it's already said in the comments. Awesome MOC as always, you never disappoint me. I'm just waiting the video for give a thumbs up! Thanks! Video will be available for sure, what is uncertain is when... Quote
Kiwi_Builder Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 (edited) Yep, I know all about it... The chassis is indeed lowered partially to fit the fifth wheel. I build a Super B once, you might have seen as well. What I basically did was merging both the chassis of the trailer with the chassis of the truck. That is at least a point to start from... Yeah I've seen that and as that people don't make them very often because they're a rather 'country-specific' thing to make and there aren't many of us from here that do Technic builds of trucks Then we have the wonderful people like you who are very good at it and make things from all around the world that take your interest I would build more things from other countries than NZ/Australia but I like the big combinations and Europe just doesn't have that with their 4x2 tractor units towing one trailer. Some Euro countries have the bigger units but I haven't gotten around to them yet, still playing in my back yard Back on subject, where are you hiding the photos and information from that because I can find all of your creations but that one Did you make a video of it? Also, what currency is the MOCplans website in? It only says $25 so I have no clue how much money I'm having leave me Edited October 10, 2015 by Kiwi_Builder Quote
2LegoOrNot2Lego... Posted October 10, 2015 Author Posted October 10, 2015 Yeah I've seen that and as that people don't make them very often because they're a rather 'country-specific' thing to make and there aren't many of us from here that do Technic builds of trucks Then we have the wonderful people like you who are very good at it and make things from all around the world that take your interest I would build more things from other countries than NZ/Australia but I like the big combinations and Europe just doesn't have that with their 4x2 tractor units towing one trailer. Some Euro countries have the bigger units but I haven't gotten around to them yet, still playing in my back yard Back on subject, where are you hiding the photos and information from that because I can find all of your creations but that one Did you make a video of it? Also, what currency is the MOCplans website in? It only says $25 so I have no clue how much money I'm having leave me Thanks again for your support and kind words! Well here in the Netherlands with certain permits and within specific parameters there are double trailer options. The great part about European trucks and trailers is that it always comes with new techniques. So do we have trailers that can set back there rear axles to make the fifth wheel appear. The trailer starts as a single trailer, but with the rear end extended a second trailer can be coupled. This would be nice to build someday, but there are so many thing to do/build... Information and photos of what? That Super B trailer? Currency at MOCplans.com is indeed in $ and that would be US$. Quote
Kiwi_Builder Posted October 10, 2015 Posted October 10, 2015 (edited) Thanks again for your support and kind words! Well here in the Netherlands with certain permits and within specific parameters there are double trailer options. The great part about European trucks and trailers is that it always comes with new techniques. So do we have trailers that can set back there rear axles to make the fifth wheel appear. The trailer starts as a single trailer, but with the rear end extended a second trailer can be coupled. This would be nice to build someday, but there are so many thing to do/build... Information and photos of what? That Super B trailer? Currency at MOCplans.com is indeed in $ and that would be US$. European combinations certainly make a lot of new techniques, with the strict limits you've got to be creative to get the most out of your load. The closest we have to the sliding to reveal the fifth wheel is some lead trailers have the fifth wheel permanently mounted under the load area and the kingpin of the rear trailer is on a tongue that slots in the space between, and of course the plain old fifth wheel permanently mounted behind it. The fifth wheel under option is mainly used for tipping B-Trains so that the lead trailer can unload normally and on some of Hall's' refrigerated trailers for maneuverability in tight delivery locations at supermarket centres. Yeah the Super B, I can never find anything on it Okay that's good, cheaper than $25 Euros I should get my parts to build the Scania next weekend and then it's all on, I'm just finalizing the LDD of the roof for the trailers so they should be done tomorrow morning (about 12 hours I'd say), what I've got so far seems to be rigid. I've also noticed that often longer curtainsiders have support pillars at intervals on each side so they should improve the rigidity. Edited October 11, 2015 by Kiwi_Builder Quote
2LegoOrNot2Lego... Posted October 11, 2015 Author Posted October 11, 2015 That also sounds impressive, a hidden fifth wheel basically. Yes that is indeed the closest. Absolutely this all is because of regulations! There is this video on YT that shows the Super B. That is all there is, and I no longer have it build. Yep, Euro certainly is stronger so that saves you a some bucks... Curious to find out how that curtainsider comes out. I don't mind so it is up to you, but maybe it is better to start a thread for your own here at EB to show us the progress on these builds? I am not sure anyone is still checking this thread of mine... Your own edition of the Scania and the trailer deserves attention! Those pillars make sense. It influence the way the trailer can be loaded, but what would you mind in a LEGO model? Quote
Henkl Posted October 11, 2015 Posted October 11, 2015 Hi Ingmar, mist you today in Amsterdam at the Mack andcspecial transport show. Your fifth wheel is there a free building instruction for or only a paid one? Quote
2LegoOrNot2Lego... Posted October 12, 2015 Author Posted October 12, 2015 Hi Ingmar, mist you today in Amsterdam at the Mack andcspecial transport show. Your fifth wheel is there a free building instruction for or only a paid one? That is correct...I and some other builders have been for some years. Last time must have been about 3 years ago now I suppose. To many other events to attend to so we have to make decisions... That is the only free instructions I have available: http://bricksafe.com/files/2legoornot2lego/MOD%20LT8258/LTSet8258A%20MPD%20LPub%20v1_1.pdf It also shows how it can be installed on set 8258, but you can skip that part off course! Quote
Chr.Maglekaer Posted October 13, 2015 Posted October 13, 2015 (edited) On 10/10/2015 at 9:59 AM, 2LegoOrNot2Lego... said: Thanks again for your support and kind words! Well here in the Netherlands with certain permits and within specific parameters there are double trailer options. The great part about European trucks and trailers is that it always comes with new techniques. So do we have trailers that can set back there rear axles to make the fifth wheel appear. The trailer starts as a single trailer, but with the rear end extended a second trailer can be coupled. This would be nice to build someday, but there are so many thing to do/build... I expect that in the Netherlands you have the same types of "modul roadtrain" as in Denmark. Edited November 20, 2016 by Chr.Maglekaer Removed attach files Quote
Kiwi_Builder Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 Some interesting combinations there, in New Zealand we don't have Type 2 but all of the others are legal (sort of) and have been for a long time. Type 1 is very similar to the standard full trailer combinations we use though there are some key differences there, the main ones being that for it to be a five axle trailer it has to have a 8x4 towing it and have an HPMV permit. Alternately you can have a four axle trailer towed by a 6x4 or more that you show. Type 3 is very similar to our B Trains but instead it's either a two axle lead trailer towing a two axle rear trailer, a three axle lead trailer towing a two axle rear trailer, a three axle lead trailer towing a three axle rear trailer or very uncommonly a four axle lead trailer towing a three axle rear trailer (this requires an HPMV permit also). Type 4 is the same as Type 1. Given your axle configurations you must have a higher axle weight limit than we do. Ingmar, Thanks for the link to the video, you hid it under a different name I'm planning on starting a WIP thread once I get some good progress going, which I haven't been able to do thanks to being extremely busy until mid-November This is the best photo I can find of the fifth wheel under the cargo area. Here's the link for it and if you click on it it comes up bigger but blurry: http://trademe.tmcdn.co.nz/photoserver/tq/412525930.jpg Quote
Kiwi_Builder Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 I have finally done the LDD of the roof It's four plates thick with 1x8 flat tiles on top. On the bottom there are 6x24 plates, the next layer up is bracing with plates connecting the joints in the bottom plates. The next layer is three rows of 6x24 plates with tiles on top. At each end there is the 1x1 Technic brick on each side for the aluminium tube to go in. Here it is with the 1x8 tiles and 6x24 plates removed, I made the bracing a different colour so it's easy to see it and the LDD is attached to this post to download and look for yourself because that gives by far the best idea of what it's like. Roof.lxf Quote
2LegoOrNot2Lego... Posted October 14, 2015 Author Posted October 14, 2015 Given your axle configurations you must have a higher axle weight limit than we do. I'm gonna be straight forward with you: I have no idea... Building truck and trailer models for me does not necessarily mean I know all about it...I actually don't Nevertheless I do find your writing(s) very interesting! Love to see how this works in other countries!!! What I do know is that it indeed all has to do with weight limits, that is for sure! Thanks for the link to the video, you hid it under a different name Uhm...a different name? Video name I suppose? I'm planning on starting a WIP thread once I get some good progress going, which I haven't been able to do thanks to being extremely busy until mid-November I completely understand, like I wrote I don't mind it is that I think your WIP deserves more attention... This is the best photo I can find of the fifth wheel under the cargo area. Great how companies come up with all new ideas! It seems like a strange solution, but if it works...why not... I have finally done the LDD of the roof It's four plates thick with 1x8 flat tiles on top. On the bottom there are 6x24 plates, the next layer up is bracing with plates connecting the joints in the bottom plates. The next layer is three rows of 6x24 plates with tiles on top. At each end there is the 1x1 Technic brick on each side for the aluminium tube to go in. Here it is with the 1x8 tiles and 6x24 plates removed, I made the bracing a different colour so it's easy to see it and the LDD is attached to this post to download and look for yourself because that gives by far the best idea of what it's like. I will check the file, thanks for sharing! So far it sounds sturdy and it probably it is going to be a trial and error process...as much builds are with LEGO... :laugh: If necessary you can always use those pillars your wrote about earlier... Here it is with the 1x8 tiles and 6x24 plates removed, I made the bracing a different colour so it's easy to see it and the LDD is attached to this post to download and look for yourself because that gives by far the best idea of what it's like. I already thought so, but had to check it first: this bracing layer makes sense for the lower layer of 6x24 plates! The top layer of 6x24 plates though is not braced proper I am afraid... Quote
Edwin Korstanje Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 You did it again Igmar, wow what a beauty and can wait to see it next week at LW Quote
2LegoOrNot2Lego... Posted October 14, 2015 Author Posted October 14, 2015 You did it again Igmar, wow what a beauty and can wait to see it next week at LW Thanks buddy...we can swap places. I will inspecting your models and you can inspect mine... :-) Quote
Chr.Maglekaer Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 Given your axle configurations you must have a higher axle weight limit than we do. Here are the rules for vehicle weights in EU http://www.transportxxl.eu/en/documents/eu_directive/vehicle_weights Quote
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