[MOC] [WIP] The Command of the AT-AT

[Tommy Styrvoky]

I don't know if beams could be pinned in a normal way without forcibly abusing the elements—if that is what you mean?

it's a option, but it's likely to fail... then the whole model comes falling down.

[Tommy Styrvoky]

Ok here's my second option, the worm gear seems to be reinforced pretty well, though I hope the technic 4x0.5 liftarms won't break, but that shouldn't happen, To fix that issue, I would suggest putting another technic brick to sandwich the worm gear and 8z gear. Turning the red bush will change the angle of the leg, I decided to keep this mechanism as simple as possible to eliminate lash between the gears to allow for fine adjustment, though there is some lash between the 8z gear and worm gear it should work fine. I have used a similar system like this to tension the tracks on some of my models, and it is durable and simple.

AT-AT leg/hip joint by Tommy Styrvoky, on Flickr

AT-AT leg/hip joint by Tommy Styrvoky, on Flickr

AT-AT leg/hip joint by Tommy Styrvoky, on Flickr

Edited January 13, 2016 by Tommy Styrvoky

[anothergol]

I don't know if beams could be pinned in a normal way without forcibly abusing the elements—if that is what you mean?

I think the problem is more to find the right angle to pin a beam to the structure in more than 2 places, if it's necessary to do so. Maybe there's a table somewhere showing which angles match which stud/plate lengths.

[LiLmeFromDaFuture]

Ok here's my second option, the worm gear seems to be reinforced pretty well, though I hope the technic 4x0.5 liftarms won't break, but that shouldn't happen, To fix that issue, I would suggest putting another technic brick to sandwich the worm gear and 8z gear. Turning the red bush will change the angle of the leg, I decided to keep this mechanism as simple as possible to eliminate lash between the gears to allow for fine adjustment, though there is some lash between the 8z gear and worm gear it should work fine. I have used a similar system like this to tension the tracks on some of my models, and it is durable and simple.

Here I refined your design into a smaller setup:

The highlighted 32034 piece () is in place of the worm gear 15457 (). The mechanism would function easily with the use of piece 33299 () as a crank; like how I used on a older, less sturdier, design for the legs.

Here is an example with real bricks:

[Tommy Styrvoky]

Here I refined your design into a smaller setup:

The highlighted 32034 piece () is in place of the worm gear 15457 (). The mechanism would function easily with the use of piece 33299 () as a crank; like how I used on a older, less sturdier, design for the legs.

Here is an example with real bricks:

I thought about a similar setup, but I was unsure of how strong it will be, I would suggest against the newer worm gear, as the same function could be accomplished by the old one. It would have more teeth to mesh with the 8z gear. If you were to insert a 2 stud long axle in the end, it would be nearly impossible to remove the worm gear I also think the worm gear may break.

[Kristof]

I like what you came up with although again, be careful about these 8t gears, As to your question, new reinforced ones really are reinforced, thus perform better and withstand more torque, yet still wont accomplish wonders. This is I think somewhat borderline case - I can't tell you with confidence whether I believe it will hold or not but I think it's worth giving a try.

I'd myself probably still try to use something that wouldn't involve 8t gears but that's just my general approach.

Regarding that idea with 24t gear sliding out - you are bot right, it's not possible. I really didn't think about the turntable geometry very well.

[LiLmeFromDaFuture]

I thought about a similar setup, but I was unsure of how strong it will be, I would suggest against the newer worm gear, as the same function could be accomplished by the old one. It would have more teeth to mesh with the 8z gear. If you were to insert a 2 stud long axle in the end, it would be nearly impossible to remove the worm gear I also think the worm gear may break.

Well, I will be careful not to stick 2l axle down there ; that happened to me before with a black 180º connecter and a white Bionicle trunk torso—I remember it like it was yesterday. I figured the newer worm gear would be clever technique since it would allow two 8 tooth gears to be placed behind it on the sides, and possibly strengthen the articulation with the extra support from . Would it really matter if more teeth on the worm gear are present, since only the couple or three in the middle would interact with 8 tooth gear?

I like what you came up with although again, be careful about these 8t gears, As to your question, new reinforced ones really are reinforced, thus perform better and withstand more torque, yet still wont accomplish wonders. This is I think somewhat borderline case - I can't tell you with confidence whether I believe it will hold or not but I think it's worth giving a try.

I'd myself probably still try to use something that wouldn't involve 8t gears but that's just my general approach.

Regarding that idea with 24t gear sliding out - you are bot right, it's not possible. I really didn't think about the turntable geometry very well.

I guess we will all have to see if it will work for the legs with physical bricks. Currently, my only alternative option to this is that idea to wedge in a 24 tooth gear at the desired angle and have the legs fixed in this fashion.

[Kristof]

^Yep, exactly. Speaking of real building, I'm looking forward to new real pictures. As much as LDD is some... kind of fun, it really gets boring soon :D

[Tommy Styrvoky]

Well, I will be careful not to stick 2l axle down there ; that happened to me before with a black 180º connecter and a white Bionicle trunk torso—I remember it like it was yesterday. I figured the newer worm gear would be clever technique since it would allow two 8 tooth gears to be placed behind it on the sides, and possibly strengthen the articulation with the extra support from . Would it really matter if more teeth on the worm gear are present, since only the couple or three in the middle would interact with 8 tooth gear?

I guess we will all have to see if it will work for the legs with physical bricks. Currently, my only alternative option to this is that idea to wedge in a 24 tooth gear at the desired angle and have the legs fixed in this fashion.

My best guess is the worm gear will fail in the fashion, as there are unsupported 8z gears, If both sides of the 8z gears are not fixed in place, the axle will bend upwards and loose purchase wit the worm gear under high strain.

[LiLmeFromDaFuture]

My best guess is the worm gear will fail in the fashion, as there are unsupported 8z gears, If both sides of the 8z gears are not fixed in place, the axle will bend upwards and loose purchase wit the worm gear under high strain.

By what did you mean about "There are unsupported 8z gears… the 8z gears are not fixed in place?"

[Tommy Styrvoky]

By what did you mean about "There are unsupported 8z gears… the 8z gears are not fixed in place?"

If you look at my design, the 8z gear is supported on both sides of the worm gear, thus it can't skip teeth, because it can't move upwards, with no external support on both sides of the gears, they will likely skip teeth. Even more in this case, as only one side is anchored, and the gear is floating on a axle 2 studs outwards, this gives the gear more leverage/travel, thus increasing the possibility of the gear to travel upwards, as everything else is supported, that will be the weakest part of the mechanism, thus likely to fail. I had a case with something similar on the turntable for my latest moc, I thought everything was supported and anchored as close to the gears, but It still managed to make a worm gear skip from on a turntable. I had to re-design the entire structure to make sure every part was fixed with a solid connection to the gears as possible.

This image shows where a worm gear exerts force when operating, the Fs force will be where it will fail.

Edited January 14, 2016 by Tommy Styrvoky

[LiLmeFromDaFuture]

If you look at my design, the 8z gear is supported on both sides of the worm gear, thus it can't skip teeth, because it can't move upwards, with no external support on both sides of the gears, they will likely skip teeth. Even more in this case, as only one side is anchored, and the gear is floating on a axle 2 studs outwards, this gives the gear more leverage/travel, thus increasing the possibility of the gear to travel upwards, as everything else is supported, that will be the weakest part of the mechanism, thus likely to fail.

Well, I don't think I would go any thicker in order to support those 8 tooth gears, as I believe it would ruin the aesthetics; I would have to ultimately result to fixing a 24 tooth gear in turntable if it fails…

[Tommy Styrvoky]

Well, I don't think I would go any thicker in order to support those 8 tooth gears, as I believe it would ruin the aesthetics; I would have to ultimately result to fixing a 24 tooth gear in turntable if it fails…

If you could sandwich the 8z gears on the side that is connected to the shoulder, and prevent them from splaying apart, that would fix it, and since the whole leg doesn't rotate that much I think if you extended the axles on the doubled up worm gears, and added a extra 2 studs(to the 4 stud long axles with stops), that would leave room for some half bushes, then a 3 stud long technic beam and another 2 half bushes to secure the beam. Or a 5.5 stud long axe could be used, if the side with the stop was on the shoulder side, It would replace the first set of half bushes, and a the beam could be mounted on the back of the stops.

....This whole mechanism doesn't work, even if you were to reverse the turntable, the gears are fixed to the leg, thus when the leg moves, the gears angle change with it, thus disengaging the gears from the turntable. In order to make this type of mechanism to work, the worm gear has to be on the same side as the gears are anchored to, otherwise the gears that mesh with the worm gear will move with the leg.... and nothing will happen, as the gears will run into the axles for the worm gear.

Edited January 14, 2016 by Tommy Styrvoky

[LiLmeFromDaFuture]

Yeah, the position I fashioned the turntable in was in order for it to work with the 8 tooth gears, being that they are fixed to the leg. This was also in order to achieve a smaller setup that could function in the limited amount of space I have to work with to design the leg hub.

[LiLmeFromDaFuture]

^Yep, exactly. Speaking of real building, I'm looking forward to new real pictures. As much as LDD is some... kind of fun, it really gets boring soon :D

At the moment, that might not be until sometime in February

[Tommy Styrvoky]

Hopefully sometime this week I can have some more time to take a look at this and see if there are other options for the shoulder joint.

[Tommy Styrvoky]

I think I have a solution, this should work, as there are 2 worm gears to keep the 8z gear somewhat supported. There needs to be a back support on the side of the worm gears to support the shaft, and pieces have to be added above the 8z gears with friction pins to keep them from falling out. The 2 worm gears need to be turned in opposite directions to move the turntable.

I think this will be solid enough, but I am unsure of the new worm gears, and if they could fail.

AT-AT leg/hip joint by Tommy Styrvoky, on Flickr

AT-AT leg/hip joint by Tommy Styrvoky, on Flickr

[LiLmeFromDaFuture]

I think I have a solution, this should work, as there are 2 worm gears to keep the 8z gear somewhat supported. There needs to be a back support on the side of the worm gears to support the shaft, and pieces have to be added above the 8z gears with friction pins to keep them from falling out. The 2 worm gears need to be turned in opposite directions to move the turntable.

I think this will be solid enough, but I am unsure of the new worm gears, and if they could fail.

So the worm gears have to be turned contrary of each other? Well, I guess that would rule out a design where they both could be adjusted simultaneously?

For the other system with one worm gear, would it work if the 8z gears were supported on the ends, despite the probable heaviness of the legs (& feet) consisting 800+ parts?

[Tommy Styrvoky]

So the worm gears have to be turned contrary of each other? Well, I guess that would rule out a design where they both could be adjusted simultaneously?

For the other system with one worm gear, would it work if the 8z gears were supported on the ends, despite the probable heaviness of the legs (& feet) consisting 800+ parts?

I wouldn't trust it unless it would be supported like this . This structure is very solid, and can only fail where the 0.5x4 technic liftarms are. Otherwise, the whole axle that the leg is mounted on could bend too, if there is no where else for the mechanism to fail.

AT-AT leg/hip joint by Tommy Styrvoky, on Flickr

[Kenway]

So detailed. To scale. Perfect. Any interior photos?

[LiLmeFromDaFuture]

So detailed. To scale. Perfect. Any interior photos?

No Kenway, there is no interior, as I forewent it for extreme structural integrity.

Edited January 22, 2016 by LiLmeFromDaFuture

[LiLmeFromDaFuture]

Aside from working on the articulation for the legs, I am beginning to proceed with redesigning and rescaling other parts of my AT-AT walker, since because the legs have received the treatment first, and have opened the door for so much possibilities of new techniques and much more detail to include.

Also I finally, with help and asking, manage to operate Bluerender on my Mac. Now I can share some renders of my progress in LDD. First off will be the foot:

As it should be noticeable, I added a few new details to the foot, with the inclusion of those "exhaust port" things above the toes. With the particular element used, it takes the AT-AT to a whole new level—it just looks ultimate! Yes those open slot 1 x 2 bricks don't exist in LBG yet, but they do in light grey for the 1 x 2 slopes without bottom tubes.

Likewise, I am using the same like elements for the ones featured on the armor plating of the body:

[anothergol]

An interesting article here, about the scale of a minifig:

http://tomalphin.com/2013/11/lego-challenge-19-calculating-minifig-scale.html

The guy adjusted the minifig to be anatomically correct, and I believe he's right. As I wrote in a previous post, Bandai's AT-ST kit is 1/48, and it's very clear that it's not minifig-scaled, while if you only take into account the height of a minifig, it should be.

He concludes that the real minifig scale would be 1/29, and I've computed my AT-ST as 1/28, which is cool.

For the AT-AT, that would translate to 80cm tall, I believe.

[LiLmeFromDaFuture]

For the AT-AT, that would translate to 80cm tall, I believe.

That is around the probable height I supposed based on the new height of my redesigned legs.

[Sucram]

I am loving this! When do you think you will be nearing completion?