The Second Crash - Day 3

[Dragonfire]

You mention casually here that Delwyn was in contact with you and told you she was suspicious of Foorth but you don't add anything of your own thoughts to this.

And here you are questioning Quincy on his singling out Foorth from the four names I gave as those I would like to hear more from and yet again you don't add any of your thoughts on Foorth to the conversation. Instead you give a soft defense of him as to reasons he may have not switched his vote.

So what are your thoughts on Foorth?

To be honest, Foorth hasn't posted much and so I'm kind of in the middle on him. I don't have much of a read on him. I mentioned the Delwyn thing as a bit of a FYI just so everyone knew who Delwyn was suspicious of. And as for my reply to Quincy, I was calling out Quincy for his poor accusation, not so much defending Foorth in particular. Had it been any other player, I would have done the same: it was the accusation that I had a problem with. I know what it's like to be accused of something due to not being online at a particular moment (the end of the day in particular). I don't know which timezone Foorth lives in, but I think it's stupid to accuse anyone due to them being absent. If they're online but don't comment, that's a different matter entirely. Just my take on things.

And asking if the block has caught another scum or not is scummy fishing. I will give that info when the block is reading to, and well before voting ends.

Isn't the definition of fishing asking for information that will help the scum? Supposing I am scum, what would I have gained by asking that question? You're going to tell us today anyway; the scum don't benefit if the information is revealed earlier. Therefore I wouldn't call that scummy fishing. Point taken though, I need to be more patient in future.

Throughout your entire post you've accused two other members (Quincy and myself) and have sort of defended the two of the four members in question,

Good observation: I have accused you and Quincy. Well done. Mafia is about accusations. As for "sort of defending", I assume you're harping Molly's question about Foorth, but as to the other person.... I can only assumed you're talking about Duke, and I would hardly call mentioning his name a defense. You're pulling things out of nowhere. Ping.

given the fact they come from the Tracker I found that worrying...

Tracker? What do you mean? Who or what comes from the Tracker? I jolly well hope you mean Blocker, because if you've gone and accidentally revealed another town role to the scum then you're an idiot

[Tariq j]

Tracker? What do you mean? Who or what comes from the Tracker? I jolly well hope you mean Blocker, because if you've gone and accidentally revealed another town role to the scum then you're an idiot

I genuinely meant blocker, I keep mixing up my words and getting confused today, sorry

[Dragonfire]

I genuinely meant blocker, I keep mixing up my words and getting confused today, sorry

Okay, that's a relief What did you mean by "they come from the Blocker"? Are you saying that we should naturally suspect those four because the Blocker mentioned their names?

[Tariq j]

Okay, that's a relief What did you mean by "they come from the Blocker"? Are you saying that we should naturally suspect those four because the Blocker mentioned their names?

I'm not entirely sure what you mean by your first question, Lady K mentioned all 4 names in her post. That's not to say we should eliminate everyone as suspects, but the four people she did mention (Tammo, mostly, Bob and Cutcobra) we should focus are attention on.

[Lady K]

I'm not entirely sure what you mean by your first question, Lady K mentioned all 4 names in her post. That's not to say we should eliminate everyone as suspects, but the four people she did mention (Tammo, mostly, Bob and Cutcobra) we should focus are attention on.

Just to clarify, these are the four I suspect more than others right now. Foorth (Tamamono), Duke (cutcobra), Ewan (mostlytechnic), and Lusk (fhomess). Woodcock (Bob) is lower on my list right now. We should keep our options open on anyone who has not been cleared. I stated these four because I want to hear more of what they have to say, the concert is better when we all sing together.....even with my beautiful voice I can't carry the performance by myself.

Please give us your thoughts on anyone you suspect could be hiding in the shadows not just these four.

[Dragonfire]

I'm not entirely sure what you mean by your first question, Lady K mentioned all 4 names in her post. That's not to say we should eliminate everyone as suspects, but the four people she did mention (Tammo, mostly, Bob and Cutcobra) we should focus are attention on.

Please respond to my earlier question.

Just to clarify, these are the four I suspect more than others right now. Foorth (Tamamono), Duke (cutcobra), Ewan (mostlytechnic), and Lusk (fhomess). Woodcock (Bob) is lower on my list right now. We should keep our options open on anyone who has not been cleared. I stated these four because I want to hear more of what they have to say, the concert is better when we all sing together.....even with my beautiful voice I can't carry the performance by myself.

Please give us your thoughts on anyone you suspect could be hiding in the shadows not just these four.

Oh - I wasn't aware that you particularly suspected them, just that you were calling them out for being quiet. Thanks for the clarification

[Tamamono]

It is very quiet in here......just to get some conversation going I would like to point out that there are many who seem to have disappeared. We need to sing together to keep the shadows at bay!

We have too many quiet performers to give a proper concert.

Foorth, Duke, Lusk, and Ewan have all been way too quiet, even in private I have not heard much from them. I have open communication with everyone (from asking for claims) and these four have been extremely silent.

Not at all. I may not be able to participate all day, but when I'm here I participate and offer insights when I have them. I don't have much to say to you in private apart from night action stuff which we have already discussed.

Foorth voted for me day one for voting for Anthony and tried to get a bandwagon forming against me and even didn't not come back to change his vote after my reveal as Town Blocker.

I didn't think your Anthony vote smelled right and I thought you were scum. I don't remember that day very well, but I remember not knowing you were the blocker until it was the night phase; either I logged on and missed it (possible) or I didn't come on in time to change (most probable).

Foorth is a good start. So, Foorth, why did you not change your vote after we found out who our Town Blocker was? Were you busy? Or were you hoping to turn that around and cause suspicion amongst us?

Again - don't remember, but I know I didn't know she was the blocker until night phase, at which point I conceded I was wrong to her in private - she will confirm.

This was Footh's vote for Molly. What pings me about this is that he votes for Molly because she voted for Anthony who we now know is scum...

This also seems suspicious, in my mind Ray asked a simple question regarding the logic behind Foorth's "ping" and for that he got voted for, not understanding the logic here. It also surprises me how Duke seems to subtly defend Foorth here by implying his logic is correct.

First point is legit - if I were scum my thinking an Anthony vote is illegit would be smart; I have no answer to this except for the fact that (and I think others will agree here) my vote for Molly was more on HER behavior rather than her target of a vote, even if that still played a factor; i.e. it was less "don't vote for him, he's town" and more "don't care about him, but I don't like you." But again, as town, I don't plan out my moves strategically, so I have no master plan or explanation.

I'm leaning scum on Woodcock as well (since he's who you're referring to, not Duke, right?), so I think you're on to something with point #2; scum vets try to cozy up to town vets oftentimes.

To be honest, Foorth hasn't posted much and so I'm kind of in the middle on him. I don't have much of a read on him. I mentioned the Delwyn thing as a bit of a FYI just so everyone knew who Delwyn was suspicious of. And as for my reply to Quincy, I was calling out Quincy for his poor accusation, not so much defending Foorth in particular. Had it been any other player, I would have done the same: it was the accusation that I had a problem with. I know what it's like to be accused of something due to not being online at a particular moment (the end of the day in particular). I don't know which timezone Foorth lives in, but I think it's stupid to accuse anyone due to them being absent. If they're online but don't comment, that's a different matter entirely. Just my take on things.

Thank you. I probably do look pretty bad for not unvoting after she claimed - that's true, and I understand the accusations against me! I'm glad you caught it. All the same, though, this is absolutely right - I'm town and would have no reason to not unvote. When there's 1 vote on the town blocker and no risk of a lynch of her and she's claimed, do you think I'd maintain course as scum?

[mostlytechnic]

Lusk and Ewan as usually more active than this so I question is it due to other engagements or due to not wanting to follow Anthony.

The first. Just a busy time of year, even when on an adventure such as this, combined with the fact that my observations on past adventures often lead to suspicion of me and arguments that lead us in the wrong directions for too long, so I'm being a bit more reserved on this trip. When I have something worth noting, I'll yell plenty.

[KotZ]

Interesting that you single out Foorth out of the four names mentioned. Why him in particular and not any of the others.

If Foorth was online and didn't switch votes, it is a legitimate concern. But since this is a game played by people in widely differing timezones, it may well be that he was asleep/switched off at the time.

That was what I was hoping to have cleared up, which (I hope) Foorth seems to have done below. Of course it could just be he said-she said and some lying, but I was hoping for a sort of alibi, and while not exactly the best, we can hesitantly at the others.

Again - don't remember, but I know I didn't know she was the blocker until night phase, at which point I conceded I was wrong to her in private - she will confirm.

Ok, thank you.

[JackJonespaw]

Current Votes:

None.

You have around 14 hours left.

[fhomess]

I am around, just not as present as I normally would be able to be in such situations. The two reactions today that stick out to me are the handful of folks who seem so eager to declare our investigator cleared and the eagerness with which Doctor Wynn seems to be following up on other people's suggestions. The first is interesting because Anthony seems to have given up yesterday. His comment and vote for Elijah can either be seen as a clear acknowledgement of loss or of an attempt to distance himself from Elijah, but either interpretation essentially suggests that he was acknowledging the investigation was correct. If anyone had doubt, at that point it shouldn't moved significantly towards confirmation of the result.

[MagPiesRUs]

Shit, time really flies when you're making the perfect smorgasbord. I guess we should probably lynch someone before the sun goes down. While I stopped by earlier, I noticed Foorth, Woodcock and Julia all popped in and said nothing. I would have expected all of you should have shown some leadership and urgency, but it looks like you're waiting for someone else to come up with a case. I know Molly said earlier today she may have caught another scum, but surely we can do something more productive than sitting around waiting for that?

Although all three of you are pretty high on my list of scum, I think Julia just leads by a nose - for defending Anthony, having no confidence in her vote for Perce, ignoring Molly's roleclaim and just generally being pretty scummy. Vote: Julia Jones (CallMePie)

[Dragonfire]

my vote for Molly was more on HER behavior rather than her target of a vote, even if that still played a factor; i.e. it was less "don't vote for him, he's town" and more "don't care about him, but I don't like you." But again, as town, I don't plan out my moves strategically, so I have no master plan or explanation.

Molly, this is also true for my suspicion of Quincy earlier today.

When there's 1 vote on the town blocker and no risk of a lynch of her and she's claimed, do you think I'd maintain course as scum?

Exactly.

That was what I was hoping to have cleared up, which (I hope) Foorth seems to have done below. Of course it could just be he said-she said and some lying, but I was hoping for a sort of alibi, and while not exactly the best, we can hesitantly at the others.

No, now you're trying to back your way out of a sticky situation. You singled out Foorth and tried to make us focus on him for really stupid reasons, and then when he makes one post in defence, you automatically withdraw your suspicion of him. IMO that's a scum move.

While I stopped by earlier, I noticed Foorth, Woodcock and Julia all popped in and said nothing.

Wait, Woodcock's been here and said nothing? With all the talk concerning him, he ought to get in here, clear things up and defend himself. Or maybe - oh la la! - he's just gone to consult with his buddies on the scum board about what to say?

[Tariq j]

3) I didn't ask a question regarding the logic behind the ping: that's only what Woodcock has accused me of. I made a fluffy role-playing comment referring to Foorth being a robot. And even if I hypothetically did do what Woodcock is accusing me of, I don't get how it's scummy at all. Oh la la!

Something isn't sitting well here. When I first read this post I believed you, however, having read back on Day 2 you seemed to have the opposite impression:

To be honest, this seems as if you're just looking for an excuse to justify a weak, baseless vote. What sinister undertones could it have had?

And I was going to bring this up today as well, Dink just got to it first.

Your posts aren't adding up at all, today you're saying you didn't find his post scummy at all, but yesterday you did. Oh la la!

[CMP]

Shit, time really flies when you're making the perfect smorgasbord. I guess we should probably lynch someone before the sun goes down. While I stopped by earlier, I noticed Foorth, Woodcock and Julia all popped in and said nothing. I would have expected all of you should have shown some leadership and urgency, but it looks like you're waiting for someone else to come up with a case. I know Molly said earlier today she may have caught another scum, but surely we can do something more productive than sitting around waiting for that?

I take this is a 'get you talking' vote, and I apologize, I'm having a bit of trouble getting back into the swing of things, I was quite busy/distracted on our lengthy break.

This might come across as trying to steer attention elsewhere, but I'm concerned that neither Gale nor Duke have appeared today period. I glanced through the rules and it doesn't seem like there's anything regarding inactive players unless I misread. So...I suppose we just have to deal with the fact that they're going to be dead weight?

I'll vote: Ewan Breckenridge (mostlytechnic).

I trust that the town block has good reason for suspecting these four. Out of them, Foorth has come across as fairly on the level to me, Lusk has too for as little as he's been around, and Duke...has gotten weirdly quiet as of late, like I mentioned.

But onto Ewan...he wasn't around on Day One. Day Two, he comes in swinging with some...weird logic.

Now, I caught up on day 1 without looking ahead to today so I could read it like I'd been a part of it. I marked a few things that stood out, and now that I'm caught up on yesterday and today, here's my thoughts (and yes, I understand that I'm now commenting with the benefit of more information including the result of the lynch.

"Hey look I'm town because I didn't say I was gonna look back before I did!"

This pinged me - not because it was about me, but because it was a scum-read on someone who'd made literally just a couple fluffy day 1 posts. How on earth do you already get a scum read on that?

That's about as much of a scum read as you get sometimes on Day One...

And this - as soon as I saw Perce's random vote I knew he was in trouble, but I understood what he was doing. I've lived lives over on another world known as MafiaScum and they actually call the start of the game "RVS" for Random Voting Stage. Everyone throws out votes for whoever, with no real justification, just to get things started and see how people respond. As a noob to our group, that's basically was Perce was doing, but that's not how we normally act and he got lynched for it. Sorry dude! I can say that I would have been very unlikely to have voted for him for exactly this reasoning. The ONLY way I'd have voted for him was just to prevent a no-lynch, but probably not even then. Especially after he pretty clearly claimed vanilla, I was convinced he was just a struggling newbie and legitimately town.

I really didn't like this. I never hid the fact that I wasn't sure of my own vote on Percy but here comes Ewan saying "Oh, well. It was OBVIOUS he was townie." And to a point I agree with the logic behind not suspecting Percy, I followed it too, for the most part...but if you're that certain about somebody being town, don't vote for them. I wasn't feeling great about my own vote, but if you're ever 'convinced he was legitimately town' why would you ever vote for somebody? That's not how mafia works. :wacko:

Oh, and this one pinged me yesterday too. You're correct that being a godfather twice in a row is unlikely. But again, THE LAST GAME HAS ZERO INFLUENCE ON THE ODDS IN THIS GAME. I'm following facts and statistics. You're the one spouting common stupidity, because most people SUCK at statistics. You are literally no less (and likewise, no more) likely to be godfather this time because you were last time. You even basically admit that my numbers are right but then call me scum for stating literal objective facts. Oh, and two of us called you on the bad statistics but I'm the one you called scum for it. Guess you already had enough fighting going on with Anthony....

I skipped quoting Ewan for most of the day because arguing with Elijah over dumb statistics a fair chunk of his posts.

Really? You weren't the only one? I just reread day 1. Here's what I found:

See, some reasoning (being quiet)

Too talkative

You making an accusation WITH base to it. So you don't always throw out baseless scum reads.

A reason for scum-reading.

A baseless accusation/vote. And what happened to him? Oh yeah, he got freakin' lynched for it!

Accusations with a reason.

Another accusation of me, even though he got me confused with someone else.

Another (legit) accusation of me for lying low.

Now, here's the interesting thing to me. Those posts from Elijah and Ray were back to back. The next post was YOU continuing the accusations on me with literally no reason given. So, a scum trying to build a bandwagon on me? That's pretty much what it looks like to me. As for your claim that day 1 had many people throwing out baseless accusations, I sure didn't find that at all. In fact, yours was the only one I saw (other than the obvious joking stuff with Anthony/Elijah).

For some context, he was arguing with Delwyn (confirmed town) over day one stuff, namely that Delwyn had been throwing around baseless comments and she pointed out that it was a fairly common thing on Day One.

You know, much like the random voting phase Ewan had mentioned earlier. Except this time it's 'scum trying to build a bandwagon' and not 'something everyone does'. It's called poking people for reactions around here and it happens regularly early on.

So, let's recap. He joins us one day later to brag about how our lynch was poorly chosen and how obviously Percy was town. He spends most of the day arguing with Elijah over statistics or voicing hypocritical suspicions with someone who appears to be confirmed town.

I'm pretty confident in my vote.

[def]

I haven't had much time recently to dig deep in here. My second life is taking over. For the moment I'll place a vote here:

vote: Ewan Breckenridge (mostlytechnic).

I'll be back before the end hopefully if my vote is better elsewhere.

[mostlytechnic]

Well... I sure hope that we get some actual info today from the block to guide the voting, because right now we've got two normally solid players (Julia and Elijah) strongly barking up the wrong tree in voting for me. And it's hard to defend against, since it's still early in the adventure and I actually have been unusually quiet.

Julia - when I was arguing with Delywn, she wasn't yet a confirmed townie. So there's a limit to how much you can hold that against me. Sure, if I was scum I'd have known she was town, but do you think then I'd have been dumb enough to kill her off that night? (and no, I'm not saying I know she was the scum kill - could have been vig kill as well)

More importantly though, you're totally taking the discussion out of context to beat me with it. Yes, accusations are thin in the early game. But there's a difference between thin and literally baseless, just like there's a difference between an experienced player making baseless accusations (Delwyn) and a noob doing the same (Perce) - so no, I was NOT being hypocritical. Context makes all the difference.

And as for why I was brought up in the list by the town block, it's because anyone being too quiet deserves to be brought out. I haven't been publicly cleared and so yeah, Molly's right to throw my name out there. I've got no problem with that. I do note though how a couple people jumped on that as an excuse to try and start a bandwagon on me... One with poor reasoning and one with no reasoning...

Wow, only a few hours left and almost no votes... so I will

Vote: Woodcock (bob)

because he's one of the few being as quiet or quieter than I have been, and almost all of it fluff.

[Lady K]

I am very glad we have finally decided to sing together once again. And to those four who I named I appreciate the responses.......oh wait.....one of you didn't respond.....Duke, Duke....are you out there somewhere....perhaps you are hiding in the shadows because you have been discovered as scum......

Yes we have a result. Not from a night investigation directly, but indirectly tied to last nights actions and a day 1 claim by Duke Bowman (cutcobra). He sent me his claim very late near the ending of the day that he was the town tracker and had tracked Dewlyn(RofF) night one and saw her as a doctor or watcher targeting him night one. She told me this was not the case and that did not happen night one. Night two she was targeted and we know now she was town, so I take Dewlyn as telling the truth and Duke as trying to infiltrate the town block. I contacted him early at the beginning of day 3 asking for his night results. As a test I had him track me night two without telling him my target. He has not contacted me at all, now granted he has not been online since the 21st but I have given him time for his defense.

Vote: Duke Bowman (cutcobra)

[mostlytechnic]

Well then I will

unvote: Woodcock (bob)

Vote: Duke Bowman (cutcobra)

Now, am I right that we have like 30 minutes before the end of the day? Eek! So many people not voting.

[Tariq j]

Well I guess it goes without saying, good work!

Vote: Duke Bowman (cutcobra)

[mostlytechnic]

No, from the time stamps we've got TWO minutes. Even worse! Looks like a no-lynch day

[JackJonespaw]

No Lynch Today!

You've got 24 Hours to Put in your Night Actions.

[JackJonespaw]

¬ From the Journal of Jack Jones, Entry Date Lost, Named Day 3

The last hours had been spent in darkness. We barely had any torches left, and we’d seriously misjudged just how quickly they would burn down. We had to light a torch, see as far ahead as we could, and slowly inch forward until no one remembered which way the stairs turned, in which case we would light another torch.

Therefore, we were very, very behind schedule. As we could barely see, there wasn’t much conversation, and what seemed like half of the group had been silent for the entire 72 hours. I was only hoping that we hadn’t left anyone behind.

Be that as it was, the group just didn’t have the will or strength to get rid of anyone. I feared for that for the next few hours - it was very dark, and we were very susceptible.

¬ End Journal Entry