Pirate theme getting worse

[IvanTheBuilder]

Hello. I have over the past year realised that the LEGO pirate sets are getting worse. And by that i mean less minifigures and a smaller part count. But the prices are as always progressing to higher levels. Am I the only one who holds this opinion or do some other LEGO pirate fans see this as well.

[Tomsche]

It`s something that happens along all the ranges, not just Pirates

[IvanTheBuilder]

Yes but with them it is very obvius.

[Kaboozle]

I think 2015 Pirates is better than we give it credit for, especially the minifigs, but still it wasn't great. Hopefully if LEGO make Pirates of the Caribbean sets next year they'll put more effort into designing them as they tend to do this with new licensed themes.

[Captain Becker]

Well, we have to keep in mind also that the Lego is mainly for kids. Not really adult fans like us. I do however agree whit you a bit. Especially when we got the Brickbeards bounty in 2009 and the Brick Bounty 2016, they were just over prized about a 100 euros or more, when I think it should have been about 80 euros. And they lacked a lot in overall desing, comparing to the older ships, and they were pretty much copies from each other.

So yes, in some aspects its true, but then again, Pirates are not the Flagship of lelgo like it may have been in the 80´s or the 90´s. And I dont expect much from the Pirates line anymore, however, I was extremely happy to see some thought and love put into the minifigs prints and the flag of the bluecoats in 2016, So not all hope is lost yet.

Captain Becker

[Kaboozle]

Yeah, we can't expect TIC to put as much effort into Pirates as Star Wars or City.

[IvanTheBuilder]

Well, we have to keep in mind also that the Lego is mainly for kids. Not really adult fans like us. I do however agree whit you a bit. Especially when we got the Brickbeards bounty in 2009 and the Brick Bounty 2016, they were just over prized about a 100 euros or more, when I think it should have been about 80 euros. And they lacked a lot in overall desing, comparing to the older ships, and they were pretty much copies from each other.

So yes, in some aspects its true, but then again, Pirates are not the Flagship of lelgo like it may have been in the 80´s or the 90´s. And I dont expect much from the Pirates line anymore, however, I was extremely happy to see some thought and love put into the minifigs prints and the flag of the bluecoats in 2016, So not all hope is lost yet.

Captain Becker

That is very true sadly. And i think for LEGO as a company it would be a good move to cut the Pirates line as it is not much of a profit compared to other themes like Ninjago or Star Wars. I just hope they give us another proper wave in 2018 or even sooner but that is very unlikely to happen.

Edited August 23, 2016 by IvanTheBuilder

[TheLegoDr]

It doesn't seem like a lot of the early themes are as popular anymore. Look at castle (they had to go sci-fi), space (only NASA related or Star Wars), and pirates (few and far between).

It is clear Star Wars and other Licensed themes are the real moneymaker for LEGO. NInjago is popular and did introduce some neat Pirate related items, but with a ninja/steampunk flair, so not always as useful as they could have been.

I actually thought the 2015 line was done really well, although it was almost a carbon copy of the 2009 line, just with new prints and pieces. I didn't buy any of the sets, but I did jump on the chance to get some new bluecoats (even though I prefer the Revolutionary Soldier bluecoat in the CMF line). And new pirate prints which were updated prints of what I grew up with was more than welcome. It had a nice nostalgic feel to the sets, although I still prefer my late 80s/early 90s sets for substance and final aesthetic.

[Robert8]

The Pirate line is very formulaic: Pirate Ship, Outpost, etc...

Some sets like 6253 and 10210 are rare jewels

I think LEGO should try something different for the next in house line. I have 4 suggestions to keep it fresh.

-Bring back Inslanders. They already did it in CMF Series 11. It just need to be its own "independent" theme to avoid controversies

- Include magical/mythological creatures like the Kraken, sea dragons, mermaids, etc...

- A theme more focused in the soldiers than the pirates, so a huge fortress would be the biggest set of the line, etc...

- A pirates vs pirates theme with 2 different pirates "factions" fighting against each other.

[TheLegoDr]

^I like the idea of a more Asiatic Pirate group, similar to POTC 3. That could be fun. New prints/sails and whatnot anyway.

[Littleworlds]

I think the last pirate theme was indeed pretty weak. The buildings were extremely simplified and possibly meant as entry-level theme for younger kids. At least thats the only explanation apart from not bothering to design something proper

And yeah, the Minifigs were the only highlight of it really. I got a couple of the shipwreck defense-set on sale, the rest wasn't even much represented on the shelves where I was looking...

Really a pity, since I do think pirates, if properly done still have some potential. At least we got some Ninjago Air pirates last year. Maybe it has to get more into that direction to be successful...

[Kaboozle]

The sad truth is that LEGO is trying to make money and Pirated simply is not that profitable, apart from with AFOLs and some TFOLs, so they don't really have much reason to keep it for longer than one wave. Hopefully the new POTC movie wil make pirates more popular.

[AViewToALego]

I think 2015 Pirates is better than we give it credit for, especially the minifigs, but still it wasn't great. Hopefully if LEGO make Pirates of the Caribbean sets next year they'll put more effort into designing them as they tend to do this with new licensed themes.

Definitely. Especially compared to Nexo Knights, the "Pirates 2015"-line is a complete masterpiece.

Edited August 23, 2016 by AViewToALego

[BrickJagger]

This is a trend happening across all classic themes. Pirates 2009, while being fairly generic, was a very good theme. Pirates 2015 was a clear recession. The same can be said for Kingdoms and Castle 2013. Space is next up, I expect a new Space theme soon that introduces nothing new and is discontinued after one year.

The sad truth is that Licenses are the big thing right now rather than actual creativity, but it'll die out one day because everything does. That's why I have hope that the classic themes can come back one day stronger than ever.

[IvanTheBuilder]

I just started my Pirate collection. I had no interest in the previous waves because I was mainly buying Star Wars sets and I was overlooking other themes so i really hope they will give classic themes another shot.

[Lyichir]

Personally I was fairly impressed with the latest Pirates wave, despite its small size. The sets it did get had some nice details and techniques, including forts that made use of brick-built detail instead of large printed wall panels, and figures and sets inspired by the classics. While a bigger wave with larger sets would have been nicer, I do think that in terms of the quality of the sets we got was nicer than the 2009 wave, which tended to have less interesting and complex builds.

As for a lot of the other comments about this, there seem to be a lot of misconceptions circling around. The idea that Lego is overreliant on licenses these days is inaccurate, since licensed themes still make up only about a third of their sales and that hasn't changed for the past decade or so. Themes like City, Ninjago, and Friends are consistently among Lego's best-selling themes.

[kurigan]

IMHO: I think Lego realizes that a lot of what keeps certain themes, like Pirates, going is adult interest. So in an effort to keep that revenue flowing they make what they can, but dumb things down for two reasons. AFOLs are more likely to customize or part-out so why bother with intensive designs? Add to that the chance that kids might actually take to the theme after all and over complicating the sets might only turn children off, theoretically. Keep in mind all our perspectives may be skewed by age and maturity. Were the "classics" all that great or were just easily impressed as children?

[Pulp Detective]

The Pirates wave of 2009 is what got me to love this line and I was expecting the same quality from last years wave.Suffice to say I was disappointed,the whole wave felt like a rehash of the '09 wave with the main difference the bluecoats instead of the redcoats.

But I did buy the ship (the Brick Bounty) because I never had one and God knows when Lego will bring back this line..... if ever dare I say.

And from what I hear Lego might not even make sets for the new PotC movie next year,which will be a huge shame if it's indeed true.

Edited August 24, 2016 by LOTR34

[Kaboozle]

I was into other themes at the time of 2009 and also at the time of POTC so 2015 pirates along with a couple of small older sets is all I've got.

[IvanTheBuilder]

Well then what can we say in conclusion?

Good or bad?

[x105Black]

Well then what can we say in conclusion?

Good or bad?

I thought it was good, despite it being smaller than it's predecessors.

Minifigures were excellent.

[TalonCard]

Hello. I have over the past year realised that the LEGO pirate sets are getting worse. And by that i mean less minifigures and a smaller part count. But the prices are as always progressing to higher levels. Am I the only one who holds this opinion or do some other LEGO pirate fans see this as well.

I think there's a lot to unpack there. The truth is that we only have one year's worth of recent Pirate sets that doesn't compare favorably with the previous couple of waves. There's no evidence to suggest that future Pirate sets won't improve--I mean, just put the Black Seas Barracuda, the Red Beard Runner, the new Imperial Flagship, and the Queen's Anne Revenge next to each other--it's hard to argue that quality is definitely trending downward in each case. The Red Beard Runner doesn't even compare with the Barracuda, but the most recent ships are far, far better than the Runner.

As for increasing prices/fewer pieces and minifigures, I would like to see someone crunch the numbers--I suspect that accounting for inflation, the difference isn't that severe. And the minifigures are of much higher quality than they were in the 90s too, at least.

But taken as a whole, the 2015 Pirate line isn't quite as good as the 2009 line. I think the individual sets tell a slightly different story, though. I think 2015's Shipwreck Defense and Treasure Island are far better than the equivalent 2009 Cannon Battle and Loot Island. (I'd go so far as to say that Shipwreck Defense is one of the best small LEGO Pirate sets of all time.) It's the larger sets that just don't measure up, the Soldier's Fort and the Brick Bounty. (Though I much prefer the Brick Bounty's skull-and-swords over the goofy jolly roger of the 2009 line--one of the best things about LEGO Pirates is that they have a little edge to their general whimsy.)

I think that on the surface the 2009 and 2015 lines are pretty similar in terms of play experiences, but the builds are quite different. The overall quality of sets is higher in the 2009 line, but I think the 2015 sets have a more appealing aesthetic with some really great sets.

I don't think the real issue is that we've had a "bad" year for LEGO Pirates--IMO the real sticking point for most of us Piratical die-hards is that Pirates has been and most likely will be kept alive with sporadic releases every couple of years, with the same basic factions and types of sets. The good news is that it gives all kids a chance to make LEGO Pirates a part of their childhood. The bad news is that LEGO's rapid release cycle means that the window in which to even get the sets is shorter and shorter. And there's no second wave to build on the first. I think the clone brands have, unfortunately, stepped in to fill that gap somewhat--there are a number of smaller ships and other sets that aren't direct ripoffs of LEGO design that could easily fit right into a second wave of Pirate sets.

Keep in mind all our perspectives may be skewed by age and maturity. Were the "classics" all that great or were just easily impressed as children?

I think that's a good question to ask. It's not so much that we were easily impressed at the time--LEGO went above and beyond with the boxes and catalogs and other media to create an immersive Pirate world that felt real. And a lot of sets were genuinely impressive. But nostalgia is powerful--some of the older sets are either uninspired (Forbidden Island, Shipwreck Island) or have really weird builds when you look at them up close (Imperial Trading Post), and don't compare favorably with some of the more recent sets.

Also, time and better sets in the future will probably change people's opinion of the 2015 line. I remember seeing the 2004 +4 Pirate sets, and just shaking my head. By themselves, they were a poor substitute indeed for minifigure pirate sets. But now I wish I had bought them, as they are a pretty cool and unique incarnation of LEGO Pirates. I'm seeing a lot of love now for the Islanders and the 1996 Pirate sets, which were generally disliked by AFOLs back in the day.

It doesn't seem like a lot of the early themes are as popular anymore. Look at castle (they had to go sci-fi), space (only NASA related or Star Wars), and pirates (few and far between).

It would be hard to recapture the popularity of the Pirates theme at its hight...but I think that has more to do with the wide range of themes LEGO has had in the past few years compared to 1989-1994, when Pirates was the newest of only four core minifigure themes. When you think about it, it's kind of weird that it was that way for five years. LEGO is much more open now to new ideas and settings than it was at that time, and that's not a bad thing. We've had dinosaurs, monsters, mummies, alien invasions, water worlds, cowboys, time travel, secret agents, ninjas, swamps, arctic, farms, and on and on and on--and that's not even counting all the licenses and video games. Pirates just has to wait its turn amongst the dozens of other potential themes and revisits of older themes.

This isn't the worst it could be by any means--from 1997 to 2009 there were no new minifigure Pirate sets at all, and it was awful. By comparison, 2009-11 and 2015 seem like a new golden age of LEGO Pirates. And it seems a little indulgent to sulk over the lack of Pirates in terms of specifically Pirate themed sets when we've had some nice Pirateish releases from other themes in the meantime; Ninjago, the LEGO Movie, Spongebob, etc, and some nice representation in the Collectable Minifigures. But still, the lack of anything on the horizon is a bit of a letdown. (I'm more dissappointed about the lack of new Pirates of the Caribbean sets than I thought I would be.)

BUT. 2019 will be the thirtieth anniversary of the Pirate theme--LEGO can't let that go unobserved. I can't imagine they wouldn't bring their A-game to at least one big set--I'm looking forward to it.

TC

[azog]

Your right 100%! The pirate theme is a fantastic theme! Yeah maybe the newer ones were not the best. But the minifigures made it all worth it! For lego to remake the bluecoats and redcoats is quite a big deal! Lego could have done something a lot worse. And talon card your right! There is a great chance that lego could be bringing us a huge and fantastic pirate theme to celebrate its anniversary! For all we know it could be the best pirate theme yet!

Your right 100%! The pirate theme is a fantastic theme! Yeah maybe the newer ones were not the best. But the minifigures made it all worth it! For lego to remake the bluecoats and redcoats is quite a big deal! Lego could have done something a lot worse. And talon card your right! There is a great chance that lego could be bringing us a huge and fantastic pirate theme to celebrate its anniversary! For all we know it could be the best pirate theme yet!

[IvanTheBuilder]

I think there's a lot to unpack there. ...

TC

Sorry man i currently have no time to read this.

[kurigan]

Sorry man i currently have no time to read this.

I’ve gone and edited out the unnecessary content from your post. In such cases it really is not necessary to quote the entire message nor is it particularly wise to make comment on the length of the post then proceed to repost it in its entirety.