"Castle lines never die" or "what made me change my mind and believe in new exciting castle lines".

[x105Black]

16 minutes ago, BrickJagger said:

I think the main difference in opinion between everyone here is whether the next Castle theme should be fantasy-based or realistic. I'm still upset that TLG never got around to making Elves in 2009, and I would love to see a second Fantasy including them, as well as much more of the underrepresented Dwarves. I'd be down for five factions total: Good Humans, Elves, Evil Humans, Evil Dwarves and Goblins. I don't know if all of that could be accomplished in three years, but then again it's not a confirmed fact that Castle themes come in three year cycles, even if there is evidence to support that recently.

That's a reasonable observation, as well.  I'm up for either, although I would prefer more human-based sets.  I've never been too big a fan of the elves and dwarves (I might feel differently if the dwarves could bend their legs, or if there were more than a couple of elves), but I'd be open to it if the pieces were worthwhile.  I'm more interested in rehashing and revamping the Classic Castle era from 1978 - 1997, as that's what I grew up with.

I'd love to see Forestmen come back, as has been discussed before, and I'd prefer a co-operation element with some (but not all) Forestmen being elves.  I think, overall, I'd like to see the races more inter-mingled like this.  Maybe the village has a dwarven blacksmith.  Maybe there are a few goblins that fight with an evil-oriented faction.

To be completely honest, I'd rather not have the alignment of the factions be so completely obvious.  I like the ambiguity, with the possibility that the knights in black can be the good guys, and the knights in white could be evil.  In Game of Thrones right now, I'm rooting for the Dragon faction to defeat the Lion faction (maybe with the help of the Wolfpack).

[Trekkie99]

11 hours ago, BrickJagger said:

I think the main difference in opinion between everyone here is whether the next Castle theme should be fantasy-based or realistic. I'm still upset that TLG never got around to making Elves in 2009, and I would love to see a second Fantasy including them, as well as much more of the underrepresented Dwarves. I'd be down for five factions total: Good Humans, Elves, Evil Humans, Evil Dwarves and Goblins. I don't know if all of that could be accomplished in three years, but then again it's not a confirmed fact that Castle themes come in three year cycles, even if there is evidence to support that recently.

The decision between realistic and fantasy castle themes is a tricky one for me personally. I'm torn on the issue the same way in which I'm torn between aliens vs no aliens in a space theme. Usually I like to have blacktron (the bad knights) attacking Mtron (the peasants) and then having space police (the good knights) coming to save the day.  

But then comes along the insectoids (goblins)! "Oh no!" "They do nothing but pillage and murder!" "The good knights are unable to stop them, even with the joined forces of the bad knights who were fearing for their safety!" We're doomed!!!" "Wait." "What's this?!" "Some mythical race of long eared humanoids (who happen to be super dreamy!) have joined are forces!" "We're saved!" "And look!" "The reclusive dwarfs are helping as well by launching sneak attacks upon the goblins!" "Hurray!" "We've won!" "Let us host a feast in honor of our new found friends!"

Wow. That just got really exciting! I think we can all agree which type of castle theme would sell best.  

Edited June 10, 2017 by LegoMonorailFan

[Digger of Bricks]

1 minute ago, LegoMonorailFan said:

The decision between realistic and fantasy castle themes is a tricky one for me personally. I'm torn on the issue the same way in which I'm torn between aliens vs no aliens in a space theme. Usually I like to have blacktron (the bad knights) attacking Mtron (the peasants) and then having space police (the good knights) coming to save the day.  

But then comes along the insectoids (goblins)! "Oh no!" "They do nothing but pillage and murder!" "The good knights are unable to stop them, even with the joined forces of the bad knights who were fearing for their safety!" We're doomed!!!" "Wait." "What's this?!" "Some mythical race of long eared humanoids (who happen to be super dreamy!) have joined are forces!" "We're saved!" "And look!" "The reclusive dwarfs are helping as well by launching sneak attacks upon the goblins!" "Hurray!" "We've won!" "Let us host a feast in honor of our new found friends!"

Wow. That just got really exciting! I think we can all tell which type of castle theme would sell best.  

I'm surprised that Nexo Knights didn't introduce any third party ally/enemy factions, that would have made things more interesting for the theme and its TV show.

Perhaps the knights could have allied with some hipster coffee loving elves, or some geeky, basement dwelling computer hacker dwarves. 

Well, maybe the multiple factions would have made the theme too similar to its big bang predecessor Legends of Fabuland, oh, I mean Chima. 

[Trekkie99]

Just now, Digger of Bricks said:

I'm surprised that Nexo Knights didn't introduce any third party ally/enemy factions, that would have made things more interesting for the theme and its TV show.

Perhaps the knights could have allied with some hipster coffee loving elves, or some geeky, basement dwelling computer hacker dwarves. 

Well, maybe the multiple factions would have made the theme too similar to its big bang predecessor Legends of Fabuland, oh, I mean Chima. 

 

 

[Lyichir]

I do think that fantasy makes more sense for a modern many-faction theme, simply because of how much easier it would make it for kids to differentiate them. Someone brought up a comparison to Chima's huge number of factions, and that's a perfect example—it'd be very hard for kids to mix up a lion vehicle and a wolf vehicle, or a raven fig and an eagle fig. Elves and KK2 are other examples, using bright colors to differentiate characters and their alignments. It'd be harder to achieve that with more nuanced distinctions between human factions—especially if you wanted "realistic" castles that limited color distinctions between factions to accent colors on largely grey or black buildings. Fantasy settings also allow for a wider range of architecture to be used for different factions, as opposed to many "realistic" medieval conflicts which tended to be between factions which largely had similar cultures and use of technology (the main exception being conflicts like the crusades that'd be touchy subjects from a modern perspective).

I think Fantasy Castle's over-the-top sensibilities tended to make this work—Dwarves and human knights looked very different from one another, as did trolls and skeletons, and the sensibilities of their structures and vehicles differed greatly as well. It also helped that that theme's multiple factions still boiled down to two major "alliances", with the humans and dwarves working together against the undead and troll factions. I wouldn't mind seeing a new castle theme like that.

Edited June 10, 2017 by Lyichir

[x105Black]

1 hour ago, Lyichir said:

I do think that fantasy makes more sense for a modern many-faction theme, simply because of how much easier it would make it for kids to differentiate them. Someone brought up a comparison to Chima's huge number of factions, and that's a perfect example—it'd be very hard for kids to mix up a lion vehicle and a wolf vehicle, or a raven fig and an eagle fig. Elves and KK2 are other examples, using bright colors to differentiate characters and their alignments. It'd be harder to achieve that with more nuanced distinctions between human factions—especially if you wanted "realistic" castles that limited color distinctions between factions to accent colors on largely grey or black buildings. Fantasy settings also allow for a wider range of architecture to be used for different factions, as opposed to many "realistic" medieval conflicts which tended to be between factions which largely had similar cultures and use of technology (the main exception being conflicts like the crusades that'd be touchy subjects from a modern perspective).

I think Fantasy Castle's over-the-top sensibilities tended to make this work—Dwarves and human knights looked very different from one another, as did trolls and skeletons, and the sensibilities of their structures and vehicles differed greatly as well. It also helped that that theme's multiple factions still boiled down to two major "alliances", with the humans and dwarves working together against the undead and troll factions. I wouldn't mind seeing a new castle theme like that.

Even if Castle goes Fantasy again, I'm really hoping that they don't push it over the top.  And as I said above, I'd really hope that they didn't keep the races completely segregated.  I do think that using colors to differentiate the factions would be helpful.  So the Forestmen faction would all wear dark greens and browns, whether they be human, elf, or otherwise.  The Black Falcons would all wear dark blues, whether they be humans, dwarves, or otherwise.  The colors don't have to be bright for this to work, there's an easily visible separation between dark red and dark purple.  Giving each faction a different building style is also a great idea.  Maybe such a theme could explore things like Greco-Roman and Nordic styles along with the standard medieval builds.

[SerenityInFire]

I just want them to bring back orcs/trolls and those wonderful warg molds.  

[x105Black]

48 minutes ago, SerenityInFire said:

I just want them to bring back orcs/trolls and those wonderful warg molds.  

I would welcome these things.  I'm particularly wanting to see the wargs return.  Wolfpack warg riders would be so much fun to see.  But yes, bigfig trolls would be great as well.

[gedren_y]

That Crownie castle was an Escher and BURP nightmare. Worse was that the BURPs were mixed Dark Bley and Dark Green. Lego should never go there again.

Given the popularity of Elves (it's true), I doubt Castle will go into high fantasy any time soon.

[thetang22]

Plot twist:  The next "Castle" theme is actually going to be a "City" theme, and it's going to be a Renaissance Festival :)

(while that's a joke, I think it could be kinda fun, in a way)

Regarding Fantasy vs. Realistic...I think Fantasy is more likely to have wacky building/vehicle designs, whereas Realistic would give us much more traditional structures.  On the other hand, I'd be more interested in the potential factions of a Fantasy theme, despite preferring more traditional structures.

[x105Black]

1 hour ago, gedren_y said:

Given the popularity of Elves (it's true), I doubt Castle will go into high fantasy any time soon.

Maybe it will push Castle into high fantasy, as LEGO will see that it sells well.

36 minutes ago, thetang22 said:

Regarding Fantasy vs. Realistic...I think Fantasy is more likely to have wacky building/vehicle designs, whereas Realistic would give us much more traditional structures.  On the other hand, I'd be more interested in the potential factions of a Fantasy theme, despite preferring more traditional structures.

Agreed on both points.

[Digger of Bricks]

2 hours ago, thetang22 said:

Plot twist:  The next "Castle" theme is actually going to be a "City" theme, and it's going to be a Renaissance Festival :)

(while that's a joke, I think it could be kinda fun, in a way)

Well seriously, maybe we could see castle incorporated into the City theme someway, though not as a actual castle theme, of course. 

I think an medieval archaeological dig site subtheme could be plausible, with sets revolving around the excavation of castle ruins just outside of the city limits looking for medieval weaponry and throne room treasures. 

[Artanis I]

On 10/06/2017 at 1:12 PM, BrickJagger said:

Evil Dwarves

Don't be saying those 2 words together, apparently it is offensive...

[Nabii]

So many people in this thread still saying Nexo-Knights is not Caslte. Fine, you can believe that if you like. But it was developed as Castle, it was tested alongside and against much more traditional Castle sets and it was the one that kids around the world helped shape and chose as their favourite direction for a castle theme.

 

If, despite these very strong test scores, Nexo Knight does not perform well in the market place then how likely do you think it is LEGO will take a bet on one of the themes that tested worse? Like the old Classic style castles?

Anyone seen any Space sets since Galaxy Squad 'failed'?

Never make the assumption that just because you like something and it has been around for years that it will continue to be made. And if you spend a couple of years constantly telling the kids who read this (and other) forum how crappy NEXO Knights is because it's different to how Castle was when you were kids. It does you no favours. The Designers, who you should really want on your side, might start to see you as complaining people who are never happy with anything we do and don't seem to understand this is still mostly a kids toy. If you don't like what we design that's fine, but unless it's a bad building experience or the quality of bricks has tanked (things that should be complained about) then why are so many of you trying so hard to tell kids they shouldn't like it? That it is terrible? That only dumb little kids would like it? You seem so delighted with the idea Nexo Knights might fail.

You're hoping something you claim to be fans of goes wrong? It's crazy, and as fans of 'castle' it is self defeating. You should want it to shine, so that when it comes to a glorious ending LEGO turn around and say: "Yep, that was good, let's get back to traditional castle stuff." and not: "Kids don't seem to like castle anymore no matter how we dress it up, let's get another movie license."

[Digger of Bricks]

56 minutes ago, Nabii said:

So many people in this thread still saying Nexo-Knights is not Caslte. Fine, you can believe that if you like. But it was developed as Castle, it was tested alongside and against much more traditional Castle sets and it was the one that kids around the world helped shape and chose as their favourite direction for a castle theme.

 

If, despite these very strong test scores, Nexo Knight does not perform well in the market place then how likely do you think it is LEGO will take a bet on one of the themes that tested worse? Like the old Classic style castles?

Anyone seen any Space sets since Galaxy Squad 'failed'?

Never make the assumption that just because you like something and it has been around for years that it will continue to be made. And if you spend a couple of years constantly telling the kids who read this (and other) forum how crappy NEXO Knights is because it's different to how Castle was when you were kids. It does you no favours. The Designers, who you should really want on your side, might start to see you as complaining people who are never happy with anything we do and don't seem to understand this is still mostly a kids toy. If you don't like what we design that's fine, but unless it's a bad building experience or the quality of bricks has tanked (things that should be complained about) then why are so many of you trying so hard to tell kids they shouldn't like it? That it is terrible? That only dumb little kids would like it? You seem so delighted with the idea Nexo Knights might fail.

You're hoping something you claim to be fans of goes wrong? It's crazy, and as fans of 'castle' it is self defeating. You should want it to shine, so that when it comes to a glorious ending LEGO turn around and say: "Yep, that was good, let's get back to traditional castle stuff." and not: "Kids don't seem to like castle anymore no matter how we dress it up, let's get another movie license."

Of the three most recent "big bang" themes, Nexo Knights is my favorite, and I think you've helped design a most imaginative theme. 

I think this theme has helped greatly with the absence of traditional castle and space currently, and fans of both can find some useful minifigures and parts (THE PARTS! ), even though it may not be the theme they wish for. The good guys offer space fans some great minifigures and pieces (Trans. Neon Orange galore ), while the bad guys gave castle fans some ominous fantasy army builders. 

And regarding your last point, I'm definitely grateful for an original theme, since I think we are way too saturated with licences themes.

Also, since Exo Force, your set designs are best within many of the themes you have worked with! 8635 Mobile Command Center, 5973 Hyperspeed Pursuit, 5974 Galactic Enforcer, 7066 Earth Defence HQ, 9448 Samurai Mech, 70008 Gorzan's Gorilla Striker, and 70315 Clay's Rumble Blade are absolute favorites of mine! 

[gedren_y]

For fantasy creatures, and some fantastic elements, Nexo Knights works (Elves, too, BTW). For builders of castles, and historic realism, it is supremely lacking. If Nexo Knights would have been closer to He-Man than to Power Rangers in concept, I believe more people would think of it in Castle terms.

[SirBlake]

5 hours ago, Nabii said:

So many people in this thread still saying Nexo-Knights is not Caslte. Fine, you can believe that if you like. But it was developed as Castle, it was tested alongside and against much more traditional Castle sets and it was the one that kids around the world helped shape and chose as their favourite direction for a castle theme.

If, despite these very strong test scores, Nexo Knight does not perform well in the market place then how likely do you think it is LEGO will take a bet on one of the themes that tested worse? Like the old Classic style castles?

Anyone seen any Space sets since Galaxy Squad 'failed'?

Never make the assumption that just because you like something and it has been around for years that it will continue to be made. And if you spend a couple of years constantly telling the kids who read this (and other) forum how crappy NEXO Knights is because it's different to how Castle was when you were kids. It does you no favours. The Designers, who you should really want on your side, might start to see you as complaining people who are never happy with anything we do and don't seem to understand this is still mostly a kids toy. If you don't like what we design that's fine, but unless it's a bad building experience or the quality of bricks has tanked (things that should be complained about) then why are so many of you trying so hard to tell kids they shouldn't like it? That it is terrible? That only dumb little kids would like it? You seem so delighted with the idea Nexo Knights might fail.

You're hoping something you claim to be fans of goes wrong? It's crazy, and as fans of 'castle' it is self defeating. You should want it to shine, so that when it comes to a glorious ending LEGO turn around and say: "Yep, that was good, let's get back to traditional castle stuff." and not: "Kids don't seem to like castle anymore no matter how we dress it up, let's get another movie license."

1. It's about as "castle" as any castle with tank treads and jet planes, which is to say, not at all.

2. Take a bet? Last I checked, TLG is doing just fine. If they don't see the value in continuing to serve an audience they've spent 40 years building, that's their mistake to make.

3. No, there's been a terrible draught in the space theme, and that too is a mistake. But kids don't like space toys, right? /sarcasm

4. It also does us no favors to lie and talk about how wonderful a theme is that we don't like. Also, the designers are the ones who should want us on their side, not the other way around. It's our kids that are currently keeping them in business. I can't tell you how many hundreds of dollars a year TLG is missing out on because my daughter and I are skipping the Lego aisle because there's nothing there for us. She still gets the occasional Elves set, but nothing like a few years ago when we both had product available for us. It's a "bad building experience" because I don't want to build it in the first place. It's not my intention to "tell kids they shouldn't like it". I am communicating with my fellow fan that I am displeased with current offerings, and in case you haven't noticed, I am not alone. I am delighted at the chance that NK might fail because to my subjective eye, the whole theme looks bad. Trans orange and tanks have no business in a castle theme. 

5. I am a fan of Lego in general, but if there's no product I'm interested in, what's to be a fan of? Once again, as a drastic departure from traditional castle, the failure of NK would be a confirmation of what I and many others have deemed as stillborn from the very beginning.

All of that said, I don't understand why you're choosing to make this about a Nexo Knights indictment. As far as I can tell, this thread is about a hopeful, post NK future for castle. Should TLG be so short sighted as to damn all of Castle to purgatory because their wacky He-Man and the Visionaries of Power Rangers theme failed, that's fine. People like me will move on and take our wallets with us.

[BrickJagger]

7 hours ago, Nabii said:

So many people in this thread still saying Nexo-Knights is not Caslte. Fine, you can believe that if you like. But it was developed as Castle, it was tested alongside and against much more traditional Castle sets and it was the one that kids around the world helped shape and chose as their favourite direction for a castle theme.

 

If, despite these very strong test scores, Nexo Knight does not perform well in the market place then how likely do you think it is LEGO will take a bet on one of the themes that tested worse? Like the old Classic style castles?

Anyone seen any Space sets since Galaxy Squad 'failed'?

Never make the assumption that just because you like something and it has been around for years that it will continue to be made. And if you spend a couple of years constantly telling the kids who read this (and other) forum how crappy NEXO Knights is because it's different to how Castle was when you were kids. It does you no favours. The Designers, who you should really want on your side, might start to see you as complaining people who are never happy with anything we do and don't seem to understand this is still mostly a kids toy. If you don't like what we design that's fine, but unless it's a bad building experience or the quality of bricks has tanked (things that should be complained about) then why are so many of you trying so hard to tell kids they shouldn't like it? That it is terrible? That only dumb little kids would like it? You seem so delighted with the idea Nexo Knights might fail.

You're hoping something you claim to be fans of goes wrong? It's crazy, and as fans of 'castle' it is self defeating. You should want it to shine, so that when it comes to a glorious ending LEGO turn around and say: "Yep, that was good, let's get back to traditional castle stuff." and not: "Kids don't seem to like castle anymore no matter how we dress it up, let's get another movie license."

So are you saying that Nexo is a failure or are you referring to what traditional Castle fans think about it? I for one would love to know how well it's selling so we can have a more definitive discussion about the future of Castle.

Is there going to be a third year of Nexo?

[Digger of Bricks]

6 hours ago, gedren_y said:

For fantasy creatures, and some fantastic elements, Nexo Knights works (Elves, too, BTW). For builders of castles, and historic realism, it is supremely lacking. If Nexo Knights would have been closer to He-Man than to Power Rangers in concept, I believe more people would think of it in Castle terms.

When the first vague details started coming out late 2015 regarding a "big bang" fantasy castle theme, I originally visualized a World of Warcraft style theme, especially since some sources were describing it as somewhat "steampunk".

But instead, we got a type of space/castle crossover styled theme. Yes, it sort of is hard to think of it as a castle theme, I see it as somewhat more of a space theme.

I almost think a lot of fans might look back at this theme in retrospect and reconsider it as actually a pretty cool theme, irrespective of it not being a true space or castle theme.

[x105Black]

9 hours ago, Nabii said:

So many people in this thread still saying Nexo-Knights is not Caslte. Fine, you can believe that if you like. But it was developed as Castle, it was tested alongside and against much more traditional Castle sets and it was the one that kids around the world helped shape and chose as their favourite direction for a castle theme.

 

If, despite these very strong test scores, Nexo Knight does not perform well in the market place then how likely do you think it is LEGO will take a bet on one of the themes that tested worse? Like the old Classic style castles?

Anyone seen any Space sets since Galaxy Squad 'failed'?

Never make the assumption that just because you like something and it has been around for years that it will continue to be made. And if you spend a couple of years constantly telling the kids who read this (and other) forum how crappy NEXO Knights is because it's different to how Castle was when you were kids. It does you no favours. The Designers, who you should really want on your side, might start to see you as complaining people who are never happy with anything we do and don't seem to understand this is still mostly a kids toy. If you don't like what we design that's fine, but unless it's a bad building experience or the quality of bricks has tanked (things that should be complained about) then why are so many of you trying so hard to tell kids they shouldn't like it? That it is terrible? That only dumb little kids would like it? You seem so delighted with the idea Nexo Knights might fail.

You're hoping something you claim to be fans of goes wrong? It's crazy, and as fans of 'castle' it is self defeating. You should want it to shine, so that when it comes to a glorious ending LEGO turn around and say: "Yep, that was good, let's get back to traditional castle stuff." and not: "Kids don't seem to like castle anymore no matter how we dress it up, let's get another movie license."

OK, so this post has pushed me back from my optimism about the future of the Castle theme into a general negativity about the people running LEGO and how their minds work.  I'd love to see some of the ideas that tested worse than Nexo Knights.  I have to imagine that there are flaws beyond simple thematic elements.  I also don't think Nexo Knights would have tested as well as indicated here if there were actually a current Space and Castle themes available.  But really, I have so little to go on that I can only trust my own gut.

7 hours ago, gedren_y said:

For fantasy creatures, and some fantastic elements, Nexo Knights works (Elves, too, BTW). For builders of castles, and historic realism, it is supremely lacking. If Nexo Knights would have been closer to He-Man than to Power Rangers in concept, I believe more people would think of it in Castle terms.

Agreed.  There are some things about Nexo Knights and Elves that are really cool.  I applaud the lava monster concept, something I think LEGO would have been unwilling to use in a traditional Castle theme.  I also love the concept of stone monsters, even if I personally think they didn't work as well in practice due to color and printing issues.  And I really do appreciate the effort to go out on a limb with the Castle theme.  It can't be easy to take such a risk.  I just personally don't like where the theme went as a whole, despite the best efforts of talented designers and dumb little kids -- er, play testers.

3 hours ago, SirBlake said:

1. It's about as "castle" as any castle with tank treads and jet planes, which is to say, not at all.

2. Take a bet? Last I checked, TLG is doing just fine. If they don't see the value in continuing to serve an audience they've spent 40 years building, that's their mistake to make.

3. No, there's been a terrible draught in the space theme, and that too is a mistake. But kids don't like space toys, right? /sarcasm

4. It also does us no favors to lie and talk about how wonderful a theme is that we don't like. Also, the designers are the ones who should want us on their side, not the other way around. It's our kids that are currently keeping them in business. I can't tell you how many hundreds of dollars a year TLG is missing out on because my daughter and I are skipping the Lego aisle because there's nothing there for us. She still gets the occasional Elves set, but nothing like a few years ago when we both had product available for us. It's a "bad building experience" because I don't want to build it in the first place. It's not my intention to "tell kids they shouldn't like it". I am communicating with my fellow fan that I am displeased with current offerings, and in case you haven't noticed, I am not alone. I am delighted at the chance that NK might fail because to my subjective eye, the whole theme looks bad. Trans orange and tanks have no business in a castle theme. 

5. I am a fan of Lego in general, but if there's no product I'm interested in, what's to be a fan of? Once again, as a drastic departure from traditional castle, the failure of NK would be a confirmation of what I and many others have deemed as stillborn from the very beginning.

All of that said, I don't understand why you're choosing to make this about a Nexo Knights indictment. As far as I can tell, this thread is about a hopeful, post NK future for castle. Should TLG be so short sighted as to damn all of Castle to purgatory because their wacky He-Man and the Visionaries of Power Rangers theme failed, that's fine. People like me will move on and take our wallets with us.

This is a fantastic post.  Unfortunately, my wallet is still around for a couple of Star Wars sets a year, and the occasional Marvel set.  That said, I would invest much more heavily in LEGO for myself, my brother, my nieces, and others (like I did a few years back) if there was more that I was interested in.

Ultimately, I'm glad that Nabii came here to share with us, because it's rare to see designers actually interact with their audience in a public forum like this.  And Nabii has done it more than most, so I definitely thank him for his time.  But I do have to admit that his post came off as, well, as someone who was just told that their work sucked.  It came off as bitter.  I can understand that.  Many people have been saying very negative stuff about the sets that he created, so it's a perfectly reasonable reaction.  But I would hope for a more tempered and cool-headed discussion.  Perhaps Nabii could look over some of the ideas that people have posted here and tell us what would / wouldn't work, or what can / can't be done, and why, so that we could offer better ideas and work together to make Castle the best that it can be.  Because isn't that the goal we all have here, fan and designer alike?

Here are some other relevant threads:

 

Thank you.

Edited June 13, 2017 by x105Black
Edited to add links to other relevant topics for the eyes of the designers.

[Trekkie99]

3 hours ago, SirBlake said:

1. It's about as "castle" as any castle with tank treads and jet planes, which is to say, not at all.

2. Take a bet? Last I checked, TLG is doing just fine. If they don't see the value in continuing to serve an audience they've spent 40 years building, that's their mistake to make.

3. No, there's been a terrible draught in the space theme, and that too is a mistake. But kids don't like space toys, right? /sarcasm

4. It also does us no favors to lie and talk about how wonderful a theme is that we don't like. Also, the designers are the ones who should want us on their side, not the other way around. It's our kids that are currently keeping them in business. I can't tell you how many hundreds of dollars a year TLG is missing out on because my daughter and I are skipping the Lego aisle because there's nothing there for us. She still gets the occasional Elves set, but nothing like a few years ago when we both had product available for us. It's a "bad building experience" because I don't want to build it in the first place. It's not my intention to "tell kids they shouldn't like it". I am communicating with my fellow fan that I am displeased with current offerings, and in case you haven't noticed, I am not alone. I am delighted at the chance that NK might fail because to my subjective eye, the whole theme looks bad. Trans orange and tanks have no business in a castle theme. 

5. I am a fan of Lego in general, but if there's no product I'm interested in, what's to be a fan of? Once again, as a drastic departure from traditional castle, the failure of NK would be a confirmation of what I and many others have deemed as stillborn from the very beginning.

All of that said, I don't understand why you're choosing to make this about a Nexo Knights indictment. As far as I can tell, this thread is about a hopeful, post NK future for castle. Should TLG be so short sighted as to damn all of Castle to purgatory because their wacky He-Man and the Visionaries of Power Rangers theme failed, that's fine. People like me will move on and take our wallets with us.

With complete respect to @Nabii, I have to agree 100% with this post. Space does not belong in a castle theme and vice versa. 

Also, am I the only one that thinks Lego should be setting trends vs copying what's trendy?

Edited June 13, 2017 by LegoMonorailFan

[Artanis I]

Looks like 2013 was the last ever real Castle theme. Too bad.

I'm guessing that also means there won't be any proper Space themes going forward either. And if Pirates didn't sell, there goes every theme worth collecting over time.

(I am buying Star Wars, but only to get ships & characters of someone else's imagined world)

[BrickJagger]

19 hours ago, LegoMonorailFan said:

With complete respect to @Nabii, I have to agree 100% with this post. Space does not belong in a castle theme and vice versa. 

Also, am I the only one that thinks Lego should be setting trends vs copying what's trendy?

Their main goal is to make as much money as possible, which is why every new theme they roll out is a tried and true concept or an adaption of an already popular franchise. Lego really isn't into taking risks, and to me that's one of their biggest drawbacks.

Just so @Nabii knows, if TLG decides after NK's run to scrap Castle the same way they did Space, they'll be losing the business of quite a few members of this forum, including myself. Following trends might be profitable to an extent but we all know what happened in 2003. Lego might claim that Space is "taking a break" or something, but it's increasingly obvious that it's dead as a doornail and won't be coming back until Star Wars is done pumping out films (never). 

Lego used to be much more varied than it is today, and it's pretty sad to think about how far they've fallen since not even five years ago. There used to be tons of different options: Pirates, Space, Power Miners, Atlantis, Dino, Monster Fighters, Castle, etc. but here in 2017 all we have for non-licensed themes are City/Friends, Elves and Nexo Knights. All of Lego's resources are being diverted to pump out massive numbers of generic and overpriced licensed sets. Lego is supposed to inspire creativity, and I see none being emitted from those sets.

If Lego wants to sell out, fine. However, I hope they know that they've destroyed their own message and it will eventually come back to bite them when Star Wars/Superheroes stop doing big numbers in the box office and the generation that grew up with Ninjago graduates high school.

 

 

Edited June 13, 2017 by BrickJagger

[Trekkie99]

 

21 minutes ago, BrickJagger said:

Their main goal is to make as much money as possible, which is why every new theme they roll out is a tried and true concept or an adaption of an already popular franchise. Lego really isn't into taking risks, and to me that's one of their biggest drawbacks.

Just so @Nabii knows, if TLG decides to scrap after NK's run to scrap Castle the same way they did Space, they'll be losing the business of quite a few members of this forum, including myself. Following trends might be profitable to an extent but we all know what happened in 2003. Lego might claim that Space is "taking a break" or something, but it's increasingly obvious that it's dead as a doornail and won't be coming back until Star Wars is done pumping out films (never). 

Lego used to be much more varied than it is today, and it's pretty sad to think about how far they've fallen since not even five years ago. There used to be tons of different options: Pirates, Space, Power Miners, Atlantis, Dino, Monster Fighters, Castle, etc. but here in 2017 all we have for non-licensed themes are City/Friends, Elves and Nexo Knights. All of Lego's resources are being diverted to pump out massive numbers of generic and overpriced licensed sets. Lego is supposed to inspire creativity, and I see none being emitted from those sets.

If Lego wants to sell out, fine. However, I hope they know that they've destroyed their own message and it will eventually come back to bite them when Star Wars/Superheroes stop doing big numbers in the box office and the generation that grew up with Ninjago graduates high school.

 

 

Agreed.

Edited June 13, 2017 by LegoMonorailFan

[Digger of Bricks]

1 hour ago, BrickJagger said:

Lego used to be much more varied than it is today, and it's pretty sad to think about how far they've fallen since not even five years ago. There used to be tons of different options: Pirates, Space, Power Miners, Atlantis, Dino, Monster Fighters, Castle, etc. but here in 2017 all we have for non-licensed themes are City/Friends, Elves and Nexo Knights. All of Lego's resources are being diverted to pump out massive numbers of generic and overpriced licensed sets. Lego is supposed to inspire creativity, and I see none being emitted from those sets.

This is most definitely a concern to me, considering that the last non "big bang" action theme we had was Ultra Agents in its second and last year in 2015. It was also the only theme fitting that bill for 2015, and now we haven't had another such theme since then.

Like I said though, I do like Nexo Knights, and Ninjago and Chima have given us some nice sets and parts, but they don't really fill a more generalized genre. That's what was great about themes such as space, castle, pirates, Adventures, agents, and others; they had a basis in familiar storyline archetypes, not needing to lean on a tie in TV show or books.

1 hour ago, Artanis I said:

Looks like 2013 was the last ever real Castle theme. Too bad.

I'm guessing that also means there won't be any proper Space themes going forward either. And if Pirates didn't sell, there goes every theme worth collecting over time.

(I am buying Star Wars, but only to get ships & characters of someone else's imagined world)

Perhaps there is hope for these subthemes in the Creator theme, something both @danth and @LegoMonorailFan have proposed in topics recently, but Creator couldn't fulfill everything a theme would have to offer, such as new parts or heavy amounts of minifigures. But Creator may change along the line hopefully.