10 hours ago, Balrogofmorgoth said:

We were always going to get more Brickheadz…between the BH and Rivendell people have shown lego that we simply want more LOTR products. Getting another BH pack doesn’t mean we won’t get anything else. It won’t be this year because they hadn't gotten a chance to see how the license sells yet. The BH didn’t even sell THAT well. Rivendell did. There will be more, especially if Barad-Dûr does well. I’ll be very surprised if 2025 doesn’t yield even more

I mean, if they wanted to test the waters, a small, (relatively) cheap playset seems like a better idea than another Brickhead...

31 minutes ago, Cyprinus said:

I mean, if they wanted to test the waters, a small, (relatively) cheap playset seems like a better idea than another Brickhead...

You would think, and so would I, but clearly they thought differently. BH in general must sell well enough since they keep doing them. But they also probably haven’t had time to plan and design playsets for this year just going off of sales of last year’s BH and Rivendell. Barad-Dûr had to have been planned at least tentatively long before because they don’t just design and release huge D2Cs in a matter of months 

keep in mind that most sets have a ~2 year turnaround, but Brickheadz are probably much faster due to the simple and standardized build. Barad-Dur was probably already started, but If Lego is making more LOTR sets because of Rivendell doing well, it would take around another year for them to release. Have patience, I don't think this is the end for LOTR

1 minute ago, Balrogofmorgoth said:

You would think, and so would I, but clearly they thought differently. BH in general must sell well enough since they keep doing them. But they also probably haven’t had time to plan and design playsets for this year just going off of sales of last year’s BH and Rivendell. Barad-Dûr had to have been planned at least tentatively long before because they don’t just design and release huge D2Cs in a matter of months 

My thoughts exactly!

40 minutes ago, Lordhelmet said:

Is there any possibility we get some actual playlets this year?  With all the leaks that came out for later this year I am not sure there are any opportunities left?  Like the "orange" theme I think is the minions.  Just curious if there is any possibility of actual playlets this year.  

I highly doubt it. If that’s a possibility at all then they were probably waiting to see how the other sets they released sell before they designed playsets. We’ve seen small rushed waves of sets in the past but it doesn’t seem like that’s happening or we likely would have heard something. I think we will have to wait until 2025 to see whether the theme sticks around

1 minute ago, ForgedInLego said:

keep in mind that most sets have a ~2 year turnaround, but Brickheadz are probably much faster due to the simple and standardized build. Barad-Dur was probably already started, but If Lego is making more LOTR sets because of Rivendell doing well, it would take around another year for them to release. Have patience, I don't think this is the end for LOTR

My thoughts exactly!

I agree, it sounds like they have plans for the theme just based on comments from several different people. I still really hope for a full blown theme with playsets and dioramas and battle packs and such. But I think 2025 is the earliest we would see anything like that

8 minutes ago, ForgedInLego said:

keep in mind that most sets have a ~2 year turnaround, but Brickheadz are probably much faster due to the simple and standardized build. Barad-Dur was probably already started, but If Lego is making more LOTR sets because of Rivendell doing well, it would take around another year for them to release. Have patience, I don't think this is the end for LOTR

My thoughts exactly! 

There is no "probably" there - the survey leak we had a year ago already had a full build of Barad-Dur. Thus unless Rivendell absolutely tanked, we were almost guaranteed to get it.

People asked for a set and there ya go...another BH! LOL

Hopefully this is just the prelude to something very substantial.

If LEGO believed that small LOTR sets could be profitable and compatible with their enterprise strategies, they would have done them.

Try look at Harry Potter as a comparison of two themes covered by LEGO in very different way since the beginning (and Harry Potter have its big, adult and pricy sets like Microscale Hogwarts, Diagon Alley, Icons, Gringotts... probably the Burrow) and so on.

When LEGO started investing in LOTR, designing Rivendell and Barad-Dur, they likely had an idea of what the market could be and how to invest in it. I imagine at that time they had done some surveys before and found out what was the most interesting target considering, for example, age, willing of pay, what they expected by LEGO and valuing other themes active or in developement.

And LEGO produced what they thought would fit the market: big, detailed and, on consequence, pricy sets, targeted to adult and something small and collectable like Brickheadz.

I'm not saying we won't ever see an entire wave of playsets or something more affordable (not considering Brickheadz) than Rivendell and Barad-Dur, cause strategies can change, but I won't hold breath waiting for them.

If they keep these big sets coming, and drop a Minas Tirith, Helms Deep, Minas Morgul etc. I'm going to have to sell body parts!

I'm already trying to figure out how to save and where to put Barad-Dur to go with the Tower of Orthanc. $460 versus $200 is a big difference! It will probably crush it in design as well.

Personally I suspect it's more a legal issue that Lego (for now) isn't allowed to make a whole new wave of sets rather than a survey result.

Another BH is no surprise, but I expected something more interesting this time e.g a Gondor soldier vs Orc. A shield with the printed white tree emblem would have been fantastic.

17 minutes ago, brimbolet said:

Personally I suspect it's more a legal issue that Lego (for now) isn't allowed to make a whole new wave of sets rather than a survey result.

Another BH is no surprise, but I expected something more interesting this time e.g a Gondor soldier vs Orc. A shield with the printed white tree emblem would have been fantastic.

Doing a Gondor soldier without any sets likely having such a solider would be very odd. Makes much more sense to do more main characters to fill out the fellowship. Wouldn't be surprised if there is either another unknown BH set that has more of the Fellowship, or at least more next year if the theme continues. 

42 minutes ago, brimbolet said:

Personally I suspect it's more a legal issue that Lego (for now) isn't allowed to make a whole new wave of sets rather than a survey result.

It seems unlikely to me that an legal issue let´s them produce two big sets aswell as some brickheadz but doesn´t allow them to make smaller Sets.

1 hour ago, brimbolet said:

Personally I suspect it's more a legal issue that Lego (for now) isn't allowed to make a whole new wave of sets rather than a survey result.

Another BH is no surprise, but I expected something more interesting this time e.g a Gondor soldier vs Orc. A shield with the printed white tree emblem would have been fantastic.

Lego has the license obviously so this wouldn't be a legal issue for them.  They have the rights to the movies as we have Rivendell and Barad Dur coming plus all the brickheads.  This won't be a legal issue, it's a matter of what lego wants to do with the theme themselves.  

What I could see happening is one or more diorama sets. There are so many iconic Lord of the Rings scenes that they can choose from, perhaps the most obvious being Merry and Eowyn defeating the Witch King (with the quote being either the "not by the hand of man will he fall" prophecy or Eowyn's "I am no man"). But there are many other choices, from Isildur cutting the ring off Sauron's hand, to Gandalf stopping the Balrog, to Sam defeating Shelob, to Gandalf upon Shadowfax "who alone among the free horses of the earth endured the terror" of the Witch King as he rides through the shattered Gates of Gondor (quote: "In rode the Lord of the Nazgul, under the archway that no enemy ever yet had passed, and all fled before his face.").

That last one I'd buy in a heartbeat.

Edited January 21, 20241 yr by KristinnK

7 hours ago, zoth33 said:

Lego has the license obviously so this wouldn't be a legal issue for them.  They have the rights to the movies as we have Rivendell and Barad Dur coming plus all the brickheads.  This won't be a legal issue, it's a matter of what lego wants to do with the theme themselves.  

That depends on what they agreed to make. Agreements like that are rarely that you can do as much and whatever you like with the property. They will have agreed certain parameters.

3 hours ago, MAB said:

That depends on what they agreed to make. Agreements like that are rarely that you can do as much and whatever you like with the property. They will have agreed certain parameters.

Even more so agreements with the Tolkien estate. And LotR rights are about as convoluted as any IP out there at this point.

But I would agree unlikely that a legal issue is preventing them from doing play sets.

Edited January 21, 20241 yr by mtrsteve

10 hours ago, KristinnK said:

What I could see happening is one or more diorama sets. There are so many iconic Lord of the Rings scenes that they can choose from, perhaps the most obvious being Merry and Eowyn defeating the Witch King (with the quote being either the "not by the hand of man will he fall" prophecy or Eowyn's "I am no man"). But there are many other choices, from Isildur cutting the ring off Sauron's hand, to Gandalf stopping the Balrog, to Sam defeating Shelob, to Gandalf upon Shadowfax "who alone among the free horses of the earth endured the terror" of the Witch King as he rides through the shattered Gates of Gondor (quote: "In rode the Lord of the Nazgul, under the archway that no enemy ever yet had passed, and all fled before his face.").

That last one I'd buy in a heartbeat.

“All save one. There waiting, silent and still in the space before the Gate, sat Gandalf upon Shadowfax: Shadowfax who alone among the free horses of the earth endured the terror, unmoving, steadfast as a graven image in Rath Dínen.”

11 hours ago, MAB said:

That depends on what they agreed to make. Agreements like that are rarely that you can do as much and whatever you like with the property. They will have agreed certain parameters.

Sure they can not just make whatever they want. But if we are beeing realistic here. How likely does it seem to you that they are ok with Barad-Dûr and Rivendell aswell as Brickheadz but would decline other Sets? Sure everything is possible but to me that seems very, very unlikely.

12 hours ago, MAB said:

That depends on what they agreed to make. Agreements like that are rarely that you can do as much and whatever you like with the property. They will have agreed certain parameters.

Usually they have the rights to certain properties like the movies, book, etc.  which is obviously what they have the rights to based on the sets so far.  I know there are parameters but they seem to have the rights to the movies so what I'm saying is there is a lot of things they can make.   

9 hours ago, zoth33 said:

Usually they have the rights to certain properties like the movies, book, etc.  which is obviously what they have the rights to based on the sets so far.  I know there are parameters but they seem to have the rights to the movies so what I'm saying is there is a lot of things they can make.   

I don't think they have the rights to the book, isn't that why they weren't allowed to explicitly state that the white haired dwarf in Rivendell is Gloin? 

11 hours ago, zoth33 said:

Usually they have the rights to certain properties like the movies, book, etc.  which is obviously what they have the rights to based on the sets so far.  I know there are parameters but they seem to have the rights to the movies so what I'm saying is there is a lot of things they can make.   

Yes, and what I am saying is that there is usually an agreement in place about what type and size and how many products they will produce far in advance. They don't "have the licence" and get free rein to produce and sell whatever they like in whatever numbers they want during the licence period. There will be strict agreements over the details of set sizes, production numbers, characters to appear, descriptions of proposed sets, and so on. If they had an agreement to do, for example, 3 premium ICONs sets in the Rivendell price band for sales aimed at adults and another 8 brickheadz, they don't get to make kids sets just because "they have the licence". 

I remember before the return of the Harry Potter theme it was preceded by some brickheads, but there were only a few months between the release of the BHs and the actual sets, so these were probably in production at the same time. It still baffles me that they didn't attempt to release even a small wave of playsets and the big D2C for LotR. This would've been the perfect test to see if they should continue with playsets, D2Cs or both. They did it with the HP line and to a lesser extend even with the Indiana Jones.

11 hours ago, MAB said:

Yes, and what I am saying is that there is usually an agreement in place about what type and size and how many products they will produce far in advance. They don't "have the licence" and get free rein to produce and sell whatever they like in whatever numbers they want during the licence period. There will be strict agreements over the details of set sizes, production numbers, characters to appear, descriptions of proposed sets, and so on. If they had an agreement to do, for example, 3 premium ICONs sets in the Rivendell price band for sales aimed at adults and another 8 brickheadz, they don't get to make kids sets just because "they have the licence". 

If they made Rivendell then they probably can make other sets.  I don't know the specifics obviously but if they made that set and the brickheads why would they exclude other smaller sets it doesn't make any sense.  

13 hours ago, JimBaggins said:

I don't think they have the rights to the book, isn't that why they weren't allowed to explicitly state that the white haired dwarf in Rivendell is Gloin? 

I don't think they have the rights to the books either probably just the movies as the Rivendell set seems to be inspired from.  

1 hour ago, zoth33 said:

If they made Rivendell then they probably can make other sets.  I don't know the specifics obviously but if they made that set and the brickheads why would they exclude other smaller sets it doesn't make any sense.  

I don't think they have the rights to the books either probably just the movies as the Rivendell set seems to be inspired from.  

That's just the way it is. License rights can get awful specific. Case and point, Lego isn't allowed to do a Star Wars collectible Minifigures line. They've made every Star Wars character under the sun, but they aren't allowed to sell them in that particular format. And the Tolkien estate is notorious for being very specific about their license deals, which has only become more complicated in recent years with more and more of the material being adapted.

13 hours ago, MAB said:

Yes, and what I am saying is that there is usually an agreement in place about what type and size and how many products they will produce far in advance. They don't "have the licence" and get free rein to produce and sell whatever they like in whatever numbers they want during the licence period. There will be strict agreements over the details of set sizes, production numbers, characters to appear, descriptions of proposed sets, and so on. If they had an agreement to do, for example, 3 premium ICONs sets in the Rivendell price band for sales aimed at adults and another 8 brickheadz, they don't get to make kids sets just because "they have the licence". 

Noone doubts that there might be specific licenses but in the end we don´t know what is really in there - and sure there will be several points that make sure Lego can just make whatever. But the point isn´t really what they are allowed right now, but if they would be allowed to do playsets of smaller size - and there is just seems very unlikely to me that they wouldn´t be allowed if they would want to make them. So I think it is either they want and we will get some next year - or they don´t want yet and we will have to wait longer till they finally do.

2 hours ago, zoth33 said:

If they made Rivendell then they probably can make other sets.  I don't know the specifics obviously but if they made that set and the brickheads why would they exclude other smaller sets it doesn't make any sense.  

Sure, they could make them if they had the agreement to make them. The sets they have done so far suggest that they were aiming for the premium adult market rather smaller sets. They would exclude smaller sets if they didn't originally plan to make them and didn't get the agreement to make them. Remember these agreements are usually made for multiple years and they don't meet every few months to come up with variations to what they agreed. 

It may well be that they didn't plan to make them as they didn't sell so we'll first time around in supermarkets and toy stores, and that with the increase in adult interest, it is better they do big and exclusive sets only.