Unpopular Opinions about LEGO

[1974]

No it's not

[Vindicare]

On 4/22/2021 at 8:07 AM, KotZ said:

God I would love that.

Me too. As amazing as their mech designs have been lately, they could really knock it out of the park. Then the minifig prints & hairpiece advances. 

[MAB]

7 hours ago, Johnny1360 said:

LEGO is for children only, so don't complain because instructions are over simplified.

 

Have you seen LEGO's website recently, the bit where it says adults welcome? Or the ages printed on boxes such as Sesame Street and Winnie the Pooh?

 

Or do you mean children only, including aged 18+ children that haven't grown up.

[Flak Maniak]

I always found the "instructions are oversimplified" complaint strange. (Side note on numbered bags, you can dump all the parts out together if you want, so that's not a very good complaint, but also, if you do try dumping all the parts out together, you will quickly find you prefer doing it by the numbered bags!) Back to the instructions, yes, steps have part callouts and will involve way fewer parts each. That's so. But official builds nowadays are genuinely much more complex than they were twenty years ago. Far more SNOT, more parts-density overall, just, a lot more going on. Even if you wanted to keep the difficulty of following instructions the same, you would still pace them slower in the modern era, because the builds are inherently more complex. But also, obviously, Lego does want them to be as easy to follow as possible; they want children to have an easy time of it. And that's a good thing.

Also, you'll notice that instructions for older-targeted sets (for example Barracuda Bay) are a lot breezier, gloss over more things, than instructions for sets for the under-10 crowd. Lego clearly thinks very carefully about these things; if a set is for grown-ups, the instructions will add more parts per step, and will have fewer "caution of X" thingies, you know what I'm saying. They try to make instructions for sets for small children extra-clear. And that's a good thing.

[Johnny1360]

7 hours ago, MAB said:

 

 

Or do you mean children only, including aged 18+ children that haven't grown up.

This and I don't mean it in an insulting manner. I even have a few 4+ sets.

LEGO has been really taking the adult market by storm, the past year or so.

Mostly though I was poking fun at all the people that used that excuse in the past for over simplified instructions and uncomplicated builds, when they where clearly wrong with their unpopular opinion.

 

[hagridshut]

15 hours ago, Johnny1360 said:

LEGO is for children only, so don't complain because instructions are over simplified.

 

The existence of the instructions debate puzzles me.  I've never had issues with either the old style or newer type of instructions booklets.

People who are offended by the new instructions being too easy, can get their mental exercise through designing and building MOCs.

[The Stud]

On 4/23/2021 at 6:20 AM, Lego David said:

Eventually, Ninjago will run out of steam and its popularity will begin to decline (you could argue that has already started happening). If a new Big Bang theme comes out, and it is executed in way that manages to attract new fans, then it would have a pretty high chance of winning. 

I feel like at this point, Ninjago doesn't really bring it that many new fans... most of its current fans are the same people who got into the theme when it first came out. That's why LEGO needs to introduce a new big theme with every new generation of kids, if they want to attract new fans. 

From what I’ve heard about the newer seasons, the show itself seems like it could be running out of steam, but I feel like the sets themselves still do pretty well. Whenever I’m doing my Lego shopping at a store, I still see kids checking out the Ninjago sets and it at least seems to be doing pretty well since it’s usually mentioned in Lego’s top selling themes each year and they don’t seem to be pumping the breaks on the quantity of sets they’re producing. And even though Cartoon Network has inarguably done a horrendous job airing the show in the US, it’s trending a lot of the time when I browse Netflix so that can’t be doing too bad either. It’s hard to tell whether Ninjago is bringing in many new fans though, but for now, it seems to still be doing pretty well.

I think Lego is approaching Monkie Kid in a similar way to Ninjago, but I don’t know how much success they’re finding with it. Every time I go to my Lego Store, they’re usually almost fully stocked on Monkie Kid stuff and I don’t know how well they’re promoting the show to kids or their parents. None of these other attempts at big bang themes, like Chima and Nexo Knights, have worked out for them and other non-licensed ventures, like Hidden Side and Vidiyo, don’t seem to be faring so well either.

Personally, I don’t want Ninjago to end anytime soon. This might be an unpopular opinion, but I think it’s the strongest line Lego has going right now. Year after year, they come out with nice looking sets that almost always give you a great value for your money and they are able to keep the storylines fresh and interesting. I have problems with the show itself right now, but I don’t want to lose Ninjago anytime soon.

[Johnny1360]

I actually think the dragons and mechs are pretty good and just when I was about through with Ninjago, I see the new sets, kind of like the looks of the tropical island themes. As far as the media side of it, never seen any Ninjago shows ever, even previews or anything. Not unusual for me though don't really watch any movies at all or TV shows. Probably from all those years as a kid when my dad would tease me about the boob tube or idiot box as he liked to call it. Although I do enjoy some sports and tech type shows.

I do agree, great value and interesting parts and builds, have no use for my hundreds of Lloyds, Coles and Kais though 

[Flak Maniak]

This shouldn't count as controversial enough for this thread, but: I think they should bring back the back-of-box pictures to inspire alternate builds. The point should be to reinforce, at every turn, the notion that what counts is what you create yourself.

For the sake of the children? Sure. But also, for the sake of you lot, the online fans! Let's see them 18+ black-box sets with weird-looking alt builds on the back! You grown-ups need to be told too, to build from your imaginations! $300 D2C sets need the alt-build back-of-box pics as much as the $20 sets for children do!

[Vindicare]

17 hours ago, Flak Maniak said:

I always found the "instructions are oversimplified" complaint strange. (Side note on numbered bags, you can dump all the parts out together if you want, so that's not a very good complaint, but also, if you do try dumping all the parts out together, you will quickly find you prefer doing it by the numbered bags!) Back to the instructions, yes, steps have part callouts and will involve way fewer parts each. That's so. But official builds nowadays are genuinely much more complex than they were twenty years ago. Far more SNOT, more parts-density overall, just, a lot more going on. Even if you wanted to keep the difficulty of following instructions the same, you would still pace them slower in the modern era, because the builds are inherently more complex. But also, obviously, Lego does want them to be as easy to follow as possible; they want children to have an easy time of it. And that's a good thing.

Also, you'll notice that instructions for older-targeted sets (for example Barracuda Bay) are a lot breezier, gloss over more things, than instructions for sets for the under-10 crowd. Lego clearly thinks very carefully about these things; if a set is for grown-ups, the instructions will add more parts per step, and will have fewer "caution of X" thingies, you know what I'm saying. They try to make instructions for sets for small children extra-clear. And that's a good thing.

The thing about the instructions I find funny, in an ironic way, is that LEGO is all about sustainability...but wastes so much instruction space by just making one step a single piece...or just two. They could greatly cut down on the pages used if they’d cut that kind of stuff out. Now, that’s obviously from an adult perspective, but it’s just weird. 

Edited April 26, 2021 by Vindicare

[MAB]

5 hours ago, Flak Maniak said:

This shouldn't count as controversial enough for this thread, but: I think they should bring back the back-of-box pictures to inspire alternate builds. The point should be to reinforce, at every turn, the notion that what counts is what you create yourself.

I don't think that is what LEGO wants. They like that people build the pictured set and never break it up. As it means they buy more sets, and still more.

4 hours ago, Vindicare said:

The thing about the instructions I find funny, in an ironic way, is that LEGO is all about sustainability...but wastes so much instruction space by just making one step a single piece...or just two. They could greatly cut down on the pages used if they’d cut that kind of stuff out. Now, that’s obviously from an adult perspective, but it’s just weird. 

There is a view that it is paper, so can be sustainably sourced and is recyclable,  no matter how much ink is on it or how much fuel is needed to transport it. (Single use) plastic bad, paper good.

[1974]

TLG got too many complaints about there not being instructions for the alts on the back of the boxes

Kids today are not MOC'ers anyway

[NickLafreniere]

As much as I would love some alternate builds on the back of the box, I agree that most people do not want to build their own thing. Especially when it is a Marvel or DC set, where the pieces mainly have 1 specific use to make the iconic vehicle from the movie or whatever.

So many LEGO sets are replicating specific objects, using some specialized pieces, that it may be difficult to make other things. So only some LEGO themes would be suitable to have alternate builds.

One of my favorite themes from my childhood were the Designer (as well as Inventor) sets, which were waaaay better than creator 3-in-1. 

Look at set 4099 Robobots. This was a 49-in-1 set!!!! 3-in-1 is a joke... Although you only get instructions for a few models, you can challenge yourself and use logic to figure out how to make the cool builds that don't have instructions. You feel accomplished if you can copy the picture and learn how the LEGO designers made it.

 

[Peppermint_M]

3 hours ago, 1974 said:

TLG got too many complaints about there not being instructions for the alts on the back of the boxes

Kids today are not MOC'ers anyway

Adults today don't seem to be MOCers from all the complaints about sets not being good enough!

[jimmynick]

3 hours ago, 1974 said:

TLG got too many complaints about there not being instructions for the alts on the back of the boxes

Kids today are not MOC'ers anyway

When I was a kid I had this lovely wooden tangram kit (still have it somewhere!) that included a leaflet, which showed an assortment of possible arrangements. The fun was in working out how to achieve the prescribed shape and noticing when something had gone wrong. Can't say I ever took that approach with the alt builds, but at least they were nice inspiration...

[Flak Maniak]

43 minutes ago, Peppermint_M said:

Adults today don't seem to be MOCers from all the complaints about sets not being good enough!

Yeah I'm not too worried about the kids; they're gonna take their sets apart and build other stuff no matter what you do. (Or, almost all of them, anyway.)

But it's the folks on here who need to be prodded to do so! I was serious when I said that $300, D2C, 18+, black-box sets should have some funny-looking alt build inspiration pictures on the back! These are from the 2000 Millennium Falcon; imagine how great it would be to have this on the back of the 2017 UCS one!:

What matters is not what's in the box, or what some far-away Lego designer decided; what matters is what YOU create! If you want X subject matter, you have the power!

Lego might not think that brightly-colored box-fronts are easy to sell to grown-ups; they may be right about that. But, they should make sure to include things that remind the adult customers of that childlike wonder, things that remind them of being a kid, sitting there with a pile of parts... And just messing around, trying different things.

[MAB]

I don't think that is what most adults (especially new to the hobby adults) want from 18+ sets. Most seem to want to build a kit and display it. And any adults that are creative will be buying across all age ranges for parts and building their own MOCs. I doubt the size of the middle region, as in people that want to build without instructions but still need to be told what they can build, is very big.

[Aanchir]

14 hours ago, Vindicare said:

The thing about the instructions I find funny, in an ironic way, is that LEGO is all about sustainability...but wastes so much instruction space by just making one step a single piece...or just two. They could greatly cut down on the pages used if they’d cut that kind of stuff out. Now, that’s obviously from an adult perspective, but it’s just weird. 

Well, unlike fossil fuels, trees are a renewable resource. And the sets with the most simplistic instructions (such as those with 4+, 5+, or 6+ age markings) are typically not the ones with especially bulky manuals anyhow. So I don't think the environmental impact of the instructions is too high on LEGO's priority list. Of course, it could potentially be a worthwhile goal for them to look into further down the road — even if they keep some of the steps simple, they could potentially still cut down on the volume of paper they use by printing more steps per page.

10 hours ago, 1974 said:

Kids today are not MOC'ers anyway

I don't know why you'd think that… I've seen plenty of MOCs from kids either shared by proud parents on social media, entered into building competitions like the Brattleboro Museum's annual LEGO contest, uploaded on the LEGO Life app, etc. For that matter, bulk lots of LEGO sold online still tend to include seemingly random assemblies of parts that are the remainder of kids' MOCs, and/or vast quantities of loose parts which indicate that at some point or another, the owner of those bricks decided to use them for something other than the sets they originated from.

Now, bear in mind that from an adult perspective, a lot of these beginner-level MOCs likely seem like nothing to write home about (including the sort of stuff that AFOLs might disparage as "rainbow warriors"). But that's hardly an indication that kids don't have a serious interest in creative building. After all, if kids weren't interested in open-ended creative building, then themes like Classic, Creator, Dots, and Minecraft which put a huge emphasis on that sort of creative building and free-form customization would not be nearly so successful.

If anything, AFOLs often seem to be the ones most likely to disregard those themes due to their rainbow colors, lack of traditional minifigs, lack of realistic/detailed example builds, and lack of parts and colors that are "useful" to fans of specific minifig-scale themes. Just look how many complaints about LEGO's "lack of original themes" tend to be narrowly focused on the number of non-licensed, minifig-scale "play themes", disregarding not only the "core creative themes" like Classic, Creator, and Dots, but also other non-minifig-scale themes like BrickHeadz, Technic, and Architecture.

[1974]

3 minutes ago, Aanchir said:

I don't know why you'd think that…

I don't think, I know

I spend a lot of time around kids, I work professionally with kids, I know many other adults who do, I have contacts at LEGO .. and I ask a lot of questions

No, kids do not MOC as much as me and my friends did when we were kids. They tend to build the sets as they are allthough a lot of minifig modding is popular

It's only when there's a big tub of parts I see MOCing, be it privately, in kindergarden or in (pre)school

Modern sets are complicated, have loads of parts and there's only one suggestion in the set. I also very rarely see 3-1 Creator sets being taken apart to make the other two

I've been quite observant of this for a decade and I've asked a number of adults in other parts of the world as well

Cheers,

Ole

[Toastie]

8 minutes ago, 1974 said:

I've been quite observant of this for a decade and I've asked a number of adults in other parts of the world as well

I can only confirm that. My data pool is far less big than Ole's I am sure, but this is what I am seeing as well. I also do play a lot of attention to this, as it is also of relevance to my job.

And I am also hearing parents that complain about modern LEGO sets - all along the line: There are so many special parts in one set, that building alternatives is really tough (= impossible).

It has been said elsewhere on EB (I believe in the "Oldest sets you own" thread or the like, that the old sets look so - "crude" - but still so lovely - and clearly recognizable as "plane", "truck" our "house". I also heard about the debates of needing to be more accurate with regard to shapes and appearance to be able to compete successfully with other brands. And boom - there we have a triangular circle: Being accurate using ever smaller or complex/diverse pieces means that when you buy a $/€19.99 set there is not much you can do with it other than - well the set. Provided it is not a box of bricks set - containing as many colors as individual pieces . But yes: TLG sells their stuff, for sure. 

And the same holds the for the "bucket of LEGOs" (>base plates< (to start somewhere!), plates, bricks, maybe tires ... and that's it - no hinges, tiles ... etc pp): Kids build like crazy ... all sorts of things.

Best
Thorsten

[MAB]

20 minutes ago, 1974 said:

No, kids do not MOC as much as me and my friends did when we were kids. They tend to build the sets as they are allthough a lot of minifig modding is popular

It's only when there's a big tub of parts I see MOCing, be it privately, in kindergarden or in (pre)school

I think that's partly due to the number of sets kids have these days. Most kids I know have loads and they tend to get kept together, and the MOCing is done if they have Classic sets or a bucket full. Whereas in the 70s we had a bucket full and that was it.

[Toastie]

1 minute ago, MAB said:

Whereas in the 70s we had a bucket full and that was it.

This is very true.

Best
Thorsten

[1974]

Not all of us. I had a pretty big collection of Classic CS/CC, Town, Trains and Technic. and even with that I tended to MOC mostly. So did we all back then. The great IDEA Books was a major inspiration to me and so was the back-of-the-box-builds

I've also bought a lot of unsorted lots over the years and I mostly see official sets in various states of disrepair, not MOCs

[Toastie]

11 minutes ago, 1974 said:

Not all of us. I had a pretty big collection of Classic CS/CC, Town, Trains and Technic.

Oh that is nice - I had a friend back then - he had 12V trains and much more. Unreachable in so many ways.

I'm a bucket person though - the sets I got from my parents were mostly small - 4 wide trucks and cars and ... well bricks. Slope sets. Brick sets. It was a dream coming true.

[1974]

Yeah, that was indeed nice. Not so nice that my father threw the lot away.

I did have buckets of LEGO inherited from that nincompoop, like a lot of blue track trains. But that was old hat in 1980 when the grey era started