42115 - Lamborghini Sian FKP 37

[Gray Gear]

19 minutes ago, agrof said:

@Gray Gear It is funny, that You are refferring to 8043 as childhood model, you want us to feel old crap? 

Color vomit has it's purpose, it helps the build a lot. Think about it from a different perspective: LEGO wants to reach new, wider market by presenting lines, like the UCS Technic cars, Creator Expert, UCS Star Wars sets. To be succesfull, they have to make it in that way, that even a beginner, non-engineer headed average Joe must be able to build in a fool-proof way for flawless experience. Without this corporate TLG intention, we would not have such sets, probably at all. So it is kind of win-win, with a minimal tradeoff.

In overall age I might be quite young in this community, but since I have never had a dark age, I still have 16 years of LEGO experience under my belt 

I think making fool proof instructions is bad. It prevents you from making mistakes, which prevents you from learning something. If you for example can't put in a diff the wrong way, you won't learn learn why it is important which way the diff is facing. In short, it keeps you from growing as a builder.

24 minutes ago, Jundis said:

Whoa, Lego already have a 4L bar with this feature!

Yes, so awesome. I still have them. I used them to have glow in the dark lightsabers back then 

[kbalage]

41 minutes ago, Rikus said:

My only concern is about the color of the interior... from the picture it seems to be a black-green combination... same green shade of the body.

But according to official images of the real car, it should have been full black or (even better) orange-black combo. One of the distinctive elements of italian sport cars is their interior colors, after all...

As they said all Sians will have a different color scheme. I'm sure TLG did not come up with the colors by themselves, they worked with Lamborghini to decide what goes there. If you check some examples of lime Lambos you can mostly see a black interior with lime accents, that matches what wee see on the photo. 

[ibessonov]

We can look at it from a different perspective. Do you really want most of your LEGO pieces to be black? Having generic pieces in more colors is awesome, isn't it?

[agrof]

29 minutes ago, Gray Gear said:

I think making fool proof instructions is bad. It prevents you from making mistakes, which prevents you from learning something. If you for example can't put in a diff the wrong way, you won't learn learn why it is important which way the diff is facing. In short, it keeps you from growing as a builder.

Probably you have a good analytic mindset, and stamina for trial and error. These are valuable skills, and mandatory for engineering. Let's be realistic though, LEGO does not target engineers only - they would become bankrupt in a month. There is even more people out there, with other skills - which are equally important for our society. Speaking of LEGO, let everyone enjoy the building experience. In a more advanced mode, we can do MOCs, in whatever level we want.

Anyway, it is also one of the beauties and challanges to make a design foolproof. You will see it if you choose engineering as profession. For mass production to minimalize waste, utilize production efficiency, it is also a lot poke yoke solutions are involved. Color vomit is one of them. Once You have the experience, and understand the correlations in a system behind, you will start to appreciate. Trust me. 

Edited May 17, 2020 by agrof

[dabo]

Would love to get my hands on this set and I don't even like Lambos.

[Akbalder]

Do we know why the functions of the car are not explained on the back of the box?

[howitzer]

I have no problem with colour vomit interior, as it makes reading the instructions easier. Squinting at instructions booklet trying to differentiate between black and dbg parts isn't really my idea of a challenging build. On the other hand, if I wanted a genuine puzzle to test my problem-solving skills, there are much, much better and cheaper alternatives for that than an UCS Technic car.

[Seasider]

@agrof - yes I think the colourful chassis (colour vomit) we get is TLGs version of poka yoke.

In my engineering world there are lots of Lego models across peoples desks (star wars microfighters and speed champions being most popular) and those who do the larger sets still say some of them are complex so appreciate the very clear instructions. 

[allanp]

Ugh, not the colour coding debate again! All I'll say is that colour coding on the inside of a model sucks because it makes whatever mechanism I am building look like a toy for 5 year olds, which is fine for smaller sets, but for sets aimed at 16, and now 18+, that I'm paying a very premium price for, a premium set aimed at adults (yes it is) I wanna feel like I'm building a real miniature gearbox, not something that's made for 5 year olds. And as for finding pieces easier, I don't think colour coding is that effective. I've had sets with lots of colour coding and sets with no colour coding, and honestly I don't feel like there's much difference. And in terms of reducing mistakes, we still see a lot being made, Jim is still putting his diff in backwards in 42070 . What does make a big difference for me is to reduce the size of the pile of parts you are looking through at any one time by having more numbered bags. So instead of having 20 bags numbered 1 to 4, have 20 bags numbered 1 to 20. Basically, take the number of pieces in any given set, divide that number by around 200 or so, and that's the number the bags should go up to ideally. And in places where colour coding might be of any use () then use a colour that looks natural. No need to use lime green in the bowls of the chassis of the Chiron, or bright orange wave selectors or bright red and blue gears. With black and 2 shades of grey (and tan and white only where needed), that's 5 colours, what more do you need to still have nice and clear instructions?

Edited May 17, 2020 by allanp

[Anio]

7 minutes ago, allanp said:

What does make a big difference for me is to reduce the size of the pile of parts you are looking through at any one time by having more numbered bags. So instead of having 20 bags numbered 1 to 4, have 20 bags numbered 1 to 20. Basically, take the number of pieces in any given set, divide that number by around 200 or so, and that's the number the bags should go up to ideally.

You forgot that, for most users, numbered bags works once only : when the set is new.
Very few users unbuild their sets by taking the instructions backwards to get parts sorted like day 1.

Not to mention that doing so is even more complicated in Technic than in any other theme. For example, sometimes you just can't pull out an axle the way you inserted it into several other elements of the build.

[Bartybum]

20 minutes ago, allanp said:

I don't think colour coding is that effective. I've had sets with lots of colour coding and sets with no colour coding, and honestly I don't feel like there's much difference.

Because clearly you're skilled enough at building. Others are not, and need the help.

[allanp]

10 minutes ago, Anio said:

You forgot that, for most users, numbered bags works once only : when the set is new.
Very few users unbuild their sets by taking the instructions backwards to get parts sorted like day 1.

Not to mention that doing so is even more complicated in Technic than in any other theme. For example, sometimes you just can't pull out an axle the way you inserted it into several other elements of the build.

Well I guess it depends how you store you Lego pieces. If you don't have that many sets and you keep them all in one unsorted box (like I think most of us started out doing) then yeah, finding pieces is hard. I remember those days of constantly sweeping my hand through a big box of Lego trying to find that one piece! But I would argue that colour coding doesn't make it easier. At least that was my experience. If you have progressed to having your parts sorted then you're all set. Coding becomes even less needed. But Like I say, there is room for some level of colour coding and still have it feel like a premium set, by having more naturalistic colours. Gears and wave selectors don't need to be bright red, blue and orange.

2 minutes ago, Bartybum said:

Because clearly you're skilled enough at building. Others are not, and need the help.

Ah, well maybe you are on to something there. To be honest when I sort through pieces I can mostly do it by feel and not even look at the piece to know what it is. So maybe you are right in that respect. But still, why all the brightness of the rainbow?!I Is there really no middle ground between having it feel like a premium collectors set and something made for 5 year olds?

[Danee]

@Anio

I am one of this few users who unbuild his flagship sets that way 

And yes, it gets a little bit frustrating sometimes 

I also place every pin and gear like it’s aligned in the instruction and try to place the liftarms so, that you don’t see the little dot caused by the injection moulding. 
 

So, build and unbuild takes a lot of time for me, but I really enjoy this extended building process 

[astyanax]

2 hours ago, Gray Gear said:

I think making fool proof instructions is bad. It prevents you from making mistakes, which prevents you from learning something. If you for example can't put in a diff the wrong way, you won't learn learn why it is important which way the diff is facing. In short, it keeps you from growing as a builder.

But a company has no interest in seeing you grow as a builder. They want to see you grow as a buyer.

And with "you" I mean the generic plural.

[brickless_kiwi]

The price tag...its a no from me..

[Ngoc Nguyen]

Can we not the derail the topic with discussions about the necessity of inner color coding please

[Dylan M]

32 minutes ago, astyanax said:

But a company has no interest in seeing you grow as a builder. They want to see you grow as a buyer.

And with "you" I mean the generic plural.

I agree... 

it's a BIG Business after all 

[Vectormatic]

2 hours ago, Gray Gear said:

 

I think making fool proof instructions is bad. It prevents you from making mistakes, which prevents you from learning something. If you for example can't put in a diff the wrong way, you won't learn learn why it is important which way the diff is facing. In short, it keeps you from growing as a builder.

yeah no, if the instructions are very explicit about placing the diff the right way and not the wrong way, inquisitive minds will reason about why that is anyway.

 

Also, after doing the "mariage" bit on the Chiron, and thinking id balsed up the gearbox (due to an error in my testing method), my first thought wasnt "yay i get to learn something" , it was "holy frack, the way this thing is built, if there is an error in the gearbox it is going to take me hours to fix it, bunch of utter bastards"

 

Also, if lego didnt do fool proof instructions, and the porsche would have been as complex and dificult (no colour coding, just 100 steps in the manual etc) as most die-hards would seem to want, it wouldnt have been such a sales hit with the non AFOL crowd, and we wouldnt have gotten the Bugatti or this lambo.

If you want a challenge, wait for something like the inevitable "pimp my lambo" project, use the LXF to colour swap everything to black/dbg, and use the generated instructions, you will end up with a better/fixed model and hating yourself for having to look for 1 specific black piece among 3000 others.

 

 

On topic of the set, im happy with the colour not being olive green, if it had been, that would have seriously put my purchase into question, especially since all the new parts make colour swapping impossible for now. Furthermore it looks undeniably lambo-like, and its a BIG new technic set, so im game. (might wait for a slightly better price though, and ive got a rather big backlog right now, so no rush)

[Bartybum]

48 minutes ago, allanp said:

But still, why all the brightness of the rainbow?!I Is there really no middle ground between having it feel like a premium collectors set and something made for 5 year olds?

No, because they want as many people to be able to build it as possible. That and colour vomiting everything is cheaper.

[Maaboo the Witch]

20 minutes ago, Bartybum said:

No, because they want as many people to be able to build it as possible. That and colour vomiting everything is cheaper.

As long as said people are all over the age of eighteen...

[Lipko]

I love color vomit. And I don't love challenges when building a stock product. So wat.... 

It't just a matter op opinion. And whoever says that the internals of machines are not colorful haven't seen to much machines from the inside.

Edited May 17, 2020 by Lipko

[Timorzelorzworz]

Finally we're getting many panels in lime, including 3x11flat panels. The logo seen is always on the lime 2x2 liftarm (one hole, one axle hole) at the front and on top of the seats. It is always the same part, so hopes are big that it is printed like 1x1 round tiles at rims

 

[Bartybum]

3 minutes ago, Maaboo35 said:

As long as said people are all over the age of eighteen...

Like already been said, that's just marketing to make it seem more exclusive

[Maaboo the Witch]

8 minutes ago, Bartybum said:

Like already been said, that's just marketing to make it seem more exclusive

Let me get this straight, are you disrespecting the box?

[allanp]

27 minutes ago, Lipko said:

I love color vomit. And I don't love challenges when building a stock product. So wat.... 

It't just a matter op opinion. And whoever says that the internals of machines are not colorful haven't seen to much machines from the inside.

I see the insides of machines and service/repair them most days of the week as part of my job. They are not multicoloured.

Having said that you can still fully colour code something without resorting to bright, ugly and garish colours like the Chiron or 42082. 

As for the age on the box being 18+, I do think it's cool for Lego to want to make these sets accessible to younger builders, I just think that you can go too far with the kiddie colours in such a premium set.

Edited May 17, 2020 by allanp