42113 Bell Boeing V-22 Osprey

[ChocolateCrisps]

1 hour ago, J_C said:

"Hello, is is TLG, Denmark?"

"yes"

"I am calling from Texas, USA, from Bell Helicopter company, you are using one of our designs without valid licence, precisely, you broke the agreement we have had and we are not happy about it (we are actually pretty f*****g mad), I would like to speak about that"

"eh....well...you know...wait a minute..."

Not so simple

Set 60021 made it past Bell's radar a few years back - so perhaps they should have just repeated that approach from the start!

[Dylan M]

See you in August 01.... 

 

[Eaglefan344]

So the F-35 Lightning II and Sopwith Camel (with actual machine guns) were fine but this isn't?

[J_C]

30 minutes ago, ChocolateCrisps said:

Set 60021 made it past Bell's radar a few years back - so perhaps they should have just repeated that approach from the start!

yes, but this time, they got the licence, got an agreement, probably collaborated during development, who know what sort of marketing plans Bells has with "their" lego set, so now, just dropping the licence and launch with without any mentioning of Bell would not be the same thing. 

[JaBaCaDaBra]

2 hours ago, J_C said:

we are not happy about it

Is an airplane factory actually interested at all if someone makes toys from their designs?

Edited July 20, 2020 by JaBaCaDaBra

[Bartybum]

2 minutes ago, JaBaCaDaBra said:

Is an airplane factory actually interested at all if someone makes toys from their designs?

Probably not, but it's probably more to do with a legal requirement to enforce things.

Even though this whole ordeal is stupid, TLG should've just come up with their own unlicensed design without needing to be a licensed Boeing model. Pretty sure no one owns the rights to the tiltrotor configuration, because Arma 3 has an unlicensed tiltrotor, and Lego did one in the AW609 style before with 8434.

[Gray Gear]

This is dumb. Who the hell thought this was a good idea?

Canceling a Product that has alredy been developedand  produced because of a moral issue that hasn't been an issue for the whole time of development...You really can't make sh*t like this up.

I feel bad for everyone who was exited for this set, we'll see how this situation develops itself...

[J_C]

19 minutes ago, JaBaCaDaBra said:

Is an airplane factory actually interested at all if someone makes toys from their designs?

by default probably not at all, but since LEGO and Bell got a licence agreement, it is not that easy for TLG to just lets drop the licence, erase the logo from the box and go. i

f they did it like that from beginning, simply designing the tilt rotor aircraft, that would be ok.But they took Bell onboard, got the contract, so now they certainly cannot just back out from it and go ahead without licence. 

[Timorzelorzworz]

My retailer said that there is no official statement from lego in terms of canceling and that (pre)orders are shipped without any restriction.

[JaBaCaDaBra]

2 minutes ago, Timorzelorzworz said:

My retailer said that there is no official statement from lego in terms of canceling and that (pre)orders are shipped without any restriction.

On facebook there are multiple people that claim they received the hereunder following statement from TLG:
--

"The LEGO Technic Bell Boeing Osprey V-22 was designed to highlight the important role the aircraft plays in search and rescue efforts.

While our set depicts a rescue version of the plane, the aircraft is predominately used by the military. We have a long-standing policy not to create sets which feature military vehicles and in this case we have not adhered to our own internal guidelines.

As a result, we are currently reviewing our plans to launch this product on August 1. "

Edited July 20, 2020 by JaBaCaDaBra

[Timorzelorzworz]

Maybe, but all produced sets already sent to retailers will ship. They have the sets already in warehous and send it to customers at august the first.

[AVCampos]

3 minutes ago, JaBaCaDaBra said:

On facebook there are multiple people that claim they received the hereunder following statement from TLG

That statement is legitimate.

[J_C]

so the global company can be tilted, threatened and turned upside down by 2 hipsters: 

https://www.promobricks.de/lego-42113-technic-osprey-dfg-vk/105350/

literally 2. 

And TLG falls apart with fear, because 2 guys protested. Two! 

weird world we live in. 

Edited July 20, 2020 by J_C

[hjxbf]

 If they end up cancelling this, it is hypocrisy. All licence partners for the Technic line have defense revenue; Mercedes, Land Rover, Volvo, Liebherr, Dodge (Chrysler), VAG. 

Should mark the end of licensing altogether, if the argument is to be applied universally.

There are several other feasible ways of handling this situation, which do not have similar implications.

It is tempting to not buy the Lambo or the Volvo for exactly the same reason. Revenue hits are probably the best possible way to show TLG what the community feels about this.

Edited July 20, 2020 by hjxbf

[XenoRad]

If they end up cancelling this they'll lose plenty of time and money spent developing this set, not to mention they'll upset the people looking forward to it.

 

Seems very strange to bow down to some protesters in this fashion, unless of course there was more happening internally and they just used this as an excuse.

[Vectormatic]

13 minutes ago, hjxbf said:

 If they end up cancelling this, it is hypocrisy. All licence partners for the Technic line have defense revenue; Mercedes, Land Rover, Volvo, Liebherr, Dodge (Chrysler), VAG. 

Should mark the end of licensing altogether, if the argument is to be applied universally.

There are several other feasible ways of handling this situation, which do not have similar implications. 

It is tempting to not buy the Lambo or the Volvo for exactly the same reason. Revenue hits are probably the best possible way to show TLG what the community feels about this.

If you want to take history into account, pretty much anything german has made machinery for the Nazi warmachine at some point, Porsche designed and built full blown tanks, BMW made all kinds of engines etc... Any older american brand will have built engines for tanks in WWII, if not the tanks themselves, lorries, jeeps etc...

And given that violence is otherwise okay in many lego themes (star wars, pirates, ninjago is filled with weapons etc..) i think the focus of the policy should be to have no place in current conflicts, so no current weapon systems, and no vehicles in direct military livery, as that would aid play of modern war scenarios. In that case the Osprey would be OK, as it should be imho.

As for not buying sets, i entirely agree that the community should make itself heard in cases like this, but just stopping buying unrelated sets isnt a clear message, we need to reach out and voice our problems. Personally im probably skipping the lambo anyway, but due to the colour variation issues in that set.

 

55 minutes ago, J_C said:

so the global company can be tilted, threatened and turned upside down by 2 hipsters:  

https://www.promobricks.de/lego-42113-technic-osprey-dfg-vk/105350/

literally 2. 

And TLG falls apart with fear, because 2 guys protested. Two! 

weird world we live in. 

Yup, thanks to the power of the internet, minorities smaller then ever can be more vocal then ever, so now two nutjobs can drum up loads of incinsere indignation in their online echochamber and bully a company like lego, which i have no doubt about was acting in good faith. (even if a two minute google reveals that the SAR activities of the Osprey are relatively minor compared to how many of them fly in direct military transport roles)

 

 

Personally i would be disappointed if the osprey gets cancelled, both because im not happy that lego would bow to this kind of whining, and because i like the design from what i've seen. It is the first non car/bike set since 42042 that ive been interested in buying.

[TeriXeri]

This won't just have effect on a single set, but also potentially hurts something like the Southwest 737-800 IDEAS project that just hit 10.000 votes 2 weeks ago.

And I'm not saying that because there happens to be a C-40 version of it, but more like the license Boeing won't look too great now unless there's an official solution/article.

 

Edited July 20, 2020 by TeriXeri

[AVCampos]

1 hour ago, J_C said:

so the global company can be tilted, threatened and turned upside down by 2 hipsters

Cobi pours out military sets from their ears, and they didn't bat an eye; yet TLG launches a set that has connections to the military, and they lose their minds. Why? Because TLG gives them a lot more notoriety.

[JLiu15]

42113 set: *potentially cancelled*

Us who were looking forward to it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ap4nvdEotqw 

Honestly though, it really sucks that this set may never see the light of day. I understand TLG's intentions with this decision, but needless to say this is such an anticlimactic outcome for this beautiful set. Looks like it's back to Bricklink for DBG panels 

[Bartybum]

5 minutes ago, TeriXeri said:

This won't just have effect on a single set, but also potentially hurts something like the Southwest 737-800 IDEAS project that just hit 10.000 votes 2 weeks ago.

A 737-800 is an aircraft whose purpose is overwhelmingly for commercial aviation. A V22’s purpose is almost entirely for military use. It’s quite different, even if I don’t agree with them pulling it

I hope they at least release instructions when we get another dumb battery box.

[howitzer]

Just now, Bartybum said:

A 737-800 is an aircraft whose purpose is overwhelmingly for commercial aviation. A V22’s purpose is almost entirely for military use. It’s quite different, even if I don’t agree with them pulling it

I hope they at least release instructions when we get another dumb battery box.

Lime rotor blades, anyone?

I wonder what will become of the new parts/colours if the Osprey really does get canceled for good. Will we get a few collectors items from those sets that inevitably make it into the general market or will those parts be released in some other set in the future?

[TeriXeri]

33 minutes ago, Bartybum said:

A 737-800 is an aircraft whose purpose is overwhelmingly for commercial aviation. A V22’s purpose is almost entirely for military use. It’s quite different, even if I don’t agree with them pulling it

I know its a commercial passenger jet compared to a military transport aircraft, that wasn't my point.

It was more about the Boeing license potentially  looking  bad now, not the subject matter, unless they manage to solve this professionally without simply erasing the set.

Still, I don't think this is Boeing/Bell at fault here, as ultimately it's LEGO who makes & publishes the sets, and those companies majority of products aren't even Defense related.

This isn't the first Boeing set either, it goes back as far as 1974.

 

Edited July 20, 2020 by TeriXeri

[Vectormatic]

14 minutes ago, AVCampos said:

Cobi pours out military sets from their ears, and they didn't bat an eye; yet TLG launches a set that has connections to the military, and they lose their minds. Why? Because TLG gives them a lot more notoriety.

Cobi has no publicly announced "no military stuff" policy like Lego.

 

5 minutes ago, Bartybum said:

A 737-800 is an aircraft whose purpose is overwhelmingly for commercial aviation. A V22’s purpose is almost entirely for military use. It’s quite different, even if I don’t agree with them pulling it

I hope they at least release instructions when we get another dumb battery box. 

I think part of the problem is also that this licensed product means a defense company now makes money off of kids indirectly. In that case, pretty much every license ever is now tainted, and Boeing is off the table 100%

[JaBaCaDaBra]

2 minutes ago, howitzer said:

rotor blades

I suppose they allready produced a load of them...
So B&P will be the place to search

[mahjqa]

I think Lego made a bad call from the start developing this model in the first place.
I get it, it's got interesting functions. But throwing money at an arms manufacturer to produce a military vehicle (c'mon, those few stickers don't fool anyone) is a bad look.