Suggestions for a short train

[patox]

Hi, I've just picked up my first Lego train, 60197, and the carriages seem long. I'm trying to run the train under a city with lots of sharp turns. I'm using custom 3D-printed R24 tracks.

I'm completely new to this and I don't know anything about the train system.

What's the way to build the undercarriage so it can handle tight corners? Do the Lego train base plates provide the best performance? Are there any 16-stud long plates that will work? I'm thinking creating a custom plate and 3D-printing it.

[KvadratGnezdo]

My best guess would be getting rid of stock train bases and making new ones out of panels + technic panels. Then I would recommend changing stock couplers and replacing them with technic and/or older magnets.

Edited October 17, 2020 by KvadratGnezdo

[zephyr1934]

R24 is very tight, get some plates and some turntables to make some quick and dirty flatcars to figure out what dimensions could negotiate those turns. If you stay 6 wide at the ends of the cars you will also need to have a larger gap between cars

[LegoDW]

Believe this is the first thread I have seen that commented the passenger cars were to short.  You might want to check out the last Holiday Train 10254, it had some very short carriages and engine.  

One of the biggest advantages of 60197, is the bogies (trucks) are on a pin and allow for taking tighter curves.  With your tight curves, recommend retaining this functionality.  

[patox]

3 hours ago, LegoDW said:

One of the biggest advantages of 60197, is the bogies (trucks) are on a pin and allow for taking tighter curves.  With your tight curves, recommend retaining this functionality.  

I designed a 16 x 6 train plate with similar functionality as the ones in set 60197. How's this?:

Also, since I'm new to trains, is it frowned upon or considered cheating, if you design and print your own pieces?

[Hod Carrier]

12 hours ago, patox said:

Also, since I'm new to trains, is it frowned upon or considered cheating, if you design and print your own pieces?

No, I don't think so.

That said, why bother? It's a lot of faff and hassle, and there's no guarantee that you'll get a useable part at the end of the process. From my very limited understanding, the manufacturing tolerances in genuine LEGO parts is very tight, and it's going to be important to get your printed parts as close to this level of accuracy if it's going to work. LEGO models are held together by friction alone so the clutch power of parts is vital, which is why they mold their parts, not print them. To loose and they fall apart, too tight and they don't grip correctly causing stress and distortion. Your design may be spot-on, but variability in the performance of your printer or even the choice of material you use to print can all impact on the accuracy of the final product.

As has been mentioned above, you can always fabricate your own baseplate using existing LEGO parts. Most builders do this because it allows you to create whatever characteristics you wish for. You really don't need to use a train baseplate at all.

[zephyr1934]

The lego train base and train bogie plate were designed to work together, including the fact that the 2/3 brick height of the baseplate hides the bogie plate. In my opinion the biggest benefit of the train baseplate is the strength to height ratio and the strength to weight ratio. Neither of which is likely to be a limiting factor in your case. And in your case your bogies will likely need to turn further than the lip of the train baseplate would allow.

While the bogie plate is a good concept, it is expensive, only available in limited colors, and ultimately is not necessary. Still, the lego bogie plate is a good part as long as you have room for it. There is no need for a custom plate though, I use technic plates (2x6 or 2x8) when I build with the train bogie plates.

There are many alternatives to the bogie plate, the 2x2 turntable is probably the most popular alternative, but 4x4 turn tables work too if you don't mind the extra height.

 

14 hours ago, patox said:

Also, since I'm new to trains, is it frowned upon or considered cheating, if you design and print your own pieces?

There are no rules except those that you make for yourself. There are some people here who regularly build using all sorts of 4 letter words like: glue, tape, paint, saw. There are many others who are strictly purists and will only build with genuine lego parts. There was even one person who set out to only use bricks that were in new condition but manufactured prior to 1990 or some date like that. Most folks seem to be "mostly pure," only turning to third parties for critical parts like track, wheels, stickers, lights, control, etc. that Lego will never produce.

[dr_spock]

22 hours ago, patox said:

I designed a 16 x 6 train plate with similar functionality as the ones in set 60197. How's this?:

Also, since I'm new to trains, is it frowned upon or considered cheating, if you design and print your own pieces?

Neat.  Print it and see if it works?  No rules except for contests and stuff like that.  It's your hobby.

[Celeste]

10 hours ago, zephyr1934 said:

There was even one person who set out to only use bricks that were in new condition but manufactured prior to 1990 or some date like that

Oh man. That must've been a bit hard to do, but I'm curious how that turned out.

[Amicus1]

10 hours ago, zephyr1934 said:

There are some people here who regularly build using all sorts of 4 letter words like: glue, tape, paint, saw.

TIL saw and paint are four letter words. Hmm :)

[Modeltrainman]

@patox, I've messaged you some ideas. 

Edited October 20, 2020 by Modeltrainman

[zephyr1934]

12 hours ago, Amicus1 said:

TIL saw and paint are four letter words. Hmm :)

On average, yes (grin)

[LegoDW]

On 10/18/2020 at 8:00 PM, patox said:

Also, since I'm new to trains, is it frowned upon or considered cheating, if you design and print your own pieces?

 For a purest, yes you are not using official Lego parts so your creating. For most, maybe....  I look at it this way, its your interpretation of this hobby, do what makes you happy.  If you have at table supporting your Lego or a shelf, unless that is made of Lego (that would be expensive!!!) then its already not 100% Lego so have some fun with it.  3D printing looks like a lot of fun.  If I had a printer, I would do it too!

 

 

 

 

[patox]

On 10/19/2020 at 6:08 PM, Modeltrainman said:

@patox, I've messaged you some ideas. 

Thanks for the tips!

[patox]

@Modeltrainman had some great ideas, but I wanted to try my hand at 3D printing a piece that I designed.

Here's the corner that the train needs to negotiate:

 

And here's the 3D-printed train base:

 

The shortened 60197 passenger train:

[Modeltrainman]

@patox, very nice!

[dr_spock]

Nice. What kind of plastic filament did you use?

 

 

[LegoDW]

Hey did you try with one one wheel set per bogie (truck).  Your cars (couches) are so short might look better.  For your engine the motor will need duel wheel sets, but the front bogie could just have one,  

 

Regarding your layout, those are tight turns.  Unfortunate you have the white support right at the end of the turn.  If you could move back even 1 stud would give you a little better clearance.

 

I like the purple.  Can you print replacements for the yellow roof, purple would look better IMO.    

[Dav1d]

The LEGO trams are short. 8404 and 60097. For 8404 I fitted a 9V motor in the centre carriage and one wheel set in the front, and one in the rear carriage. For 60097, no wheels in the centre, 9V motor in the front carriage, 2 wheel sets in the rear carriage.