15 hours ago, koalayummies said:

That was the whole point of bringing it up PPP! The heck? You say it's irrelevant to bring up PPP here and then in the same paragraph state that you think the prices are high across this "theme". That was the entire point of bringing PPP comparisons into this. I demonstrated that the 18+ theme is a bit on the higher side of a price metric and you respond to that with "don't bring this into this discussion its not relevant" while saying the same exact thing that what I said, proved? The f is going on here.

You misunderstand. Certainly you will concede that a 1x1 tile in an ART set has a value of about 0.003 Cents whereas e.g. a large arch in the Grand Piano may have a value of 35 Cents a piece, or would you?! What am I getting at? Calculating an average part count and based on that an average price per piece is just methodically completely wrong when you can't even reasonably compare those factors. That's all I'm saying and it probably even furthers my point, at least in my own internal logic: A bunch of bags of 1x1 tiles that literally may be worth 7 Euro in a 120 Euro set makes this a terrible value, no matter how you skin it whereas a large number of clearly more costly parts in a 350 piano set, including electronics components, represents a different, possibly better value. Sorry if this still sounds confusing, but I'm struggling with words here to explain my jumbled thoughts on the matter properly....

Mylenium

13 hours ago, MAB said:

Well you are talking about value to them to produce. I am talking about the value to me as a consumer.

But then we can never have an "honest" discussion about price developments in the first place. You know, I e.g. don't care for sneaker shoes, either, but at this point it is clear to everybody & their mum that most of them are overpriced, which is kinda what I'm getting at in the LEGO universe as well. Well, whatever. This is getting too complex and it seems like every thought I have on the subject unravels a ton of others, so I'm going to stop here. My brain just isn't working that well at the moment and I can't seem to get my message across, so no point to add to the confusion...

Mylenium

3 hours ago, Mylenium said:

But then we can never have an "honest" discussion about price developments in the first place. You know, I e.g. don't care for sneaker shoes, either, but at this point it is clear to everybody & their mum that most of them are overpriced, which is kinda what I'm getting at in the LEGO universe as well. Well, whatever. This is getting too complex and it seems like every thought I have on the subject unravels a ton of others, so I'm going to stop here. My brain just isn't working that well at the moment and I can't seem to get my message across, so no point to add to the confusion...

What does overpriced mean? It will mean different things to different people, just like value is different to different people.

To me, if something sells to the target market at the set price at levels that are expected, then it is not overpriced. However, many people may not buy the item because they think it is overpriced. Of course, they could sell more by lowering the price to a level that more people would buy at, and while the volume of sales goes up that does not necessarily mean a higher overall profit or even higher sales (in terms of $ rather than units). 

Making comparisons between themes or even within themes is difficult because what is good value in one theme may not be as valued in another. Assigning a nominal value on a minifigure for example is difficult when to some people they are the only thing worth having, whereas to others they are things that get in the way of the "real" bricks.

2 hours ago, MAB said:

What does overpriced mean? It will mean different things to different people, just like value is different to different people.

To me, if something sells to the target market at the set price at levels that are expected, then it is not overpriced. However, many people may not buy the item because they think it is overpriced. Of course, they could sell more by lowering the price to a level that more people would buy at, and while the volume of sales goes up that does not necessarily mean a higher overall profit or even higher sales (in terms of $ rather than units). 

Making comparisons between themes or even within themes is difficult because what is good value in one theme may not be as valued in another. Assigning a nominal value on a minifigure for example is difficult when to some people they are the only thing worth having, whereas to others they are things that get in the way of the "real" bricks.

What I consider overpriced is when the PPP is above average and the size is small...

5 hours ago, MAB said:

What does overpriced mean?

Just a few random thoughts:

• inconsistent/ unpredictable pricing for the same pieces across different sets
• weight/ volume/ bulk per set
• complexity (or lack thereof) of a set
• whacked up pricing compared to sets with similar numbers of pieces and complexity

Granted, still hard to pin down, but I'm just not clear-minded enough ATM to give you a better explanation.

Mylenium

On 10/27/2020 at 1:55 PM, Mylenium said:

Just a few random thoughts:

• inconsistent/ unpredictable pricing for the same pieces across different sets
• weight/ volume/ bulk per set
• complexity (or lack thereof) of a set
• whacked up pricing compared to sets with similar numbers of pieces and complexity

Granted, still hard to pin down, but I'm just not clear-minded enough ATM to give you a better explanation.

Mylenium

And build time is important too...

To me, another big factor, is how widely a set is sold on the market.

It can be a big difference if a set/theme like Monkie Kid is LEGO exclusive, vs a theme like Creator 3-in-1 or Ninjago getting 30-40% discounts elsewhere (especially during 2019 that was common to see).

Yes, LEGO did have 30-50% off on their own website sometimes, but usually that's for common sets that would be cheap elsewhere as well. 

As far as 18+ goes, it doesn't bother me.

Edited October 28, 20204 yr by TeriXeri

42 minutes ago, TeriXeri said:

To me, another big factor, is how widely a set is sold on the market.

It can be a big difference if a set/theme like Monkie Kid is LEGO exclusive, vs a theme like Creator 3-in-1 or Ninjago getting 30-40% discounts elsewhere (especially during 2019 that was common to see).

Yes, LEGO did have 30-50% off on their own website sometimes, but usually that's for common sets that would be cheap elsewhere as well. 

As far as 18+ goes, it doesn't bother me.

It doesn't really bother me either, but was it really necessary? I don't think so...

And seems like LEGO just makes limited edition sets more expensive and collectors still buy them...

8 hours ago, JintaiZ said:

And seems like LEGO just makes limited edition sets more expensive and collectors still buy them...

I believe this is called "good market research", "good assessment of the customer base", etc. etc. and that this is the basis and inner works of the "free"-market-economy, particularly when this market is saturated with the product.

Best
Thorsten 

5 hours ago, Toastie said:

I believe this is called "good market research", "good assessment of the customer base", etc. etc. and that this is the basis and inner works of the "free"-market-economy, particularly when this market is saturated with the product.

Best
Thorsten 

I mean... it's simply a good way to earn money...

The 18+ age rating is odd. I don't like it that some retailers will take the age rating on Lego to mean the same as other age restricted items such as knives, pornography etc. Apart from the small parts for young children Lego is suitable for everyone, just that it may be a bit complicated.

But I'm really starting to dislike this black packaging. The sets don't stand out any more. A nice urban street background would make the Sesame Street stand out. The sand of Tatooine would've been better for the Cantina.

2 hours ago, TheMainBricker said:

The 18+ age rating is odd. I don't like it that some retailers will take the age rating on Lego to mean the same as other age restricted items such as knives, pornography etc. Apart from the small parts for young children Lego is suitable for everyone, just that it may be a bit complicated.

 

I can't say that I have seen a retailer refuse to sell an 18+ toy to anyone although at the price I guess normally an adult will be present. That said, I have never seen a retailer refuse to sell a 16+ set to a 10 or 12 year old.

 

2 hours ago, TheMainBricker said:

But I'm really starting to dislike this black packaging. The sets don't stand out any more. A nice urban street background would make the Sesame Street stand out. The sand of Tatooine would've been better for the Cantina.

I think they really stand out against other sets on shelves.

7 hours ago, TheMainBricker said:

But I'm really starting to dislike this black packaging. The sets don't stand out any more. A nice urban street background would make the Sesame Street stand out. The sand of Tatooine would've been better for the Cantina.

I'd say it depends. In fact, I'd say 10275's box looks great. However, black boxes and black sets just don't work together.

20 hours ago, MAB said:

I can't say that I have seen a retailer refuse to sell an 18+ toy to anyone although at the price I guess normally an adult will be present. That said, I have never seen a retailer refuse to sell a 16+ set to a 10 or 12 year old.

Amazon actually put an age restriction on the Voltron set, which then requires the driver to ask for age/ID before handing over the product.

20 hours ago, MAB said:

I think they really stand out against other sets on shelves.

They don't stand out against each other though.

5 hours ago, TheMainBricker said:

Amazon actually put an age restriction on the Voltron set, which then requires the driver to ask for age/ID before handing over the product.

I mean... kids and teens are not allowed to purchase toys by themselves; but a retailer will never refuse to sell a 18+ toy to a teenager if the parent/guardian allows them to buy one...

On 11/3/2020 at 1:25 PM, MAB said:

I think they really stand out against other sets on shelves.

 

5 hours ago, TheMainBricker said:

They don't stand out against each other though.

I won't say any of you are wrong, but these are opinions. Some people like them, other people doesn't. It depends...