Lego Ideas 90th Anniversary Fan Vote

[Lord-Vorahk]

31 minutes ago, Kingriedak said:

Which I (and pretty much all of my friends) loved, we were big fans of Hero Factory's building system, and loved the system that G2 used, although in 2016 Bionicle took an aesthetic nosedive with all the metallic colours. kind of amazing how they were spot on in 2015 and missed the mark almost completely the following year.

"Hey, how many red pieces should the red guy have?"

"Three?"

"Works for me."

 

That said, while a lot of us were okay with CCBS, myself included, there was a lot of pushback from other fans who expected Lego to (somehow) recast all of the old G1 parts and bring them back, and then pick up exactly where G1 left off. And they were militant.

I, personally, would be fine with a CCBS Bonkle set. Others? Maybe not. Just like you've personally said you wouldn't take a mech with a minifig, I'd personally be happy to take a brick-and-minifig Bionicle G3 with something akin to the Marvel Mechs providing the "Constraction" angle. Everyone's got different requirements and wishes for it, and the hard part would be find the right balance.

 

[UberCorp]

42 minutes ago, Kingriedak said:

do you think Bionicle fans would prefer a set using those over something more System-based?

As a life long Bionicle fan, I just want anything related to the original story and care less about the building system. A huge reason Gen 2 fell flat for me was despite being constraction and sharing names as the original wad they rebooted the story and lost the decade of books and comics that the original line had built up. Which IMO made it feel less like Bionicle than it could have.

I would be way more than happy getting a system set if that’s what it requires to get the theme to be thrown a bone.

Edited January 28, 2021 by UberCorp

[Merlo]

9 hours ago, JoeyB said:

Sorry, I had to make this.

True, true... Didn't stop me voting Imperials though.

[Roebuck]

8 hours ago, Scarilian said:

The second 2020 Lego review of 35 Lego Ideas sets includes a set known as Brickwest Studios. It is generally believed that Lego Western was not included because Brickwest Studios will be one of the winners the review and made into a set that would be released in 2022. I feel such a set would satisfy Lego Western fans and if such a set were to be released, Western would not need a 90th Anniversary set.

Personally I do not think that is the case, why was not islanders included? Probably the same reason as western

43 minutes ago, Merlo said:

True, true... Didn't stop me voting Imperials though.

Same here, I have always liked imperials more than pirates. A lot of people probably voted pirates because it sounds like a more general description of the theme even if they would be fine or even prefer imperials or islanders.
It the assumed top 3 are in the last vote, I will vote for pirates, but think classic space will win

[Fuppylodders]

Genuine bionicle question:

If people didn't like the reboot and didn't get into it because lack of story and marketing.... 

What would be different about a potential one off set that would make you buy it? Which would likely come with a lack of story, and probably a lack of marketing....? 

[Lira_Bricks]

1 hour ago, Fuppylodders said:

Genuine bionicle question:

If people didn't like the reboot and didn't get into it because lack of story and marketing.... 

What would be different about a potential one off set that would make you buy it? Which would likely come with a lack of story, and probably a lack of marketing....? 

I want technic robots. I never cared for the Bionicle story since the story was never available in my native language. The later sets had nothing to do with technic.

 

8 hours ago, Kingriedak said:

although in 2016 Bionicle took an aesthetic nosedive with all the metallic colours. kind of amazing how they were spot on in 2015 and missed the mark almost completely the following year.

So I decided to take a look... https://brickset.com/sets/theme-Bionicle/year-2016

These do not look like anything Bionicle haha, if you did not tell me anything, I would assume Hero Factory or a new CCBS-theme. Not even the faces/masks/helmets/... look like those from the Toa mata or Toa nuva

Edited January 28, 2021 by Lira_Bricks
Comment on Bionicle 2016

[MAB]

11 hours ago, Scarilian said:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

The second 2020 Lego review of 35 Lego Ideas sets includes a set known as Brickwest Studios. It is generally believed that Lego Western was not included because Brickwest Studios will be one of the winners the review and made into a set that would be released in 2022. I feel such a set would satisfy Lego Western fans and if such a set were to be released, Western would not need a 90th Anniversary set.

 

 

Generally believed by who? I think they were not included because of the dated and somewhat stereotypic depiction of Native Americans that would not be popular today.

Edited January 28, 2021 by MAB

[Kingriedak]

2 hours ago, Fuppylodders said:

Genuine bionicle question:

If people didn't like the reboot and didn't get into it because lack of story and marketing.... 

What would be different about a potential one off set that would make you buy it? Which would likely come with a lack of story, and probably a lack of marketing....? 

There is no chance, and I mean absolutely no chance that it will depict anything from the reboot. If we were to get something, it would likely be something representing the Toa Mata (Tahu specifically) or the GSR (which we never got a set of, and it's one of the few things in Bionicle that looks good when made out of system)

And regardless of whether it sells or not (hardcore afols would never buy it anyway), if its a mosaic or a bust then I just won't get it. I don't think Lego is gonna touch Bionicle in the future, and if this is our last set and it sucks, then oh well, it won't hurt to not buy it because we're not getting anything in the future after this anyway, but if its a set of system built Toa Mata with articulation similar to the comic book mechs? I'd buy them instantly

1 hour ago, Lira_Bricks said:

So I decided to take a look... https://brickset.com/sets/theme-Bionicle/year-2016

These do not look like anything Bionicle haha

Horrible, aren't they? I appreciate the return of Purple, and Umarak looks gorgeous, but it feels like competent set designers built the core figures with a healthy blend of Technic and CCBS, and then they gave an intern who's only ever worked on ninjago the loudest, most annoying parts and ordered him to finish it up. Its just so over the top

 

If you guys want opinions on Bionicle from someone far less jaded and bitter, then I highly suggest this recent video by RolloutReviews

 

Edited January 28, 2021 by Kingriedak

[Lego David]

11 hours ago, Kingriedak said:

If they were close to these, I'd totally be in favour of them 

To be honest, I don't really like that particular style. I far prefer the one I posted, which is about the same size as the original Toa Mata sets, except system-built. On top of that, having brickbuilt masks just wouldn't work for me... Having special mask elements has always been part of Bionicle's appeal IMO. 

2 hours ago, Fuppylodders said:

If people didn't like the reboot and didn't get into it because lack of story and marketing.... 

What would be different about a potential one off set that would make you buy it? Which would likely come with a lack of story, and probably a lack of marketing....? 

This a one-off set we're talking about here. If it's a tribute to the original line and the original line's story, I see no reason why Bionicle fans wouldn't want it. 

22 minutes ago, Kingriedak said:

Horrible, aren't they? I appreciate the return of Purple, and Umarak looks gorgeous, but it feels like competent set designers built the core figures with a healthy blend of Technic and CCBS, and then they gave an intern who's only ever worked on ninjago the loudest, most annoying parts and ordered him to finish it up. Its just so over the top

Why does everyone dislike the 2016 Bionicle sets? I personally think they are on par with the 2015 ones, if not better. The fact that they added more piston detailing and such doesn't really bother me personally. 

[Kingriedak]

1 minute ago, Lego David said:

I far prefer the one I posted

I'll concede on the one you posted looking better in many aspects, but I'm really not a fan of the articulation it has. I don't wanna be too critical, that is someone's moc after all

3 minutes ago, Lego David said:

brickbuilt masks just wouldn't work for me... Having special mask elements has always been part of Bionicle's appeal

agreed, it just seems unlikely we'd get that, but in a more ideal world I'd also be asking for that

4 minutes ago, Lego David said:

Why does everyone dislike the 2016 Bionicle sets?

2015 just had...something to it man. It was doing Bionicle easy, and 2016 tried way too hard and ended up failing

[MAB]

1 hour ago, Kingriedak said:

Horrible, aren't they? I appreciate the return of Purple, and Umarak looks gorgeous, but it feels like competent set designers built the core figures with a healthy blend of Technic and CCBS, and then they gave an intern who's only ever worked on ninjago the loudest, most annoying parts and ordered him to finish it up. Its just so over the top

I'm no fan of Bionicle (I've never really been into constraction at all although we have a load of parts that we use to make bare skeletons for shooting at with NERF guns) but to me as an outsider the 2016 sets, and the 2015 ones, look similar but somehow better looking than the original early 2000s sets. Maybe Bionicle fans need to learn from the generation before. Stick the word Classic in front of Bionicle, then complain about everything released after the first few years. The way you describe these seems to be the equivalent of the derided "Jellybean Knights" in Castle circles.

[koalayummies]

5 hours ago, MAB said:

The way you describe these seems to be the equivalent of the derided "Jellybean Knights" in Castle circles.

Admittedly had to search. For the curious: the rainbow assortment of Knights Kingdom protagonists.

[Kingriedak]

6 hours ago, MAB said:

Maybe Bionicle fans need to learn from the generation before. Stick the word Classic in front of Bionicle

We kind of had that, back when Bionicle was a Technic subsidiary, the Technic logo was sort of our version of the "Classic" label.

6 hours ago, MAB said:

but to me as an outsider the 2016 sets, and the 2015 ones, look similar but somehow better looking than the original early 2000s sets

That's evolution for you, here's a hastily thrown together timeline of the building systems that lead to that

Spoiler

 

Technic Competition (1998): The unintentional progenitor to all of Constraction.

Slizers/Throwbots (1999-2000): The modern balljoint and buildable robot action figure concept starts to form.

Roboriders (2000): less of a focus on balljoints, more of a focus on launchers and collectables.

Technic Bionicle (2001-2003): The culmination of the first three, early era Bionicle was using large, technic heavy sets for its titans, a balljoint focused, buildable action figure focus for medium sized sets, launchable disks and collectable masks, the one new thing it brought to the table was predefined lore and books written for it.

Metru Arc Bionicle (2004-2005) Less of a focus on Technic, more of a focus on the action figure/balljoint system.

Inika Era Bionicle (2006-2008) Technic functions have been fazed out almost completely from regular canister sets.

Glatorian Arc Bionicle (2009) Same as the 2006-2008, but the story was being taken in a new direction in hopes to reboot it, this is essential Bionicle G1.5.

Lego Ben 10 (2010): Direct progenitor to CCBS, it was used to appease Bionicle fans while Lego made another Constraction IP.

pre CCBS Hero Factory (2010) A blend of Bionicle and Ben 10 parts.

Hero Factory Proper (2010-2014): CCBS, a figure building system that relied on cost effective smooth shells and bones, and allowed for fewer unique molds to be made each year is born, very few Technic functions appeared in its entire run.

Bionicle G2: Bionicle comes back in the CCBS system, as well as the reintroduction of Technic functions to figures, 2015 specifically had a smoother aesthetic and less technic parts, while 2016 was getting more of a technic heavy focus (good) but was aesthetically and debatably getting uglier (bad).

Star Wars CCBS (???-2017): Pops up, directly competes with Bionicle, doesn't appeal to system fans (because its Constraction) or Bionicle fans (Because of its human characters) but is pushed anyway despite being a failure to anyone with eyes, it performs so abysmally that it (likely) kills Constraction as a whole

 

 

[Alexandrina]

8 hours ago, MAB said:

Generally believed by who? I think they were not included because of the dated and somewhat stereotypic depiction of Native Americans that would not be popular today.

I've come across this view a lot, but I don't see how that would be a deal-breaker as regards including Western in the poll. Aside from the fact that any stereotypes in the 1990s range aren't bound by law to be incorporated in a future reboot - regardless of past mistakes, there's nothing stopping Lego from one day producing sets with a thoughtful and accurate depiction of Native Americans - it's worth bearing in mind that at no point in Western's run did Native Americans interact with any of the other factions. There's overlap between the Cavalry and the Bandits, and the Bandits and the Cowboys, but the Native Americans are their own thing.

I actually think Western could come back as a fully-fledged theme without hitting any real political pushback and without compromising the quality of the sets - if they kept focus on the cowboys-and-bandits tropes of classic Western movies like "Shane". Lego can easily come up with some named characters - throw a cowboy, a bandit, a sheriff and a cavalry soldier in polybags, then have sets such as a covered wagon, a saloon, a bank, a train, a frontier sodhouse, etc.

In actual fact, I'm hoping it wasn't excluded because of the Ideas concept, but because Lego already have plans to bring it back as a fully-fledged theme for next year anyway. I need me some frontier women minifigures!

[ProfSrlojohn]

10 hours ago, Fuppylodders said:

Genuine bionicle question:

If people didn't like the reboot and didn't get into it because lack of story and marketing.... 

What would be different about a potential one off set that would make you buy it? Which would likely come with a lack of story, and probably a lack of marketing....? 

3 reasons.

1) It wouldn't be a reboot, it'd be a one-off celebratory set. There weren't a lot of people who were upset at g2 being a reboot anyway, (even though it wasn't for a multitude of complicate reasons I won't waste time on) they were generally just upset that the dangling plot threads left by Greg Farshtey when he was told by lego to quit the postmortem serials weren't going to be resolved. Can you really blame them?

2) It wouldn't really be expected to have a plot, as a celebratory set. It's not a whole new theme, it's just a one-off. Any plot it would have would be representing G1 (and maybe G2) plot, nothing more.

3) I would presume it'd at least have the level of marketing expected of a one-off celebratory set. We aren't expecting 3-year theme marketing from a one-off set. That'd be asinine to expect.

The thing about g2 was that, for the niche it was filling, the next big-bang constration theme, it got none of the push or plot required to make that happen, especially compared to it's predecessor, the first big-bang theme. I never saw an ad for Bionicle G2 ever, on any website. I only found out about it by stumbling by the website when it was first revealed. The plot was rather sparse early on, and it did pick-up, a bit as things progressed, but the way it was done meant that it didn't draw people in. It didn't catch people. Especially when the first and only bit of media for the first 2 waves were animated shorts, voiced by one guy, that were released sporadically, at different times in different countries. It didn't even make it all 3 years.

G2, more than any other big-bang theme or 3-year theme attempt, was a master-class in how *not* to market and push a new lego theme. Especially with big-daddy Ninjago in the background at one of it's highest points.

[icm]

20 minutes ago, Kingriedak said:

Back when Bionicle was a Technic subsidiary, the Technic logo was sort of our version of the "Classic" label.

Yep, that's how I've thought of it for a long time.  Classic Bionicle is 2001-2003, but especially 2001 when it still had the Technic label.  2004 was ok too, but I completely lost interest in 2005 when the canister sets lost their gear functions and masks as distinct from heads.  I see my very limited interest in just the first couple years of Bionicle as closely analogous to my primary interest in just the first couple years of Space.

[ProfSrlojohn]

17 minutes ago, Alexandrina said:

I've come across this view a lot, but I don't see how that would be a deal-breaker as regards including Western in the poll. Aside from the fact that any stereotypes in the 1990s range aren't bound by law to be incorporated in a future reboot - regardless of past mistakes, there's nothing stopping Lego from one day producing sets with a thoughtful and accurate depiction of Native Americans - it's worth bearing in mind that at no point in Western's run did Native Americans interact with any of the other factions. There's overlap between the Cavalry and the Bandits, and the Bandits and the Cowboys, but the Native Americans are their own thing.

I actually think Western could come back as a fully-fledged theme without hitting any real political pushback and without compromising the quality of the sets - if they kept focus on the cowboys-and-bandits tropes of classic Western movies like "Shane". Lego can easily come up with some named characters - throw a cowboy, a bandit, a sheriff and a cavalry soldier in polybags, then have sets such as a covered wagon, a saloon, a bank, a train, a frontier sodhouse, etc.

In actual fact, I'm hoping it wasn't excluded because of the Ideas concept, but because Lego already have plans to bring it back as a fully-fledged theme for next year anyway. I need me some frontier women minifigures!

Random idea: Make boxed sets of cowboys and cavalry soldiers and such on the side and market it as a game. It sells well for companies like Games Workshop, or Warlord games, why not Lego? Not to mention of the handful of western themed minature games that exist, few of them are similar scales. As a wargamer, a wargame, heck, even a western adventure game, with lego's level of quality control, as well as the ability to kitbash like no other game, would be lovely.

Not to mention it'd go over well with MOCers since they'd basically have massive western parts packs.

Edited January 28, 2021 by ProfSrlojohn

[MAB]

20 minutes ago, Kingriedak said:

That's evolution for you, here's a hastily thrown together timeline of the building systems that lead to that

  Hide contents

 

Technic Competition (1998): The unintentional progenitor to all of Constraction.

Slizers/Throwbots (1999-2000): The modern balljoint and buildable robot action figure concept starts to form.

Roboriders (2000): less of a focus on balljoints, more of a focus on launchers and collectables.

Technic Bionicle (2001-2003): The culmination of the first three, early era Bionicle was using large, technic heavy sets for its titans, a balljoint focused, buildable action figure focus for medium sized sets, launchable disks and collectable masks, the one new thing it brought to the table was predefined lore and books written for it.

Metru Arc Bionicle (2004-2005) Less of a focus on Technic, more of a focus on the action figure/balljoint system.

Inika Era Bionicle (2006-2008) Technic functions have been fazed out almost completely from regular canister sets.

Glatorian Arc Bionicle (2009) Same as the 2006-2008, but the story was being taken in a new direction in hopes to reboot it, this is essential Bionicle G1.5.

Lego Ben 10 (2010): Direct progenitor to CCBS, it was used to appease Bionicle fans while Lego made another Constraction IP.

pre CCBS Hero Factory (2010) A blend of Bionicle and Ben 10 parts.

Hero Factory Proper (2010-2014): CCBS, a figure building system that relied on cost effective smooth shells and bones, and allowed for fewer unique molds to be made each year is born, very few Technic functions appeared in its entire run.

Bionicle G2: Bionicle comes back in the CCBS system, as well as the reintroduction of Technic functions to figures, 2015 specifically had a smoother aesthetic and less technic parts, while 2016 was getting more of a technic heavy focus (good) but was aesthetically and debatably getting uglier (bad).

Star Wars CCBS (???-2017): Pops up, directly competes with Bionicle, doesn't appeal to system fans (because its Constraction) or Bionicle fans (Because of its human characters) but is pushed anyway despite being a failure to anyone with eyes, it performs so abysmally that it (likely) kills Constraction as a whole

 

 

Haven't you missed the superheroes ...

I quite enjoyed those but sold them a couple of years ago.

3 minutes ago, ProfSrlojohn said:

Random idea: Make boxed sets of cowboys and cavalry soldiers and such on the side and market it as a game. It sells well for companies like Games Workshop, or Warlord games, why not Lego? Not to mention of the handful of western themed minature games that exist, few of them are similar scales. As a wargamer, a wargame, heck, even a western adventure game, with lego's level of quality control, as well as the ability to kitbash like no other game, would be lovely.

Not to mention it'd go over well with MOCers since they'd basically have massive western parts packs.

If they are going to market it as a game, then they need to develop the game and rules and LEGO games don't have a reputation of being very good. 

You could say the same about any theme though - why not make a game for the minifigure parts, whether it is Space, Castle, Vikings, Elves, Trolls, City people, ...

[Kingriedak]

3 minutes ago, MAB said:

Haven't you missed the superheroes

Oh yeah, those, its sad how lego was able to understand quite early that these wouldn't sell well, but they had better recolours than the star wars version of the line

[JintaiZ]

35 minutes ago, Kingriedak said:

 

That's evolution for you, here's a hastily thrown together timeline of the building systems that lead to that

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Technic Competition (1998): The unintentional progenitor to all of Constraction.

Slizers/Throwbots (1999-2000): The modern balljoint and buildable robot action figure concept starts to form.

Roboriders (2000): less of a focus on balljoints, more of a focus on launchers and collectables.

Technic Bionicle (2001-2003): The culmination of the first three, early era Bionicle was using large, technic heavy sets for its titans, a balljoint focused, buildable action figure focus for medium sized sets, launchable disks and collectable masks, the one new thing it brought to the table was predefined lore and books written for it.

Metru Arc Bionicle (2004-2005) Less of a focus on Technic, more of a focus on the action figure/balljoint system.

Inika Era Bionicle (2006-2008) Technic functions have been fazed out almost completely from regular canister sets.

Glatorian Arc Bionicle (2009) Same as the 2006-2008, but the story was being taken in a new direction in hopes to reboot it, this is essential Bionicle G1.5.

Lego Ben 10 (2010): Direct progenitor to CCBS, it was used to appease Bionicle fans while Lego made another Constraction IP.

pre CCBS Hero Factory (2010) A blend of Bionicle and Ben 10 parts.

Hero Factory Proper (2010-2014): CCBS, a figure building system that relied on cost effective smooth shells and bones, and allowed for fewer unique molds to be made each year is born, very few Technic functions appeared in its entire run.

Bionicle G2: Bionicle comes back in the CCBS system, as well as the reintroduction of Technic functions to figures, 2015 specifically had a smoother aesthetic and less technic parts, while 2016 was getting more of a technic heavy focus (good) but was aesthetically and debatably getting uglier (bad).

Star Wars CCBS (???-2017): Pops up, directly competes with Bionicle, doesn't appeal to system fans (because its Constraction) or Bionicle fans (Because of its human characters) but is pushed anyway despite being a failure to anyone with eyes, it performs so abysmally that it (likely) kills Constraction as a whole

 

 

Also think Ninjago mechs have a similar general idea to Bionicle, even though they are much bigger.

Edited January 28, 2021 by JintaiZ

[Kingriedak]

1 minute ago, JintaiZ said:

Also think Ninjago Mechs have a similar general idea to Bionicle, even though they are much bigger.

They're not constraction. unless you mean something about how they evolved, I wouldn't know, I've never liked Ninjago and have no interest in seeing what its about

[JintaiZ]

Just now, Kingriedak said:

They're not constraction. unless you mean something about how they evolved, I wouldn't know, I've never liked Ninjago and have no interest in seeing what its about

I consider Ninjago mechs a "brick-built" version of constraction sets as the overall shaping still looks quite similar to other constraction sets.

[Kingriedak]

5 minutes ago, JintaiZ said:

I consider Ninjago mechs a "brick-built" version of constraction sets as the overall shaping still looks quite similar to other constraction sets.

Yeah, but as a constraction mocist, if you threw a disassembled ninjago mech in my bucket of parts you've just put stuff in that I'll have to pick out later, with the exception of a few small parts like mixel joints or fingers. Overall, brick built mechs just aren't constraction. I'm not even sure they have the same range of motion as a normal constraction figure

[Lego David]

8 hours ago, Kingriedak said:

I'll concede on the one you posted looking better in many aspects, but I'm really not a fan of the articulation it has. I don't wanna be too critical, that is someone's moc after all

I can echo your sentiment about the articulation on the MOC I shared, but I feel like if LEGO is gonna make a set like that, they are probably gonna market it as a "display piece" like most of their current large 18+ sets. So if that were the case, there would be more focus on the looks and less focus on the articulation. 

1 hour ago, Alexandrina said:

Generally believed by who? I think they were not included because of the dated and somewhat stereotypic depiction of Native Americans that would not be popular today.

I mean, the first wave of Western sets didn't even include Native Americans... it was just the Cowboys, Bandits, and Cavalry. The Indians wouldn't come until the second year of LEGO Western, in 1997. If LEGO were to theoretically make a Western set as the 90th anniversary set, they probably would have done something like a Fort Legoredo remake, which didn't include any Indians at all. So technically speaking, they could get away with making a new Western set while still staying away from inaccurate Native American depictions. 

Edited January 28, 2021 by Lego David

[Scarilian]

12 hours ago, Roebuck said:

Personally I do not think that is the case, why was not islanders included? Probably the same reason as western

Islanders is a very short lived subtheme of Pirates. I expect most subthemes were bundled into the overall theme.

The only exception is seemingly Castle which notably had subthemes of varying different lengths and sets spanning many years. As shown by the recent Lego Ideas Barracuda set, elements of Islanders could be adapted in any potential Pirates sets. As shown by recent Ninjago sets, aspects of Islanders could also be included in other themes.

If Islanders had been listed as a seperate theme it would have stood no chance, but bundled together with Pirates, it means perhaps it could be adapted in future.

10 hours ago, MAB said:

Generally believed by who? I think they were not included because of the dated and somewhat stereotypic depiction of Native Americans that would not be popular today.

Primarily those following the current Lego Ideas reviews along with having an understanding of potentially conflicting sets and how it would appear if Western simultaniously won the 90th anniversary and had a Lego Ideas set chosen very shortly after that would be adapted at the same time :p

As for the nonsense that they would not adapt it because it potentially depicts Native Americans. These are from 2016, 2011 and 2010. Lego can easily create a new Western theme and simply portray the Native Americans as kind/peaceful - honestly that seems exactly what they are going for with the CMF Native American inspired figures.

 

 

Edited January 28, 2021 by Scarilian