New Mould Discussion

[Brick900]

This is the thread where you can discuss new moulds LEGO is producing. There is already the thread for new animal moulds, but this one is meant to be more general.

Edited September 19, 2024 by Brick900

[Xfing]

Not like super new, because this piece is said to have started appearing in 2023, but this: 
https://rebrickable.com/parts/2391/technic-beam-1-x-7-thick-with-alternating-holes/

And you know what? I've seen an equivalent piece in a clone brand set that was released in 2022. Here, check it out, at 11:11 specifically (among other times), you can see the piece in question. The video is dated for Apr 29, 2022.

 

 

Does that mean we have evidence of Lego co-opting a piece that was previously introduced by a clone brand? If so, would it be the first time it has happened, or have there been precedents like this in the past?

[SpacePolice89]

On 9/19/2024 at 8:32 PM, Brick900 said:

This is the thread where you can discuss new moulds LEGO is producing. There is already the thread for new animal moulds, but this one is meant to be more general.

It would be great with information about molds in general, also discontinued molds and dates of use. On Bricklink there is information about which years a part has been produced but I'd be interested in the status of the molds. Some are stored while others get destroyed. Very seldom such information is available, Lego has confirmed that the monorail molds are gone .

[Mikdun]

I guess one would need to be quite close to the production/maintenance of Lego company.

Plus, there are mould variants (when you improve or change something to the part) and "copy tools" (which are just clones, producing identical parts).

Moulds gets used over time (or rather over injection cycles) and needs repair. If the damage gets too big it gets scrapped.

Depending on the businnes model companies stores unused moulds for shorter or longer before sending them for scrap. It will be interesting to know what is Lego policy on this.

[Brick900]

This new 4x6 round mould has been released rather recently.

https://rebrickable.com/parts/3766/plate-round-4-x-6/

Edited October 4, 2024 by Brick900

[SNIPE]

new part 2x2 macaroni brick curved in yellow, available in set 77002 Cyclone v metal sonic which comes out jan 2025.

Edited October 11, 2024 by SNIPE

[saqrio]

On 9/21/2024 at 2:28 AM, Xfing said:

Not like super new, because this piece is said to have started appearing in 2023, but this: 
https://rebrickable.com/parts/2391/technic-beam-1-x-7-thick-with-alternating-holes/

And you know what? I've seen an equivalent piece in a clone brand set that was released in 2022. Here, check it out, at 11:11 specifically (among other times), you can see the piece in question. The video is dated for Apr 29, 2022.

 

 

Does that mean we have evidence of Lego co-opting a piece that was previously introduced by a clone brand? If so, would it be the first time it has happened, or have there been precedents like this in the past?

It’s possible that LEGO introduced the Technic beam after seeing something similar in a clone brand, but without clear confirmation, it’s hard to say for sure. There have been cases where clone brands produced parts or designs before LEGO, but this isn't well-documented. LEGO typically leads in innovation, though clone brands sometimes introduce variations earlier. It’s an interesting observation, but we’d need more evidence to determine if LEGO co-opted the design in this case. Precedents do exist, but they're rare.

[Lyichir]

On 9/20/2024 at 5:28 PM, Xfing said:

Not like super new, because this piece is said to have started appearing in 2023, but this: 
https://rebrickable.com/parts/2391/technic-beam-1-x-7-thick-with-alternating-holes/

And you know what? I've seen an equivalent piece in a clone brand set that was released in 2022. Here, check it out, at 11:11 specifically (among other times), you can see the piece in question. The video is dated for Apr 29, 2022

 

 

Does that mean we have evidence of Lego co-opting a piece that was previously introduced by a clone brand? If so, would it be the first time it has happened, or have there been precedents like this in the past?

It's kind of hard to say Lego copied the competitors with a piece like this because the competitor's piece was itself derivative of parts Lego had introduced earlier—specifically, 1x11 and 1x15 "flip flop beams" were introduced in Lego Technic in 2021, so a clone brand coming out with a 1x7 version in 2022 is less a case of them being truly innovative and more just a case of them beating Lego to the punch with a logical extension to that new "family" of parts. The same applies to things like Lego's recently introduced 1x5 plates—yes, Lego had not produced those for a long time, and yes, clone brands had filled that void, but there's no real argument that Lego introducing one was copying those clone brands rather than just creating something that follows naturally from 1x1, 1x2, 1x3, and 1x4 plates.

Edited October 17, 2024 by Lyichir

[MAB]

5 hours ago, Lyichir said:

It's kind of hard to say Lego copied the competitors with a piece like this because the competitor's piece was itself derivative of parts Lego had introduced earlier—specifically, 1x11 and 1x15 "flip flop beams" were introduced in Lego Technic in 2021, so a clone brand coming out with a 1x7 version in 2022 is less a case of them being truly innovative and more just a case of them beating Lego to the punch with a logical extension to that new "family" of parts. The same applies to things like Lego's recently introduced 1x5 plates—yes, Lego had not produced those for a long time, and yes, clone brands had filled that void, but there's no real argument that Lego introducing one was copying those clone brands rather than just creating something that follows naturally from 1x1, 1x2, 1x3, and 1x4 plates.

I agree. Once a family of parts has been introduced, a new sized member being added is a natural progression and not copying even if another company filled in a gap in that family before LEGO did.

[anothergol]

9 hours ago, Lyichir said:

It's kind of hard to say Lego copied the competitors with a piece like this because the competitor's piece was itself derivative of parts Lego had introduced earlier—specifically, 1x11 and 1x15 "flip flop beams" were introduced in Lego Technic in 2021, so a clone brand coming out with a 1x7 version in 2022 is less a case of them being truly innovative and more just a case of them beating Lego to the punch with a logical extension to that new "family" of parts. The same applies to things like Lego's recently introduced 1x5 plates—yes, Lego had not produced those for a long time, and yes, clone brands had filled that void, but there's no real argument that Lego introducing one was copying those clone brands rather than just creating something that follows naturally from 1x1, 1x2, 1x3, and 1x4 plates.

"Clone" brands are so advanced by now anyway, what can Lego still do that won't be a "copy"?
It would be everyone's (and especially Lego's, and our) best interest to stop wanting to protect/patent "new" parts and instead share what's out there.

Stud inverters, inverted clips, all kinds of chainable slopes, curves and wedges, wedge tiles, 3x4 plates, 1x10 tiles.. anything you can dream of does exist (and is sometimes really hard to find because there's no Bricklink for clones [probably the real reason why Lego bought it btw]), and if people are too snobs about the Lego brand, and if Lego is too proud and protective of its brand, we're never gonna see those pop up as genuine Lego.

Lego generally tries to make their own version of what already exists out there. Like, stud+bar already existed, but Lego's is more "in system". 2/3 bracket brick was already widely available, Lego made theirs rounded (but in general, brackets are A LOT more powerful in clone systems).
And also the infamous 1x5 plate that Lego tried to patent, that other brands had for years.

Of course there are parts that Lego would never do for "safety" reasons. Like, THE most useful "Lego" part that cannot and will never be genuine Lego, because not every existing part has stud blockers, and you can definitely lose these inside bricks:

 

Edited October 17, 2024 by anothergol

[The Island Chronicles]

I have one for food molds. 

https://www.eurobricks.com/forum/index.php?/forums/topic/200162-lego-food-pieces-info-new-molds-and-ideas/

[Xfing]

There's an easy solution for that "safety" concern - just add a thin, bracket-width ring in the middle, perhaps a square one even. Won't be quite as clean, but it'll work. But agreed, this piece is insanely useful, as are many SNOT solutions and brackets that Cobi has. I really do wish they'll continue appearing as proper Lego.

[Mylenium]

On 10/17/2024 at 4:07 AM, Lyichir said:

It's kind of hard to say Lego copied the competitors with a piece like this because the competitor's piece was itself derivative of parts Lego had introduced earlier—specifically, 1x11 and 1x15 "flip flop beams" were introduced in Lego Technic in 2021

CaDa has had such beams since the beginning of eternity (and by extension other alternative brands that copied CaDa), so your interpretation doesn't make much sense.

On 10/17/2024 at 9:17 AM, MAB said:

Once a family of parts has been introduced, a new sized member being added is a natural progression and not copying even if another company filled in a gap in that family before LEGO did.

I would agree, but ultimately we have to take the facts for what they are: LEGO are weaponizing the protected designs exactly for that reason. It's the old debate of whether it's an inevitable, natural technical solution or a conscious decision to pick this exact design. And since this is based on the "first come, first served" principle, it's all an effed up mess. Whoever beats the others to the punch can basically dictate what's right and what's wrong and abuse the system. That's why we are in this mess, after all.

On 10/17/2024 at 1:10 PM, anothergol said:

"Clone" brands are so advanced by now anyway, what can Lego still do that won't be a "copy"? It would be everyone's (and especially Lego's, and our) best interest to stop wanting to protect/patent "new" parts and instead share what's out there.

10000 % agree. It's just disappointing that so far no court has ordered LEGO to even provide a FRAND licensing option and spare the legal system all that annoying trouble and cost.

Mylenium

 

[Xfing]

Sooo, we all know that Lego have been playing catch-up with their competitors and introducing some pretty revolutionary pieces in recent years, this late into the game (which just shows how behind they can be sometimes). This part family when, you think? 

Edited November 15, 2024 by Xfing

[Mylenium]

On 11/15/2024 at 4:07 PM, Xfing said:

This part family when, you think?

Never? It's one of those weird things where LEGO's design philosophy figures in. They rather invest in seemingly redundant molds of existing pieces turned upside-down to keep the build experience simple (in their view). I also mentioned in another thread that those direction inverters could be problematic in terms of internal tension in the elements, elements grinding on one another and of course disassembling stuff. Based on those criteria it's unlikely we will ever see this.

Mylenium

[Xfing]

On 11/16/2024 at 5:44 PM, Mylenium said:

Never? It's one of those weird things where LEGO's design philosophy figures in. They rather invest in seemingly redundant molds of existing pieces turned upside-down to keep the build experience simple (in their view). I also mentioned in another thread that those direction inverters could be problematic in terms of internal tension in the elements, elements grinding on one another and of course disassembling stuff. Based on those criteria it's unlikely we will ever see this.

Mylenium

Interesting, I thought the only consideration was Lego's arbitrary refusal for some obscure, idealistic reason. Didn't know there were practical considerations as well. I understand for example with the "loose stud" part that Cobi so specializes in, it's possible to lose that part beyond retrieval if inserted into a brick rather than a plate. That's a rather serious problem. But I never figured there were similar ones with the inverters. No one has complained about structural problems or durability of those, to my knowledge.

[SNIPE]

2 new parts in set 60445 Formula 1 Truck with RB20 & AMR24 F1 Cars

Edited December 18, 2024 by SNIPE