2L Driving Rings Question

[LegoLord1880]

A few months ago I decided to bite the bullet and order 3 of Lego's new 2L driving rings from the McLaren P1 so I could keep my parts up to date (and because I mostly build with studded Technic parts). I've been experimenting with manual transmissions with shift linkages using the new shift forks. I ran into problems getting the rings to hold in or out of gear like my 3L rings can. Is there a reliable way of getting the rings to snap into gear and hold position?

[gyenesvi]

10 hours ago, LegoLord1880 said:

Is there a reliable way of getting the rings to snap into gear and hold position?

I don't think so, I guess they are designed to work with rotational selectors, such as the wave selector and the forks controlled by drums that keep them in place.

[SNIPE]

The only way, besides what @gyenesvi said would be to link a 3L drive ring up to a 2L drive ring, so that they both move at the same time, the 3L would be using the white 3L axle joiner.

you could also maybe use some sort of spring loaded latching mechanism like the trigger on a gun, but you would need to probably make one for when the ring is up and down (but not one for if its centered).

a more elegant solution would just be to use this part along with a motor, the motor will keep the drive ring from sliding around, unless you apply enough torque to manually turn the motor, in that case you could use a worm gear +  spur gear to move this part and keep/ditch the motor

[LegoLord1880]

9 minutes ago, SNIPE said:

The only way, besides what @gyenesvi said would be to link a 3L drive ring up to a 2L drive ring, so that they both move at the same time, the 3L would be using the white 3L axle joiner.

you could also maybe use some sort of spring loaded latching mechanism like the trigger on a gun, but you would need to probably make one for when the ring is up and down (but not one for if its centered).

a more elegant solution would just be to use this part along with a motor, the motor will keep the drive ring from sliding around, unless you apply enough torque to manually turn the motor, in that case you could use a worm gear +  spur gear to move this part and keep/ditch the motor

That sounds like a good plan, but i'm fresh out of Lego motors that are are not burned up (I have a bad habit of overloading them). Recently I saw a MOC on Rebrickable that used rubber bands to pull a 1L beam into the groove on a 3L driving ring. I have built the MOC, but I don't know if his mechanism will hold up when stressed. I need to shift pretty fast when rev-matching my vacuum engines.

Here's a link to the MOC:https://rebrickable.com/mocs/MOC-16840/Pleasedontspammebro/5-speed-gearbox-with-realistic-h-pattern-shift-neutral-and-optional-reverse/#details  

[LegoLord1880]

By the way, here is one of my shift linkage setups on a 4 speed manual. The 2 sides are symmetrical, with pieces removed for visibility.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1RSKHSAS-QLBC1ZzhbdCo6_61f7QC1Omu/view?usp=drive_link

[2GodBDGlory]

 

12 minutes ago, LegoLord1880 said:

By the way, here is one of my shift linkage setups on a 4 speed manual. The 2 sides are symmetrical, with pieces removed for visibility.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1RSKHSAS-QLBC1ZzhbdCo6_61f7QC1Omu/view?usp=drive_link

Looks like the sharing settings on that aren't set up properly; it's not giving me permission to view it.

Here's a couple images of something that could be worth looking into:

It's just using a fixed shock absorber to make it snap in and out of position. It seems to work fairly well, but I'm not sure about your specific application. If you're getting high RPM out of your vacuum engines, I wouldn't want to see this driveshaft spinning quickly, since you'd probably get wear between the driving ring and the shock absorber. It's a thought, at least!

[LegoLord1880]

57 minutes ago, 2GodBDGlory said:

 

Looks like the sharing settings on that aren't set up properly; it's not giving me permission to view it.

Ok, I fixed the permissions so anyone with the link can see the picture. I think your setup would work, but it's not compact enough for my liking. Wear between the driving ring and shock absorber raises some concern. Nice username!

Edited January 11 by LegoLord1880
fixed some bad wording

[2GodBDGlory]

2 hours ago, LegoLord1880 said:

Ok, I fixed the permissions so anyone with the link can see the picture. I think your setup would work, but it's not compact enough for my liking. Wear between the driving ring and shock absorber raises some concern. Nice username!

Thanks!
One thing I wonder about is whether or not it would work to just set it up so that sliding those selector forks would require sliding an axle through an axlehole, just to add some friction. It shouldn't be hard to implement, but I guess the question is just whether that much friction would limit the fast shifting you're looking for.

You could easily swap for the old style of 2L driving ring with its friction axle joiner (you'd also have to go to old 16T gears then), or new 3L rings, though. What advantage were you hoping to get from these new ones?

[LegoLord1880]

49 minutes ago, 2GodBDGlory said:

 

You could easily swap for the old style of 2L driving ring with its friction axle joiner (you'd also have to go to old 16T gears then), or new 3L rings, though. What advantage were you hoping to get from these new ones?

I would go for that, but I only have one old style 2L driving ring and only 2 gray 16t transmission gears. Also, I don't like how they can hold position between neutral or in gear. I guess Lego's parts designers 35 years ago didn't think we'd expect so much from these pieces of plastic. Another reason I don't go with the old style is so I don't need a billion old style extensions to use 20t, 24t, or 12t transmission gears.

The thing with shifting a four speed fast is the up-right-up motion from second to third gear ends up being a diagonal motion, and I accidentally engage second and third at the same time. That or I move the stick too far on that first "up" motion and it goes into 1st gear. An instant downshift like that is a good way to break stuff, especially since I usually put reverse gears in the top-left position. 

[2GodBDGlory]

Hmm, that got me thinking of this design from @Gray Gear:

His design is optimized for a 6-speed, but it's got a clever sliding part to automatically prevent the gearbox from having multiple gears engaged at once. Could that work in your case?

[LegoLord1880]

I've tried that mechanism before but it takes up a lot of parts and space. It also can't keep the stick from coming out of gear. I think I'll adapt the mechanism from the Rebrickable link I posted.

Thanks

[Alex Ilea]

Not sure, but maybe the new 2L ring is compatible with the old 2L connector that could keep the old 2L ring in place?

[Aurorasaurus]

1 hour ago, Alex Ilea said:

Not sure, but maybe the new 2L ring is compatible with the old 2L connector that could keep the old 2L ring in place?

Nope :(

I tried that and was honestly confused why they didnt make it work with it.

[2GodBDGlory]

1 hour ago, Alex Ilea said:

Not sure, but maybe the new 2L ring is compatible with the old 2L connector that could keep the old 2L ring in place?

Yeah, there's not any little arm to catch on the inside, as on the previous driving rings.

3 hours ago, LegoLord1880 said:

I've tried that mechanism before but it takes up a lot of parts and space. It also can't keep the stick from coming out of gear. I think I'll adapt the mechanism from the Rebrickable link I posted.

Thanks

Yeah, that's true. The solution from Rebrickable does look fairly workable, at least!

[LegoLord1880]

18 hours ago, Aurorasaurus said:

Nope :(

I tried that and was honestly confused why they didnt make it work with it.

They didn't put in that little tab because it would interfere with the shift forks.

[Stereo]

Chainsaw teeth are 1 plate apart, maybe you could springload one against the round part of the shift fork to hold it in 3 positions.