Lost: Season 6 WARNING SPOILERS!

[JimBee]

I didn't like this episode that much. It felt like a "filler" episode, where the events had hardly anything to with the excitement and events of the rest of the season. And it being a Ben-centric episode... let's just say I'm liking the character less and less. Since the beginning of this season (admittedly with very little screen time compared to Season 2 and after), Ben's lost most of his traits that made him an interesting character- his deviousness, his tendency to lie... now he just seems... pathetic, and his lies aren't even close to being as clever as they used to be. The alternate universe parts of the episode were pretty pointless as well, besides highlighting facts that we already knew (except with the AU "twist").

So not that exciting, even with the cliffhanger. I was expecting Charles Widmore to come any time by now, as his involvement with the island seems like one of the biggest mysteries, especially since we've been given very little background info on this.

I did like the reference to Nikki and Paula from Season 2, though.

[def]

I did like the reference to Nikki and Paula from Season 2, though.

Season 3 (aka the filler season)?

I wasn't overly impressed either, it hurt momentum a lot. But, the scenes with Richard Alpert were amazing, and rescued the episode for.

I agree, Ben's turned into something else, kind of a middle-man on the island, in control of nothing.

From the AV Club review

http://www.avclub.com/articles/dr-linus,39051/

I’ve got a theory about Ben. Watching him manhandle the Dharma Initiative’s expensive machinery in order to access the “frozen donkey wheel,” and remembering how he told Locke earlier this season that he doesn’t know what “the smoke monster” is, I’m starting to think that Ben is like one of those guys in every office who knows how to make his computer do what he needs it to do, but doesn’t know why he’s doing it. In his time on the island, with and without The Hostiles, I think Ben has learned how to manipulate the devices of Dharma and the island, but he doesn’t really understand any of it. It’s all spit and bailing wire with him.

[Rufus]

Guys, I'm going to have to disagree with you here. Just seen this episode (we're 2-3 days behind in the UK), and I thought it was great - sure, not the best, but - finally - we have Ben's Redemption.

It's been coming - he's always been a bad guy, though I agree with the AVClub theory about him not knowing why he's doing what he's doing. I've always had the feeling Ben is a Darth Vader character - bad through and through, but I'll bet he'll be instrumental in the overthrow of evil in the end. Ben's 'turn' from following not-Locke to joining the 'good guys' on the beach, mirrored with his choosing Alex over power in the parallel world, wrapped it off nicely; meanwhile switching between Arnzt (if that's his name) in the parallel world and the Black Rock dynamite stuff was small-screen genius.

It looks like Jack is beginning to understand - presumably he's being 'groomed' to take over from Jacob?

I too liked the reference to Nikki and Paulo - I wondered when that loose end would be tied up, though how did Miles know they were buried alive? Did he 'speak' to them?

[JimBee]

Season 3 (aka the filler season)?

Blah blah blah. Yeah, that one. The best one.

Guys, I'm going to have to disagree with you here. Just seen this episode (we're 2-3 days behind in the UK), and I thought it was great - sure, not the best, but - finally - we have Ben's Redemption.

It's been coming - he's always been a bad guy, though I agree with the AVClub theory about him not knowing why he's doing what he's doing. I've always had the feeling Ben is a Darth Vader character - bad through and through, but I'll bet he'll be instrumental in the overthrow of evil in the end. Ben's 'turn' from following not-Locke to joining the 'good guys' on the beach, mirrored with his choosing Alex over power in the parallel world, wrapped it off nicely; meanwhile switching between Arnzt (if that's his name) in the parallel world and the Black Rock dynamite stuff was small-screen genius.

But now he's just so pathetic. And like that review (def's link) said, I felt like I already knew the facts presented about Ben in "Dr. Linus", and I don't need it drilled into my head by highlighting them with a mirror universe. The part at the beginning where Ben is accused of killing Jacob particularly bothered me- "H-h-h-h-e-e-e-s ly-lying! Wh-why would I k-kill J-jacob?". Pathetic.

I too liked the reference to Nikki and Paulo - I wondered when that loose end would be tied up, though how did Miles know they were buried alive? Did he 'speak' to them?

I was thinking about this, and came to the conclusion that this is probably the case. Miles wasn't on the island when they died, and I don't remember him talking about it to anyone who was.

But that brings up another question- Sun was present when Miles said this, and she was one of the people who buried them alive. I remember the charm of that episode, "Expose", was that in the end, Nikki and Paulo were paralyzed, not dead, but the gravediggers never found out. Yet Sun didn't say anything when Miles said that.

[def]

Ben's 'turn' from following not-Locke to joining the 'good guys' on the beach, mirrored with his choosing Alex over power in the parallel world, wrapped it off nicely;

But hadn't Ben been on Jacob's side all along? He was deceived into killing Jacob. I was a little confused by that whole thing... First, Jacob was a mystical presence in that magic shed, then later he was a guy on the beach with bodyguards. Some of the transitions from the Dharma Initiative to The Others and after that gets a little fuzzy for me. The time travel part is where I lost the flow.

[Legorski]

Has anyone though of it this way,

One of the "candidates" is Kwon, so we have no idea on wether it's Jin, Sun, both ... or possibly their child?

Totally unexpected and a odd twist, Maybe Jacob touched both of the Kwon's at their wedding to signify their child-to-be-born-on-the-island as one of his "candidates".

Hell, this came to me last night right before bed, might just be my delusional mind, I'm Crazy You Know! XD

Edited March 20, 2010 by Legorski

[Professor Flitwick]

Just watched Ab Aeterno (Latin for something 'From the beginning', or something similar), great episode! I had a theory that Jacobs touch will make Ben, The O6 and the others he's touched 'immortal', but it was punctured by the fact that Sawyer and Kate have both aged drastically from their encounter with Jacob. I now feel that it is caused by the touch of the Man in Black. Also, Recon and What Kate Does were both very bad episodes, considering how late we are in the shows run, we should be getting much higher quality episodes.

Also, if anyone wants them, I have a list of the following episodes and their centrics:

The Package - Sun/Jin

Happily Ever After - Desmond

Everybody Loves Hugo - Hurley

The Last Recruit - Jack (not %100 sure)

The Canditate - ???

Across the Sea - Jacob/Man in Black

What They Died For - ???

The End -???

Who is enjoying seeing Cindy, Lynn, Aldo, Charlotte, Liam etc again? I am!

[def]

I loved the Richard Alpert episode. Questions were not answered, but the overall mythology was extended, and the Black Rock (and Richard) got its origin story. As well, the mystery of the island deepened, who is really good,

vs. claiming they're good. Another eight hours or so left, let's hope they pull everything off.

[Legorski]

I loved the Richard Alpert episode. Questions were not answered, but the overall mythology was extended, and the Black Rock (and Richard) got its origin story. As well, the mystery of the island deepened, who is really good,

vs. claiming they're good. Another eight hours or so left, let's hope they pull everything off.

Loved the episode as well, and as stated, question were not answered on the contrary I now have more questions then ever, and remember "We all go to the hell"

[posades]

Loved the episode as well, and as stated, question were not answered on the contrary I now have more questions then ever, and remember "We all go to the hell"

I'll add to the "that episode was awesome" camp. Loved the back story of Richard (err Ricardo ), but the whole who is good versus evil thing is getting in my head now. That last line that Richard's wife said seemed important...maybe the people who thought they were all in purgatory was right?

[Legorski]

I'll add to the "that episode was awesome" camp. Loved the back story of Richard (err Ricardo ), but the whole who is good versus evil thing is getting in my head now. That last line that Richard's wife said seemed important...maybe the people who thought they were all in purgatory was right?

It's not purgatory, It's Hell.

But then again the fact that the Oceanic Six were off the island to their normal life sorta destroys that theory, that and the others being able to get off the island with the submarine in the earlier seasons.

Seems like Locke (or Flocke, or John-Locke's-looking-smoke-monster-dude, or smokey, or whatever you wish to call him) is at war with both Jacob (and co.) and Widmore (and co.) so is this war turning into a three-way or will Widmore join with Jacob (and co.)? Widmore mentioned that there wold be a war on the island, and that if he didn't go back that the wrong side would win, and since he's at war with Locke, either he's on Jacob's side or fending off on his own. The whole situation of the 'war' confuses me, hopefully things will clear up in the next episode, but thats not going to happen,

[def]

Episode 11, Happily Ever After, was possibly better than the Richard Alpert episode. It was so messed up, and had no sideways flash! Desmond was actually traveling. Again, so much stuff happened, it's hard to process it all. That's what TV recaps are for!

[Lepaka]

=O

Sayid, Jin and Sun! No!

[Professor Flitwick]

=O

Sayid, Jin and Sun! No!

You forgot Frank. It was such a sad episode, I had tears in my eyes. At least Sayid redeemed himself, Sun and Jin died together, and Frank played a kinda big part in his final appearance. As of yet. Actually, why haven't they put Lapidus in the Flash-sideways yet?

Also, the thread title says WARNING SPOILERS! so I don't think we need to spoiler tag everything.

Edited May 7, 2010 by professor flitwick

[JimBee]

Actually, why haven't they put Lapidus in the Flash-sideways yet?

Probably because he doesn't have a big enough part. They can only fit so much in, and frankly (hehe), there was never any mystery surrounding him. he just sorta tagged along with everyone else. As awesome of a character as he was though. Hopefully that actor will get more opportunities in the future.

But yeah, last week's episode was a huge shocker. I knew Sayid had it coming, but I always thought that Jin and Sun would've made it to the end. Maybe no one does...

[posades]

It was sad to see Sun and Jin go, but I agree with others that it was beautifully done, particularly the scene where their hands let go and it fades (not gonna lie, I got a little teary-eyed). As for Lapidus, talk about a lame way to die; I hadn't even realized he had died until someone mentioned it to me later. And Sayid's death I can't say was too disappointing, but I did like the way the writers redeemed him as good in the end.

My big question is how the flashsideways connect with the timeline on the island. Perhaps after the characters die on the island they go on to live their happy lives of the alternate reality?

[Professor Flitwick]

Probably because he doesn't have a big enough part. They can only fit so much in, and frankly (hehe), there was never any mystery surrounding him. he just sorta tagged along with everyone else. As awesome of a character as he was though. Hopefully that actor will get more opportunities in the future.

But yeah, last week's episode was a huge shocker. I knew Sayid had it coming, but I always thought that Jin and Sun would've made it to the end. Maybe no one does...

Well they could slip him in the FlashSidways piloting the plane, or being a passenger, like how they changed it for Desmond (and they should've done for Juliet). Doesn't have to be major, just there.

[Forresto]

Okay I havea theory about the MIB and Locke.

What if the MIB took over Locke back when Linus shot and shoved Locke into that pit with the bodies? Locke after that did seem a bit biter or at least meaner then he was. It would also explain how he got out of the pit.

[Professor Flitwick]

Okay I havea theory about the MIB and Locke.

What if the MIB took over Locke back when Linus shot and shoved Locke into that pit with the bodies? Locke after that did seem a bit biter or at least meaner then he was. It would also explain how he got out of the pit.

Nice, but Locke left the Island after that when he pushed the wheel. MIB is looking for a way off, he wouldn't of tried to get the Oceanic Six back, and try and escape again.

I do have a theory on the MIB. In 'The Man Behind the Curtain' in season three, Locke and Ben visit 'Jacobs Cabin'. There was a ring off ash around it. Locke hears the words 'help me'. Locke flicks on his torch, and all hell breaks loose as things start flying around.

We've seen the ash keeps the Smoke away, but what if this wasn't their to stop him getting in. What if it was to stop him getting in. Locke hears help me, who does he help by (albeit, inadvertently) giving him a body? The MIB. We've somewhat seen that Jacob wouldn't mind techknowledgey, as he allowed the Dharma Initiative in, so the MIB may no like it, and started to get mad. When they run out, Locke and/or Ben may have knocked away the ash, and MIB is loose.

The one flaw in this; Smokey was actively moving around way before.

[JimBee]

Well they could slip him in the FlashSidways piloting the plane, or being a passenger, like how they changed it for Desmond (and they should've done for Juliet). Doesn't have to be major, just there.

True, but maybe he isn't even dead. We only saw him get hit by the door, so he might still be alive. Either way, I'd rather have him as a surviving supporting character than Miles.

What I don't get is why the MIB went through all of that trouble just to get Locke's body. He sent him back and forth between the island and the real world, just to have him come back as a corpse. And then, he's not even using the corpse itself, but taking on the appearance of it. Why couldn't the MIB just use any corpse? There were plenty to go around on the Island, hundreds, even. The Others, the DHARMA, the 815ers... why did it have to be Locke or Christian?

[Professor Flitwick]

Why couldn't the MIB just use any corpse? There were plenty to go around on the Island, hundreds, even. The Others, the DHARMA, the 815ers... why did it have to be Locke or Christian?

I believe that they do normally disappear. I don't quite understand all the in's and out's, but when that Dharma lady said they had to bury the bodies, I believe that it was part of the truce between Dharma and the 'Hostiles', that all bodies must be buried, so that the MIB cannot take over them, but as for why he couldn't take them out of the pit I cannot say. Also remember Alex, Christain and Yemi (Eko's brother) where not buried, and their bodies disappeared, and all became manifestations of Smokey/MIB. Why could any of them be permanent? Well, I believe it's because they weren't Candidates, whereas Locke was.

And, I think Lapidus is dead, as much as it pains me to say. He was standing, what... six feet from the door? All that pressure from the water must of launched that door at him a couple of hundred miles an hour. Even if he survived that, he wouldn't be swimming out, and no one dragged him out, so I guess he's dead. Never know, Jacob could come back as him, with Lapidus being a hidden Candidate!

Edited May 8, 2010 by professor flitwick

[JimBee]

I believe that they do normally disappear. I don't quite understand all the in's and out's, but when that Dharma lady said they had to bury the bodies, I believe that it was part of the truce between Dharma and the 'Hostiles', that all bodies must be buried, so that the MIB cannot take over them, but as for why he couldn't take them out of the pit I cannot say. Also remember Alex, Christain and Yemi (Eko's brother) where not buried, and their bodies disappeared, and all became manifestations of Smokey/MIB. Why could any of them be permanent? Well, I believe it's because they weren't Candidates, whereas Locke was.

Ah, that's right. Thanks for that. I just hope they explain why buried bodies can't be taken over, and why Locke's body never disappeared.

[def]

I was sure the finale was tonight, but apparently it's this weekend. I was so expectantly waiting for it tonight, and I (easily) predicted Jack as Jacobs replacement to a co-worker.

[posades]

I was sure the finale was tonight, but apparently it's this weekend. I was so expectantly waiting for it tonight, and I (easily) predicted Jack as Jacobs replacement to a co-worker.

Yeah, the whole Jack-as-the-next-Jacob thing wasn't exactly a curveball. I dunno, to me this penultimate episode was surprisingly lacking in substance; sure we got Jack as the successor and a crappy death for Richard, but besides that I expected more from the last episode before the finale.

At least it was better than the cheesy "cave of light" episode with the weird flashback.

[JimBee]

I was sure the finale was tonight, but apparently it's this weekend. I was so expectantly waiting for it tonight, and I (easily) predicted Jack as Jacobs replacement to a co-worker.

I never took the producers of this show as the kind to do the typical thing, and I doubt they'll let me down. I predict that the finale will be the most unpredictable thing ever. Yet, I predict that Jack (and everyone else in the normal universe) will die.

I dunno, to me this penultimate episode was surprisingly lacking in substance; sure we got Jack as the successor and a crappy death for Richard, but besides that I expected more from the last episode before the finale.

Yeah, I agree. However, I think they were just setting things up for the grand finale by explaining a few last minute details. And agreed on Richard's death, that was not epic at all. No buildup of suspense, and the same exact thing that happened to all of those who stayed with Dogen.

At least it was better than the cheesy "cave of light" episode with the weird flashback.

I actually liked that episode. The stories behind Jacob and TMIB were finally revealed, both of which I found fascinating.

My hopes are set extremely high for the grand finale. I really hope it doesn't revolve around Widmore, Ben, or Penny. I'm hoping for it to mainly be about the characters we've had since the beginning, even deceased ones, with a plot revolving around Desmond and TMIB. I don't really know what to expect though. I'll be anticipating it greatly (and rewatching the first episode enhanced on Saturday).

Also, did anyone see the promo winner during the commercials? I thought it was really great, with the scenes put onto ocean-looking frames. I especially liked the scale with the dark/ light rocks at the end. That must've taken some serious editing skills if it was for a contest for regular people (e.g. people without the funds to have Hollywood effects).

Oh, and one last thing. A few weeks back, one of the promos showed the scene with Locke and Walt from Season 1, where Locke is explaining how to play that game (with the dark vs. light concept). Looks like the folks over at IGN were right about this plot stretching all the way back to the beginning.