LEGO Purism

[fallentomato]

After seeing the discussion this morning about a creation posted by the Brothers Brick that wasn't entirely made of LEGO it got me thinking about the phenomenon of LEGO purism. I was wondering what everyone here thought about it. So I've got a few questions for you all:

1) How do you define LEGO purity? What is allowed in a "pure" LEGO creation? Some things to consider are non-LEGO plastic elements (competitor brands and fan imitations) other non-LEGO materials (cloth sails, non-LEGO string, paper, cotton) , modified LEGO elements (cut, filed, painted or otherwise changed), stickers, specialized/<insert that tiresome argument> elements (BURPs, Bionicle pieces, chases and boat hulls etc.) and non-system themes (Belville/Scala, Duplo, Galidor, Clickts, etc.)

2) Are you a purist? That is, do your own creations live up to the purity standards you set forth in #1?

3) How do you feel about "impure" MOCs? Do you treat them differently? Avoid them all together? Treat them the same as any other MOC?

I'll avoid answering my own questions for right now, so my own opinions don't overwhelm the start of this thread. Also, you should check out the LEGO purity quiz if you haven't done it before.

Edited July 30, 2009 by fallentomato

[Captain Green Hair]

I always try to use Lego as much as possible.

99,9% of the time, luckily there is a Lego solution.

If however i can not find a Lego solution for that 0,01%, i do not hesitate to cheat a little for the good of the MOC.

For example custom sails and rope just look too good on a sailing ship, and then there is the 2 times a year i modify a brick.

[cole]

1) I'd say anything made by lego, rubber bands, string, duplo ect. is purist. using sharpie, scissors or your own string would be customizing.

2) I would think of myself as a purist, even though I have used sand paper, scissors and sharpie before, most of my mocs and figures are purrist.

3) I like seeing custom things, it's definitly hard to do and should get the same amount of attention.

And that link isn't working for me, says page can't be displayed.

Edited July 30, 2009 by cole

[Mr Spielbrick]

Whew... This could become an interesting discussion!

Basically, LEGO purism means to me: using only what The LEGO Company has created/sold, without tampering with it (brasso etc). So elastic bands and sails fit into the purist kingdom. Even Technic, Bionicle, Duplo (I guess) and Galidor.

Personally I only use LEGO System stuff.

As for the "rules"... It's a toy, there are no rules! Just because I prefer to work with LEGO System bricks and figs, doesn't mean I don't enjoy seeing custom made figs. There are some extremely talented people out there who create lovely work. Half the time it looks even better than what TLC themselves make. I suck at customising, so I myself don't attempt it and stick to "official" stuff for my own creations.

[HumanPackMule]

I consider myself to be a purist.

[CP5670]

1: It should be something that TLG could in principle make into an actual set with the current brick palette. That means no clone pieces, third party pieces or illegal techniques.

2: In terms of illegal techniques, yes, but I'm open to anything else. The main thing I want to have in my MOCs is long-term strength and stability, without losing the ability to modify them (so no gluing). Part mods are fine if they are done professionally and look like official pieces, but I can't manage that so I don't mod anything myself. In the past I avoided clone brands for quality reasons, but Lego no longer has a clear advantage there and there are some useful clone parts out there that don't exist in Lego.

3: The same as any other MOC. I can always appreciate a good creation, even if it's not something I would make myself.

[Sandy]

I myself like to use only official LEGO pieces in my LEGO creations, but that doesn't mean I can't appreciate mixed media and such done by someone else.

There's just a fine line as to when something can be called a LEGO creation. If there's too many "outside influences" in it, it's just not LEGO anymore. That's why I frown upon MOCs that feature a large amount of eg. Megabloks, but are still titled as LEGO creations.

That applies to the robot on the link in the first post, too. It's a nice creation, for sure, but it's in the borderline of what I would call a LEGO creation.

[fallentomato]

And that link isn't working for me, says page can't be displayed.

Fixed!

1: It should be something that TLG could in principle make into an actual set with the current brick palette.

So how do you feel about old pieces that are no longer in production?

[CP5670]

So how do you feel about old pieces that are no longer in production?

I should have probably phrased that better. I meant the entire catalog of Lego pieces up to now, both past and present.

[Captain Green Hair]

Took the test and scored a 7.45 out of 10, while i rated myself an 8 at the beginning, not bad i'd say.

[Commander Flash]

I am 99.8% purist. There is a once in a blue moon chance I use a decal. I never use: Sculpey, clone brands, custom weapons or accessories, or paint on a figure.

[fallentomato]

Took the test and scored a 7.45 out of 10, while i rated myself an 8 at the beginning, not bad i'd say.

Yeah... I got a 0.00/10, which is strange, because there were a couple things I was "iffy" about so you think I'd at least get a 0.02 It's true though, I am very permissive and never hesitate to cut/file/paint pieces and while I don't actively seek out off-brand pieces I have accumulated a fair amount and they find their way into my creations every now and then. There are some great sectional couch pieces (I think they are Tyco) that I have used in my movies on numerous occasions.

[Matn]

8.02/10, that's what I got. I'll answer to your questions;

1) How do you define LEGO purity? LEGO purity is for me only using elements designed by LEGO. So, not using any other things. No BrickArms or Brickforge, no custom decals, no painting, no other brands, no strings or so.

2) Are you a purist? I am. Well, I was. Err... I always considered myself to be a purist. But when I realised LEGO would never release other LEGO Harry Potter figures, my decision was made: I will make my own decals; but I'll never go any further. I'm trying the whole decal thing, it's working out fine. However, I painted a couple of pieces for the MCWcontest, but I'll never do it again. Now, onto customizers who sell their stuff: I was always standing sceptic against it. But now I think it's just fine. The animals made by BrickForge look outstanding, clean and simple, fitting with the LEGO horse, something that wouldn't happen if LEGO produces them. So, I will never go further than making my own decals and applying them or perhaps buying something of BrickForge. Using other brands? It's tempting, but no, never. Why am I tempted? Because other brands have some great accesoires!

3) How do you feel about "impure" MOCs? I am always impressed by great customized figures, they can look fantastic. When I see a MOC uses other brands, well... If that person thinks it's alright, then so it be. It's their own decision. Let's face it, sometimes using other brands can look pretty good. Strings and self-made sails; I'm really fine with that. It's hard to make fantastic ships and LEGO doesn't produce these things, so it's really obvious when there's no other option. Impure MOCs can be good, if worked out well.

Edited July 30, 2009 by Matn

[Modulex Guy]

I consider myself 90% purist.

I do like some of the custom elements such as BrickArms and Brickforge and custom made figs, but I rarely buy them.

I build with official LEGO elements and are completely un-modified.

I do occasionally make a custom sticker for a sign, and buy aftermarket pneumatic tubing because its stronger and less likely to crack due to age.

MegaBlocks = Blasphemy!

[Athos]

If its not officially produced by the Lego Company, then I don't use it. I have been known, however, to use some prototype pieces that are available on bricklink (i.e. red wizard hats, black wizard beards, white hair, etc.). I have also been sorely tempted by the BF animals...

The part selection that Lego produces are the pallet that we have to work with and we see what we can do with it. Or another metaphor, the parts we have are like the rules in the game. Modifying the parts is like breaking the rules.

Any modification feels like cheating to me.

Steve

[Peppermint_M]

I consider a purist to be someone overly fussy about things of, lets face it, a childs toy.

I am not a purist. I use whatever I need or want to get the desired effect. In fact the quiz rates me 0.47/10

How can MOCs be impure?

They are your own creation...

I think it's a big fuss over nothing, tbh. I am putting my non-Lego into a different box to avoid mixing them. I buy all brands of building brick, just to see what they are like.

[prateek]

I'm not purist since I've used Megabloks and BTR before with my LEGO. I've tried making customs but I fialed miserably

[fallentomato]

The part selection that Lego produces are the pallet that we have to work with and we see what we can do with it. Or another metaphor, the parts we have are like the rules in the game. Modifying the parts is like breaking the rules.

That's one way to look at it. I guess building with LEGO is more of an artistic expression than a game for me, so there's no way to cheat. Also, breaking the rules can be fun and sometimes leads to the best art. But I do understand the desire to limit oneself to the LEGO parts, because I too feel that I get most creative when I have some limitations to work within. That's why I love building alternate models for sets.

I am not a purist. I use whatever I need or want to get the desired effect. In fact the quiz rates me 0.47/10

Woohoo! Sounds like we have similar opinions. What's the opposite of a LEGO purist? A LEGO heathen?

[Eilif]

1) Purism: The standard of building a creation using only unaltered elements produced bty LEGO.

2) Am I a purist? No. I use a some clone elements (Tyco 1x3 "shingled" roof slopes are a favorite) and some clone accessories (Enlighten chrome sabers and brown bandanas). I also use aftermarket weapons (BF, BA, etc) and Brickforge scooters. I've also altered elements at times, and used custom decals. I don't do it much, and most folks who see my layout can't immidiately tell, but I'm definitely not a purist.

3) How do I feel about it? I like Purist, Clone, and Mixed MOCs and I even regularly check in at the clone brick forum. As for the display of clone MOCs, if there's just a bit of clone stuff mixed, in I don't care, but if there is alot, then it's a good idea to mentioned it.

One common hipocrisy I have noticed is that alot of folks have no problem with a MOC filled with custom decals and Brickarms, but as soon as they notice Megabloks pieces they get indignant.

[Siegfried]

1) How do you define LEGO purity? For the most part anything made by TLG, but some lines have pushed the boundaries there.

2) Are you a purist? Yes. I'm actually one of the high end wankers who, for example, dislikes using minifig parts in MOCs. (Yes I know TLG have done it themselves once or twice.)

3) How do you feel about "impure" MOCs? I admire them in some ways, but in most cases I don't get them. I just don't see the point. Once you have the attitude of "why have rules on MY work?!" you might as well have the attitude of "why not bring out the welder?". Where does it stop? To me it's like restoring an old warbird. By the end often under half of the original plane is left... so is it really a WWII plane? Have you restored it or rebuilt it? In the case of a warbird there is no choice; it's either a heap of rust or you replace. In the case of LEGO there is a choice, and I choose to stick with LEGO when building LEGO. Anything else seems more like kitbashing to me.

Thanks fallentomato for the link; I don't recall that test. I was surprised by my result though; I got 7.39...

Took the test and scored a 7.45 out of 10, while i rated myself an 8 at the beginning, not bad i'd say.

...and I would have expected to get more than him! Looking at the overall results, I think my tolerance of Belville, Scala, Bionicle, ZNAP and Modulex hurt my case!

If its not officially produced by the Lego Company, then I don't use it. I have been known, however, to use some prototype pieces that are available on bricklink (i.e. red wizard hats, black wizard beards, white hair, etc.). I have also been sorely tempted by the BF animals...

Me too, but so far I've resisted. The recent release of the cows made life a bit easier!

[Emperor Claudius Rome]

2) Are you a purist? Yes. I'm actually one of the high end wankers who, for example, dislikes using minifig parts in MOCs.

What do you mean by that?

Anyways:

1) Somebody who only uses TLG official parts.

2) Kinda. I mean, I haven't done anything to customize Lego yet. But I plan on using these "Purple Islanders" decals Cap. Kirk made. And I also might order Brickarms or brickforge in the future,

3) Everybody has their own creations. So I don't care if it's using Unoffcial Lego bricks, aslong as it's good.

[Siegfried]

What do you mean by that?

Taking hands out of minifigs and using them as gun monopods, using legs as the top of cupboards, that kind of stuff. To me those pieces are broken once disassembled.

[salty tbone]

I am definitely a purist, but I certainly appreciate the skill of all MOCs and the attraction to high-quality "after-market" parts.

And I have bought other brands (I don't mix them), most recently being the new Halo sets, to see how they compare with Lego.

[Svelte]

Taking hands out of minifigs and using them as gun monopods, using legs as the top of cupboards, that kind of stuff. To me those pieces are broken once disassembled.

I completely agree with you; I don't like disassembling minifig torsoes and legs as it damages the parts, which seems 'illegal' to me. (I will very occasionally change minifig hands from flesh to yellow or vice versa, but only as a last resort).

What about instances where parts that previously came assembled now come separately, like the 2 turntable pieces or the bicycle chassis and separate wheels released in 09 sets like City Corner or the Camper? I think anyone who has tried to disassemble turntable pieces would be able to feel the piece stressing as you try and pop them apart. Would that mean the separate pieces now released are OK, but it isn't purist to disassemble them from sets where they originally came attached?

I generally consider myself a purist (although I do cut tubing!) but anything that Lego produces or has produced is OK to use - whether cardboard backdrops, the old elastic band holders, Duplo, Bionicle, Galidor, Scala etc. I don't really consider Modulex a purist substance as it isn't designed to connect with the system (whereas Technic pieces and Duplo obviously were.) I don't have any desire to use clone bricks, as much as for having no wish to waste money on dodgy brands as for Athos' reason to keep within 'the rules' of the system!

I don't really have a problem with their use, but to be honest I find a lot of the custom pieces produced by BrickArms or BrickForge tiresome in their exhaustive detail. I'm not a military builder in the slightest, and the desire to produce an infinite catalogue of weaponry whether based on real arms or fantastic ones, doesn't really fit with the spirit of Lego as I see it. Transforming populations of civilian minifigs into merciless killers by outfitting them with ever-more elaborate submachine guns, bayonets, grenades, ammunition packs and so on, is just not something that appeals to me. The extremely fine level of sculpted detail on some of these parts doesn't really seem to fit with Lego's design house-style.

[Siegfried]

I will very occasionally change minifig hands from flesh to yellow or vice versa, but only as a last resort)

Me too. My Walrus is actually a custom. But if I change something it's going to be like that for a long time!

What about instances where parts that previously came assembled now come separately, like the 2 turntable pieces or the bicycle chassis and separate wheels released in 09 sets like City Corner or the Camper?

The turntables are an annoyance to me. I try to use my pre-assembled ones in preference, and I've never dissembled one. I find it especially annoying how many of the creator instructions assume the turntables are still disassembled, forcing you to work around it or break them again.