I loved Technic growing up and really wished I still had the sets that were sold in an auction by one of my stepdads. Anyway, I now have two youngsters and my son has just moved onto the standard lego and so Daddy gets to start playing with legos again...Yeah.

I just recently bought the 8183 but wasn't super impressed as it was either fully left, center or fully right when steering and also stop or full speed for the throttle (no digital proportional at all) plus it was just to small for me. Next, I bought the 8146 (nitro muscle) and really like the size but it does not have any RC stuff (motor, controller, etc).

Now, I would like to try a real RC Car or Truck and don't want to spend more than about $200 (used or new). I believe that NXT is really the only way to go for RC but PLEASE advise. I have been thinking about maybe buying the 8297 (off-roader) and adding power functions to it or maybe I just need to wait to actually buy a NXT set first.

QUESTION.....

1. Is there a decent LEGO set that one can buy that already has good rc function. If so, let's hear it? If not, suggestions?

thanks

If I had a choice between using Lego NXT or Power Functions (PF) for REMOTE CONTROL vehicles, I'd pick PF every time for these reasons:

1) The motors are more powerful and compact (see Philo's excellent Power Functions Presentation and Technic Motors comparison at http://philohome.com/tech.htm ).

2) It's much more "user friendly"; one can just "build and go" without having to learn NXT programming .

3) There's EXPANDIBILITY with PF (one can just keep adding PF Battery Boxes and PF Receivers to make more complex MOCs; this is difficult to do with $100+ NXT bricks).

Check out Blakbird's Technicopedia at http://www.ericalbrecht.com/technic/ to find a set you like. Most of the Power Functions sets are available on eBay or at Bricklink ( http://www.bricklink.com ). Just type in the set number and see what pops up.

Edited February 15, 201015 yr by dluders

If you want to make a cool truck/car chassis using Power Functions parts, see the "Basic 2-Axle Chassis Construction" instructions available at the "Hard Truck Contest" website http://www.doublebrick.com/htc . Be sure to scroll down to the bottom-center of that page. The vehicle is very nimble, and you can build your own body on top of the chassis.

If I had a choice between using Lego NXT or Power Functions (PF) for REMOTE CONTROL vehicles, I'd pick PF every time for these reasons:

1) The motors are more powerful and compact (see Philo's excellent Power Functions Presentation and Technic Motors comparison at http://philohome.com/tech.htm ).

2) It's much more "user friendly"; one can just "build and go" without having to learn NXT programming .

3) There's EXPANDIBILITY with PF (one can just keep adding PF Battery Boxes and PF Receivers to make more complex MOCs; this is difficult to do with $100+ NXT bricks).

Check out Blakbird's Technicopedia at http://www.ericalbrecht.com/technic/ to find a set you like. Most of the Power Functions sets are available on eBay or at Bricklink ( http://www.bricklink.com ). Just type in the set number and see what pops up.

This is a great start especially when wanting to decide between PF and NXT. As for Blackbird's that is also a great start. Thanks.

These are all a great start and I really appreciate it. After looking at some of the Technic kits does anyone know of one right off hand that does not include the Power functions but can where it can be easily added?

QUESTION.....

1. Is there a decent LEGO set that one can buy that already has good rc function. If so, let's hear it? If not, suggestions?

The 8275 bulldozer comes to mind, and this year's 8043 excavator will be fully RC too. Some other good choices are 8475 and 8366, but those are older sets that could get expensive on ebay and Bricklink, and they also used an RF system that is not compatible with the PF receivers.

These are all a great start and I really appreciate it. After looking at some of the Technic kits does anyone know of one right off hand that does not include the Power functions but can where it can be easily added?

Many sets have instructions to add a motor in some way, but not for a full RC vehicle setup with two motors. You can always modify the sets yourself to motorize the steering and drive, but I'm not sure if any set has a particularly simple way to do it.

One can motorize the Lego #8297 Off Roader set with either NXT items or Power Functions. Check out the "NXT 4WD with Operational Dashboard" and "Pimped 8297 Off Roader" on the website http://www.bouwvoorbeelden.nl/home_eng.htm . The 8297 set is available for $120-$130 on eBay or Bricklink.

Han's Technic site http://www.designer-han.nl/lego/original%20modifications.htm has mods to the #8258 Crane Truck (which is an expensive set but has Power Functions elements already).

8376 is the way to go. try to find one. everything you need is in one box.

Keep em coming this is great. I am starting to get a vision.....:> :> There are some really good ideas here plus the links to sites are really helpful. Thanks...

Edited February 17, 201015 yr by tazmanian

8376 is the way to go. try to find one. everything you need is in one box.

I really looked at this and was excited because it is an RF based car but because the base is really just a base and

not modular it is more of what I would think of as a throw away car, right? My other question to anyone

who might have one is ....is it proportional (aka. when you go forward you have increments and not just 100% for the throttle).

Looks like a really great car, though. Thanks a bunch for the input and this might be a good side car for the sidelines..

I have the #8376 (Hot Flame RC Car) from 2003-2004, and no it is not modular. This 244-part kit is a stand-along RC car that is difficult to use in other MOCs. It is a pre-Power Functions model that is "fun" but can't be modified much. It can be run outside, though, and doesn't have the 15-foot infrared signal limitation that regular Power Functions (PF) equipment have. Sometimes the PF infrared signal gets affected by strong sunlight. Some guy made a video of the car at http://www.mefeedia.com/video/28414826 .

If you like ROCK CRAWLERS and trucks, check out the Brick Truck Trial website http://www.bricktrucktrial.com/ . There are several cars that have links to Brickshelf folders with detailed sequences of photographs to build their trucks. Be sure to check out the "Portal Axle" concept for raising the truck chassis high above the axles.

Edited February 17, 201015 yr by dluders

the 8376 goes as fast as you pull the trigger . just like a regular rc car. i would think it would be more powerful than a power function car to.

Edited February 17, 201015 yr by eric87

the 8376 goes as fast as you pull the trigger . just like a regular rc car. i would think it would be more powerful than a power function car to.

According to Philo's "Lego 9V Technic Motors Compared Characteristics" webpage http://philohome.com/motors/motorcomp.htm , the "Electric RC Race Buggy Motor" (Peeron 5292) is "Very powerful, it also consumes a lot of energy. Not recommended for use with a RCX which can't deliver the current needed by this beast. The innermost shaft hole is geared up by a 23/17 factor. Only the outermost output is tested below." The Power Functions XL is even more powerful than that: "Actuated by the same core as NXT motors, it rotates slightly faster (less internal gear reduction)." The PF XL motor is still #1 among all Lego 9V motors ever made.

Edited February 18, 201015 yr by dluders

According to Philo's "Lego 9V Technic Motors Compared Characteristics" webpage http://philohome.com/motors/motorcomp.htm , the "Electric RC Race Buggy Motor" (Peeron 5292) is "Very powerful, it also consumes a lot of energy. Not recommended for use with a RCX which can't deliver the current needed by this beast. The innermost shaft hole is geared up by a 23/17 factor. Only the outermost output is tested below." The Power Functions XL is even more powerful than that: "Actuated by the same core as NXT motors, it rotates slightly faster (less internal gear reduction)." The PF XL motor is still #1 among all Lego 9V motors ever made.

Actually, the RC motor is in fact the most powerful one. You can see that its mechanical power at 9V is 2.38W, as opposed to 2.21W for the XL. However, it spins much faster and you will need to gear it down a lot for most purposes, which is less efficient than the internal gearing that motors have, so in practice I think they will be roughly the same.

Edited February 18, 201015 yr by CP5670

Actually, the RC motor is in fact the most powerful one. You can see that its mechanical power at 9V is 2.38W, as opposed to 2.21W for the XL. However, it spins much faster and you will need to gear it down a lot for most purposes, which is less efficient than the internal gearing that motors have, so in practice I think they will be roughly the same.

Well, I suppose that you're technically correct. "Power" is measured in Watts, so the RC motor is "more powerful" than the Power Functions (PF) XL motor. HOWEVER, in regards to the all-important TORQUE category, the #5292 RC motor has 2.48 Newton-centimeters of torque vs. 14.5 N.cm for the PF XL motor. Since the #5292 RC motor has only 33% efficiency at 9 volts (vs. 45% for the PF XL motor), the bottom-line torque output is what folks see.

When my son built a whirling battlebot weapon with the RC motor, it sure would spin fast but when it encountered an obstruction, it would activate the current-limiter on the PF Receiver unit or on the RC motor itself so that it wouldn't burn up. He didn't have a similar problem hooking up a PF XL motor against the same obstruction.

ANYWAY, there's no question that the PF XL motor is MORE COMPACT, more versatile, and easier to use than the bigger RC motor.

Well, I suppose that you're technically correct. "Power" is measured in Watts, so the RC motor is "more powerful" than the Power Functions (PF) XL motor. HOWEVER, in regards to the all-important TORQUE category, the #5292 RC motor has 2.48 Newton-centimeters of torque vs. 14.5 N.cm for the PF XL motor. Since the #5292 RC motor has only 33% efficiency at 9 volts (vs. 45% for the PF XL motor), the bottom-line torque output is what folks see.

When my son built a whirling battlebot weapon with the RC motor, it sure would spin fast but when it encountered an obstruction, it would activate the current-limiter on the PF Receiver unit or on the RC motor itself so that it wouldn't burn up. He didn't have a similar problem hooking up a PF XL motor against the same obstruction.

ANYWAY, there's no question that the PF XL motor is MORE COMPACT, more versatile, and easier to use than the bigger RC motor.

There is a tradeoff between torque and speed though. You can't directly compare the torque outputs of two motors that run at different speeds, since you can always change the torque by using gearing. The 5292 motor compensates for its lower torque with a much greater speed and is meant to be geared down when used in models, like the old 2838 motor.

But yeah, I agree that the XL is still a better choice for almost any purpose. It has a much more convenient shape and is cheaper to get these days too.

Edited February 18, 201015 yr by CP5670

This is pretty exciting as we are getting pretty technical but after reading the above this brings up a good point and I must venture to ask:

Since it appears that the lego power functions are only for use withing 15 feet than is there anything that lego currently carries that is RF or goes further than 15 feet?? 15 feet is great for close range but the best for say a race car.

This is pretty exciting as we are getting pretty technical but after reading the above this brings up a good point and I must venture to ask:

Since it appears that the lego power functions are only for use withing 15 feet than is there anything that lego currently carries that is RF or goes further than 15 feet?? 15 feet is great for close range but the best for say a race car.

Well, of course things are getting TECHNIC-al HiTechnic ( http://www.hitechnic.com/home?lang=en-us&target=d24.html ) makes Lego-certified electronic components for NXT robots. One can use a Power Functions remote to control NXT, but I don't believe that the RANGE of the infrared signal is any greater. One could use Bill Shaw's Inanimate Reason RC servo integration kit ( http://inanimatereason.com and http://www.bricklink.com/storeDetail.asp?p...mp;itemStatus=U ) to control a Lego vehicle with regular RC components. The Brinklink is http://www.bricklink.com/store.asp?p=InanimateReason ; be sure to click on the "Show All Custom Items" link at the left edge of that webpage.

You don't need special hardware to fit non-LEGO servos into a LEGO MOC:

Se more photos of this MOC here: http://lotekbricks.blogspot.com/2001/04/rckillough.html

But you can't get proportional steering/power this way, the polarity switches are either on or off. Adding more non-LEGO hardware can solve this. When I used this system back in 2001 I was trying to find someone who could build a custom "servo" that took the signal from the receiver and controlled a 9V output instead, that way it could have been proportional. But I could not find anyone, not that I put that much energy into it...

Well, of course things are getting TECHNIC-al HiTechnic ( http://www.hitechnic.com/home?lang=en-us&target=d24.html ) makes Lego-certified electronic components for NXT robots. One can use a Power Functions remote to control NXT, but I don't believe that the RANGE of the infrared signal is any greater. One could use Bill Shaw's Inanimate Reason RC srervo integration kit ( http://inanimatereason.com and http://www.bricklink.com/storeDetail.asp?p...mp;itemStatus=U ) to control a Lego vehicle with regular RC components. The Brinklink is http://www.bricklink.com/store.asp?p=InanimateReason ; be sure to click on the "Show All Custom Items" link at the left edge of that webpage.

I like the servo idea which could get me the proportional steering but that still leaves the distance problem.......hmm

You don't need special hardware to fit non-LEGO servos into a LEGO MOC:

Se more photos of this MOC here: http://lotekbricks.blogspot.com/2001/04/rckillough.html

But you can't get proportional steering/power this way, the polarity switches are either on or off. Adding more non-LEGO hardware can solve this. When I used this system back in 2001 I was trying to find someone who could build a custom "servo" that took the signal from the receiver and controlled a 9V output instead, that way it could have been proportional. But I could not find anyone, not that I put that much energy into it...

That's great :> :> I hate to say it but this reminds me of my bailing wire and duck tape days.

Bodging is the artform that will keep us alive after the apocalypse. ;)

Ok so I have learned quite a bit from this topic and that there are more than one way to "skin a deer" even in the lego world. With that I will do some more looking but be expecting to see a new topic a bit more about this whole RF (Radio Frequency) IR (Infra Red) thing. Lego is a great product but they need to come out with more a standard RF set so that people can use it for racing and other things that require a bit more distance than just 15 feet crazy feet.

This might be usefull: I created a RC sportscar with complete detailed step-by-step instructions. Although it's not for sale, it might give you some good ideas.

You can download instructions from my brickshelf page.

More info can be found at my MOC-Page.

Good luck and happy building !!