Oky Posted February 10, 2011 Posted February 10, 2011 Hmm...doesn't always seem to be too childish: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9TP7PB-E3M Uhm, the first clip was censored, proving KDM's point, and the second clip doesn't even mean anything. Yes, he's indeed in the next episode. Here's the link. Wow, he looks nothing like Tarkin. Sorry for this outburst, but... Stop it with the fan-service already!! Quote
Brickadeer Posted February 10, 2011 Posted February 10, 2011 (edited) Uhm, the first clip was censored, proving KDM's point, and the second clip doesn't even mean anything. Well, the second clip contains a sexual component. Children are very unlikely to recognize this point. And the fact that the scene was censored clearly doesn't prove that CW was designed as a kid's series. Edited February 10, 2011 by Brickadeer Quote
The Legonater Posted February 10, 2011 Posted February 10, 2011 Stop it with the fan-service already!! Fan-service? What fan service? The only thing I see them giving fans is dissapointment. Quote
sok117 Posted February 10, 2011 Posted February 10, 2011 Fan-service? What fan service? The only thing I see them giving fans is dissapointment. I'm actually going to remain hopeful for this one, although Greedo was a big upset, I don't know all that much about Tarkin, so I'm okay, but I hope they make him cold and calculating. Quote
The Legonater Posted February 10, 2011 Posted February 10, 2011 I'm actually going to remain hopeful for this one, although Greedo was a big upset, I don't know all that much about Tarkin, so I'm okay, but I hope they make him cold and calculating. Well there's another giant gash in EU. He was a governor in that time- Leia even referanced that in Ep.4. Making him a captain is pathetic. Does this make it a little more distressing? Quote
sok117 Posted February 10, 2011 Posted February 10, 2011 Does this make it a little more distressing? not really as I have already stated I am not familiar with Tarkins back story, so any story they can come up with may go well with me, so I am once again going to remain hopeful. Quote
Oky Posted February 10, 2011 Posted February 10, 2011 Fan-service? What fan service? The only thing I see them giving fans is dissapointment. They keep throwing in OT characters (and even dead PT characters) just to keep the OT fans interested, regardless of whether they end up ruining the character or not. Seriously, I wouldn't be surprised if we see a kid Han Solo too at some point too. Quote
The Legonater Posted February 11, 2011 Posted February 11, 2011 They keep throwing in OT characters (and even dead PT characters) just to keep the OT fans interested, regardless of whether they end up ruining the character or not. Seriously, I wouldn't be surprised if we see a kid Han Solo too at some point too. Well they were going to have him on Kashyyyk in RotS. If they wind up getting to that point, Lucas will probably push for that. Quote
commanderneyo Posted February 11, 2011 Posted February 11, 2011 (edited) Well according to Brickdoctor they are not screwing up Tarkins backstory (Though that remains to be seen) Wookieepedia said:he and his brother Gideon joined the Republic Outland Regions Security Force, a military policing force that kept the Outland Regions, a Rim area that included Eriadu, safe from piracy. Tarkin was a fast riser who achieved the rank of commander Edited February 11, 2011 by commanderneyo Quote
Brickadeer Posted February 11, 2011 Posted February 11, 2011 (edited) Now that I've seen the commentary for this last episode, I think I may get why these episodes are so... screwy. Filoni seems to be implying that this whole arc is a "dream" of sorts, equating it to the tree on Dagobah. All of this is intended to give Obi-Wan, Ashoka and Annakin a glimpse of the future. Which would imply that none of this is real. At least I hope that is what Filoni is saying. If none of this is real, THEN the symbolism is okay with me. And yes, I DO get the symbolism. So I'll see what this week's episode brings. The commentary gives me hope that they aren't changing canon with completely new force users who underpin our whole understanding of the force. I don't really think so. At the very beginning of Clone Wars, when Asoka was introduced, Yoda told Obi Wan that the big question was if Anakin would be able and willing to let her go. Later in the series, Luminara asked him pretty much the same question. She asked him the general question if we was prepared to let Askoa go if her time has come. Anakin didn't answer this question; was he said in fact was that he was not prepared to let her go at this point of time or in this particular case. And in the Mortis-Arc the self character trait is displayed again. It has not become clear, though, if it is really love for his friends or selfishness, which means that he doesn't want to loose them because he doesn't want to be alone or because he doesn't want to feel guilt again like it was the case with his mother's death. Whatever trait it is, it is precisely this trait that will be exploited by Papatine to turn Anakin to the dark side. Luke, on the other hand, displayed true love for his friends; in EP5, he wanted to rescue them simply because he felt that this was the right thing to do. So unlike it was the case with Anakin, there were no different possible motives. However, it shades some light on Yoda's behaviour not to let him go to rescue his friends; thus, the question may be asked if he didn't display some kind of selfishness as well. What he had in mind was a purpose for Luke: becoming a de facto tool to destroy Vader and the Emperor, and the feeling behind this purpose was fear, definitely a dark feeling, the fear that the dark side could ultimately triumph. But Luke didn't stay on Dagobah; he simply did what he felt was right, so he trusted his feelings and in doing so he trusted in the Force to guide his actions, not in his believes about what ought to be done. In this arc, it is clear that Anakin has made a step towards the dark side in revealing that he is more driven by his selfishness - being with Padme and his friends - than other motives; and in advancing this goal, he will be ultimately driven by his pragmatism (that was displayed in this show several times, e. g. when he tortured a person to get information or stabbed another in the back to save Obi Wan and Satine) and ultimately not hesitate to join the dark side. Edited February 11, 2011 by Brickadeer Quote
The Legonater Posted February 11, 2011 Posted February 11, 2011 Well according to Brickdoctor they are not screwing up Tarkins backstory (Though that remains to be seen) Ah, but how about this: Tarkin gained increasing stature as a vocal supporter of Palpatine and received notice as the Seswenna sector's governor throughout the Clone Wars. In the last days of the Clone Wars' date=' Palpatine appointed Tarkin as the first Moff. Quote
commanderneyo Posted February 11, 2011 Posted February 11, 2011 Ah, but how about this: Yes but it might not screw with his backstory, it all depends what time of the Clone Wars his appearance will be based off, personally though I agree it probably will ruin his backstory. Quote
The Legonater Posted February 11, 2011 Posted February 11, 2011 Yes but it might not screw with his backstory, it all depends what time of the Clone Wars his appearance will be based off, personally though I agree it probably will ruin his backstory. No, it doesn't depend at all- in that quote it clearly says he's a govenor throught the entire Clone Wars. Quote
BrickArtist Posted February 12, 2011 Posted February 12, 2011 That was an absolute treat to read, brickadeer. Woderfully put, Quote
Brickadeer Posted February 12, 2011 Posted February 12, 2011 That was an absolute treat to read, brickadeer. Woderfully put, Thanks :) Quote
commanderneyo Posted February 12, 2011 Posted February 12, 2011 Here is the Preview for "The Citadel" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNAX8dX11rA Quote
commdr_neyo Posted February 12, 2011 Posted February 12, 2011 I just saw the latest episode, and although they did show muchin Anakins vision, they erased it later, so I don't think it will interfere with Ep.III. Anaking going darkside for moment was quite weird though, because when it happened in Ep.III, he wanted to kill Obi-Wan as soon as he saw him. After all, the episode was decent, but I think the next 3-part episodes will be weird. Quote
Spyderlord Posted February 12, 2011 Posted February 12, 2011 I don't really think so. At the very beginning of Clone Wars, when Asoka was introduced, Yoda told Obi Wan that the big question was if Anakin would be able and willing to let her go. Later in the series, Luminara asked him pretty much the same question. She asked him the general question if we was prepared to let Askoa go if her time has come. Anakin didn't answer this question; was he said in fact was that he was not prepared to let her go at this point of time or in this particular case. And in the Mortis-Arc the self character trait is displayed again. It has not become clear, though, if it is really love for his friends or selfishness, which means that he doesn't want to loose them because he doesn't want to be alone or because he doesn't want to feel guilt again like it was the case with his mother's death. Whatever trait it is, it is precisely this trait that will be exploited by Papatine to turn Anakin to the dark side. Luke, on the other hand, displayed true love for his friends; in EP5, he wanted to rescue them simply because he felt that this was the right thing to do. So unlike it was the case with Anakin, there were no different possible motives. However, it shades some light on Yoda's behaviour not to let him go to rescue his friends; thus, the question may be asked if he didn't display some kind of selfishness as well. What he had in mind was a purpose for Luke: becoming a de facto tool to destroy Vader and the Emperor, and the feeling behind this purpose was fear, definitely a dark feeling, the fear that the dark side could ultimately triumph. But Luke didn't stay on Dagobah; he simply did what he felt was right, so he trusted his feelings and in doing so he trusted in the Force to guide his actions, not in his believes about what ought to be done. In this arc, it is clear that Anakin has made a step towards the dark side in revealing that he is more driven by his selfishness - being with Padme and his friends - than other motives; and in advancing this goal, he will be ultimately driven by his pragmatism (that was displayed in this show several times, e. g. when he tortured a person to get information or stabbed another in the back to save Obi Wan and Satine) and ultimately not hesitate to join the dark side. This is very well reasoned Brickadeer. Wonderful post indeed as someone else pointed out. But I don't think that Anakin is selfish, no, remember Qui-Gon's discussion with his mother in Ep.I ("He gives without any thought of reward", "He knows nothing of greed"). I believe he pretty much remained selfless and loving throughout the saga. But there was one thing he never learnt as an adult. He grew in power and wisdom, but he never learned to face and let go of his guilt. He was absolutely lost in it. He never accepted his failure with his mother, and it's his mother he will eventually see in Ahsoka and Padme. Instead of facing the guilt, he buried it too deep inside. The manifestation of this denial will be trying to protect everything and everyone (see how he feels when he couldn't help Rex in the TCW movie, or when he couldn't help Oddball when he was on Palpatine rescue mission in ROTS). Buried deep within him, it will come back as a volcano. He really only faced that guilt while Palpatine was killing Luke. Then he was complete and truly unstoppable. And I think (and elaborated extensively in my previous post on page 82, I am quite surprised no one commented on it ) that Ahsoka will shed additional light on his character. She is far from an accessory spoiled kid of the CW. She will grow quite complex IMO. I wouldn't be surprised if Yoda actually had a vision of her future, and sent her to Anakin as a mean to try and finally make him confront his guilt, once she leaves him. And she will, one way or another. Anyway, just my 2 cents Quote
Oky Posted February 12, 2011 Posted February 12, 2011 So... Either this was indeed a dream that the three Jedi somehow had together or time flows much faster on Mortis. Seeing how they lived through several seasons during their stay their, I'd go with the latter. Either way, I still don't get these episodes. I do see the symbolism, but I don't understand how it all fits together. For instance, why was the son so devastated that the father took his life after attempting to murder him himself? And I thought only the blade of mortis could kill the son? Or did the father's death make him mortal or something? I'll have to rewatch these episodes sometime to understand it, I guess. Anaking going darkside for moment was quite weird though, because when it happened in Ep.III, he wanted to kill Obi-Wan as soon as he saw him. After all, the episode was decent, but I think the next 3-part episodes will be weird. Anaking? I disagree. It made sense because he didn't know why is going to betray Obi Wan. And it the next episodes look MUCH less weird than this Mortis arc. In fact, I'm looking foward to it despite its already apparent flaws. Quote
commdr_neyo Posted February 12, 2011 Posted February 12, 2011 Anaking? I disagree. It made sense because he didn't know why is going to betray Obi Wan. And it the next episodes look MUCH less weird than this Mortis arc. In fact, I'm looking foward to it despite its already apparent flaws. Haha, oops. Yes, that is true, but I think he had seen more than we. He just saw some grey guy, and when the brother called him 'Emperor', Anakin immediately knew who he meant. The next arc might be less weird, but still, the commentary makes it so Quote
Brickadeer Posted February 12, 2011 Posted February 12, 2011 (edited) So... Either this was indeed a dream that the three Jedi somehow had together or time flows much faster on Mortis. Seeing how they lived through several seasons during their stay their, I'd go with the latter. Either way, I still don't get these episodes. I do see the symbolism, but I don't understand how it all fits together. For instance, why was the son so devastated that the father took his life after attempting to murder him himself? And I thought only the blade of mortis could kill the son? Or did the father's death make him mortal or something? I'll have to rewatch these episodes sometime to understand it, I guess. Anaking? I disagree. It made sense because he didn't know why is going to betray Obi Wan. And it the next episodes look MUCH less weird than this Mortis arc. In fact, I'm looking foward to it despite its already apparent flaws. As for the motives, I think the final dialogue reveals it all: Father: "You and I are tied together. And your strength runs through me. This way, I take your power." That's why Anakin could kill the son. Then: Son: "Please, don't die!" Father: "I always knew there was good in you!" So I'd simply say that this is the reason why the son didn't kill the father, and why he was so devastated that the father took his life. At this point Anakin steps in and kills the son - who apparently has returned to the light side since he showed so much compassion for his father and who became vulnerable to ordinary weapons because of the sacrifice the father made. Son (dying): "So you betrayed me?" This line implies that the son suspects that the father wanted Anakin to kill the son. However, it remains unclear if the Anakin really had to kill the son. The next line of the father implies that this was not the case, so that the father believes that Anakin made the wrong choice, and that it was this choice, not the previous visions, that reveals to the father Anakin's future role: Father: And now, I die. My heart (is) broken, knowing the role you're gonna play." Edited February 12, 2011 by Brickadeer Quote
j30spiff Posted February 12, 2011 Posted February 12, 2011 (edited) Very good insight Brickadeer. I was thinking along the same lines. So I'd simply say that this is the reason why the son didn't kill the father, and why he was so devastated that the father took his life. The son drew power from his Father and the Father sacrificed himself to stop his son. The son never killed his Father before because without him, he had no power. As his father died he was still selfish and devastated because as his Father's life faded, so did his power. That's why he told his Father "Please, don't die". I don't believe Anakin had to kill the son as with the Father dead, the son was no longer a threat. Anakin freely takes life without hesitation and that makes him susceptible to falling to the dark side. Edited February 12, 2011 by j30spiff Quote
RvB Posted February 12, 2011 Posted February 12, 2011 As for the motives, I think the final dialogue reveals it all: Father: "You and I are tied together. And your strength runs through me. This way, I take your power." That's why Anakin could kill the son. Then: Son: "Please, don't die!" Father: "I always knew there was good in you!" So I'd simply say that this is the reason why the son didn't kill the father, and why he was so devastated that the father took his life. At this point Anakin steps in and kills the son - who apparently has returned to the light side since he showed so much compassion for his father and who became vulnerable to ordinary weapons because of the sacrifice the father made. Son (dying): "So you betrayed me?" This line implies that the son suspects that the father wanted Anakin to kill the son. However, it remains unclear if the Anakin really had to kill the son. The next line of the father implies that this was not the case, so that the father believes that Anakin made the wrong choice, and that it was this choice, not the previous visions, that reveals to the father Anakin's future role: Father: And now, I die. My heart (is) broken, knowing the role you're gonna play." But didnt the son try to kill the father but killed his sister? Quote
j30spiff Posted February 12, 2011 Posted February 12, 2011 But didnt the son try to kill the father but killed his sister? Good point. Maybe the son was unaware of where his power came from until his Father stated: Father: "You and I are tied together. And your strength runs through me. This way, I take your power." Quote
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