Minifigs vs 4+ figs

[Asilla]

Hi.

Newbie asking:

Why is the 4+ figs not so much used ? And I was told "not a lego fig "

I don't understad that ? It must be a lego fig when lego makes it

I have a handful of the 4+ figures and they look fine to me, the faces is even more

"real" looking.

[Oky]

Well, many AFOLs believe that there is such a thing as "un-lego" parts and minifigs. Many licensed figs with non-traditional proportions have been accused of that too. The problem is that they are not as versatile as the traditional minifigs. On top of that, the 4+ figs came in sets that were highly "<insert that tiresome argument>" (consisted of large parts) which added to the hatred of them. I personally don't mind them as much as others for similar reasons as you, but I do agree that they are kinda useless outside of their own themes.

I'd love to see you prove us wrong, though.

Hope that helped.

[Henchmen4Hire]

I see kids play with both kind of figures with no problem, it's mostly the adults that are resistant to using those 4+ figures. I hate to take sides, but I don't like them, just too used to the smaller ones I guess. Also, it's a hassle to re-design your vehicles to fit the 4+ figures, heh.

[ProducePrincess]

I really don't like the jack stone figs just for their look. The faces and bodys look more like regular action figures rather than mini-figs . Their limbs can't be removed and they are very tall making them quite useless for mocs.

I found a jackstone fig when my front steps were being replaced and i threw it back as soon as i found it

[vexorian]

I was gone in dark ages in 2003 so I had no idea what you were talking about. So I am posting these pics so that other people in my position don't have to do it:

If I was around at those times I would have instantly turned into a hater, here's way:

* You can't dissasshemble them.

* They are inconsistent in size with real minifigs.

* They look like a Playmobil and a LEGO minifigs' bastard child.

* They have ears, now that's just wrong.

* They obey to a trend to have less stylish stuff and more pseudo-real stuff. I really hate that trend, it is great the theme died.

Edited July 4, 2010 by vexorian

[Henchmen4Hire]

There's nothing inherently "bad" about those figs, I'm still not sure why people (AFOLs) hate them so much. They're just different from the minifigs you guys are used to, but then again, a banana is also different from the LEGO minifigs you guys like, does that make them "bad" and "wrong"? haha

[Shadows]

They do look a little freakishly strange, but there's certainly no crime in using them. Personally, I'd like to find an easy way to salvage the hats off the 4+ pirates for ... Fabuland Pirates!

Fabuland is a perfectly acceptable 'oversized' figure line, so don't even start on them or you'll feel my wrath.

then again, a banana is also different from the LEGO minifigs you guys like, does that make them "bad" and "wrong"? haha

I tend to avoid bananas in my MOCs.

[blueandwhite]

I suspect that the distain for these figures stems from the fact that many AFOLs at the time were concerned that these 4+ figures might saturate the market pushing our beloved minifig to the backburner. The 4+ figures were incompatible with existing figures as they were an entirely different size and shape. As builders, making MOCs in scale with these giants would require far more bricks as the 4+ figures are considerably larger than the average minifig. There isn't really anything wrong with the 4+ figures or any of the parts from the 4+ line, however they don't really fit that well with traditional LEGO themes.

I certainly had no interest in anything 4+ at the time.

[Rick]

Fabuland Pirates!

Got something planned?

I tend to avoid bananas in my MOCs.

You gotta have bananas... and cherries of course.

[Asilla]

Hi.

Thanks for all you answers, its very interesting.

I got the 4+ figs by a mistake, did't know there was two sizes and I was so glad that I won the auction now I know why.

But the figures look nice to me and I think I'll try to use them in some MOC's.

[Artifex]

There's no such thing as 4+figs.

Move along, now.

Move along.

Nothing to see here.

[Henchmen4Hire]

I tend to avoid bananas in my MOCs.

You gotta have bananas... and cherries of course.

That's the spirit! :P

[dr_spock]

I have a few 4+ figs too. My son unloaded them on me once he got to age 8. He was fine playing with them and the regular mini-figs before then. I haven't figured out what to do with them yet. Maybe some creatures from outer space or land of giants MOC?

[Peppermint_M]

Lego 4+ wasn't like the Lego of their childhoods, thus it is bad or wrong or not lego in their minds.

After all, many of the main arguments used against 4+ applies to Fabuland too...

Mark my words, when I am in my 40s and all the kids who got 4+ as their first "real" lego are AFOLs, then there will be a similar following for 4+ as there is for Fabuland now.

[vexorian]

Yeah, I have never been a fan of fabuland figs for the same reasons. But at least their size is compatible with the other figs and MoCs. I think this is really the main issue with 4+ figs.

Anyway, fabuland lasted for 10 years and 106 sets. Jack stone, and 4+ have lasted for so little time each that it seems that TLG had issues selling them. It does not seem these themes had enough market penetration. In my attempts to google these figs I kept finding FOLs that were completely regretful of getting those sets due to the figs being incompatible with 'real' figs... Mark my words, Jack Stone figs are not going to get more legitimate unless somehow LEGO makes new themes with them and finds a magic recipe to be able to sell them. But it seems like they have stopped trying by now.

It is right that in many ways this is due to people preferring what's more familiar to them. And that's exactly the reason the 4+ figs were a mistake. Familiarity is a force to be reckoned with. If TLG wanted to introduce new figs to the market, the least they could have done was to keep the size close and accessories compatible. There is an inherent issue with the minifig being currently so iconic to LEGO products. My little cousin thinks that minifigs are called "Legos". That's mostly due to a new wave of cable commercials and marketing (ie hose LEGO Starwars/Indy/Batman 3D shorts keep getting played at a certain cable channel we have in here) that was successful in selling LEGO to him and kids his age but also in tying the minifigs to LEGO's identity.

[The Green Brick Giant]

I really don't like the jack stone figs just for their look. The faces and bodys look more like regular action figures rather than mini-figs . Their limbs can't be removed and they are very tall making them quite useless for mocs.

Exactly, they just can't be customized. That makes them useless to me.

[Eilif]

I believe that 4+ figs are despised because they are a tangible example of LEGO getting further and further into j uniorized parts, and further away from "traditional" LEGO SYSTEM. I MOC almost exclusively in Minifig scale, so in my personal MOC'ing, they are pretty much useless.

On the other hand, I have found that the 4+ figs are great for the LEGO class that I teach (see my sig), as they have no pieces that can be lost, and are easy to keep count of. I had collected about 20 of them, but they were almost all stolen, so if anybody has some that they would like to donate, or sell (for a good price) I'd love to hear from you.

[Lego_Hero]

I believe that 4+ figs are despised because they are a tangible example of LEGO getting further and further into j uniorized parts, and further away from "traditional" LEGO SYSTEM. I MOC almost exclusively in Minifig scale, so in my personal MOC'ing, they are pretty much useless.

On the other hand, I have found that the 4+ figs are great for the LEGO class that I teach (see my sig), as they have no pieces that can be lost, and are easy to keep count of. I had collected about 20 of them, but they were almost all stolen, so if anybody has some that they would like to donate, or sell (for a good price) I'd love to hear from you.

It's a scale issue with me as well. They just don't fit in with anything I build. I will say however that the two I have are being used. Both are characters with growing powers in my Protectors Universe. I have a Jack Stone with blue jeans and a black shirt, plus a pilot in grey fatigues.

[willy_poodle]

Do you think they should make some new version of minifigs with bending arms and legs like MB or stick to the old ones forever?

I know they are classic, but sometimes you want them to kneel or strike a different pose.

[Aanchir]

If I was around at those times I would have instantly turned into a hater, here's way:

* You can't dissasshemble them.

* They are inconsistent in size with real minifigs.

* They look like a Playmobil and a LEGO minifigs' bastard child.

* They have ears, now that's just wrong.

* They obey to a trend to have less stylish stuff and more pseudo-real stuff. I really hate that trend, it is great the theme died.

How are ears "wrong?" After all, Technic figs have ears, too. And, for that matter, Technic figs also fit most of the other things you named (technically, you can disassemble them, but I don't think you're supposed to, any more than you're supposed to separate minifig legs from the waist or separate arms from the torso).

The main reason people prefer regular minifigs is that they've been the most consistent design over time, which allows for the most variety. And, beyond that, it's just what people are used to.

Plus, the intended age of 4+ figs and the years they were released means that most AFOLs of today didn't experience them when they were part of the target audience. Perhaps in several years, there will be a trend of AFOLs using 4+ figs the same way AFOLs today use Fabuland. You never know...

Edited July 5, 2010 by Aanchir

[BrickClick]

I myself have no problem with the 4+ figures

I have a few of the pirates and a couple of the Jack Stone ones.

I dont see anything wrong with them though I don't use them much.

And I think ears make them look more realistic instead of ''wrong'' there is nothing ''wrong'' with these figs at all!

[vexorian]

Do you think they should make some new version of minifigs with bending arms and legs like MB or stick to the old ones forever?

I know they are classic, but sometimes you want them to kneel or strike a different pose.

If it is not broken...

MB has a wide variety of minifig styles, something that seems more like an identity issue. For example, the HALO figs are just small action figures and although I guess kids like them, I find them very dissappointing cause I could just really put action figures in MoCs if I wanted that stuff. The nice thing about LEGO figs is that they are cartoony and even the peach skin ones are consistent in design with things dating 1980s. So minifigs are part of the construction and identity of LEGO rather than just an action figure you put in the vehicle.

If TLG really wanted to add articulation, I hope they do it in a way that parts are still interchangeable and the overall look of the fig remains consistent with the original ones, specially the size and the accessories. In fact, I doubt the attempt would be successful if they do not do that.

How are ears "wrong?" After all, Technic figs have ears, too. And, for that matter, Technic figs also fit most of the other things you named (technically, you can disassemble them, but I don't think you're supposed to, any more than you're supposed to separate minifig legs from the waist or separate arms from the torso).

That's the reason I also dislike technic figs. Anyway, the ears of that pirate one are just too noticeable, I doubt you will be able to use a helmet on that head.

Perhaps in several years, there will be a trend of AFOLs using 4+ figs the same way AFOLs today use Fabuland. You never know...

Again, it was rather unsuccessful in comparison to Fabuland which lasted 10 years. Even so the count of AFOLs that use Fabuland figs is very small. Plus the scale makes it very unlikely. I think I've seen more fabuland figs being used by AFOLs than technic figs. Where are those things in MoCs? I cannot really remember a single MoC with them. The only thing that comes to my mind is that CopMike sometimes uses a technic body for his sig fig.

[CP5670]

I regularly use the Technic figures in my models. One reason they're not used as much today is that they were discontinued around 2003, along with the seats designed for them. They were more common in Technic MOCs back then. The scale difference with minifigs is very large though and they are obviously meant to fit into different kinds of models, so they don't cause any conflict with minifigs.

As for these 4+ figures, I don't have any and never paid much attention to them. I wouldn't use them simply because they don't fit in with my existing minifigs (the same reason I don't like fleshies), but otherwise there is nothing wrong with them.

[Eilif]

Do you think they should make some new version of minifigs with bending arms and legs like MB or stick to the old ones forever?

I know they are classic, but sometimes you want them to kneel or strike a different pose.

LEGO has tried more articulated figures at various times. There were the original buildable "homemakers" figs from the 70's (with studs for ears!), Technic figures, and Belleville figures, amonng others. These have always been distinct products, designed for lines that are separate from the minifig based lines.

As for the classic minifig, adding more joints, would require increasing the size of the minifig. As well as not wanting to see any change in the form of the Minifig, I'd also not like to see any size changes. The limitations of the fig are part of the charm.

I am surprised to see that more AFOL's haven't used the Belleville, or 4+ figs in larger scale models. It happens sometimes, but only rarely.

[blueandwhite]

Do you think they should make some new version of minifigs with bending arms and legs like MB or stick to the old ones forever?

I know they are classic, but sometimes you want them to kneel or strike a different pose.

Personally I feel that minifigs are already incredibly expressive despite their limited articulation. With their incredibly short arms and legs, additional articulation seems unwaranted and would only serve to diminish the minifig's distinctiveness as a figure. As I see things, minifigs have become one of the most iconic toys around. To play around with such an iconic property is asking for trouble. Even the smallest of changes is likely to result in an outcry from fans. Little things like the introduction of flesh tones sparked a huge controversy. I can only imagine what the reaction would be like if minifigs were introduced with joints at the knees (which they don't have) and elbows. In many ways this is why figures like the Jack Stone characters are criticized so harshly.