Technic questions at Brickfair Q&A

[CP5670]

There was a Q&A session with Steve Witt of TLG at Brickfair a few days ago, and a few questions came up about Technic that you might find interesting.

One guy asked about the future of pneumatics in Technic sets. Steve said that TLG wants to make Power Functions the main focus of the Technic line, and hinted that there won't be more pure pneumatic sets in the near future. However, he did say that the company is interested in exploring possibilities of combining pneumatics with PF in some way.

Someone else also asked why TLG moved from studded and studless construction over the years. He said TLG wanted to move away from Technic bricks in general because as the holes in them don't have the exact same height as some other bricks that have studs on the side. Trying to connect the two leads to a slight height mismatch and an illegal assembly. Apparently TLG was not as strict about having different part specifcations compatible in the 70s as they are today. On the other hand, he said that they plan to keep putting Technic bricks in other themes.

[Anio]

Someone else also asked why TLG moved from studded and studless construction over the years. He said TLG wanted to move away from Technic bricks in general because as the holes in them don't have the exact same height as some other bricks that have studs on the side. Trying to connect the two leads to a slight height mismatch and an illegal assembly. Apparently TLG was not as strict about having different part specifcations compatible in the 70s as they are today. On the other hand, he said that they plan to keep putting Technic bricks in other themes.

And also because :

- studless enable to build much more complex and compact things ; it is easier to build in three dimensions

- studless is much cheaper to produce than studful.

[Siegfried]

Trying to connect the two leads to a slight height mismatch and an illegal assembly.

To me that's a separate issue that was solved by parts like...

Technic should never have been used like that in the first place. I think Anio has the real answer.

[Erik Leppen]

Steve said that TLG wants to make Power Functions the main focus of the Technic line

I consider that very bad news.

Power functions elements make models a lot more expensive without really adding techniques.

the holes in them don't have the exact same height as some other bricks that have studs on the side

Then redesign technic bricks The proves it's possible to lower the holes in Technic bricks by 0.12 mm...

Edit: but I don't really believe this is the real reason. Anio's arguments sound a lot more realistic.

Edited August 9, 2010 by Erik Leppen

[CP5670]

That seems more credible to me too, especially the cost reason (studless beams don't need an expensive 4-sided mold like studded bricks do). I'm just repeating what Steve said.

[allanp]

name='Erik Leppen' date='09 August 2010 - 05:14 PM' timestamp='1281366848' post='788680']

I consider that very bad news.

Power functions elements make models a lot more expensive without really adding techniques.

I completely agree.

Power functions are like a very nice tasty spice , just a little goes a long way but you don't want to have very much otherwise it ruins it.

Besides, like i've said numerous times, with all that gearing down already done for you inside the motors it slightly removes the point of a technic set.

Give me pneumatics anyday (just wish they would make the cylinders two times longer!). One large PF motor in a compressor with several pumps can power a large number of cylinders simultaniously with great power, making there movements precise is a nice challenge of skill. I'm gonna stop now before I ramble on for ages about how good pneumatics were and even better they could be.

[roamingstop]

Give me pneumatics anyday (just wish they would make the cylinders two times longer!).

Actually I wonder how much time / energy it would cost to make a longer pneumatics cylinder a little similar to the way Big Bens wheels are regularly used for Steam engine MOC's. The longer LA is certainly interesting but too 'non lego' like... but a longer pneumatic cylinder could be interesting.

Anyone got ideas on how much it costs for rapid prototyping moulds these days? And then conversion to production? Dont forget a pneumatic cylinder would be mounded in minimum of 2 parts and require assembly....

Just thinking...

[allanp]

Actually I wonder how much time / energy it would cost to make a longer pneumatics cylinder a little similar to the way Big Bens wheels are regularly used for Steam engine MOC's. The longer LA is certainly interesting but too 'non lego' like... but a longer pneumatic cylinder could be interesting.

Anyone got ideas on how much it costs for rapid prototyping moulds these days? And then conversion to production? Dont forget a pneumatic cylinder would be mounded in minimum of 2 parts and require assembly....

Just thinking...

This is something I have often wondered. I think it would require at least a 4 part mould for the cylinder barrel, and a longer, machined stainless steel rod (or treated/coated steel). All the other components can be "recycled" from existing cylinders. You have probably seen this video from pithivier57 before but it is possible to glue in a longer section of tube to make them longer, and they work very well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kMpVfnE4Rs&feature=related

[eMHa]

The hope for more pneumatics meltdown...

With 8049 I got my first little pump and really rediscovered pneumatics (before I had only the old pneumatic system sets 8851 and 8040 and the new pneumatic set 8862).

To construct a electric pump out of the old pumps (or better cylinder with spring) is a real pain. I tried it and they get very big und don't work very good.

To construct a electric pump with the "new" hand pump (http://www.peeron.com/inv/parts/2797c01) is better (if you have at least two of them) but still it gets very big.

I'd really like to see more little pumps and bigger cylinders.

PS: Hopefully I'll soon finish http://www.brickshelf.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?i=4537715 . Until now I've integrated the electric pump into the drive section and redisgned the boom. I only have to optimize the super structure for better appearance.

[allanp]

I'd really like to see more little pumps and bigger cylinders.

Would something like the parts descibed here interest you?

http://www.eurobricks.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=36939&view=findpost&p=648107

[Jetro]

Power functions are like a very nice tasty spice , just a little goes a long way but you don't want to have very much otherwise it ruins it.

Well, that depends on how much you are used to...

Anyway, I'd also prefer to see a moderate amount of PF and as much Pneumatics as I can get my hands on

[Jurgen Krooshoop]

I'd definately be very happy with more/better pneumatics too. I really really hope TLG would do that for us.

[Paul B Technic]

I would also like to see more pneumatics in the future...

[roamingstop]

An observation I had forgotten. One of the corner stone products in Lego Education 2010 is the Pneumatics Control Set, which gets a good write up and forms part of the classroom concepts. I dont know if it is listed in the 2011 Education guides - I will try to find out.

[eMHa]

Hi,

Would something like the parts descibed here interest you?

http://www.eurobricks.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=36939&view=findpost&p=648107

yes, that sounds very interesting. But these are only thoughts, or? Is there something to buy already?

An observation I had forgotten. One of the corner stone products in Lego Education 2010 is the Pneumatics Control Set, which gets a good write up and forms part of the classroom concepts. I dont know if it is listed in the 2011 Education guides - I will try to find out.

Yeah, it seems the education products come to the rescue Just found http://guide.lugnet.com/set/9641 which is available over amazon This would satisfy a lot of my pneumatic needs

[DLuders]

Yeah, it seems the education products come to the rescue Just found http://guide.lugnet.com/set/9641 which is available over amazon This would satisfy a lot of my pneumatic needs

The 9641 Pneumatics Add-On Set is now in stock and available from the Lego Education Store website http://www.legoeducation.us/store/detail.aspx?KeyWords=9641&searchtype=0&sport=3&by=20&c=0&t=0&l=0&ID=1572 for USD 55.

"The Pneumatics Add-On Set is part of a complete package. Combining the set with the Simple and Motorized Mechanisms Set enables you to carry out engaging cross-curricular activities. Your students will explore power systems and components, sequence and control, pressure, prototyping, kinetic and potential energy, and much more. The set and corresponding Pneumatics Activity Pack feature 14 principle model activities that introduce students to the basics of pneumatics. In addition, four main models and activities and two additional open-ended problem-solving activities thoroughly educate students about pneumatics. The set features 31 specialty elements, including pumps, cylinders, valves, an air tank, tubes, and a manometer."

[Meatman]

As somone mentioned before, studded parts are so hard to keep clean. My 8880 set looks like crap even after I wash it. The dust and dirt gets down in the holes of the studs and that is it.

[allanp]

yes, that sounds very interesting. But these are only thoughts, or? Is there something to buy already?

Sadly, these are not available, they are only my wishes. I know TLG have a policy of not using ideas from fans so TLG, if you are reading this, please don't let that policy put you off from using these ideas.

[CP5670]

The 9641 set has been around for a few years now, but it's very expensive for what you get. You can buy some of the pneumatic parts individually on the Lego Education site, and of course the Forest Tractor is still around. Those are probably the best sources of pneumatics at the moment.

As somone mentioned before, studded parts are so hard to keep clean. My 8880 set looks like crap even after I wash it. The dust and dirt gets down in the holes of the studs and that is it.

The Swiffer products work nicely for removing dust off bricks. They don't clean the dust inside hollow studs (which needs washing), but that dust is less noticeable anyway.

If you build in non-Technic themes too, you find various ways to deal with the dust. The hardest things to clean are not actually studs, but the greebled details commonly seen in Space and City models. I still haven't found any good solution for those.

[roamingstop]

An observation I had forgotten. One of the corner stone products in Lego Education 2010 is the Pneumatics Control Set, which gets a good write up and forms part of the classroom concepts. I dont know if it is listed in the 2011 Education guides - I will try to find out.

It would seem (in the UK) that the Pneumatics Add on set is selling pretty well this year - the schools like the parts, and they can be used at home. (Ahem).

Also the new Renewable Energy Add on packs, featuring the E Motors, new Solar Power Cells, Energy Meters etc will be released in August... so may be shipping to lucky people soon.

There is also a load of sensors / actuators coming from Mindsensors and HiTechnic, and I wonder if Lego are happy to allow these items to become more (or less) specific target groups, and use the LA in the more main stream sets which require reliability (ahem Excavator... you know who you are) and easy of assembly.