Heroica RPG General Discussion

[Endgame]

Scuba...

>Go back in time to the Orcish War.

>Murder Tarokai at Fortaan.

>Become the original veterans of Heroica.

>Amass an army of heroes.

>Use your power over Heroica to establish yourself as King Guts of Eubric.

>Profit.

[Scubacarrot]

So if we want to avoid the Grandfather Paradox making time travel unnecessary, does that mean that after this quest, Guts, Hybros, Nyx, and Docken are in a universe where every event that in any way affects a hero is exactly the same, but is actually a different universe, to account for the fact that what the other players will know of what we do and what we know of what the other players do is the same in both universes because we won't play out what we might have done in the original universe and the other players won't play out what they might do in our universe?

Basically yes. We hopped to another universe, the universe we came from just seizes to exist.

Scuba...

>Go back in time to the Orcish War.

>Murder Tarokai at Fortaan.

>Become the original veterans of Heroica.

>Amass an army of heroes.

>Use your power over Heroica to establish yourself as King Guts of Eubric.

>Profit.

Guts would die. Remember that like 200 heroes went into Fortaan, most were probably pretty good. The six that survived were just the nasty ones that trampled over the others. Probably. Plus that much knowledge of what would happen is basically a magnet for all kind of evil. I don't think it would work out too well. Also, what's the point in being King if you know when you wanted to be it in the first place, you'll be long dead.

[Endgame]

Just warp right into the throne room with your sword in Tarokai.

Also, plant a prophecy in the churches of Eubric that one day you'll come back to rule - say, 200-250 years later. Snap back to the present and bam, reclaim your crown.

[Brickdoctor]

Basically yes. We hopped to another universe, the universe we came from just seizes to exist.

Well, no, it doesn't cease to exist, because all the other players are still in it. We just perceive their actions as being the same in our universe as they would have been in their universe (but we don't know that), and likewise do they perceive ours.

[Palathadric]

Just realized now that Pretzel and Mizuki were both arguing about how we killed the Death Progg in our respective quests at the same time.

[Kintobor]

Oh god, it's Bioshock Infinite all over again!

I'm waiting for the Heroica universe's Lutece twins to pop up any second now...

[Scubacarrot]

Just warp right into the throne room with your sword in Tarokai.

Also, plant a prophecy in the churches of Eubric that one day you'll come back to rule - say, 200-250 years later. Snap back to the present and bam, reclaim your crown.

I don't think that's how it works...

"Yeah, I am the bald guy from the prophecy that calls himself Guts. What? What do you mean there are hundreds of guys saying the same thing?"

Well, no, it doesn't cease to exist, because all the other players are still in it. We just perceive their actions as being the same in our universe as they would have been in their universe (but we don't know that), and likewise do they perceive ours.

No, you're looking at it wrong. The second universe is just a direct copy. We are the only thing that changed. Everything else plays the same way.

[Brickdoctor]

"Yeah, I am the bald guy from the prophecy that calls himself Guts. What? What do you mean there are hundreds of guys saying the same thing?"

Travel to the future first, grab some technology, come back, prove that you're the true Guts by performing miracles.

[Kintobor]

Travel to the future first, grab some technology, come back, prove that you're the true Guts by performing miracles.

One of which is pushing cheeky rogues off of boats.

[Endgame]

Hop back with some sort of MacGuffin or something that proves your heritage.

[Scubacarrot]

Oh god, it's Bioshock Infinite all over again!

Nah the alternate realities were some things work out differently is stupid. Don't get me wrong, interesting, but stupid.

One of which is pushing cheeky rogues off of boats.

One of his greatest feats.

[CMP]

Oh god, it's Bioshock Infinite all over again!

I'm waiting for the Heroica universe's Lutece twins to pop up any second now...

Jacob and Christian, obviously. God knows where they'll show up next or how much more they know than they let on. Paladins, sailors, engineers. Scientists are probably only a few Quests away.

[Brickdoctor]

I think every QM should include Jacob and Christian in every quest from now on, whether as a supporting character or as a barely noticeable background character. And then we try to find them in every quest.

I need to check to see if I have the pieces used for their heads.

[Dannylonglegs]

I think every QM should include Jacob and Christian in every quest from now on, whether as a supporting character or as a barely noticeable background character. And then we try to find them in every quest.

I need to check to see if I have the pieces used for their heads.

I concur... Just like what I plan to do with Fleur!

~Insectoid Aristocrat

[Endgame]

Punii will be making a cameo in each one of my quests from this point on. ...Even if it means he is someplace completely random.

[JimBee]

Look. Time Travel in fiction is amazing. As long as there is no talk about paradoxes. megabluck paradoxes.

I'm just waiting on battle versus ourselves, a la the mirror battle in Quest #10.

[Brickdoctor]

Which head does Christian use? It looks similar to some CMF ones (like a cross between S5 Eskimo and S9 Knight), but I'm not sure. I know Jacob has the same head-hair combo as Seaian.

[Kintobor]

I intend to use the duo eventually. Not sure where though.

[Flipz]

Sums up everything beautifully about the Doctor Who Pandorica arc...

Bloody paradoxes messing with my head.

No, no, it's quite simple (note that I'm still missing a couple of key episodes, so there may be some holes, but):

The Silence were behind the whole thing. They screwed with the Tardis, knowing the universe would have to be destroyed and re-created in order for them to get their hands on Melody Pond--and, more importantly, in order for Melody Pond to exist the way she does, since she was conceived on the Tardis at the end of "The Big Bang" (Word of God states that the title is actually a filthy pun alluding to this event). They screwed up, however, in their handling of Melody and in not accounting for her...unique manner of traveling through time.

The time-travel within the episode is explained handily; it's a stable time loop, as the Doctor tries/tends to generate as often as he possibly can (as evidenced by the stuff in "The Name of the Doctor"). River "acquires" the time-travel glove at the beginning of the episode, for the express purpose of having it to give to the Doctor for these specific shenanigans (again, see her method of travel in time relative to the Doctor).

(On the subject of The Silence--bit of a pun, but: "Silence will fall when the ultimate question is asked"--the Ultimate Question is, of course, "'Doctor' who?". What a lot of people miss is a certain time the Ultimate Question was asked prior to "The Name of The Doctor"--specifically, in "The Impossible Astronaut/Day of the Moon", by Canton Delaware, shortly before The Silence fell to The Doctor's scheme and Melody was freed from their direct captivity (though she would continue the mission they brainwashed her to do until "Let's Kill Hitler").)

Incidentally, I also have an explanation of how time itself works in Doctor Who, and why some things can be changed but others can't (see, for example, why The Doctor ends up having to find new companions after the Ponds): each person has their own, individual time line. You can alter other peoples' time lines, but not your own. The complicated bit is, these time lines don't exist in a vacuum, they're all twisted around each other in complex, inscrutable ways--thus, certain alterations to other peoples' time lines is impossible because altering them would correspondingly alter your own. Now technically, you CAN alter your own time line, but...well, imagine a ball of string. Yarn, really, but string's easier to say. And there are billions upon billions of pieces of string in the ball. Now, these strings are all wrapped around each other, and it's all moving, all wibbbly-wobbly. And this one string decides, "I'm going to go back and wrap around myself," and when it does that it makes a knot. And the ball doesn't like that, 'cause now it can't move. And it keeps trying, and trying, until eventually either the string changes its mind and comes loose or else a whole bunch of strings snap, and now the wibbly-wobbly timey-wimey ball isn't holding itself together anymore, and it all comes undone in one huge spectacular mess.

How do stable time loops work in this system? Well, for the most part, the strings line up pretty orderly-like--yeah, they wrap around each other and all, but mostly it's going in the same direction. Time travelers' strings, though, are like what happens when you tell a five-year-old on a sugar high to wind up the ball (assuming he doesn't just chuck it at you and throw a tantrum to begin with)--it gets real messy, weaving in and out and back and forth in different directions. And when the time traveler string gets mixed up with other strings, they either get carried along with it for a bit and then dropped off later, or else they sort of touch briefly and diverge at a sharp angle. A stable time loop occurs when those strings touch like that an even number of times--in the beginning, it's the time-traveler string that makes the normal (or, in some cases, normal-er) string diverge, while at the end of the loop, it's the normal(-er) string that makes the time-traveler string diverge, specifically in the direction that sends the time-traveler string to divert the normal(-er) string. And in any event, "beginning" and "end" are only determined in relation to the normal(-er) string--causality is less of an issue for the time-traveler string, since it can go pretty much anywhere in the ball it wants without consequence--there's some effect, of course, but as long as it doesn't directly attempt to alter or avoid the strings it's already touched (from it's own perspective), it won't be touching something that's directly touching it and altering its own time stream. Or to put it another way: there's a beginning and end to each string's perspective, but from a non-linear non-subjective point of view they exist independently of each other even though they affect each other.

...it's possible that I may have Time Lord DNA.

I had some comment on how this affects Quest 72, but then I realized that 72 doesn't work the same way, unfortunately.

[Dannylonglegs]

*Snip*

That was beautiful.

~Insectoid Aristocrat

Edited June 19, 2013 by Dannylonglegs

[herrJJ]

"People assume that time is a strict progression of cause to effect, but actually it forms a non-linear, non-subjective viewpoint - it's more like a big ball of wibbly wobbly, timey wimey... stuff."

Alonsi!

Oh, come on, I am only at season 4 right now

Oh wait, spoiler tag... /me:idiot

[Vash the Stampede]

Honestly, Dreyrugr seems more the type that would give up in arguing with Pretzel, but I'm sure I'll think of something...hopefully soon.

Actually he is, just that he will argue if there is an obvious error in the opposing statement. This doesn't work well because Pretzel has selective hearing. I'm hoping that after this one Dreyrugr just gives up.

[Chromeknight]

And end up like Arthur or Haldor? Ha, no thanks.

I would have thought that the popularity of young, human, male rogues was in part due to thinking that's what girls want. Poor Dyric. Cursed by backstory...

[Kintobor]

I would have thought that the popularity of young, human, male rogues was in part due to thinking that's what girls want. Poor Dyric. Cursed by backstory...

And here I thought the only thing the male rogues wanted was a female rogue.

[Chromeknight]

And here I thought the only thing the male rogues wanted was a female rogue.

Perhaps. But the danger there is that she might be better, which makes him the good one in comparison.

Girls have a much finer line between being bad in a good way (naughty) and bring bad in a bad way (evil).