swils Posted January 27, 2015 Posted January 27, 2015 Confusion? High SP? High level and/or high damage AoEs because dragons don't have any way to add armor (yet? *hopeful* heh) and are still squishy? The list goes on Quote
JimBee Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 I like the idea of having the option, even though I probably wouldn't use it for a while. Honestly, second characters are a secondary problem. The big issue is that we have a severe lack of Quests and available hosts. Hosting is hard work, and it's easy to get burned out, but at the same time the standard for Quests seems to be getting higher than ever. I certainly wouldn't want to host more than one full Quest at a time myself, especially considering how difficult Arthur can be to play at the same time--and yet, unless more people step up and step out of their comfort zones, that's exactly what will have to happen in order to satisfy the need for all our players. For my money, I think the second characters are not a bad thing, but it is a significant time investment. Running a Quest and playing a character is challenging but doable, but from what I've seen playing two and hosting a Quest is really pushing it, and usually one of the three has to give. I don't think that means we should make a bunch of rules about it, but perhaps people should consider their limits before taking on too much. Bringing this discussion over to this topic (since it doesn't really concern the rule change about second characters), I do have to say that Lind has a point about the Hall being flooded with new heroes when we have shortage of quests. I'd like to play my characters simultaneously because I want to explore their stories and expand their builds. One idea that I've been tossing around in my head (that I'm sure will be disagreed upon by many) is to have heroes level up faster, or to at least give more experience out in general. RPGs in video games or even tabletops are a lot of fun because you can level up and advance classes in a matter of hours or days. We're limited by everyone getting actions in within 24 hours, yet the same battles only take a few minutes in "game time" (in a video game a battle would be over in a few minutes). What if leveling up didn't taper off (1/2 levels after level 10, 1/3 after 20, etc.), and instead a hero gained 1 level every battle? Maybe this would be too easy, then maybe differing amounts of experience could be given based on difficulty (clearly the final battle of 105 is worth more XP than an FoG battle), or more XP given for non-battle situations. The point is, characters would level up faster and more classes and builds could be explored with one character in a matter of months instead of years. People would get to level 50 pretty quickly, and the chances of them starting a new character shortly after would be higher. I, for one, would like to play several characters and tell their stories in the time that it took to tell just Hybros'. Just something to consider, I'm not calling for anything to be changed right now. As for QMing, I would definitely like to get back into it but I really don't have time (which also puts a strain on the creative juices), or the bricks. My collection is back at home which I visit only a few times per year, and I'm not a fan of LDD. If I did have the time to QM I would love to collaborate with a builder, but I'm sure all the builders here are busy with their own quests, too. It'd be neat if we could collab with GoH or something, just as an out-there thought. Quote
Flipz Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 It'd be neat if we could collab with GoH or something, just as an out-there thought. Oh, definitely, there are a LOT of talented GoH builders, which could result in a wonderfully symbiotic relationship; my problem is working up the nerve to ask someone. Quote
Kintobor Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 Jimbee's big speech. I think my biggest problem with that is that we'd go through characters too quickly. There'd be no real builds happening because by the time you got to your advanced class build perfected you'd be ready for an expert class. What about Dragoon? Is that class even worth getting at? Would the expert classes even be used? It's not a bad idea, but there's a lot of consequences that come from it that I feel would hurt the game more than help it, and at this point changing the entire level up dynamic is just going to cause a mess of problems. Do we convert everything so that everyone stays the same level, or do we put everyone to where they should be with a new level and recalculate stats. That being said, we should drag the GoH members over here look into getting some GoH players interested, even if they want to just build sets. Perhaps do a collaboration so that if they help out a Heroica QM with sets they get points in GoH. I think we could barter with these big, imposing Guild Members with someone playing a Black Knight, preferably not Lind. Quote
Lind Whisperer Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 Maybe this would be too easy, then maybe differing amounts of experience could be given based on difficulty (clearly the final battle of 105 is worth more XP than an FoG battle), or more XP given for non-battle situations.The point is, characters would level up faster and more classes and builds could be explored with one character in a matter of months instead of years. People would get to level 50 pretty quickly, and the chances of them starting a new character shortly after would be higher. I, for one, would like to play several characters and tell their stories in the time that it took to tell just Hybros'. I definitely think that there should be an option(if there isn't) for QMs to give out XP for particularly excellent RP, and if there already is, that they should use it far more often. As for QMing, I would definitely like to get back into it but I really don't have time (which also puts a strain on the creative juices), or the bricks. My collection is back at home which I visit only a few times per year, and I'm not a fan of LDD. If I did have the time to QM I would love to collaborate with a builder, but I'm sure all the builders here are busy with their own quests, too. It'd be neat if we could collab with GoH or something, just as an out-there thought. Oh, definitely, there are a LOT of talented GoH builders, which could result in a wonderfully symbiotic relationship; my problem is working up the nerve to ask someone. That being said, we should drag the GoH members over here look into getting some GoH players interested, even if they want to just build sets. Perhaps do a collaboration so that if they help out a Heroica QM with sets they get points in GoH. I think we could barter with these big, imposing Guild Members with someone playing a Black Knight... This is a bit of a crazy idea, but has anyone ever thought of creating a LUG for Heroica? LEGO does offer the LUGBULK program, which would open up the way for some truly impressive set design at below-Bricklink prices. We almost definitely have enough members for it, and we could fill in any empty spots with GoHers. "HeroLUG" It has kind of a nice ring to it. ...preferably not Lind. Believe it or not, there is a pattern behind Lind's actions, and good reasons for them. It'll have become a good bit clearer by the end of #122(or at least have a few hints at why), and by the time I finish my trilogy someday...Well, it still won't be explained entirely, but the frame of the puzzle will have been completed. Quote
Kintobor Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 I definitely think that there should be an option(if there isn't) for QMs to give out XP for particularly excellent RP, and if there already is, that they should use it far more often. This is a bit of a crazy idea, but has anyone ever thought of creating a LUG for Heroica? LEGO does offer the LUGBULK program, which would open up the way for some truly impressive set design at below-Bricklink prices. We almost definitely have enough members for it, and we could fill in any empty spots with GoHers. "HeroLUG" It has kind of a nice ring to it. Believe it or not, there is a pattern behind Lind's actions, and good reasons for them. It'll have become a good bit clearer by the end of #122(or at least have a few hints at why), and by the time I finish my trilogy someday...Well, it still won't be explained entirely, but the frame of the puzzle will have been completed. I've been reward EXP for roleplaying I believe once... maybe twice. It's because Karie's such a tease, and she enjoys betraying the party. I think there's been talks of running a Heroica quest at a Lego convention, but nothing ever came of it. I'd love to one day be a part of that if I ever got an opportunity to. I guess the question I'm going to have to ask is are these quests your planning going to be about Lind and his backstory, because no one's going to be interested in a quest about your character. A quest about Munchkins is a different story, but as a general rule, if you want to expand on your character's background (i.e., his race, where they came from, culture), so long as you don't make the quest about your character, you're fine. It's a hard line to walk, and I'd avoid it if possible. Sorry if it seems like I singled you out, you're the only black knight that came to mind. Quote
Lind Whisperer Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 I guess the question I'm going to have to ask is are these quests your planning going to be about Lind and his backstory, because no one's going to be interested in a quest about your character. A quest about Munchkins is a different story, but as a general rule, if you want to expand on your character's background (i.e., his race, where they came from, culture), so long as you don't make the quest about your character, you're fine. It's a hard line to walk, and I'd avoid it if possible. It's actually about neither, although the Munchkin backstory factors into it substantially*, since one of the main NPCs is also a Munchkin. Lind won't factor or appear in at any point, only the Munchkin backstory. I was saying that once (the hypothetical) you understands the Munchkin backstory as a whole, you'll understand Lind's actions, as he is a Munchkin, and his actions are a reflection of this. * And the backstory is part of another story that is part of the overly complex background of another project I keep saying I'm going to start up someday... I have a bad tendency to write too far ahead into the future. Sorry if it seems like I singled you out, you're the only black knight that came to mind. No problem - it was actually a little bit flattering to be referenced. Of course, being the only current Black Knight kind of helps. Quote
UsernameMDM Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 I believe PC level advancement is fine as is and made better if a PC would take the time for a decent Fields run for a Medal of Glory. Quote
Sandy Posted January 28, 2015 Author Posted January 28, 2015 One idea that I've been tossing around in my head (that I'm sure will be disagreed upon by many) is to have heroes level up faster, or to at least give more experience out in general. RPGs in video games or even tabletops are a lot of fun because you can level up and advance classes in a matter of hours or days. We're limited by everyone getting actions in within 24 hours, yet the same battles only take a few minutes in "game time" (in a video game a battle would be over in a few minutes). What if leveling up didn't taper off (1/2 levels after level 10, 1/3 after 20, etc.), and instead a hero gained 1 level every battle? Maybe this would be too easy, then maybe differing amounts of experience could be given based on difficulty (clearly the final battle of 105 is worth more XP than an FoG battle), or more XP given for non-battle situations. The last time this issue was brought up, I introduced the Medals of Glory - something I kinda wish I hadn't done, because how easy it was for some players to push ahead of everyone else. However, if everyone had an easy access to the medals, then they would be pretty much pointless to begin with. I don't think making character progress faster in general would do much good for this game. As Kintobor pointed out, players wouldn't have much time to get used to their job classes before they would be tempted to change it to a more advanced one. And since job classes are a big part of roleplaying the character, it would also hurt the character's personal story arch. I definitely think that there should be an option(if there isn't) for QMs to give out XP for particularly excellent RP, and if there already is, that they should use it far more often. It is totally possible, and I agree that it should be used more often. I usually give experience from solving puzzles or riddles in my quests, but only to the solver(s). Quote
K-Nut Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 I believe PC level advancement is fine as is and made better if a PC would take the time for a decent Fields run for a Medal of Glory. The thing is that not everyone wants to take an extensive trip to the fields to get their medal, seeing as it takes a pretty long time to get the necessary GP. The medal also takes an accessory slot, which is a major downside to it seeing as how many great accessories there are out there. I think if anything, leveling up should cap out at 1/4 of a level. It doesn't negate the use of a medal, nor does it make levels go too quickly. Once you get to level 40+ leveling up can get tedious without a medal, seeing as you're likely to get one level per quest at best unless another level is specified in the quest reward (which once you get to level 40+ its a nice reward). Making that change would still make it take a while to get fully leveled up, keeping the ability to prolong characters development and specific class build, but it doesn't have to take as long to get to the class you want. Quote
UsernameMDM Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 The thing is that not everyone wants to take an extensive trip to the fields to get their medal, seeing as it takes a pretty long time to get the necessary GP. Those who do the work/put in the time get rewarded. Quote
CMP Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 Those who do the work/put in the time get rewarded. There's sometimes next to no effort from some players who go to the Fields. Some players value roleplaying just as much and don't want to have to go through the Fields enough to get a Medal. Quote
K-Nut Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 Those who do the work/put in the time get rewarded. Yes, but is the work these days even worth it? I guess it depends on the player, but when I was getting mine I ended up getting pretty bored in the fields seeing how redundant it all got for our party. Since then, the cost of a Medal has been doubled. Perhaps it won't take as much time for those who use all of the trials, but the Medal has gotten to be pretty unattainable these days especially since all of the enemies seem harder, possibly requiring multiple trips. Quote
UsernameMDM Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 There's sometimes next to no effort from some players who go to the Fields. Yes, but is the work these days even worth it? I guess it depends on the player, but when I was getting mine I ended up getting pretty bored in the fields seeing how redundant it all got for our party. Since then, the cost of a Medal has been doubled. Perhaps it won't take as much time for those who use all of the trials, but the Medal has gotten to be pretty unattainable these days especially since all of the enemies seem harder, possibly requiring multiple trips. I know the group I was went spent months on our trip. The Fields are great for leveling - lots of battles and rewards. Some players value roleplaying just as much and don't want to have to go through the Fields enough to get a Medal. There's a trade off then. You can choose to roleplay, or you can choose to sacrifice roleplay for probably the length of 1 quest to earn MoG in order to level faster. Not seeing the big/unfair deal. Quote
Scubacarrot Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 I think the 'worth' of going to the fields depends entirely on your group. Got a strong team with plenty of supplies, set out for a bunch of battles, having several challenges active to speed up glory points (Immortal, Thick Skin, War, perhaps Overdose and you only die twice, can you even have multiple challenges on at once?) it will probably be great. I'd consider going only in that kind of group. Anyone interested, let me know. Quote
CMP Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 I know the group I was went spent months on our trip. The Fields are great for leveling - lots of battles and rewards. There's a trade off then. You can choose to roleplay, or you can choose to sacrifice roleplay for probably the length of 1 quest to earn MoG in order to level faster. Not seeing the big/unfair deal. Medals are 250 GP, and you guys spent months there. It takes a LOT longer than the length of one quest. Quote
Sandy Posted January 28, 2015 Author Posted January 28, 2015 having several challenges active to speed up glory points (Immortal, Thick Skin, War, perhaps Overdose and you only die twice, can you even have multiple challenges on at once?) No, you can only choose one Challenge per battle. I put an emphasis on that on the first page of the Fields. Quote
UsernameMDM Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 I think the 'worth' of going to the fields depends entirely on your group. Got a strong team with plenty of supplies, set out for a bunch of battles, having several challenges active to speed up glory points (Immortal, Thick Skin, War, perhaps Overdose and you only die twice, can you even have multiple challenges on at once?) it will probably be great. I'd consider going only in that kind of group. Anyone interested, let me know. Hoke & Nerwen are signed up... Medals are 250 GP, and you guys spent months there. It takes a LOT longer than the length of one quest. *cough*ZEPHER*cough* I only speak of which I know. Quote
Scubacarrot Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 No, you can only choose one Challenge per battle. I put an emphasis on that on the first page of the Fields. Okay thanks, that makes sense! War would probably be the easiest one to deal with for the multiplayer (x2). It would only take seven battles with War active to get a Medal of Glory. Considering there are six "easy" battles to be done, this seems entirely plausible to get done fairly quickly. Hoke & Nerwen are signed up... So is Quarryman, I see. You said earlier you wanted to stay for five battles to get a decamodifier, would you be willing to try for at least seven to get Medals of Glory? Quote
UsernameMDM Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 (edited) So is Quarryman, I see. You said earlier you wanted to stay for five battles to get a decamodifier, would you be willing to try for at least seven to get Medals of Glory? Yes. I'd like to go as long till a quest with house rep/really good reward comes along. I just wanted a minimum of 5, but am willing to stay much longer if no other quests come up. If a PC has 0 GP it will take 22 successful battles to earn one with 3 GP left over. Edited January 28, 2015 by UsernameMDM Quote
Lind Whisperer Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 I'm probably going to go back to the Fields someday for a Decamodifier(and a certain OP weapon), but I don't really think MoGs are what they first seem to be. Sure, the advanced leveling in #103 was fun, but I missed out almost entirely on being a rogue, and the rest of that time was spent fruitlessly Fielding for my own MoG. I get that at higher levels, the leveling does slow down to an extreme, but isn't that kind of the point? The highest level classes are there to be earned through long loyalty to the game, not jumping up through the game as quickly as possible. I've only been on #122 for a fraction of the two times* I went to the Fields, but in that short bit of time I've had more fun playing than the entire time I spent Fielding. Now, I'm not saying I didn't suffer from a particularly bad case of this when I was starting up my first FoG team, because I did, but I really think people need to focus more on the RP, and less on their levels and gear. It is called Heroica: The RPG for a reason... *Have there been any other PCs that toured part of the Fields twice in a row? Honestly curious. Quote
swils Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 Anyone interested, let me know. *Raises hand* Quote
Scubacarrot Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 If a PC has 0 GP it will take 22 successful battles to earn one with 3 GP left over. Wait. Is it 1 2 4 8 16 for GP or 1 2 3 4 5? It's the second one, isn't it. I'm dumb. Since we'll probably be using War, I count 16 battles until an Amulet. *Raises hand* Quote
UsernameMDM Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 Wait. Is it 1 2 4 8 16 for GP or 1 2 3 4 5? It's the second one, isn't it. I'm dumb. Each battle # is worth that many points. 1st = 1, 2nd = 2 so 2 complete battles is 3, so it's 1+2+3+4+5+6.... *Raises hand* So an Alchemist, Mystic Knight, Archmage, Minstrel and Dragoon walk into a bar... Quote
Scubacarrot Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 Each battle # is worth that many points. 1st = 1, 2nd = 2 so 2 complete battles is 3, so it's 1+2+3+4+5+6.... Yep! For some reason I had the optimistic thought that each battle would double the GP, haha. Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.