Heroica RPG General Discussion

[Etzel]

Welcome to Heroica Palathadric! I love your character, he's hilarious, but I'm pretty sure Christianity is non-existent in this world, so words like 'hell' and symbols like the cross would have no meaning. Of course, as this is a fictional world, it's possible that such a religion exists somewhere outside Eubric, where the most popular god and goddesses are the likes of Ennoc and Sylvania.

The most popular god in Eubric is actually Mercutio, the Trickster, at least amongst the inhabitants of the city (check the Library). But the heroes in Heroica has a more diverse selection of deities.

[Palathadric]

Welcome to Heroica Palathadric! I love your character, he's hilarious, but I'm pretty sure Christianity is non-existent in this world, so words like 'hell' and symbols like the cross would have no meaning. Of course, as this is a fictional world, it's possible that such a religion exists somewhere outside Eubric, where the most popular god and goddesses are the likes of Ennoc and Sylvania.

Christianity non-existant in Eubric, eh? All the more heathen to convert then.

Yes, I must not be from Eubric...that's the thing...no wonder I look like a human, but from my age I reckon that I'm not.

Will keep all of this in mind though, but the conversion of the heathen just seems to be so much a part of my character...hmmm...

[Bioniclover]

The most popular god in Eubric is actually Mercutio, the Trickster, at least amongst the inhabitants of the city (check the Library). But the heroes in Heroica has a more diverse selection of deities.

Christianity non-existant in Eubric, eh? All the more heathen to convert then.

Yes, I must not be from Eubric...that's the thing...no wonder I look like a human, but from my age I reckon that I'm not.

Will keep all of this in mind though, but the conversion of the heathen just seems to be so much a part of my character...hmmm...

@Etzel: I think tose were just random examples off the top of his head, which is why he said 'the likes of'.

@palathadric: The followers of Ennoc have a very similar theme to Christians, as can be seen in Etzel's Quest The Paladin Conquest.

Edited February 5, 2012 by Bioniclover

[Capt.JohnPaul]

I really hope we don't go further into this discussion. I've seen a hero who's surcoat is white with a cross. And this is fantasy. Its time period is medieval. Christianity was a major factor for most of the events that are important. (Hastings, Crusades, Reconquista) Even though it is fantasy, and real religions don't exist as a major belief, we should all choose what we think is our characters' deity. Also, based on the medieval age, we have gunpowder and handguns, (for rangers) we've had this discussion about whether or not heroes can eat chocolate, all this makes us believe this is a Renaissance Time period, and Cortes sailed to the new world. What does this have to do with religion? The Aztecs and Mayans were from a very different place, and they had gods Europe didn't even understand. So who says certain symbols or words can't be allowed? They were from a different "World" so palathadric's cross is nothing strange, considering the Knight followed chivalry, a code that coexists with the teachings of Christianity. Maybe I'm reading to far into this, but no one should've ever brought it up.

[Kadabra]

Welcome to Heroica Palathadric! I love your character, he's hilarious, but I'm pretty sure Christianity is non-existent in this world, so words like 'hell' and symbols like the cross would have no meaning. Of course, as this is a fictional world, it's possible that such a religion exists somewhere outside Eubric, where the most popular god and goddesses are the likes of Ennoc and Sylvania.

I really hope we don't go further into this discussion. I've seen a hero who's surcoat is white with a cross. And this is fantasy. Its time period is medieval. Christianity was a major factor for most of the events that are important. (Hastings, Crusades, Reconquista) Even though it is fantasy, and real religions don't exist as a major belief, we should all choose what we think is our characters' deity. Also, based on the medieval age, we have gunpowder and handguns, (for rangers) we've had this discussion about whether or not heroes can eat chocolate, all this makes us believe this is a Renaissance Time period, and Cortes sailed to the new world. What does this have to do with religion? The Aztecs and Mayans were from a very different place, and they had gods Europe didn't even understand. So who says certain symbols or words can't be allowed? They were from a different "World" so palathadric's cross is nothing strange, considering the Knight followed chivalry, a code that coexists with the teachings of Christianity. Maybe I'm reading to far into this, but no one should've ever brought it up.

*Cough*

[Capt.JohnPaul]

*Cough*

I know, I read. That could certainly be possible, but if so, I don't think there would be any need to bring it up.

[Etzel]

@Etzel: I think tose were just random examples off the top of his head, which is why he said 'the likes of'.

@palathadric: The followers of Ennoc have a very similar theme to Christians, as can be seen in Etzel's Quest The Paladin Conquest.

Yeah, I just wanted to promote Mercutio a little since he is supposed to be the most popular god in Eubric but so few of the heroes care about him.

The Followers of Ennoc in my quest is indeed somewhat inspired by Christians, or more specifically the Crusaders. But perhaps even more by the Children of the Light or Whitecloaks from Robert Jordan's fantasy series The Wheel of Time.

I really hope we don't go further into this discussion. I've seen a hero who's surcoat is white with a cross. And this is fantasy. Its time period is medieval. Christianity was a major factor for most of the events that are important. (Hastings, Crusades, Reconquista) Even though it is fantasy, and real religions don't exist as a major belief, we should all choose what we think is our characters' deity. Also, based on the medieval age, we have gunpowder and handguns, (for rangers) we've had this discussion about whether or not heroes can eat chocolate, all this makes us believe this is a Renaissance Time period, and Cortes sailed to the new world. What does this have to do with religion? The Aztecs and Mayans were from a very different place, and they had gods Europe didn't even understand. So who says certain symbols or words can't be allowed? They were from a different "World" so palathadric's cross is nothing strange, considering the Knight followed chivalry, a code that coexists with the teachings of Christianity. Maybe I'm reading to far into this, but no one should've ever brought it up.

I think you are exaggerating the historical inspiration for this fantasy world. The time period isn't medieval, it's just inspired by it. So much is different from our world so you can't really apply our culture and historical facts on in.

Personally I don't think we should have real religions in Heroica, that is just begging for problems. We have an opportunity to use our imagination freely and I think we should use it. Sandy has put up some great guidelines about the world, its inhabitants and their beliefs but left us with a lot of options for us to come up with our own unique characters and quests. Use the Library, it's a great resource.

@palathadric: I don't say this to criticise you or your character, in fact I really like him! But I see a problem with him representing a religion that doesn't fit with the rest of the world he is living in, and it can become an issue with having real life religion in the game and on this website where we've chosen not to discuss that subject.

[Khorne]

[...] Christianity was a major factor for most of the events that are important. (Hastings, Crusades, Reconquista) [...]

I just wanted to say that Hastings had nothing to do with Christianity. The battle of Hastings was purely the consequence of a feudal succesion "crisis".

On the subject of religion in Heroica, I wouldn't refer to your character's religion as christianity per se. I'm fine with you using its imagery (such as crosses) and underlying message/doctrine (whatever you call it), but I would really refrain from calling it christianity. Just invent new names for it, if you really want to create a new religion. Alternatively, you could say your monk is part of some splinter cell Ennoc cult/church.

Heroica is a fun fantasy setting and real-life religion is a really touchy subject, so let's keep the religions fictional in here. That way, no one will be offended or whatsoever. This is all I wanted to say on the subject, I hope you can understand .

EDIT:@palathadric: Please, don't take this personal. Like Etzel, I really like your character. Very original .

Edited February 5, 2012 by Khorne

[Brickdoctor]

I don't mean to minimod, but we have a rule that states,

Manners and Serious Topics: Don't be offensive to other members. We like Eurobricks to be a friendly place to discuss LEGO and won't allow posts that are intended to offend or attack. For the same reason, topics about religion or politics are not welcome on Eurobricks.

And I think that no matter what you believe, and with respect for other people's beliefs, any real-world religions should be kept out of Heroica in the interests of avoiding a debate (or worse) concerning religion.

[Capt.JohnPaul]

I just wanted to say that Hastings had nothing to do with Christianity. The battle of Hastings was purely the consequence of a feudal succesion "crisis".

You are partly right. The reason I said that was because William the Conqueror (from what I understand) didn't want to be excommunicated, as Christianity was officially becoming the power of the Western World. He had to go to the papacy and get permission, when that was done, he attacked the Anglo-Saxons and won.

I think you are exaggerating the historical inspiration for this fantasy world. The time period isn't medieval, it's just inspired by it. So much is different from our world so you can't really apply our culture and historical facts on in.

Even though it is inspired, you can clearly see comparisons. Heroica is all about helping people, and that is what Chivalry is all about. "Hoisting Down the Jolly Roger is about pirates, and pirates were mainly known during/a bit after the Renaissance, when guns were invented.

Anyways, I'll stop talking now, and let this discussion just end, because like Etzel said, this is just begging to start problems.

[Waterbrick Down]

Edit: Thanks Brickdoctor, I'll end my contributions here.

Edited February 5, 2012 by Waterbrick Down

[Etzel]

Even though it is inspired, you can clearly see comparisons. Heroica is all about helping people, and that is what Chivalry is all about. "Hoisting Down the Jolly Roger is about pirates, and pirates were mainly known during/a bit after the Renaissance, when guns were invented.

That is a very Eurocentric view that doesn't take into consideration that similar features appears in many other parts of the world. Just because it's most known in our culture from a certain time period doesn't mean it could appeared somewhere else. Heroica only exists in our mind, we make the rules and background for it. The reason why there are knights in this world doesn't have to be the same as in our. Likewise with pirate, we can't presume that just because there are pirates and gunpowder present in Heroica it takes place in a Renaissance-like world.

But I want to point out that even though I would love to dive deeper into the cultural structures and historical background of Heroica, I think we might want to keep it simple so that it can be easily accessible for all players, and keep and open attitude towards inclusion of different features that might not always fit together logically but gives a nice player experience.

Anyways, I'll stop talking now, and let this discussion just end, because like Etzel said, this is just begging to start problems.

No, that's not what I said. I said that mixing fiction and real life religion in a game here on Eurobricks is a bad idea and begging for problem. Our discussion is more about what Heroica is built upon and what kind of references that can be used in the game. That should be fine to discuss I think, but I guess it might get boring fast. Besides, keeping it simple and just go with the flow is probably the best solution for everything.

[Scorpiox]

I think it is fine with palathadric to have his character, in Heroica the Cross can mean whatever he wants it to, that is the beauty of fantasy.

[Palathadric]

Terribly sorry for starting this whole debate. Did not know it would be such a problem. I do not think I can recall mentioning that Monk Pretzel is actually a "Christian" per se (although I may have, will have to check), although the cross and my mentioning of "church" and the like certainly point significantly to that. I will, as of now, refrain from using any mention of Christianity, etc. Although, as is the nature of my character, he shall continually attempt to persuade others to his faith and help them to attain their salvation (or whatever you want to call it, "entry into the other world" or whatever) by a small "token" let me say. I figure that references to "God" should be acceptable (am I not right?), since it could be referring to anything. I hope this is okay, and if there is need for me to change anything then please let me know.

[Tanma]

So on a hopefully less turbulent topic, I was randomly searching the internet when I found a guide to being a Rogue. It's a good laugh, at least in my opinion. The link is below, in case any of my fellow Rogues want to see the official guide book.

Link

[Scubacarrot]

Terribly sorry for starting this whole debate. Did not know it would be such a problem. I do not think I can recall mentioning that Monk Pretzel is actually a "Christian" per se (although I may have, will have to check), although the cross and my mentioning of "church" and the like certainly point significantly to that. I will, as of now, refrain from using any mention of Christianity, etc. Although, as is the nature of my character, he shall continually attempt to persuade others to his faith and help them to attain their salvation (or whatever you want to call it, "entry into the other world" or whatever) by a small "token" let me say. I figure that references to "God" should be acceptable (am I not right?), since it could be referring to anything. I hope this is okay, and if there is need for me to change anything then please let me know.

I think the easiest way to do it, and I am pretty sure everyone would be ok with it, If you make your character follow Ennoc, You wouldnt have to change anything but thats just my opinion.

[CMP]

So on a hopefully less turbulent topic, I was randomly searching the internet when I found a guide to being a Rogue. It's a good laugh, at least in my opinion. The link is below, in case any of my fellow Rogues want to see the official guide book.

Link

I'm Atramor Gibbin and I approve of this link.

[Palathadric]

Being that it is all fantasy, I guess I'll just keep my character more or less the way he is, with the few changes I did mention in my last post. If that's okay.

On a slightly different topic, I am quite interesting in all the "history", if you will, of Eubric. Where can I find...Ah, never mind, I found it.

[Scubacarrot]

I'm Atramor Gibbin and I approve of this link.

I am Guts Holla, and this is my favorite link on the Citadel.

[The Legonater]

So on a hopefully less turbulent topic, I was randomly searching the internet when I found a guide to being a Rogue. It's a good laugh, at least in my opinion. The link is below, in case any of my fellow Rogues want to see the official guide book.

Link

It's like the Evil Overlord List for Rogues.

I'm Dyric Rone, and I agree with everyone else and their semi-odd, almost-third person statements.

[CorneliusMurdock]

Cronk is Cronk and Cronk is confused because Cronk not know what "link" is. Is some kind armor, right?

[Flipz]

Cronk is Cronk and Cronk is confused because Cronk not know what "link" is. Is some kind armor, right?

No, is kind of hot taste meat roll.

BTW, do you draw any of Cronk's inspiration from Draak of Irregular Webcomic!'s Fantasy theme?

[CorneliusMurdock]

BTW, do you draw any of Cronk's inspiration from Draak of Irregular Webcomic!'s Fantasy theme?

No. I did read Irregular Webcomic! but Draak has never crossed my mind as inspiration.

Cronk^TM is entirely my idea and original intellectual property.

[Sisco]

Alright, here's a little disclaimer for my questers. I am in no way forging your results. I am using a six sided die. This die has the numbers 1,2,3,4,5, and 6 on it. The die is taken from a monopoly game, and has not been altered in any way. Your results are what you are genuinely rolling. You just all have total crap luck.

Just thought that needed to be said.

[Flipz]

Alright, here's a little disclaimer for my questers. I am in no way forging your results. I am using a six sided die. This die has the numbers 1,2,3,4,5, and 6 on it. The die is taken from a monopoly game, and has not been altered in any way. Your results are what you are genuinely rolling. You just all have total crap luck.

Just thought that needed to be said.

Well, there's your problem! Digital dice and real dice tend to deal results differently. With a real die, there's physical effects on the result, while most digital dice use a pseudorandom algorithm that's next-to-impossible to predict, but are usually tweaked to provide rolls that appear random but really aren't; if you use those sorts of PRNG dice, you can manage to get a sort of familiarity down where you can instinctively guess when a streak of good or bad luck will end, even if you can't consciously guess the result.

The moral? Use a digital die so the appearance of randomness will cause a few more positive rolls.

Seriously, though, if you're going to use physical dice ditch the Monopoly one and get something out of a different game. Everyone knows that the makers of monopoly hire evil necromancers to curse their dice with bad luck before shipping them out of the factory.*

*This is a joke added for comedic effect. I am not actually suggesting the makers of Monopoly actually, intentionally add negative metaphysical properties to their dice, I am suggesting that some outside metaphysical force is responsible for the consistently "unlucky" dice that come packaged with Monopoly games.

If you MUST use a physical Monopoly die, go for the transparent/translucent ones that come with certained themed Monopoly games, they tend to be a little more forgiving than their evil opague counterparts. I still recommend switching to a non-Monopoly die, tho.