Duvors Posted September 20, 2015 Posted September 20, 2015 What loophole are you talking about, exactly? I was talking about how the agreement not to set foot in Spesialia specifically excludes Fenaro. Quote
Flipz Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 Okay, Warlen's build is just plain disgusting. I realize a lot of it is the weapon (and the rolls with it! Holy hell, I rolled a "1" five times that Round between battle results and Hexing!), but still... Quote
The Chosen Minifigure Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 Okay, Warlen's build is just plain disgusting. I realize a lot of it is the weapon (and the rolls with it! Holy hell, I rolled a "1" five times that Round between battle results and Hexing!), but still... I love it. Weather the enemies cower in fear or attack with guns blazing, they're in trouble. Is Erik sure he won't sell that wand to Warlen? Quote
Lind Whisperer Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 I'm starting to wonder if I made a bad choice in picking the Netherwings... Of course, if I can just embed the right materials in Star-Breaker(or a subsequent halberd drop - or a subsequent halberd drop renamed Star-Breaker, etc., etc...), it should be worth it. (((X2 to Humanoids(Netherwings) + X2 to Humanoids (Star-Breaker Imbued with Amethyst)) x 2 (Encouraged(Invader Armor, Imbued with Scroll of Frailty and +2 Bright Polishes, making it equal to a suit of Heavy Armour))) x 2 (Star-Breaker Imbued with Scroll of Frailty at Dream Forge or similar smithy.) I'd need to double check Sandy's tables to make the numbers are all in the right order, but still - that's a lot of x2s... (I could of course get a better torso drop than the Invader Armor, this is just my current plan until something changes.) Quote
Flipz Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 I'm starting to wonder if I made a bad choice in picking the Netherwings... Of course, if I can just embed the right materials in Star-Breaker(or a subsequent halberd drop - or a subsequent halberd drop renamed Star-Breaker, etc., etc...), it should be worth it. (((X2 to Humanoids(Netherwings) + X2 to Humanoids (Star-Breaker Imbued with Amethyst)) x 2 (Encouraged(Invader Armor, Imbued with Scroll of Frailty and +2 Bright Polishes, making it equal to a suit of Heavy Armour))) x 2 (Star-Breaker Imbued with Scroll of Frailty at Dream Forge or similar smithy.) I'd need to double check Sandy's tables to make the numbers are all in the right order, but still - that's a lot of x2s... (I could of course get a better torso drop than the Invader Armor, this is just my current plan until something changes.) Don't build around your enemies always being Fragile; basing your build around a single negative effect is a great way to bait QMs into making their enemies immune to it (especially with Frailty in particular). Poison is the big exception to this (since Witch has it as a class feature), but even then enemies being immune to poison is not unheard of. Quote
swils Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 If you're looking to part with the Netherwings, I could be tempted to take them off your back, so to speak. Haha Quote
Lind Whisperer Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 Don't build around your enemies always being Fragile; basing your build around a single negative effect is a great way to bait QMs into making their enemies immune to it (especially with Frailty in particular). Poison is the big exception to this (since Witch has it as a class feature), but even then enemies being immune to poison is not unheard of. Thanks - I'll keep that in mind... If you're looking to part with the Netherwings, I could be tempted to take them off your back, so to speak. Haha Sorry, but I love my x2 against Humanoids too much. Even without Fragile(assuming I'm wounded past half health, and that I'm doing the math even half correctly), that's 5 x 2(Humanoid bonus) (10), x another 2 (Amethyst)(20) x still one more x 2 (Encouraged) = 40 damage from a WP: 5 weapon. Not bad. Or to be more specific and class-accurate, assuming I roll a SHIELD: Damage multipliers (elements and effects) always affect the entire sum of power, and SP is reduced after the multipliers. We've been playing for four years now, this shouldn't be news to anyone... 4x WP: (4x5 = 20)x 2 x 2 = 80 + 22 = 102 damage. Which could admittedly be higher...but that's from a WP:5 weapon. A few trips to Anwyl's, and I'll start dishing out the real damage. :devil: (Or, of course, a better halberd drop + then swapping the Amythist between the weapons...) Quote
Flipz Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 Thanks - I'll keep that in mind...Sorry, but I love my x2 against Humanoids too much. Even without Fragile(assuming I'm wounded past half health, and that I'm doing the math even half correctly), that's 5 x 2(Humanoid bonus) (10), x another 2 (Amethyst)(20) x still one more x 2 (Encouraged) = 40 damage from a WP: 5 weapon. Not bad. Or to be more specific and class-accurate, assuming I roll a SHIELD: 4x WP: (4x5 = 20)x 2 x 2 = 80 + 22 = 102 damage. Which could admittedly be higher...but that's from a WP:5 weapon. A few trips to Anwyl's, and I'll start dishing out the real damage. :devil: (Or, of course, a better halberd drop + then swapping the Amythist between the weapons...) Still not as strong as having the x2 built into the weapon itself. Or to be more precise, not as flexible. Your build is highly situational. You have to be below half health (which is dangerous), and you have to be fighting Humanoids (yes, they're the most common type, but your build is taking both an Artifact slot and a weapon slot to focus on them); if you battle at full health and/or against non-humanoid enemies, all your multipliers go away, and it would take a turn to change your equipped Artifacts. By contrast, all of Arthur's type specialization is within the weapons themselves, allowing him to swap weapons for free to suit his opponent while dumping a ton of SP into his Artifact slots (SP that applies against almost all enemies, with the exceptions of those that ignore it entirely). Not saying it's a bad build, but you're assuming ideal circumstances, which isn't the only consideration in making a solid build. Quote
Kintobor Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 What's your thoughts on Karie's build, Flipz? Quote
Lind Whisperer Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 Still not as strong as having the x2 built into the weapon itself. Or to be more precise, not as flexible. Your build is highly situational. You have to be below half health (which is dangerous), I like to think of it as "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger". Also, it makes standing at the front of the line taking free hits have some point to it - although you're right, it definitely is dangerous. Which will get less so as Lind gets more health...but then it'll also get harder to get damaged...and you have to be fighting Humanoids (yes, they're the most common type, but your build is taking both an Artifact slot and a weapon slot to focus on them); if you battle at full health and/or against non-humanoid enemies, all your multipliers go away, and it would take a turn to change your equipped Artifacts. By contrast, all of Arthur's type specialization is within the weapons themselves, allowing him to swap weapons for free to suit his opponent while dumping a ton of SP into his Artifact slots (SP that applies against almost all enemies, with the exceptions of those that ignore it entirely).I guess I and Lind just place a lot of value on each gear piece and how we got it. We don't like switching them much, so we pick the parts that matter the most to us and stick with them.I didn't embed my Ruby in Star-Breaker mostly because...well, because I was broke, but also because I wasn't/aren't entirely planning on using it as a base for a weapon build. At that point, we had no idea how Sandy might be running the Clash, and in the tiny, tiny chance there would be a Dream Forge style forge, Djinn, etc., I wanted to at least have a halberd in hand, in case there was any way Lind could wheel, deal, or barter "Inflicts Frailty" into it. Quote
Flipz Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 What's your thoughts on Karie's build, Flipz? It's a fairly good mixed set, especially compared to the only other one we've seen (Nerwen's). Minstrels aren't known for having a lot of suitable Artifacts, so you've done a good job of getting your hands on defensive gear (and of course the catsuit works wonders in avoiding damage, if the QM remembers to roll for it). I'd advise continuing to look for SP, particularly since your build does align itself well to actual attacks rather than being a songbot; a lot of my complaints about Minstrel spring from it being rather boring to watch, so having a Minstrel actually attack sometimes is always welcome. You're also a little light on immunities; if you can find something similar to the Robes of the Archmagi in Handwear or Footwear form, you'll be in good shape. I like to think of it as "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger". Also, it makes standing at the front of the line taking free hits have some point to it - although you're right, it definitely is dangerous. Which will get less so as Lind gets more health...but then it'll also get harder to get damaged... Actually, not really. Black Knight is not a tank class, it's a self-preservation class--it doesn't have a huge health pool, and because of Hide and Special Dodge you can't accurately manipulate your own health (by design, otherwise Mortal hits would escalate from a nice perk to a potential monster in the making). Moreover, half health is still half health--if an enemy can get you down to half health, then they can also take you completely out if you're sitting at half health. It's a neat perk, but it's not a good basis for a core strategy. Part of the problem as well is that by rushing through levels with the MoG, you denied yourself the time to develop a decent sized gold/loot pool, and then rather than save your resources you've spent them down in between Quests. You've also focused heavily on Artifacts over weapons or shields, meaning that your gear isn't growing with you--you have a 20s-Level character with gear better suited to a pre-15 party. Avalanche, for example, is nearly 10 levels lower than Lind, but one good Quest and he'll probably outclass him--not because the build is particularly optimized, but because that's the quality of gear Lind has. My number one criteria in making a build is flexibility; back when I was hoarding Artifacts, I was doing so with the intention of making sure I could do as many different things as possible. While I've pared down a lot since then, I still have a number of different options I can take as the situation presents itself. By contrast, Lind's build is very, very specific; he does one thing really really well, and everything else is sort of "meh". It also doesn't help that you've neglected your throwing weapon build, which is unfortunate because Black Knight is one of the better classes to use for such a build (along with Assassin); as a result, again the resources you had early on did not grow with you, which in turn leaves you weak for your Level and bracket. Quote
Khorne Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 And here I am, with two swords and a throwing weapon . My armor's kind of basic as well. The Boots of Evasion are actually my most wickedly-crazy item. I just wonder where all my Gold went and how come I got so few items compared to other people . I just can't wrap my head around it . The build isn't the most optimal and definitely not the best. I am more of an RP'er than a real fighter/strategist though. That being said, I would kill for another drop that grants Nimble . I'd love Eric to be Nimble, I think it's a cool effect. If I could pick any other Artifact, a Nimble one would most likely be it. That or a perma-Hastened or perma-Lucky Artifact. When I play RPG's (console/PC games, I never played a tabletop/pen-and-paper RPG), I always go for the light-armored, sneaky rogue combat type of character. Somehow, that's just my play style. No matter what game I play, I usually always end up with a character like that. It's kind of seeping into Eric, too. I just love speedy, nimble characters who can hit hard and bestow all kinds of nasty crap upon their opponents while trying not to get hit themselves. Tanking is totally not my play-style . Quote
Flipz Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 And here I am, with two swords and a throwing weapon . My armor's kind of basic as well. The Boots of Evasion are actually my most wickedly-crazy item. I just wonder where all my Gold went and how come I got so few items compared to other people . I just can't wrap my head around it . The build isn't the most optimal and definitely not the best. I am more of an RP'er than a real fighter/strategist though. That being said, I would kill for another drop that grants Nimble . I'd love Eric to be Nimble, I think it's a cool effect. If I could pick any other Artifact, a Nimble one would most likely be it. That or a perma-Hastened or perma-Lucky Artifact. When I play RPG's (console/PC games, I never played a tabletop/pen-and-paper RPG), I always go for the light-armored, sneaky rogue combat type of character. Somehow, that's just my play style. No matter what game I play, I usually always end up with a character like that. It's kind of seeping into Eric, too. I just love speedy, nimble characters who can hit hard and bestow all kinds of nasty crap upon their opponents while trying not to get hit themselves. Tanking is totally not my play-style . Eric hits like a truck, though, so you have that on your side. I'm going to guess most of your Gold has gone to Mead/Nostrum, since Eric's always been one of the heavier Hero's Coctail users. Quote
Khorne Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 (edited) Eric hits like a truck, though, so you have that on your side. I'm going to guess most of your Gold has gone to Mead/Nostrum, since Eric's always been one of the heavier Hero's Coctail users. Yeah, you're probably right on where my money most likely went... I know I also spent tons of Gold I earned during the glory days of Raiding on Godricsleif, which in hindsight wasn't probably the most clever thing. I should've upgraded other, more special weapons instead of my starter sword. Oh well, it is as its is, I guess . EDIT: On a totally unrelated topic: HOLY SHIT, Quest #130 started exactly on the day I joined Eurobricks 10 years ago. Woooooow ... Edited September 21, 2015 by Khorne Quote
Asphalt Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 You know, someone could make some serious money if they developed a scroll of "Undead repair." And with the fear of scything reply, what do you think of Vindsval the Poisoner and his completely Witch-0-centric build Master Flipz? Quote
Myrddyn Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 I love it. Weather the enemies cower in fear or attack with guns blazing, they're in trouble. Is Erik sure he won't sell that wand to Warlen? Yeah I'm sure, both because it's good stats-wise, but also because he got given it by the Maginastra (quest 32, basically him and Erik got on well), so RP reasons. Quote
KotZ Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 Thoughts on Kiray's build, Flipz? Or is it somewhat similar to Lind's? Quote
Pyrovisionary Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 Speaking of Black knights who're very good at one thing but may have neglected flexibility in their builds Nah, I think Flipz has enough build analysis requests for today Quote
Dragonfire Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 Avalanche, for example, is nearly 10 levels lower than Lind, but one good Quest and he'll probably outclass him--not because the build is particularly optimized, but because that's the quality of gear Lind has. Umm.... thanks One question about builds and job classes - what advanced job class do you think suits Avalanche with his current build? I was thinking Raider but am open to change... Quote
K-Nut Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 Avalanche has a very generic build at the moment. I couldn't see him going Battle Mage, but I think he could really go into any other class. Quote
Dragonfire Posted September 21, 2015 Posted September 21, 2015 Avalanche has a very generic build at the moment. I couldn't see him going Battle Mage, but I think he could really go into any other class. Yeah, all the Ether stuff has never really appealed to me - unnecessary complications IMO Quote
Kintobor Posted September 22, 2015 Posted September 22, 2015 Guard Rust Hopper Type: Beast Level: 20 Health: 110/110 Defense: 0 Special: Corroding Maw - The Rust Hopper deals 20 damage and reduces the target's SP to 1 Passive Special I: Corroding Skin - When the Rust Hopper takes physical damage, the target's WP is reduced to 1 Drops: Rust Hopper Carapace (SP: 3, Immune to SP reduction, torsowear) Those things are the worst in D&D. Quote
Waterbrick Down Posted September 22, 2015 Posted September 22, 2015 Those things are the worst in D&D. I've scared off many a well armored Paladin with just the mere threat of these things. Quote
Jebediahs Posted September 22, 2015 Posted September 22, 2015 QM Note: Actions for anybody else? Atramor does a pirate jig from the back row. Ellaria lets her hair down, loosens the top two buttons of her blouse then dumps a vial of Fortune's Flush on herself from the front row. etc. Quote
CMP Posted September 22, 2015 Posted September 22, 2015 Atramor does a pirate jig from the back row. Ellaria lets her hair down, loosens the top two buttons of her blouse then dumps a vial of Fortune's Flush on herself from the front row. etc. I vote Nur becomes the new party leader. Quote
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