Heroica RPG General Discussion

[KotZ]

That just hurts.

It's my mission in life.

[Purpearljellyblob]

This is way, WAY too friggin' common in recent Quests. WAY WAY WAY too common. Like, stupidly overcommon. Stahp. Please. Before this trend gets even worse.

It is not that common in my quest, just that the party triggered two consecutive BOSSES in a row.

OR I could have just slapped a *Immune to sudden death, enamoured, bleeding, poisoned, infected, blinded sealed* instead with the same intended effect

PLUS I am too busy in RL atm to figure out the balance.

Edited September 22, 2015 by Purpearljellyblob

[Waterbrick Down]

It is not that common in my quest, just that the party triggered two consecutive BOSSES in a row.

boss =/= immune to all negative effects. Edited September 22, 2015 by Waterbrick Down

[KotZ]

It is not that common in my quest, just that the party triggered two consecutive BOSSES in a row.

How many bosses are there? Star Elves must have an easy promotional track.

[Endgame]

How many bosses are there? Star Elves must have an easy promotional track.

Hey, I've hosted quests with 4 boss fights before (48 comes to mi d), although I guess you could say the first 3 were minibosses in comparison to the final final final boss.

[JimBee]

Firestomach's left wing looks oddly feline...

[Zepher]

Firestomach's left wing looks oddly feline...

In regards to Q136, I think perhaps we should try to all lay off of judging quests while they're running a little. With all due respect to outsiders, what's most important to a quest is the enjoyment of both the players and the QM. If it were a first time QM and newbie players, then it might need advice, but CMP and I have quite a few battles under our belt from both sides of this, and we can speak up (and indeed did speak up) in regards to the battle. So maybe save all of that extraneous commentary until the end, when it's time for the QM and players to both comment and learn.

[Flipz]

It is not that common in my quest, just that the party triggered two consecutive BOSSES in a row.

OR I could have just slapped a *Immune to sudden death, enamoured, bleeding, poisoned, infected, blinded sealed* instead with the same intended effect

PLUS I am too busy in RL atm to figure out the balance.

In regards to Q136, I think perhaps we should try to all lay off of judging quests while they're running a little. With all due respect to outsiders, what's most important to a quest is the enjoyment of both the players and the QM. If it were a first time QM and newbie players, then it might need advice, but CMP and I have quite a few battles under our belt from both sides of this, and we can speak up (and indeed did speak up) in regards to the battle. So maybe save all of that extraneous commentary until the end, when it's time for the QM and players to both comment and learn.

See my earlier quote:

For clarity, I'm not complaining about a specific fight, I'm complaining that I'm seeing this across a LOT of recent fights, to the point where it's almost a common occurrence. That robs the technique of its power (instead of making the enemy intimidating, it makes me go "oh, look, the QM must like that one", the whole "when everyone's super" deal), and it makes battles BORING, which is something that in my opinion should be avoided at all costs.

Examples:

Sterope, the Queen of the Sirens

*Attacks cause hexed* *Immune to negative effects and sudden death*

Farfarello, the Demon Puppeteer

*Absorbs darkness* *Immune to all negative effects and sudden death*

Bellerai Fire-Stomach

Level 120 Ancient *Immune to Fire, Negative Effects, and Instant Kill* *Immune to Effects*

Sven

Level 102 Humanoid *Immune to Negative Effects, Fire, Wind, Earth and Instant Death*

link to Quest 129 final battle because Pie's locking the topic prevents me from quoting it

Void Eater

*Immune to all negative effects and sudden death*

Type: Ethereal

Left Claw

*Immune to all negative effects and sudden death*

Type: Ethereal

Right Claw

*Immune to all negative effects and sudden death*

Type: Ethereal

Fester *Immune to Sudden Death and All Negative Effects*

Type: Etheral

Gomex *Immune to Sudden Death and All Negative Effects*

Type: Etheral

Lurch *Immune to Sudden Death and All Negative Effects*

Type: Etheral

Morticia *Immune to Sudden Death and All Negative Effects*

Type: Etheral

Wednesday *Immune to Sudden Death and All Negative Effects*

Type: Etheral

Eudora *Immune to Sudden Death and All Negative Effects*

Type: Etheral

Pubert *Immune to Sudden Death and All Negative Effects*

Type: Etheral

Pugsley *Immune to Sudden Death and All Negative Effects*

Type: Etheral

That's at least 17 instances in the past six months alone (that's three per month!), from at least four different QMs, and I'm almost certain there's more examples I've missed.

It's not just 136, and I wasn't intending to speak directly to it; in fact, when I first made my complaint, I hadn't even realized that all of the enemies had that immunity, I'd only noticed it on the first one. Again, my complaint is not with a specific battle or Quest, my complaint is with overuse of *Immune to Negative Effects* as a trend. That's also not to say *Immune to Negative Effects* never has a place; some of the examples I've listed make perfect sense mechanically and/or story-wise. However, it's getting overused a LOT, and it's important that we stay aware of the trend.

[Palathadric]

Pretzels are best served warm, with pub mustard.

No, Seriously? Ugh!

[Scubacarrot]

Have people considered something like: "resistant to negative effects"? For example, all chances for negative effects would be halved.

I can see both sides of the issue. On the one hand, there are the players, especially assassins and classes with effect giving shields or other rolls, that are basically devaluated by the Immune to effects, immune to instant kill thing. But as a QM, you have a challenging battle to produce, and considering an assassin with a multi attack weapon has either a 1/6 or a 1/3 chance to kill anything, that's annoying, bypassing all the numbers, or a party trivializing what in the story should be a hard battle with a pumpkin bomb or something. I think "resistant" might solve those problems, making effects (and instant kill) harder to pull off on your elite enemies, while still allowing the party to deal them out. How it would work is half the chance for any effects, so 1/6 would be 1/12 and so on. A 100% chance (from a bomb for example) would become 50%. What do people think?

Edited September 23, 2015 by Scubacarrot

[Palathadric]

It's my mission in life.

No love. No love.

[StickFig]

Have people considered something like: "resistant to negative effects"? For example, all chances for negative effects would be halved.

That's a really interesting idea!

snip

Care to give Matthias some advice on how to spend the gold that's burning a hole in his pocket?

[Flipz]

Have people considered something like: "resistant to negative effects"? For example, all chances for negative effects would be halved.

I can see both sides of the issue. On the one hand, there are the players, especially assassins and classes with effect giving shields or other rolls, that are basically devaluated by the Immune to effects, immune to instant kill thing. But as a QM, you have a challenging battle to produce, and considering an assassin with a multi attack weapon has either a 1/6 or a 1/3 chance to kill anything, that's annoying, bypassing all the numbers, or a party trivializing what in the story should be a hard battle with a pumpkin bomb or something. I think "resistant" might solve those problems, making effects (and instant kill) harder to pull off on your elite enemies, while still allowing the party to deal them out. How it would work is half the chance for any effects, so 1/6 would be 1/12 and so on. A 100% chance (from a bomb for example) would become 50%. What do people think?

Well, before I say anything else, I will say that I think effect-applying bombs should only have a 50% application rate for effects (with the exception of the Alchemist-made bombs, to make them more useful compared to their more common Marketplace counterparts); effect bombs have the same problem that Nanny's Lullaby has: the player declares their action, and the enemies are automatically crippled without even a roll.

I like the idea of effect resistance on enemies, a lot actually. That said, it's still not a "one size fits all" solution. See my post in the QM Lounge for more thoughts on the matter.

...maybe I should move that last bit to the QM Lounge. One sec. done.

Edited September 23, 2015 by Flipz

[Sandy]

I'm fully back online now, since the internet modem for my new flat just arrived today. Expect updates soon!

[Lind Whisperer]

Is anyone drafting any mid-level quests?

[KotZ]

Is anyone drafting any mid-level quests?

I'm in the very early stages of drafting one right now. How come?

[Lind Whisperer]

I'm in the very early stages of drafting one right now. How come?

I'm debating hosting another one, and was seeing if anyone else was planning on it as well - also, the board's been dreadfully empty for quite some time now.

[Endgame]

There's been something of a drought.

[KotZ]

I'm debating hosting another one, and was seeing if anyone else was planning on it as well - also, the board's been dreadfully empty for quite some time now.

I haven't really followed the Hall since 136. Is the hall itself pretty dead? I felt like lots of people are out on quests at the moment.

[Kintobor]

There's been something of a drought.

Not really. Most people are on quests. The only people in the hall to my knowledge are Karie, Lind, and Quintessa.

[Flipz]

Not really. Most people are on quests. The only people in the hall to my knowledge are Karie, Lind, and Quintessa.

There's also Thalion, but he's been super quiet...

[Waterbrick Down]

Skrall's back as well, but I tend not to do anything with both characters at once unless he's really compelled to speak.

[Sandy]

Have people considered something like: "resistant to negative effects"? For example, all chances for negative effects would be halved.

That's a very interesting idea. I myself have been rolling with an actual, physical die, so I've tried to keep all success rates as 1/2, 1/3, 2/3 or 1/6. But any QM is free to give this idea a try!

Well, before I say anything else, I will say that I think effect-applying bombs should only have a 50% application rate for effects (with the exception of the Alchemist-made bombs, to make them more useful compared to their more common Marketplace counterparts); effect bombs have the same problem that Nanny's Lullaby has: the player declares their action, and the enemies are automatically crippled without even a roll.

I disagree. Once you use a bomb, it's gone forever. While they are quite cheap in the Marketplace, they're not very common as quest drops (since QMs hate them, I know). Most effects only last for a short period of time, anyway, so adding even more variables to them is overcomplicating things.

[JimBee]

I like the resistant to negative effects idea. Pie used something similar in his quests, *1/6 chance to avoid instakill*. It worked pretty well I think.

Nerwen approaches a door stamped with shining sun. The golem, standing nearly unnoticed by the door swivels its head to fix its gaze on her. She shows her letter and it returns to passivity.

Stepping inside the Sungold Shop she pins a golden badge to her chest and then purchases 2 bright polishes, for 500 gold.

She also speaks quietly to the servant at the counter.

Nerwen Calmcacil casts her six votes for Lorcan.

With that done she steps out.

Any explanation for these moves? Out of curiosity.

[Scubacarrot]

Any explanation for these moves? Out of curiosity.

Got to get those Bright Polishes before their price is corrected.