Heroica RPG General Discussion

[Flipz]

So let us resurrect a hotly contested topic of old. What is the best gem combination for a weapon?

It depends on what you want to do. In my case, I've built separate weapons that specialize in damage against specific types of enemies (my 4x vs Humanoids, my 8x vs Flying, etc.), but there's also such a thing as a general-purpose weapon, where you sometimes sacrifice a 2x or 4x against a certain enemy type in order to be able to hit more different types of enemies (For example, putting a Ruby into a weapon with an Aquamarine sacrifices the 2x against Fiery and Rock, but gives you all of the additional effectiveness of the Ruby while still letting you hit Fiery and Rock for neutral damage).

Numerically, Opal-Topaz hits the most types super-effective for the least number of ineffective types (6 super-effectives vs. 2 ineffectives) out of any two-gem combo, and Icy and Electric are still among the least common enemy types, but with Aquatic and Mechanical enemies becoming increasingly scarce the overall meta has switched over to Opal-Ruby, which gets 4x on Beasts and Plants and 2x on Vermin while eliminating the Icy weakness entirely. To that combo I'd personally add either an Aquamarine (to, as said before, turn the Fiery and Rock weaknesses neutral in exchange for a single Aquatic weakness) or a Garnet (which also neutralizes the Firey weakness, but doubles down on Rock while gaining a Flying weakness, in exchange for making Icy an x2 again and getting a 2x on Electric).

Again, though, it does depend on the weapon and the rest of your loadout; while normally I'd lean towards Opal-Ruby-Aquamarine just because of how I prioritize my effectiveness, once I buy the Frozen Halberd off of Guts I'll imbue it with Opal, Ruby, and Garnet, because a.) it already has a 0x against rock from the weapon itself, so I'm not losing anything there by putting in the Ruby and Garnet, and b.) I already have a weapon that lets me deal with Flying-types, so the Icy Halberd being unable to hit them is not a problem for me. Ultimately, you have to tailor your specific weapons to your specific needs.

[Lind Whisperer]

I notice you don't have Amethysts listed in any of those combos...

[dum]

The party and the ambassadors head out in front of the Judgment Hall to meet Immortalis.

"Have you chosen?"

"No. My verdict is not yet made. I have just finished the last judgment half an hour ago... I don't want to make a snap judgment. Return home to your families, they must miss you. Tomorrow, the sky shall be entirely clear, should I choose one of you to lead. If you see rain tomorrow, then you know my choice has been made."

Charon tears open a portal.

"Go home, heroes, ambassadors. Thank you for coming, and I hope you enjoyed your stay here."

That's not the end of the quest, is it?

[Lind Whisperer]

That's not the end of the quest, is it?

For those on standby in 147 sidequests, hopefully just a day or two more before we finish Act 1 (of 3) for Judgment Day.

[Endgame]

It's basically the end of the first bit!

[JimBee]

So let us resurrect a hotly contested topic of old. What is the best gem combination for a weapon?

What Flipz said about multiple weapons vs. single weapon combos. See the SOAH for an ideal setup in my mind. the Ruby/Opal combination is a must-have for the 4x multiplier on Beasts (which are fairly common), and I like a Sapphire in there too to double up on the Vermin multiplier (also very common). Darkness-elemental weapons are obviously the most powerful because Humanoid enemies are by far the most common. Vermin/Humanoid, Vermin/Beast and Beast/Humanoid enemies also appear now and then so a weapon like that will have massive multipliers.

I think the general idea is to have Ruby/Sapphire/Opal/Amethyst in one weapon and Emerald/Aquamarine/Diamond/Topaz/Garnet in another. I've personally never found a good use for the second combination in a single weapon, but some characters have stuck to this two-weapon rule before (Skrall, Benji off the top of my head).

I personally like having a pure light-elemental weapon on hand in case you go on a Pie quest and he throws Undead/Ethereal enemies at you like no one's business. I learned from #98 and kept Iustitia pure light-elemental for #129, and it paid off.

On principle I would keep diamonds and amethysts separate. Guts' Mythril Edge has both and it's had use in almost every situation, but I prefer otherwise.

[Flipz]

What Flipz said about multiple weapons vs. single weapon combos. See the SOAH for an ideal setup in my mind. the Ruby/Opal combination is a must-have for the 4x multiplier on Beasts (which are fairly common), and I like a Sapphire in there too to double up on the Vermin multiplier (also very common). Darkness-elemental weapons are obviously the most powerful because Humanoid enemies are by far the most common. Vermin/Humanoid, Vermin/Beast and Beast/Humanoid enemies also appear now and then so a weapon like that will have massive multipliers.

I think the general idea is to have Ruby/Sapphire/Opal/Amethyst in one weapon and Emerald/Aquamarine/Diamond/Topaz/Garnet in another. I've personally never found a good use for the second combination in a single weapon, but some characters have stuck to this two-weapon rule before (Skrall, Benji off the top of my head).

I personally like having a pure light-elemental weapon on hand in case you go on a Pie quest and he throws Undead/Ethereal enemies at you like no one's business. I learned from #98 and kept Iustitia pure light-elemental for #129, and it paid off.

On principle I would keep diamonds and amethysts separate. Guts' Mythril Edge has both and it's had use in almost every situation, but I prefer otherwise.

I actually like mono-Dark weapons along with mono-Light; there's more than a few Dark/Beast or Ethereal/Humanoid types out there, and that'll eat into your multipliers (particularly on Zepher quests). Zeph also likes his humanoid enemies being immune to Fire and Ice a lot (as in *immune to Fire*), so splitting up your combos helps keep you from being stonewalled quite so hard.

Emerald is probably the worst elemental type in the game; it has two elemental strengths that fail to complement each other (Emerald/Topaz would do okay on Aquatic if it weren't for all the Aquatic Vermin, and Emerald/Aquamarine gives you 4x on Rock but then negates Emerald's other elemental strength), and it has two extremely common weaknesses that quickly nullify most of the advantage you'll get out of it. I legitimately can't think of a circumstance where I'd put an emerald into a weapon and be happy with the decision, at best it's a strong roleplaying element for Mages' Spellcasting ability (vine ladders, trees for climbing/cover, growing crops to make NPCs like you, etc.).

[KotZ]

See quests 66, 90, 103, and 109, mixed parties can be very difficult to balance for.

It's possible, especially if you split the party, but I agree. It is a pain.

[Zepher]

Updates will come from me starting Friday, I'm sorry to keep this dragging forever.

[Rider Raider]

If they let out around May, I might have something...

WBD posted it on April 1st and said that it would take around a month. You would have to ask Pala about 145.

[Flipz]

Hey, Zeph, minor question, did we get a full level from that final battle or just normal experience? I'm trying to get all my stats in order and I've lost the post where you stated it.

[Flipz]

OoC: I'll post final stats later this evening! Everyone will have gained normal exp. from the battle. As for the gems, I did say that they could be merged with weapons! It seems a little much to me though, to have that powerful of a weapon, so I think I will rule that only one etherial gem may be merged per weapon. I think that will balance things out without totally nuking the advantages of the gems. As always, I'm willing to negotiate if you all think that's unfair. I'm just thinking of the potential future headaches of QMs, myself included, balancing for a weapon that can make an enemy slowed and fragile and weak and enraged and bound all in one go.

Could it pretty pretty please be 2 Ethereal Gems per weapon? That seems like a fair compromise between effort/resources spent on the gems and not being completely OP.

[Endgame]

As a chronic QM, 1 is plenty. Imagine if someone got Blindness and Sealed on one weapon? It'd be a nightmare.

[UsernameMDM]

True. I'd hate for other PCs to be punished with Immunity overloaded enemies because a few PCs have ethereal gem weapons.

Kind of wish this was put out there to begin with though.

[CMP]

One seems like enough.

True. I'd hate for other PCs to be punished with Immunity overloaded enemies because a few PCs have ethereal gem weapons.

Yeah, this too. The more effects one weapon deals, the less I'm gonna wanna deal with it.

[Zepher]

Kind of wish this was put out there to begin with though.

Absolutely agree. It was not my original intention - I was going to allow for as many as the player wanted, but the more I thought about it the more I thought that just wouldn't be fair to my fellow QMs.

[UsernameMDM]

That's fine Zeph, no worries.

[CMP]

...but the more I thought about it the more I thought that just wouldn't be fair to my fellow QMs.

This is something more QMs need to keep in mind when designing items, I think, otherwise inevitably it'll lead to something getting nerfed or changed.

Or else the QM will have to think up of creative solutions to get around it.

Instant kill venom...

[Flipz]

As a chronic QM, 1 is plenty. Imagine if someone got Blindness and Sealed on one weapon? It'd be a nightmare.

In fairness, only Mages can create Ethereal Diamond/Amethyst, and for once those gems seem to be in short supply.

*sigh* I understand trying to keep it balanced, it's just more than a little frustrating to have over a month's planning and deals all fall through at the last minute. I could have saved myself a lot of stressing over resources if I'd known ahead of time.

At the very least, can Ethereal Gems in Artifacts not be limited? I don't see how it'd be all that different than all the other Artifacts players have built up over the years that are immune to a bunch of elements and a bunch of effects as well.

[CMP]

He counts out 150 gold coins and hands them to the Thief. Curiously the pouch he usually kept exactly 150 gold coins in was mysteriously absent. That never seems to happen around here.

He should've just paid with two 75 gold pouches.

[Asphalt]

Ohh the 75 count pouches. Forgot about those.

[samurai-turtle]

I thought they were magic. And hold any amount you want.

[K-Nut]

Hey, if you guys have extras I could make use of them.

[Palathadric]

I jump on Althior's bandwagon.

[samurai-turtle]

He should've just paid with two 75 gold pouches.

Come to think about maybe he did, maybe he did.