Heroica RPG General Discussion

[JimBee]

Why are the items so class-exclusive to begin with? The class descriptions in the first post of this topic say which classes can use which items. I'd encourage you to stick to those guidelines, Bricksandparts. It would make it a lot easier to determine who can use what.

[Darkdragon]

I thought we need to get Sandy's prior approval for artifacts.

[Scubacarrot]

Why are the items so class-exclusive to begin with? The class descriptions in the first post of this topic say which classes can use which items. I'd encourage you to stick to those guidelines, Bricksandparts. It would make it a lot easier to determine who can use what.

To be honest, I don't see a reason to put a class restriction on artifacts at all, for most of them, at least. (Obvious exceptions being things like quivers, and the Witch Amulet)

[CMP]

To be honest, I don't see a reason to put a class restriction on artifacts at all, for most of them, at least. (Obvious exceptions being things like quivers, and the Witch Amulet)

Most all of them are suitable for anyone - most QMs don't even bother saying so in their descriptions. A few exceptions are Doc's cloaks/robes, the Sand Worm Hide, and the Warrior's Treads, off the top of my head.

[Scubacarrot]

Most all of them are suitable for anyone - most QMs don't even bother saying so in their descriptions. A few exceptions are Doc's cloaks/robes, the Sand Worm Hide, and the Warrior's Treads, off the top of my head.

I guess it is a way to steer the party in getting equal(ish) loot, but in this case, I really don't see the point.

[TheBoyWonder]

I wish to add a point about the loot. It seems an awful lot for 3 level 6 enemies against a party who are all high levels.

[JimBee]

I'm referring more to weapons. Obviously only certain classes should be able to use certain weapons, as said in the class descriptions.

[Jebediahs]

To be honest, I don't see a reason to put a class restriction on artifacts at all, for most of them, at least. (Obvious exceptions being things like quivers, and the Witch Amulet)

In my next quest I plan on having items non-suitable for Alfs and Johons.

[Kadabra]

In my next quest I plan on having items non-suitable for Alfs and Johons.

An excellent idea. My first Quest shall have the party restriction, "We're looking for any and all able Heroes, Alfs and Johons excluded."

I mean seriously? First that's a ridiculous amount of loot for an easy battle, second, the shield is OP, and third, those items are ridiculously specific and slightly overcomplicated. A shield that can't be used from the back row? AQ throwing weapon that causes random status effects and not damage? Why ot just give it a weak starting WP and slap on a Stun condition?

[Bricksandparts]

I was referring to the fact that Raiders can't use shields. If you got the idea from Hunt for the Draugr, then list it as an artifact, like that one was.

Oh, I thought everyone realized it was an artifact.

[CMP]

Oh, I thought everyone realized it was an artifact.

We can't assume anything, your items are ridiculously complicated. How is 1 earth elemental damage going to affect anything, and why can it only be used for Berserkers? Why can only Raiders use a shield artifact? How does the Quick Bow work? Does the Steel-Plated Quiver work on hand cannons or other ranged weapons?

[Sisco]

Okay guys, I think that that's enough bashing on Bricksandparts. It's pretty hard being a QM, and even harder making interesting and balanced loot. Sometimes there's a misfire. Just call them out on it and leave it at that. No need to beat the dead horse with a stick.

[CMP]

Okay guys, I think that that's enough bashing on Bricksandparts. It's pretty hard being a QM, and even harder making interesting and balanced loot. Sometimes there's a misfire. Just call them out on it and leave it at that. No need to beat the dead horse with a stick.

I'm personally not trying to bash him, it's just important to clearly word what an item does, I'm confused on several of the effects.

[Sisco]

I'm personally not trying to bash him, it's just important to clearly word what an item does, I'm confused on several of the effects.

I was meaning more this type of post:

I mean seriously? First that's a ridiculous amount of loot for an easy battle, second, the shield is OP, and third, those items are ridiculously specific and slightly overcomplicated. A shield that can't be used from the back row? AQ throwing weapon that causes random status effects and not damage? Why ot just give it a weak starting WP and slap on a Stun condition?

Just a lot of negativity here.

[Bricksandparts]

Like Sisco said, can you guys understand that being a QM is not an easy job? Balancing loot and battles is no easy task, let alone hosting a quest at all. I'm sorry that this caused so much trouble, I didn't mean for it to be so OP and all, can anyone at least think about the other person's point of view? I don't understand why Jeb has so much Negativity towards me, the only thing I could possibly have seen was that I jumped off the stairs in the hall and that's when Nur started to dislike me. I don't know why Jeb has shown disrespect to me almost everywhere our paths cross. I can understand some of the questions about the items and all, but just mocking someone and saying 'In my next quest I plan on having items non-suitable for Alfs and Johons.' just puts a bad name onto you, no one likes that, it's not funny, it's just mean . I try my best to make interesting items but try to keep it balanced. Can anyone just listen to the wise old saying and don't judge your neighbor until you walk a mile in their moccasins?

Now to answer some questions:

How is 1 earth elemental damage going to affect anything, and why can it only be used for Berserkers?

I wanted to make an item for advanced classes, and berserkers seemed the most suited for wielding axes.

Why can only Raiders use a shield artifact? How does the Quick Bow work? Does the Steel-Plated Quiver work on hand cannons or other ranged weapons?

Yet again I wanted to make a advanced class item, and when I think of raiders I think of them wielding shields. I suppose bringing it to an any-class item.

How does the Quick Bow work?

It allows a hero to have an 1 extra action per battle.

Does the Steel-Plated Quiver work on hand cannons or other ranged weapons?

I had trouble giving the description to this item, I suppose a better description would be any non-magical (spells, scrolls, etc.)

[swils]

I can understand some of the questions about the items and all, but just mocking someone and saying 'In my next quest I plan on having items non-suitable for Alfs and Johons.

Oh, come now, it was at least a -little- funny (the first time). It was contextually applicable, and didn't seem malicious.

I know that hosting is no easy task, nor is balancing your content (both for your own quest, and for the game as a whole), especially when it comes to interesting items and mechanics. For my own part, I do think this was a lot of loot (not to touch on the mechanics at all) for such a fight. Consider the Risk vs Reward presented in that fight. Additionally, items with unique effects should remain fairly few and far between, or else everyone and their imaginary friend will have them, and they lose their uniqueness, which was part of their appeal in the first place.

And, just to spin things a little, consider the ripple effect that your items will have on the rest of the game. Other QMs will have to remember or at least deal with these items and their mechanics once they are carried beyond the realm of your quests. You've already noted that being a QM can be a challenge at times, do you really want to make things that much more complicated for other QMs?

I really do understand and appreciate your intentions, your desire to keep things fresh and interesting, and encourage you to continue to do so. Just, perhaps reel it in a wee bit?

[Bricksandparts]

Oh, come now, it was at least a -little- funny (the first time). It was contextually applicable, and didn't seem malicious.

I know that hosting is no easy task, nor is balancing your content (both for your own quest, and for the game as a whole), especially when it comes to interesting items and mechanics. For my own part, I do think this was a lot of loot (not to touch on the mechanics at all) for such a fight. Consider the Risk vs Reward presented in that fight. Additionally, items with unique effects should remain fairly few and far between, or else everyone and their imaginary friend will have them, and they lose their uniqueness, which was part of their appeal in the first place.

And, just to spin things a little, consider the ripple effect that your items will have on the rest of the game. Other QMs will have to remember or at least deal with these items and their mechanics once they are carried beyond the realm of your quests. You've already noted that being a QM can be a challenge at times, do you really want to make things that much more complicated for other QMs?

I really do understand and appreciate your intentions, your desire to keep things fresh and interesting, and encourage you to continue to do so. Just, perhaps reel it in a wee bit?

I totally understand this. I would be much happier to respond to a comment like this than things that just act like I'm a douchebag like Jeb seems to think I am. I understand that this was more loot than what should have been rewarded. I'll narrow it down for the other parts of this dungeon.

[Kadabra]

I apologize for my harshness, and I understand that hosting can be a pain (It's been tough just planning my Quest and I haven't even got to host it yet ). I guess I was just frustrated by the OP items you've produced, like these, the Jo-No tree (not just the original seeds, the whole thing in general), the Fire Amulet, etc., as well as you're repeated OOC only posts on Quests and tendency to post without fully reading the thread and lashed out. It was uncool and immature of me, as I know roleplaying can be difficult if you're new, especially when stats and such get involved, and the option to just skim through and only look at things that concern us or to create OP items and abilities just for the "cool" factor can be tempting. I hope you forgive me.

[Bricksandparts]

I apologize for my harshness, and I understand that hosting can be a pain (It's been tough just planning my Quest and I haven't even got to host it yet ). I guess I was just frustrated by the OP items you've produced, like these, the Jo-No tree (not just the original seeds, the whole thing in general), the Fire Amulet, etc., as well as you're repeated OOC only posts on Quests and tendency to post without fully reading the thread and lashed out. It was uncool and immature of me, as I know roleplaying can be difficult if you're new, especially when stats and such get involved, and the option to just skim through and only look at things that concern us or to create OP items and abilities just for the "cool" factor can be tempting. I hope you forgive me.

Of course I forgive you! *Internet hug* I know we all make mistakes, no one's perfect, and I know that I have lashed out on others on and off this site, and I hope they forgive me. I know I did this to Xarrzan because I thought the quest was almost over and I wanted to get back in time for the Dastan quests, I hope he forgives me also.

[Kadabra]

[swils]

Just as a friendly reminder for all QMs (I don't want you to feel like I'm picking on you, B&P ), there is nothing wrong with rewards of gold or 'vendor-trash'. Who could possibly not love gold? Everybody loves gold! Gold enables people to advance their characters (in terms of items and strength, as opposed to character-development) parallel to, or in between, quests. Had I not acquired a shiny pair of axes on my first quest, I would have taken my earnings and had Anwyl sharpen up Thormanil's rusty, dull old greataxe, restoring some of its former head-cleaving glory! With gold, people can barter for those coveted artifacts. Further, gold enables people to load their characters' packs up with consumables, enabling QMs to design more interesting and challenging encounters balanced around the assumption that there will be a gratuitous use of those consumables, something which, to this point, we haven't ever really seen (but really should).

If you've played any of the Final Fantasy games, or similar RPGs, you'll know what it's like to use Potions and Ethers every few turns. It's a very successful mechanic, if I do say so myself.

[Flipz]

Just as a friendly reminder for all QMs (I don't want you to feel like I'm picking on you, B&P ), there is nothing wrong with rewards of gold or 'vendor-trash'. Who could possibly not love gold? Everybody loves gold! Gold enables people to advance their characters (in terms of items and strength, as opposed to character-development) parallel to, or in between, quests. Had I not acquired a shiny pair of axes on my first quest, I would have taken my earnings and had Anwyl sharpen up Thormanil's rusty, dull old greataxe, restoring some of its former head-cleaving glory! With gold, people can barter for those coveted artifacts. Further, gold enables people to load their characters' packs up with consumables, enabling QMs to design more interesting and challenging encounters balanced around the assumption that there will be a gratuitous use of those consumables, something which, to this point, we haven't ever really seen (but really should).

If you've played any of the Final Fantasy games, or similar RPGs, you'll know what it's like to use Potions and Ethers every few turns. It's a very successful mechanic, if I do say so myself.

To add to this: Gold lets Heroes develop their characters' abilities the way they want. To be sure, "unique" items are great, but too much can cause a Hero to be playing by an almost completely different set of rules than other Heroes.

Of course, there's a player side aspect of this as well; trying to become too rich or "all-powerful" is irritating to other players, and can give the impression that you're just there to kill stuff and not to role-play and interact with other peoples' stories and characters. My general (player-side) rule of thumb for mechanically developing a Hero is: pick one or two, possibly three mechanical "quirks" to go after, and aside from that, focus on story. Arasmyth is a good example; he's centered his character around being an aeromancer, and even though the Emerald in Quest 17 would have made him more powerful, he's "finished" that aspect of himself and is focusing more on his character's story and personality. For Arthur, I've chosen to make him a Scroll mage (which is why I get somewhat feverish whenever I see a new kind of Scroll ), and to get him the three "super-effective" gems (Opal, Amethyst, and eventually Topaz). Beyond that, I may see something that catches my eye, but mostly I plan to just fuel up on consumables and the occasional weapon upgrade as necessary, and focus on the story.

"Great! Finally we can wash this dirt off!" Namyrra then proceeded to take off all her clothes, jump into the tub and scrub herself vigorously.

"Ha ha! Bathtub! Not as good as a lake, but hey!" Armour and leather go flying and Tesni took a leap into the tub.

Cue Maurice walking in...

[Darth Nihilus]

Cue Maurice walking in...

Well, neither of them bothered to shut the door, so both the other Heroes and everyone else in the building can still see them.....

[Tanma]

Thank Mata-Nui there is a second Rogue on Quest 29, as De'kra is really bad at it.

[Waterbrick Down]

I think a semi-fix to OP and unique items is to not have them as drops but as stuff available to be bought at specialty shops and then let more of the drops be consumables, gold, and once in a while an artifact. The trick is letting your PC's decide to either part with their money now or save it for what may be something better down the road. Or you can always insert your neighborhood friendly loan shark to give them access to funds at a price.