Rick Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 I wish it weren't so. It seems to me like insults have been a much more important part of every game recently. It hasn't always been so, has EB Mafia become too competitive? Friendly insults between people who know each other well are one thing, but nowadays it seems like inexperienced players are quite often the target. I know it can be considered a strategy -- it's just not one I feel comfortable using and I'm not sure I like the tangent our games are taking. EB is supposed to be a friendly place and it seems like roleplay has become an excuse for overstepping the normal limits of acceptable behaviour. And this is not directed at one player specifically, we all know it's a spreading issue. Somehow I feel like repeating myself, I'm sure I wrote something very similar a couple of months ago. Well, it looks like it needs repeating. I agree with you wholeheartedly. We really, really wanted this to be a fun and funny Mafia game for everyone, and we're really very disappointed that so many people have been insulted and insulting; in some cases both. I think it is a fun and funny game for the majority of people. I sure enjoy watching it from the afterlife. You're brilliant hosts and I realise it's virtually impossible to do something about the insults. That's the responsibility of the players themselves.
Tamamono Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 Kiel, what I said was incredibly out of line and I'm am very, very, very sorry. Despite my better judgement, I let my emotions get the best of me. Please don't leave mafia. You are a very important part of the community, a really awesome team player, and most importantly to me, a very good friend. I'm very sorry that I said such hurtful things to you. I lost sight of the difference between in-game trash talk and real personal insults. If anyone should be leaving mafia, it's me. I'm also very sorry to our hosts, Rufus and Pandora, for making this game Day not fun for so many people by being downright nasty to KielDaMan and for bringing up such metagame-y topics in-thread. You two have done truly an amazing job on this game, and it's been both hilarious and fun. Mean-spirited insults like what I said have no place in a game, and such a great game at that. I hope we can all get past this and be friendly again, but I completely understand if we can't. What I said was much worse than most arguments I've seen in mafia games. Not only that, but it was also incredibly hypocritical. All too often do I see myself going down the road of insults when somebody is on the chopping block (like Sandy on Day 2 of this game - sorry again for that, Sandy). But yes, once again, I am very, very sorry for the hurtful things I said, KielDaMan. I hope you can forgive me.
Hinckley Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 Hey everyone. Could everyone do me a favor and keep this all in perspective? I would love to see this worked out. There are more important things in life than what happens in a Eurobricks mafia game. It would mean a lot to me if you guys can patch things up in game and outside the game. These sorts of things are bound to happen in games like this. But keep it in perspective. These games are fun. We're all good people. I apologize for adding any of the insulting and arguing to the games myself. While there's a legitimate tactic to it and it's part of the games sometimes, it wasn't the best way for me to lead by example. Attacking people's personal character (as opposed to their in-game character) is totally inappropriate as offense or defense. It's important to learn the difference and figure out how it works as a tactic. Attacking people is hurtful, so please don't do it. I'll pleas one more time for sanity and friendship. It really would mean a lot to me if Tammo and Kiel could patch this up and forgive each other. It's not worth it for any of you to take the game so seriously, but it's worth it to be empathetic to each other's feelings. We are a community and responsible for one another. Either way, after you log off of Eurobricks, make sure to find the people you love in real life and tell them that you love them. That's what's really important. EDIT: Oh, what d'ya know? You guys seem to have done that while I was typing. It's incredibly difficult for us to comment until after the game. We really, really wanted this to be a fun and funny Mafia game for everyone, and we're really very disappointed that so many people have been insulted and insulting; in some cases both. Thank you for your (and others) kind compliments. I think it is still a fun and funny game, but it also has the excellent distinction of bringing this bad habit insulting issue to the service. So it's an excellent game for many many reasons.
XimenaPaulina Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 It really would mean a lot to me if Tammo and Kiel could patch this up and forgive each other. It's not worth it for any of you to take the game so seriously, but it's worth it to be empathetic to each other's feelings. We are a community and responsible for one another. We're ok now. But like what I've said to Tammo privately, I have been thinking about "taking a break" from these games (even without this incident) since it's pretty much clear that my brash playing attitude isn't fit for the friendly playing atmosphere that EB is trying to promote and foster. I remember when you pointed out in one of the earlier days that there are people behind the scenes who are not at all amused by the way I'm playing. I'm well aware that there are several (or even lots) of people who don't like playing with me, and who find my in-game insults rude, uncivilized, and inappropriate. Taken out of context, yes, but spoken by the character within the bounds of the game? I guess that's where the difference in player's school of thoughts lie, and I think my pathological competitiveness isn't cut out for EB's mafia games. Like what Foog pointed out earlier, the insults being part of the recent games is spreading, and I acknowledge the fact that I've been part of the problem that's why it's best I step out for a while. I appreciate the kind words that others had for me, but I realize I'm not the best role model for a good mafia player and there are other better, proven, and more well-mannered EB players that the new players should try to emulate. Rufus/Pandora, I apologize for messing up your otherwise truly fantastic game. It has been a truly fun and funny game from the very start, and you've truly done a wonderful job as hosts.
Hinckley Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 We're ok now. But like what I've said to Tammo privately, I have been thinking about "taking a break" from these games (even without this incident) since it's pretty much clear that my brash playing attitude isn't fit for the friendly playing atmosphere that EB is trying to promote and foster. I remember when you pointed out in one of the earlier days that there are people behind the scenes who are not at all amused by the way I'm playing. I'm well aware that there are several (or even lots) of people who don't like playing with me, and who find my in-game insults rude, uncivilized, and inappropriate. Taken out of context, yes, but spoken by the character within the bounds of the game? I guess that's where the difference in player's school of thoughts lie, and I think my pathological competitiveness isn't cut out for EB's mafia games. Like what Foog pointed out earlier, the insults being part of the recent games is spreading, and I acknowledge the fact that I've been part of the problem that's why it's best I step out for a while. I appreciate the kind words that others had for me, but I realize I'm not the best role model for a good mafia player and there are other better, proven, and more well-mannered EB players that the new players should try to emulate. Rufus/Pandora, I apologize for messing up your otherwise truly fantastic game. It has been a truly fun and funny game from the very start, and you've truly done a wonderful job as hosts. I appreciate you looking inward, but the problem is far from individual. We're all responsible. I assume people look at the way def and I went at each other at the beginning of the game and think that tough talk and pushing people is the way the vets play. It's not the case. I apologize for going too far and setting a bad example. Overall, people have their tactics, but I agree mostly with Rick's feelings that insults could be removed from a player's strategy altogether and not be missed.
Eskallon Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 I appreciate you looking inward, but the problem is far from individual. We're all responsible. I assume people look at the way def and I went at each other at the beginning of the game and think that tough talk and pushing people is the way the vets play. It's not the case. I apologize for going too far and setting a bad example. Overall, people have their tactics, but I agree mostly with Rick's feelings that insults could be removed from a player's strategy altogether and not be missed. I don't think thats how it started, but more the fact that people tend to listen to you more and take in the conversation. Besides I nearly had Sandy voted out on Day 2 before you said anything and a lot of my 'tactic' of convincing people involved bad language. I did midway contact Sandy to apologise however. I was a bit of a prick myself to ADHO15 too, sorry bout that.
Tamamono Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 I apologize for adding any of the insulting and arguing to the games myself. While there's a legitimate tactic to it and it's part of the games sometimes, it wasn't the best way for me to lead by example. Attacking people's personal character (as opposed to their in-game character) is totally inappropriate as offense or defense. It's important to learn the difference and figure out how it works as a tactic. Attacking people is hurtful, so please don't do it. I agree, and I realize now just how out of line I was in my attack on Kiel last night. While I'm not fond of the tactic of trash talking, it's certainly more appropriate than lashing out at someone and using their past mistakes as weapons against them. Once again, I'm truly very sorry. But like what I've said to Tammo privately, I have been thinking about "taking a break" from these games (even without this incident) since it's pretty much clear that my brash playing attitude isn't fit for the friendly playing atmosphere that EB is trying to promote and foster. I remember when you pointed out in one of the earlier days that there are people behind the scenes who are not at all amused by the way I'm playing. I'm well aware that there are several (or even lots) of people who don't like playing with me, and who find my in-game insults rude, uncivilized, and inappropriate. Taken out of context, yes, but spoken by the character within the bounds of the game? I guess that's where the difference in player's school of thoughts lie, and I think my pathological competitiveness isn't cut out for EB's mafia games. Like what Foog pointed out earlier, the insults being part of the recent games is spreading, and I acknowledge the fact that I've been part of the problem that's why it's best I step out for a while. I appreciate the kind words that others had for me, but I realize I'm not the best role model for a good mafia player and there are other better, proven, and more well-mannered EB players that the new players should try to emulate. We're all part of the problem. Everyone makes mistakes. What's important is that we're all friends here and we can all forgive each other for those mistakes. I completely forgive you for any mistakes you've made, and I really hope that you'll continue to play in mafia games here, because I do really enjoy playing with you. What I said last night I said in the heat of the moment and I certainly didn't mean it. In the end, it's your decision, but I urge you to stay, because you really bring something special to these games and we'll miss you a lot. Please don't leave, Kiel. Mafia games just won't be the same without you.
def Posted February 5, 2012 Posted February 5, 2012 I assume people look at the way def and I went at each other at the beginning of the game and think that tough talk and pushing people is the way the vets play. I'm sorry, but please don't make that out to have been an equal, mutual thing. I know there has been problems with fighting and insults in some recent games, and specifically went into this game with a hope to avoid it.
Hinckley Posted February 6, 2012 Posted February 6, 2012 We're ok now. But like what ... as hosts. I agree... same without you. Thank you both for doing this. For anyone else wondering why I'm oddly making this about me, just trust me that it's nice to see the best in people right now. This gaming community and LEGO community mean a lot to me and it's nice to see the people involved working on making it better.
Scouty Posted February 6, 2012 Posted February 6, 2012 Wow, what an incredible day it has been. One of the best I have ever read.
Peanuts Posted February 6, 2012 Posted February 6, 2012 Wow, what an incredible day it has been. One of the best I have ever read. I absolutely second this, it's a hell of a day. This game is awesome!
Flipz Posted February 6, 2012 Posted February 6, 2012 This has been the most absurd and hilarious Day this entire game. Pandora, how are you going to top this insanity in the day close story???
K-Nut Posted February 6, 2012 Posted February 6, 2012 Those Fabuland figs are hiding in the background! They're too silent and trying not to be noticed! You guys have to lynch them! Hilarious ending, guys! I laughed hard when Sheila turned into the devil.
Tamamono Posted February 6, 2012 Posted February 6, 2012 Aww, Roger's such a gentleman! Well, I had a delightful time playing. Thank you so much for having me, Pandufus! This game has been absolutely amazing. Good luck, neutrals!
CorneliusMurdock Posted February 6, 2012 Posted February 6, 2012 Everything seems clearer after a nice cup of tea. And I do kind of look like Poirot...
Pandora Posted February 6, 2012 Posted February 6, 2012 Aww, Roger's such a gentleman! Well, I had a delightful time playing. Thank you so much for having me, Pandufus! This game has been absolutely amazing. Good luck, neutrals! Tammo, thank you so much for playing, you really gave it your all!
Fugazi Posted February 6, 2012 Posted February 6, 2012 Ah, such a moving conclusion to an exciting day! Moar please!
Hinckley Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 No, really it's true, or perhaps some sort of mish-mash of what I've said is true.
XimenaPaulina Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 Wow, that has got to be the most spirited, relentless, unforgiving, never-say-die attitude I've seen in these games! And for that, thou shall be "rewarded" Tammo...
Tamamono Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 Wow, that has got to be the most spirited, relentless, unforgiving, never-say-die attitude I've seen in these games! And for that, thou shall be "rewarded" Tammo... Thanks Kiel! I love it!
Eskallon Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 I need a haircut Oh and that ending was bloody brilliant.
Poison Ivy Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 Those Fabuland figs are hiding in the background! They're too silent and trying not to be noticed! You guys have to lynch them! You missed Mehmet and his bwankie in the background..... Maybe it does protect him!
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