Dear Mr. Ross Mills...

[Artifex]

Found this today at BleedingCool.com. Check it out and tell me what you think -- http://www.bleedingcool.com/2012/01/10/best-star-wars-lego-corporate-response-ever/

I just think they both have good arguments, but I do buy the "corporate response."

[StoutFiles]

The corporate response says that Anakin was good in The Clone Wars, but by then he had already murdered a bunch of women and children, among other things.

In fact, he's so hard pressed to find good things Anakin has done he lists "won the podrace" and "built C-3PO" as good things. Would losing the podrace make him evil? Does building a robot designed for edicate and protocol to clumsily do chores instead a good thing?

Anakin is never really good to begin with anyway. he's just selfish. He's the most selfish character in the galaxy. Me, me, me. I'll do what I want, when I want! He dates Padme when told not to, never listens to Qui-Gon or Obi-Wan, doesn't bother to save his mother from slavery, whom he's supposed to love, for years and years, etc. He only gets in the podrace because he really wants to podrace, and outright lies to Qui-Gon that he will win even though he's never won at anything. He probably built C-3PO to get out of some chores. He destroys the Trade Federation ship just goofing around when he was told not to. Even in his redeeming good moment, he only saves Luke because the Emperor is killing something of his (and tried to have him executed only a minute prior).

I understand kids don't really see him as evil, but that's my major flaw with the prequel trilogy...we're rooting for a character that is not just going to become evil, but is already evil midway through Episode II.

Edited January 10, 2012 by StoutFiles

[Werlu Ulcur]

In general I think Anakin is a grade A whining a-hole. Like Stout pointed out, I also really can't see any good actions from him in any of the movies. In the CW cartoons he's arrogant, doesn't do anything bad per se, but something altruistic and imminently good ? Even Ahsoka, as annoying as I think she is, is a better person then Anakin is or was. He's much better as Vader, when he's openly evil, then before he became Vader. Even in the end, "just" saving his son is way too small a feat to redeem himself for all the bad karma he earned when he was younger.

While I find amusing (even cute) the response Mr. Ross received, I can't imagine any suitable argument to defend the idea that Anakin is a "force of good". The best answer would be to just say that "he sells Lego, so that's why he's offered there" - harsh but truthful.

[JackJonespaw]

Take that, Ross Mills! But there is one thing I don't get:

I was recently walking past the Dundee Early Learning Centre, and was shocked and disgusted to see an advert for Star Wars toys, prominently featuring the characters Yoda and Anakin Skywalker as positive figures.

What the heck is wrong with Yoda?

[lightningtiger]

Take that, Ross Mills! But there is one thing I don't get:

What the heck is wrong with Yoda?

I agree what's wrong with our Jedi friend eh ?

Does that toy chain carry Transformers or alike too ?

Why doesn't he complain also about Han Solo, first being greedy, then hero, back to greedy, but then discovers it pays to be a hero for good eh ?

[Brickdoctor]

Actually, almost all the things listed as 'good' Anakin actions weren't done purely out of good character. Everything he did for Padme he did because he was attracted to her, despite that fact that that was in direct violation of the Jedi Code. Rescuing Obi-Wan is sort of a requirement of all Jedi. Not rescuing him would be bad, but that doesn't make rescuing him good. It's more like...typical.

Rescued Amidalla from assassin snakes, pit monsters, the Trade Federation and even found time to romance her in the fields of Naboo

Snakes?!?! Surely one doesn't even have to be a Star Wars fan at all to tell the difference between centipedes and snakes. Those things clearly have legs!

[Ceroknight]

Good thing about Skywalker

"Built C3P0"... well...

And I agree with 'Paul' about this, I think some 'bad' characters are needed to make the stories more interesting, and the bad people never win or in this case, turns good again.

[Blondie-Wan]

The corporate response says that Anakin was good in The Clone Wars, but by then he had already murdered a bunch of women and children, among other things.

In fact, he's so hard pressed to find good things Anakin has done he lists "won the podrace" and "built C-3PO" as good things. Would losing the podrace make him evil? Does building a robot designed for edicate and protocol to clumsily do chores instead a good thing?

Anakin is never really good to begin with anyway. he's just selfish. He's the most selfish character in the galaxy. Me, me, me. I'll do what I want, when I want! He dates Padme when told not to, never listens to Qui-Gon or Obi-Wan, doesn't bother to save his mother from slavery, whom he's supposed to love, for years and years, etc. He only gets in the podrace because he really wants to podrace, and outright lies to Qui-Gon that he will win even though he's never won at anything.

While I largely agree with you, I don't see how he outright lied about winning the race just because he'd never won before. He's making a prediction, which is generally understood differently than statements about existing or past conditions asserted to be true, and it seems clear he really means it (that he holds a sincere belief that he'll win). Aside from that, he was right, after all - he did wind up winning the race.

Take that, Ross Mills! But there is one thing I don't get:

What the heck is wrong with Yoda?

I do believe Yoda is good, but I've seen strong arguments to the contrary from the likes of David Brin, who IIRC has argued Obi-Wan, Yoda and the other leading Jedi are almost culpable as Vader and Palpatine for some of the worst suffering ever seen in the SW universe. He's critical of the series in general, it should be noted, largely on philosophical grounds over the moral implications of the story).

Good thing about Skywalker

"Built C3P0"... well...

Hey!

[Werlu Ulcur]

If Yoda is bad because he's (indirectly) responsible for Vader, so is Obi Wan, Qui Gon and all the rest of the Council for letting him become a Jedi.

[legolandia]

What?!? Seriously?!? Am I the only one who finds this Mr Mills to be totally pathetic and this whole letter thing very disturbing? How can a so called adult go so low?

If I were to stoop to his level I would say that based on his logic Mike and Sulley characters from Pixar's Monster Inc should not be sold in the shops because they are evil. Why evil? Because they scare innocent children and use their screams to power their city i.e. they profit from child labour (or child suffering).

By the way, the debate of whether the Jedi are good or not was debated to death a while back on many forums. Personally I would say that if the Jedi existed, in the Western society they would have been arrested, prosecuted, jailed and outlawed thousands of times for snatching or removing children away from their families (particularly when a lot of those families were vulnerable due to finding themselves in financial, environmental or other difficulties). A lot of fans fail to see the moral corruption of the Jedi Order which was ultimately the main reason for their failure and destruction. Karen Travis portrayed such corruption perfectly in the books she wrote. It is a real loss that she decided to stop writing for SW universe.

Well, that got a bit philosophical didnt it?

Edited January 11, 2012 by legolandia

[StoutFiles]

If I were to stoop to his level I would say that based on his logic Mike and Sulley characters from Pixar's Monster Inc should not be sold in the shops because they are evil. Why evil? Because they scare innocent children and use their screams to power their city i.e. they profit from child labour (or child suffering).

Had they continued doing that they would not be liked. They quickly learned the error of their ways and ended up powering the city with laughter. They make a transition from misguided to good, whereas Anakin goes from misguided to evil. There's a big difference. They also didn't murder any children like Anakin did.

People are judged for what they are and will become, not what they were. Anakin is not a little kid trapped on a desert planet, he's a selfish, angry Jedi who has already murdered many people and will eventually become the biggest mass murderer in the galaxy.

[Siegfried]

Anakin is never really good to begin with anyway. he's just selfish.

Yep. You've summed it up nicely. But it's Georges fault; Darth was cool in a tragic way, but now we "know" that Anakin deserved all that he got and more. A lot more. If there's a model case for taking children away from their parents for their own good it's Luke and Leia.

[Walter]

What the heck is wrong with Yoda?

Maybe she thought that he promoted bad grammar with his unusual speech patterns. A bad influence, Yoda is!

[Princess Muttonchops]

Yep. You've summed it up nicely. But it's Georges fault; Darth was cool in a tragic way, but now we "know" that Anakin deserved all that he got and more. A lot more. If there's a model case for taking children away from their parents for their own good it's Luke and Leia.

Yeah, I'm sure we were supposed to feel more sympathy for Anakin, but really, he's just so selfish, gullible and slow-witted that it beggars belief. He's worried about his mum, but doesn't do anything about it until its too late, even though he's breaking the Jedi code by blatantly pursuing Padme (I guess when she's changing into glamorous low-cut evening dresses every five minutes, who can blame him) (I know the point's already been made, but its just such a good point I couldn't help myself). Palpatine positively drops hints left right and center that he's a sith lord while they're at the opera, and he just starts to have suspicions (but he's not alone there, the whole Jedi council drop the ball on that one). And then, because he's having a few bad dreams about Padme dying, switches teams in the space of a heartbeat when Palpatine promises he can save her...WTF??!!

[LEGOman273]

I think this thread should be locked, or at least moved, as it has nothing to do with LEGO now, and has become simply a discussion of weather Anakin is good or evil.

[Siegfried]

I think this thread should be locked, or at least moved, as it has nothing to do with LEGO now, and has become simply a discussion of weather Anakin is good or evil.

Yes Mr Bossy Boots.

[LEGOman273]

Yes Mr Bossy Boots.

Sorry. Not trying to be bossy. Just thought it would be better in a different forum.

Edited January 11, 2012 by Legoman273

[KimT]

The **** you are.

Your posts are solely fixated upon locking or moving topics.

Please stop it.

[Batbrick]

He's much better as Vader, when he's openly evil, then before he became Vader. Even in the end, "just" saving his son is way too small a feat to redeem himself for all the bad karma he earned when he was younger.

This is probably the aspect of Return of the Jedi that bothered me the most, even as a child. I can accept and sympathise with the tragedy of Dark Vader (discounting prequel backstory), but his final scenes in that film didn't depict a character who finally realised his wrongdoings but was left no time to atone, it presented him as fully redeemed for saving his son. Even as a kid, it struck me that the entire morality of it was centered only around the protagonists. Sure Darth Vader resulted in the death of millions, but he saved his son. Redeemed!

Whih is irritating, since the tragedy of never being able to atone for all he'd done is his last moments would've worked fantastic both as punishment, tragedy, and revealing his better side, whil still playing toward the archettpes Star Wars is founded on.

Batbrick Away!

[Palathadric]

In general I think Anakin is a grade A whining a-hole. Like Stout pointed out, I also really can't see any good actions from him in any of the movies. In the CW cartoons he's arrogant, doesn't do anything bad per se, but something altruistic and imminently good ? Even Ahsoka, as annoying as I think she is, is a better person then Anakin is or was. He's much better as Vader, when he's openly evil, then before he became Vader. Even in the end, "just" saving his son is way too small a feat to redeem himself for all the bad karma he earned when he was younger.

While I find amusing (even cute) the response Mr. Ross received, I can't imagine any suitable argument to defend the idea that Anakin is a "force of good". The best answer would be to just say that "he sells Lego, so that's why he's offered there" - harsh but truthful.

Vader is definitely a hell of a lot better than Anakin. Anakin is, in my opinion really annoying, and kind of ruins two of the movies. Although, I guess, without him...well...

[Gryphon Ink]

I have to point out that a lot of the same accusations leveled against Anakin can be made against the supposedly "good" Luke Skywalker, who neglects his chores, lies to his guardians, whines about how unfair things are ALL THE TIME, endangers the Jedi Order and the last hope for the future of the galaxy by willfully ignoring Yoda's directives, constantly insists that he is ready for things when everyone around him can see that he isn't, and generally acts like a selfish prick for almost the entire original trilogy.

So, basically, the story of Star Wars is that a selfish, unlikeable, nasty little twerp is tricked into betraying his friends and assisting in the murder of billions of people and the subjugation of countless worlds, throwing himself happily into the business of dominating the galaxy with an iron fist, but then he is redeemed for all his actions when he finally saves his almost equally unlikeable, selfish, whiny son from being murdered by the guy he originally betrayed the whole galaxy for.