Brickdoctor Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 I never told Hinck a single lie...But it's hard to find a balance between careful and crazily paranoid . This reminds me of my own behavior in Isla Paradisa. I had really hoped to get a Night Action, but when I drew Cop, I had no idea how to behave behind the scenes. I know I allowed Tammo to pretty much know that I had a Night Action in the middle of Day 1, all because I didn't want to lie when he asked me if I had a Night Action. (in retrospect, I could've just acted suspicious at how he was fishing for actions, but...)
XimenaPaulina Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 I never lie to anyone and I am glad I didn't have to. And that was the main reason why I was really very suspicious of you Fangy throughout this game, as I can't help but metagamely equate your silence in this game from the one in Bloodbrick II, where you were scum and you admitted afterwards that you have difficulty lying and hence chose to remain silent. Please next time if you're Town spare us the suspicion and be more visible in the game threads. but I really was frustrated not knowing who anyone was. Without being in the loop I felt like all I could do was follow you and vote with you, and, paranoia (as you talked about a ton) led me to think that in the event that you were scum... well, I wasn't doing much to stop you. I couldn't agree more about the "not-so-good" feeling about being left out of the inner circle. I know the other Innocents felt the same way, of being helpless, 'useless', and probably slightly sheepish by conveniently following Mehmet most of the time. But I knew there was a good reason for being left-out, and it was for security of the Town's intel (though the scum really got in there waaay too deep I must say). After Hinck died, that was when I practically had to beg indirectly complain/vent out the frustration of not knowing anything to Cornelius, which eventually led me joining the OOP 2. I'll survive one of these things one day. Even it was a collective decision on our part, it really sucks that we were wrong on killing you Zeph, one of the mistakes that we wished we couldn't have done. But come to think of it, if it weren't you who was killed that night, we would've still killed an Action Campie (either Fangy or ADHO) as Tammo didn't really strike as us scum at that point. That was really one of the toughest 'sacrifice' we had to make to narrow down the suspect list further.
Jedi master Brick Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 Amazing game . I really wish I was in it, the hosting was superb and the last day was brillian with all the actions. Welled done to the hosts and players.
Hinckley Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 Way to go Campies! This reminds me of Werewolf the way the Town banded together and everyone worked for the win, but even moreso. I do mean everybody. Even Wuntin, who everyone made fun of for not posting, was an invaluable tactician behind the scenes. I'm so happy I trusted Cornelius and Cecilie with the real names and roles before I was killed. I literally sent the info to Cecilie minutes before the day was supposed to be posted (it was a couple hours late that day) and all I sent her was the stuff Cornelius didn't already know. I left the Virgins out, which was dumb, since if one of you was Scum you would know all of the Virgins by process of elimination! But, Foog had gotten so much info from me already, but more on him later. Cecilie, this was my first game playing with you and you've proven yourself one of the stronger players. You were my favorite person ever when you exposed TinyPies. Mwahahahahahaha! You set up a TPRU - Hinck rematch! You were easy to trust and your info about your conversations with def honored his strategy and helped to confirm fhomess and Flitwick. That was essential in moving forward and you put so many missing pieces together. Cornelius, we finally worked on the same side and we're an awesome team. No more emotions in the future when we think a friend is Scum! The group PM should've ended the minute I got suspicious with Foog's first failed result. And no, I didn't fully trust you until after I was dead, and Sandy sent a PM before he realized I was dead telling me he verified you over and over and over. I felt good that my instincts had gone with you and not Foog. And thank you for honoring my suspicious gameplay after I died and shutting out Foog and Tammo! When I heard that was happening I was so excited! I've been dying to talk to you since I was killed just to comment on the game. I missed going through the experience with you. We had so much fun this time! You did such an amazing job leading the Town. Way to survive and kick some megablocks! Pandufus, amazing hosting job! :thumbup: The concept was brilliant. It's an excellent way to involve the vanillas and it truly succeeded. Your concept was clever and very well presented and I love your sense of humor! This is the most exciting game I've played here I believe. The concept was really exciting for the entire Town, trying to figure out who to protect, who to believe, who to focus night actions on. It was a nightmare of where to send the reverse psychology and where reverse psychology could be used on me. I took this game so seriously and I wouldn't have been able to if it weren't for the strong concept and hosting production values that went into it. You two are true experts and how amazing that you pulled it all off doing your first game. Here comes the criticism and you both know what's coming, so I apologize in advance for re-hashing it all and not letting go of my bwankie: Yes, the bwankie, I love it and hate it. Cornelius, this is a huge thing I would've loved to explain to you after I died so you could share in my indignation. Wait until you hear some of it. Really, it's not that bad of a criticism, but as I've said in private, I think it's overly-creative and over-thought. It was needlessly complicated for a game concept that is simple enough to create it's own complexities. Mafia is a great concept and doesn't need to be fancified. There are a lot of ready-to-use games on Mafiawiki and most of them are twice as simple as our most simple games here. That's my advice to hosts: twists are good, but don't over-complicate things. The bwankie is overcomplicated and I do call it megablocks that I was never told how it worked. Here's my role PM, just to show everybody what I had to work with from the beginning: You have an ancient artefact in your possession. It is a cloak or blanket of unknown material, and since your arrival in the valley it has begun to shimmer mysteriously. It’s just so shiny and reflective. Each night you may place this material over yourself or any other player, but you’re not quite sure what effect that might have. You must use it – if you submit no action, you will use it on yourself. What the megabluck? Naturally, I asked questions and I was told that my role was worded in a way where I'd be able to figure it out. Eventually, I realized I was a nexus. I had a few roles in mind, but didn't give it much research because I was way too busy trying to keep up with coordinating claims and info behind the scenes. That's the busy part for a town. The Town should be able to focus on the mystery of who is the informed minority, not "what the hell does my night action do?" That would've added a ton of work on my part and I was already spending too much time on the game as it is. So, it would've taken anybody a lot of time to figure it out, so I'm not saying just me. And this role, since it seemed invincible, would've been a good Town leader no matter who had it, so whoever had it would've been likely to already be very busy helping the Town. Fast forward and it turns out, like I said, I'm a nexus. The blanket, however, also blocks. So, it makes me look like Scum and blocks the Townie watcher I put it on. Poor WBD never got to use his night action. I wanted an invincible watcher for a couple nights, but he was completely blocked. Whatever. I was told I could've foretold that since I was told I slept peacefully when I used it. I'm not trying to interpret the NA results I get. I like it when the host's results are clear and mean what they mean. It was easy to figure out that it reflected the Scum and that they did something to def on the first night, but now I'm told I could've controlled who the actions were reflected to? What they hell did you mean by that? How? And what were the clues that that was possible? Mystery night actions: How would I ever figure any of that out? How would anybody? And you've said the blocking action was added to help balance it. Well, do you know how Scummy "Goofy" looks when he seems to frame people and block them? So many people PMed me telling me one of the protectors was Scum, which they were right, but most people assumed Goofy was full of shit. We were afraid to use it since we didn't know what the megabluck it would even do. Ugh, it's a mess. Beautiful game still, nothing's perfect. I have a lot to say about this because it was my role, but I would leave this sort of complication out of future games. I would love to hear the full explanation on my role and how I was expected to figure out the specifics. Outside of being a way to protect, I found the extra crap it was doing annoying and took away from our plans to get concrete results. Having something cooky like that on our side should've lead us to figure out why Foog couldn't be investigated but I'm not sure they ever really figured out that's why Foog couldn't be blocked, investigated or killed. I'm really busy right now and I have a lot more to say, but I should be getting back to my family. I could write about this game for hours. It was really lovely. Just amazing!
Eskallon Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 Wow, brilliant conclusion and brilliant game Pandora and Rufus. This game was great fun and after my little break from EB gaming, its safe to say I am back for good. Tammo- That was some defense. And hey, you got Eskallon to unvote. I'm pretty sure we didn't start that plan until Hinck was suspicious of you. Day 3 maybe? Thanks, Cornelius! Yeah, I'm pretty surprised Esky unvoted too! He must have been biting his nails quite a bit during the interval between Day 7 and the Conclusion. Sowwy Esky! Sorry Tamamono, but I knew. I did have a small plan though, I knew that their was a 1% chance you were right and since everyone was voting for you yesterday I decided to unvote you and try to suck up any knowledge possible out of you. I played along with it till the end knowing you were dead that day and likely to be scum. I mean, who would ask their teammates to kill virgins because they are innocent. Oh so let me clear it up, that I'm not stupid He told me that he pretended to defend you in order to gather some information from you in private, which apparently worked. Maybe just hedging his bets a bit really. And, as you probably guessed, you were my target anyway on the final night, Esky, so there was no need to ask for protection. I really had no clue I was going to be your protection. I really wish we had been in contact earlier, and that we could have been a little team. Sandy and Mehemet: When you died Mehmet it went a bit pair shaped for me, I suddenly wasn't in the knowing and spent the next day not doing much. This did bug me, but as soon as day 6 opened I got on with it and started working hard. I think my performance in this game was ok at the begging, bad in the middle and then perked up a lot behind the scenes with some more tactical choices. I learnt a lot in this game and look forward to seeing more of you all here.
Rick Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 Thanks for a great game Pandora and Rufus. You're absolutely brilliant hosts. The pictures, the narrative, the immature jokes... I really enjoyed following along. Well played Foog and Tammo! You really fought for it, but the scum's numbers had just been reduced too quickly. There was no escaping the remaining town power roles. And congratulations to 'us' townies of course.
Eskallon Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 (edited) I have been waiting to say this: 10 Games-1 Win Still probably the worst win-lose ratio on EB but it makes me happy. Edited February 9, 2012 by Eskallon
def Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 Def - You'll no longer have to remind me PM'd apologies are meta-gaming, I'll not send you anymore, ya jerk. As always, you were also a pleasure to play with, AND, in the future, even though I don't PM you every time, no matter what side we're on or how much we fight, I respect you so much as a player. So, blanket apology now. As for wanting you dead this game, I thought it would either clear or not clear the investigator... I think. I don't recall, but you just smelled scummy to me, and I thought - info-wise - you'd be better off to us dead. The PM apology wasn't meta-gaming, the note in the discussion thread was, where you explained that you were playing a character and no hard feelings, etc. Anytime people explain their thread actions in the discussion thread, it gets a from me, and is the reason why I stopped using one when hosting. It's too tempting. A PM'ed apology is quite nice, and helps to keep things smooth between players. I quite appreciated it. Thanks Anyway, I can't fathom why you thought you'd have more info from me dead, since, if I were scum, I would have rallied to get Hinck lynched with that investigation result, and I wouldn't have left info at the end of the day to clear him. And just everything else I did in thread, like rally to get scummy Pie lynched, all but cleared me. Cecilie and fhomess felt confident enough with me to tell me their roles. So, I'm sure you had your reasoning, but I still don't see it. No worries But, a little note to all who thought my claiming innocence on day one was scummy... Huh? In the history of mafia games here, never has any scum ever claimed innocence five times in thread, even if they're being fingered as scum. It's not a scum move. It's not a town move. It's a "Day one is boring, and nobody is doing much" move. I laughed to Murdock in PM that I would get a lynch vote for revealing info to the group. Because that's just how the games here tend to be, and sure enough, when I woke up the next day after telling what the point of the game was, I was the lynch leader. My general interaction with the town on day one can be illustrated in this helpful clip: You can guess which is the hapless, put-upon innocent, and who are the snarling, blood-thirsty townspeople Zepher is the one who was turned into a newt Oh well, it was all for the best to go out early. I had a heart to heart with fhomess (I think, it was one of the Witchbreed students, anyway) where I confessed that I didn't really mean the "scum or dumb" phrase, it more of, "scum or not def." Everyone has their own logic when playing these games, and I'm not going to hold it against people for not having the same thought processes as me. The games are won, almost every time, without me, so people are doing something right And by the way, @fhomess, that quote Kiel posted from me about you having no strategy was not actually my opinion. I felt bad when he posted it. Basically, I wanted to get Kiel to lay off you, since I knew you were a virgin, and I didn't to share that with Kiel. So I just wrote it that way. It's one thing for someone to say that about you to you directly or in thread, and another to say it behind your back in PM, and that might have been hurtful to your ego. So please know I didn't mean it. I just wanted to keep you alive
badboytje88 Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 I have to stop here and give the hosts a huge compliment! The set up for the game was a really lovely build, fun characters, an amazing level of detail and lots of humor. Truly inspirational!
Hinckley Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 Hinckley - You know I change up my game every game. I played low this game, yeah, but it's just what I was feeling. You're right in saying I'm a spaz, but I really was frustrated not knowing who anyone was. Without being in the loop I felt like all I could do was follow you and vote with you, and, paranoia (as you talked about a ton) led me to think that in the event that you were scum... well, I wasn't doing much to stop you. I also find it funny I pushed against Goofy so much, and you kept telling me to trust him... it made me think you were scummy, but in fact, you had a 100% legit reason to trust Goofy. FUTHERMORE: listen to me once in a while. I was right in saying Magilla was scum. I said that long ago. Long long ago. It's just like Jesus, I figured out Draggy was scum, and the convoluted way that it happened, and you just didn't listen. As always, it was a pleasure. Definitely a pleasure but you are an megablocks-face! You pestered and pestered me to reveal the list and trust you. Then when I go through the people with aliases you read it, and then never respond. And I took a long time spelling everything out and asking specific questions or at least giving you something to work off of. You didn't have names, but you knew what made me trust people and what seemed suspicious. And then you just stop communicating altogether. It seemed like you tried your best to get into the "inner circle" and when it didn't work, went back to scumming it up with your buddies. I was so annoyed. Yes, and you were right about Magilla but who would listen to the scummy blocker? And Foog was a master! Foog - textbook excellence in Scum tactics! He never utilized what he learned except for NA planning. The weak doctor claim itched the back of my brain. Foog is a good friend, funny and helpful. But, I knew the claim wasn't verifiable by tracking and seeing his protection targets survive alone. Foog also came to me and asked me to take the tracker off of def and put it on him. That made me suspicious too. It was a really good ploy, but I thought it would be a smart Scum play. Def was killed that night and I even went to Foog clarifying what he thought the tracker did. Outside of that, I trusted him completely. I knew he knew too much to not have him verified so that was priority one. I never gave him real names unless they needed protection and yes I gave some false info, and let some real names slip. I remember him guessing fhomess was the investigator and I love that he really thought that! But, if I'd have been left in the game, I would've gone right after Foog for not being able to be investigated. But, I probably would've done just what the OOP (thanks for keeping that alive guys! Harriet Slutter and the Order of the Penis! ) did after I died. Kill the Scummy liar Bob who will always be a Cultist no matter what the hosts say and then try to take Foog out at night. When I heard you tried to have him blocked and killed, I wanted to stand up and applaud, but I was at work. When I saw Zepher die, I was like Whoops! And then, so happy to see the final Tammo accusation! A reformed Scum? A reverse conversion? Who would fall for that unless it's me in Werewolf? Anyway, Foog was so trustworthy but I honored my own "advice to Town" after Werewolf. Mostly... I got sloppy there for a bit. I should never have coordinated Night Actions with him. I'm not sure what I was thinking. The first night I think I had that awful cold and then after that it was habit. Foog was smart enough to tell us he was unsuccessful the night that Cecilie couldn't investigate him and Wuntin couldn't kill TPRU which lead us to the confusion of the "multi-block" theory. Kiel had been blocked the first two nights and then the first night he was unblocked was the "multi-block" night. So we double verified Kiel. My point is, Foog silently worked his way into the trusted circle. I'm paranoid enough to keep thinking that just because we saw him tracking Cornelius the night he said he protected him didn't mean he was cleared. I just wish I would've been more paranoid! But with the three stooges of Cultists bumbling over one another to turn themselves in (no offense Pie, Pies and Brickdoctor) who would've thought there was an expert (or two! More on the redemption of Tammo later) in the Scum mix?? Cornelius, wasn't Foog the megablocks who proposed the "Where are the vets in the Scum line-up?" question. megablocks Foog. You owe Cornelius Murdock a Coke! Foog, yours was one of the smoother Scum games I've seen here. Draggy did good during Bloodbrick but he rode on two night action results that seemed to verify him. So he had more leeway. You really played it well. Foog apologized by PM for killing me and I'm not upset by that at all. It was great to match wits against you Foog. That's how the game goes and I'm glad we played this together. Even on opposite sides, I had such a great time because you were so dedicated. And you're fun to play with. I'm glad our fun PMs with Cornelius didn't totally kill the Campies the way they did in Bloodbrick. You were lying, but you were still friendly and fun and that's what's great about these games: interacting. Oh so let me clear it up, that I'm not stupid I really had no clue I was going to be your protection. I really wish we had been in contact earlier, and that we could have been a little team. Sandy and Mehemet: When you died Mehmet it went a bit pair shaped for me, I suddenly wasn't in the knowing and spent the next day not doing much. This did bug me, but as soon as day 6 opened I got on with it and started working hard. I think my performance in this game was ok at the begging, bad in the middle and then perked up a lot behind the scenes with some more tactical choices. I learnt a lot in this game and look forward to seeing more of you all here. No, you're not stupid but you over-think things and you wanted to be the hero for participating so hard. That lead you to make up crazy theories and accusations based on nothing but your brain working overtime. Simplify. Occam's Razor. Learn when to shut up, no offense. You were out of the know after I died, because in my death knell my final words were "Eskallon's not Scum but don't tell him anything anymore. He's so volatile with his over-theorizing, he's bound to spill everything to a Scumbag." Naturally, I had already spilled too much to Foog, but that's still they reason why you ended up shut out. Sorry. I hope you take this as constructive criticism and not an attack. Oh well, it was all for the best to go out early. I'm glad you take these games so seriously. All of your hard work in the first two days came back through and was really helpful when the Townies started bridging the gaps and banding together. It made things a lot clearer to be able to piece things together through what we knew you did and who you had talked to. Nice job, def. For only living two days you made a big impact on the game and the outcome.
Eskallon Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 No, you're not stupid but you over-think things and you wanted to be the hero for participating so hard. That lead you to make up crazy theories and accusations based on nothing but your brain working overtime. Simplify. Occam's Razor. Learn when to shut up, no offense. You were out of the know after I died, because in my death knell my final words were "Eskallon's not Scum but don't tell him anything anymore. He's so volatile with his over-theorizing, he's bound to spill everything to a Scumbag." Naturally, I had already spilled too much to Foog, but that's still they reason why you ended up shut out. Sorry. I hope you take this as constructive criticism and not an attack. Im one way it was a good thing, instead of relying on you and others, I took to my black book and made my own theories, I ended up looking out in the day thread more and became much more aware of everything going on. I also learnt to not over-theorize and sometimes let the flow go.
Hinckley Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 Im one way it was a good thing, instead of relying on you and others, I took to my black book and made my own theories, I ended up looking out in the day thread more and became much more aware of everything going on. I also learnt to not over-theorize and sometimes let the flow go. That's good to hear. I was worried about you. It's good to see some growth from you. You were more active and it seems you already learned from what you might've done wrong in this game.
Scubacarrot Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 I was wondering, how did the scum decide to kill me on night six, process of elimination, or did you know?
def Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 Oh, and by the way, Flitwick, I should mention that it was good to work with you, even for a short while. I really can't remember a game where we were on the same side, so it was about time
Bob Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 I have been waiting to say this: 10 Games-1 Win Still probably the worst win-lose ratio on EB but it makes me happy. 15 Games-0 Wins Can I take my prize now?
Scubacarrot Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 15 Games-0 Wins Can I take my prize now? You won now. so it isnt correct...
Bob Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 You won now. so it isnt correct... No, I was lynched/voted off. You don't win if your team wins and you were killed off.
Scubacarrot Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 No, I was lynched/voted off. You don't win if your team wins and you were killed off. oh.. I figured either your team wins or your team loses, But I see then... You should be honored then, because you were obviously a threat in most games!
Cecilie Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 I couldn't agree more about the "not-so-good" feeling about being left out of the inner circle. I know the other Innocents felt the same way, of being helpless, 'useless', and probably slightly sheepish by conveniently following Mehmet most of the time. But I knew there was a good reason for being left-out, and it was for security of the Town's intel (though the scum really got in there waaay too deep I must say). After Hinck died, that was when I practically had to beg indirectly complain/vent out the frustration of not knowing anything to Cornelius, which eventually led me joining the OOP 2. I actually suggested to Cornelius that we include you in the OOP . I felt so sorry for you when you seemed all desperate to get info about stuff in thread, when I knew you had been doubly cleared . And I knew you would be able to provide valuable insight And thanks Hinck for trusting me with your info before you died . I had so much fun talking with you, and it meant a lot to me that you trusted me to keep your legacy going together with Cornelius . I really tried to work hard this game. Probably getting a bit too emotionally involved. I actually had trouble sleeping a couple of nights because I couldn't stop thinking about the game .
XimenaPaulina Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 I actually had trouble sleeping a couple of nights because I couldn't stop thinking about the game . Ha! Definitely one of the symptoms of mafia game addiction , but also a testament of one's dedication and passion to the game. But you're not alone, I'm sure others have experienced this too, I had my own share of 'sleep hours sacrifice' because of playing mafia games.
Fugazi Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 Once more, thanks to Pandora and Rufus for hosting this exciting game! You did it in a thoroughly professional way, paying great attention to details and gracing us with beautiful visuals. I hope this experience was as enjoyable to you guys as it has been to us, and that we will see you host again in the future! And thanks to all the players who have made this an exciting and challenging mafia! Congratulations to the winners for a very solid game, the rapid organisation of town making things very difficult for us scum. Hinckley has been exceedingly efficient gathering information and keeping (most of it ) to himself while fending the initial suspicions caused by the cursed cloak. You never gave up being paranoid -- including sending your valuable information away when you felt you were in danger -- and it made all the difference once you were gone. Then Cornelius stepped in your shoes very efficiently and stopped listening to my lies the minute Hinck was dead, and to my limited knowledge did a thorough job of picking up the pieces and clearing the remaining players in a methodical manner. We had hoped to break the town momentum by killing Hinck, but it never happened. And this game did prove what def has been saying all along -- when every townie is intent on finding scum and is paying attention to the game, there's no way scum can win! For those who would like an explanation for the night kills, here's a quick summary of what was going on behind the scenes: Night 1: Rick - Despite what has been mentioned, this choice was not simply metagaming. The town was already much too organised by the end of Day 1, with probably half the players already claiming to Hinckley. We knew it was going to be a difficult game, and we wanted to strike at the heart of the forming town resistance. The choice was between Cornelius and Rick, as we had suspicions both were Virgins. Rick was the less forthcoming one in private, and we thought less likely to attract protection. Night 2: def - For a while we actually thought you could be the investigator! We also knew who protected you, so we thought that killing you would cast suspicion both on the town protector and on Hinckley who was organising this protection. All this while getting rid of either the investigator or a Virgin, it was all win. The only problem we hadn't foreseen was that targets of our blocker were given specific 'results' which actually helped them clear themselves. Probably something to do with being bitten by a snake? It took us a while to realise it and from that moment our night block became a much less interesting option. Night 3: Waterbrick Down - We had focused on Virgins until that point, but then realised that despite our inside information the suspect list was getting too short too quickly and that we wouldn't be able to dodge the numerous night actions for much longer. We didn't know for sure who the investigator or the vigilante were, but we were also afraid that one of them would be watched. So killing the watcher was as much a way to avoid being seen protecting TinyPies, as paving the way for killing the investigator later on. No, we didn't know whether the High Priest would be able to ninja his way past the watcher's gaze, since the watcher's target wasn't the High Priest himself but someone else. It wasn't a risk I was prepared to take when we had already taken many others with variable success. I guess this is a good a time as any to echo Hinckley's frustration with his role. We had this High Priest who had no obvious action in his role description, but eventually figured out that he was an ascetic -- a role I knew nothing about until it was mentioned by Hinckley or Cornelius in a town PM thread. So we went on assuming that the Mafiawiki description of the ascetic applied, and this made the High Priest immune to night actions except kills. We might have guessed that he could not be seen targeting someone, but being inexperienced we didn't want to chance it. Had we known this, and that the High Priest was also immune to night kills, our strategy would have been different. While on paper the mysterious roles seem like a good idea, in actual play they probably result in more frustration than anything else. Night 4: Hinckley! - We were actually prepared to kill you on night 3 -- the action PM was sent -- then changed our minds! I tried my best in private to make you protect someone else with your cloak, but when it became obvious that you wouldn't we changed our plans. Back then we didn't know that we could have killed you anyway. You probably wouldn't have passed on your information to Cecilie and Cornelius, and we might have had a better shot at confusing the town. Oh well, it's easy to see our mistakes with the benefit of hindsight. Anyway, the reason we killed you was obvious -- your trust in me was dwindling fast, and you were about to spill your info to other townies. Which you did in the end, an extremely wise move that we had desperately attempted to prevent. Unfortunately for us, this negated most of the benefits we hoped to draw from your death. Night 5: fhomess - It was either you or Cecilie, and we chose the wrong one! When the real investigator came out of the woodwork, we quickly pieced from private conversations that it would be either you or Cecilie. But I was so sure that Hinckley was trying to steer me away from fhomess with what I thought was a faked slip-up, that I pushed for killling fhomess. I should have paid more attention to the public thread instead. On top of that the Cherrinator came and stole a Virgin from us. Getting rid of the Cherrinator at that stage was trivial. You were by far the most unprofitable kill for us! While we're on the topic of the town investigator, I have to take all the blame for TinyPies' fake investigator claim. I was the one pushing TP to claim to Hinckley when he was asking around. There were many reasons why by that time in the game we thought there was no proper town investigator. One of them was that the number of known townie actions was high enough that it only left about 11 spots for Virgins, and we needed to kill 10. Another night action meant that we had no leeway and had to kill all of the Virgins, while avoiding the roaming cherrinator. Plus we also had get rid at least of the protector and the mirror cloak in order to kill all of the Virgins. That seemed just like too heavy to be balanced, and the townies already had two investigative roles: the Flavor Cop and the Cherrinator. All in all, it seemed reasonable to think that there was no true investigator in the town line-up. Moreover, when def was killed and turned up Virgin we considered the idea of one-shot investigative actions spread around the town, which would have kept the Virgin numbers reasonable while giving town a chance to find us through investigation. In any case, at the time it seemed like a worthy risk for TinyPies to claim investigator, but it soon became obvious that I had made a major mistake. Night 6: Scubacarrot - You were the only remaining Virgin that the town didn't know we knew about, so you were the least likely to use attract protection. We knew we were history, but we wouldn't throw away our last chance to take out a Virgin! So this pretty much wraps up my comments. I know Hinck thought I was suspicious for not following the game and not being online as often as I normally am during a mafia game, but in real life our youngest baby was (and is) giving us a hard time and I was pretty much sleep deprived for the whole game. Some nights I was just too tired to think straight or take the time to reply to my private messages, and some nights I just didn't have the time. I know there are bits of information I just forgot to communicate to my scum mates in good time. I'm sorry for that, and hopefully everything will have settled down in time for the next game!
CorneliusMurdock Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 No, I was lynched/voted off. You don't win if your team wins and you were killed off. No, it was a team game. And you were on the winning team. So congrats, Bob, first win! Your explanation of Rick's death, Foog, makes me wonder how different things would be if you'd chosen me instead. Though Rick probably wouldn't have been stupid enough to lynch Bob. So we probably would have won a day sooner.
Hinckley Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 Your explanation of Rick's death, Foog, makes me wonder how different things would be if you'd chosen me instead. Though Rick probably wouldn't have been stupid enough to lynch Bob. So we probably would have won a day sooner. No, we all would've lynched Bob. Someone on the dead writeboard commented that the Scum wouldn't be so stupid as to not be aware of the role PMs which were posted publicly on the second day, but you don't think of that when you're in the game. And after the 3 stooges lynches, we weren't expecting smart Scum! Bob simply did everything wrong. I was shocked when I saw him post the fake PM and try to insinuate they had never had a conversation in private. I was totally confounded when I saw your defense. Foog - I'm not sure what made me so paranoid about being killed, even with the mirrored blanket, but I had a strong feeling I wouldn't make it through the night. The interlude about the mirror made me nervous, but I couldn't really get any info from what Is was saying so I just pushed it out of my head. No time to try to decipher it, just make sure everything's taken care of if I die. So, the herbalist was the high priest on Night 3? That would've sucked to die on night 3. I wouldn't have passed my info on and I wouldn't have started piecing the rest of the roles together. That would've been a huge and frustrating letdown. And yes, it was a real slip-up when I told you fhomess was a Virgin. My only hope was to paint it red so it made you suspicious on the "off-chance" you were Scum. For those of you who weren't in our PM thread, I had made a slip-up in a group PM, sending a message that was supposed to only be for Cornelius. We were suspicious of Kiel, so I did a fake slip-up where I claimed to be a Virgin to see if we can get the Scummy Kiel to target me. So, by the time I really did slip something accidentally to Foog, he thought it was another fake claim. It took me a while to realize why he thought it was so obvious that fhomess was the investigator. And my paranoia serves me so well sometimes. I had three suspects for the investigator: TinyPies, fhomess and Cecilie, but left Cecilie off of the list for some reason when talking to Foog and Cornelius about it. I'm also glad to know that you guys were as frustrated with the High Priest as I was with the bwankie. Interesting but annoying as hell and it was more of an annoying complication in the long run. ... despite being an awesome game overall! As far as the metagaming goes for me stalking people, it served me really well with TPRU. I was so confused why his name was in italics forever, yet he wouldn't post. I even posted about it in-thread. "How long is Betty Swallocks going to try to say something?" While I was waiting for him to reply to my questions about his role, I watched how long it took him to reply and what else he did while I was waiting. I'm crazy! TinyPies, it really was fun to match up again. You had Eskallon going, so . He even PMed a "Revenge of the Sith" trailer to Sandy and told her I was Anakin, so consider your defense a success! I really didn't even think of it as a re-match until after you were lynched. I felt nostalgic about Roman Mafia and then confounded why such a seasoned player would make such a risky move. But it made me relax my guard on Foog for a little while. We thought the Scum was desperate to get into the inner circle and made a crazy risk. If Foog was Scum, why would they try so hard to get into the trusted circle? But, that didn't stop me from investigating Foog anyway. I so loved WaterbrickDown in this game, too. He spent 7 hours analyzing everyone's game play. Foog thought your final suspicions were right. But, the research was so helpful and it gave me something to bounce off of my allies. The thorough analysis of a posthumous verified player is a valuable tool. I did notice you were contacting everyone I was verifying for you and I was against that in case you slipped or the verifications weren't what we thought, but I didn't want to be a tyrant leader and tell people how to play. It made me nervous and a little suspicious, but being suspicious of you wasn't helpful. I was annoyed when they took you out because you were on my list of backups.
Scubacarrot Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 I was surprised I wasnt trusted as much after leading the vote on Brickdoctor, is a scum leading a vote for another scum done before?
Poison Ivy Posted February 9, 2012 Posted February 9, 2012 I was surprised I wasnt trusted as much after leading the vote on Brickdoctor, is a scum leading a vote for another scum done before? Lots, from what I have seen in previous Mafia. It gains trust for the Scum and gets them into the Town's inner circle in some cases. An example of this would be Cirque Du Freak, where the Scum (Mainly Fred Fred Burger) led the vote against a member of their own team, Darth Nihilus. It didn't do them any good in the end, since Darth tried to reverse psychology a leading memeber of the town by saying he was suspicious of the members of the Scum, not knowing that the person was the Town Vigilante, thus ending the game for the Scum.
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