Scorpiox Posted February 22, 2012 Posted February 22, 2012 Ugh, 10+ pages while I'm off. Concernin' dear Yasu, who seems a-yet even more bad. Addin' to what was a-said earilier, Yasu roleclaim would-a have been more believable if it hadn't been said as a pretty final thing, so I ain't believin'. Hopefully we can gather some more info tonight, I'm-a gonna get busy soon... I-a gonna Vote: Yasu (TheBoyWonder).
CorneliusMurdock Posted February 22, 2012 Posted February 22, 2012 So, did we all see those genies or was that just in Great Grandfather Lloyd's vision? And in time honoured tradition, shall we discus what we think would happen if there is no lynch? You all make very good points, which I do agree with. I just opened it up as a topic for debate, as we do not have much to go on at this time. You said it, Yasu! Now we have to see whether your admittedly lousy defense will save you. On Day One, with nothing else able to be confirmed, it's not looking good for you when voting opens. It was a very early roleclaim, and as mentioned, doesn't really help the Town either way. The Scum know who to block if we believe the claim and the Towniness of Yasu. Going after one of the silent minority might be an idea (due to not contributing) but I know some of them are in different timezones sleeping strangely. Also, in Day One, there isn't really much to go on. It's usually lots of people all saying the same thing, so perhaps not as damning to be quiet at this stage? It looks as though we may have a unanimous decision soon. Vote: Yasu (TheBoyWonder) Since voting for Yasu now wouldn't matter, I've decided to look through the day and vote for who I think is most suspicious. Akio brings up the "not voting issue". This is a conversation that always leads to dead ends and stupidity every time it's brought up. I think the scum are more likely to bring it up to diffuse attention from actually looking for suspects. After that he makes brief summarizing posts in order to appear helpful and active. That's why I Vote: Akio (Rumble Strike).
Peanuts Posted February 22, 2012 Posted February 22, 2012 Since voting for Yasu now wouldn't matter, I've decided to look through the day and vote for who I think is most suspicious. Akio brings up the "not voting issue". This is a conversation that always leads to dead ends and stupidity every time it's brought up. I think the scum are more likely to bring it up to diffuse attention from actually looking for suspects. After that he makes brief summarizing posts in order to appear helpful and active. That's why I Vote: Akio (Rumble Strike). That's interesting what you bring up here. As I said early in the thread, not voting never was an option, since it's impossible that really each one of the 32 people in this temple refrains from voting. And you are right, the rest of what he says looks like he's chosen the middle way of posting not too few without being helpful at all. Akio certainly is a person worth watching.
Rumble Strike Posted February 22, 2012 Posted February 22, 2012 Whenever someone suggests not lynching on the first day they always garner unwarranted suspicion. I don't really know why I expected this time to be any different. Sure, I haven't added dozens of posts but there really isn't much to go on on Day One.
Peanuts Posted February 22, 2012 Posted February 22, 2012 Whenever someone suggests not lynching on the first day they always garner unwarranted suspicion. I don't really know why I expected this time to be any different. Sure, I haven't added dozens of posts but there really isn't much to go on on Day One. No, there certainly was nothing to go on today. What about the person, who made a weird statement, erratic defences and a roleclaim? But that's certainly nothing worth talking about.
JimBee Posted February 22, 2012 Posted February 22, 2012 Role cop certainly isn't the most convenient claim for a scum to make, unless as my dear mother already pointed out, she's a scum role cop, which could well be the case. Yes, that's partly what I meant but by claiming role cop and hoping to live would also take resources (night actions targeting him) away from the loyal members of our families when they could be used to confirm other members. In addition, I agree with my father in that letting Yasu run loose is a bad idea, regardless of loyalty. Clearly she was our best option for today.
Rumble Strike Posted February 22, 2012 Posted February 22, 2012 No, there certainly was nothing to go on today. What about the person, who made a weird statement, erratic defences and a roleclaim? But that's certainly nothing worth talking about. Of course I meant besides Yasu, who clearly has had a massive amount of discussion.
def Posted February 22, 2012 Posted February 22, 2012 My thoughts exactly, great job Norio. What have you done so far? Voted with the herd? Check. Insulted Yasu-chan as you did it? Check. Done absolutely nothing else? Check. Looks like there are cracks showing in your glass house yet again Great job, Noriko-chan I'd just like to point out that the above two statements by Maniko are just a bunch of roleplaying acting, and while it looks like she's said a lot and might have thought about what she said, she really just voted for Yasu without providing any real reason. And I don't think the second statement has anything to do with the situation, other than that it includes the really MegaBloky excuse that she can't answer Yoshiko's question because she's too far away for Yoshiko to hear her. This is exactly why people don't need to "rant on" about roleplaying. Sure, we're all Yakuza members finding the disloyal in our family, but the roleplaying is not the key thing here. Participating and putting ourselves out there is, because that's how we have info to work with later. You've done a great job of that, Emi-chan. I'd like to think I have too. Whether you agree with my opinions and way of thinking or not, at least it's out there for people to see. Unlike, say, human-barnacles like Noriko-chan up there. Maniko-chan mo. She too should put more time into reading and forming opinions than in playing dress-up. My two yen. This reminds me of the summer of '03, when I was undercover in Saudi Arabia. An oil tycoon was funding faux-Islamic terrorists as a cover for his real plans, destroying the richest oil resources in the world and thereby cornering the market on non-renewable energy. I was able to gain access to his inner circle, while posed as a Texas oil tycoon (be it one of Japanese ancestry). Was my accent convincing? Well, I'm still here aren't I? Did I put the roleplaying ahead of my mission? Not a chance! As fun as it was to wear a 10-gallon hat and talk like John Wayne, when I needed to carry out my mission, I put my priories in order, and did what needed to be done, using that role when appropriate. What's the lesson here? Take out the scum first. Roleplay second And Noriko-chan better not think she's still Mustafa Nidia, because that was pretty insufferable.
MetroiD Posted February 22, 2012 Posted February 22, 2012 This is exactly why people don't need to "rant on" about roleplaying. Says the person who can't even be bothered to check the gender of other Family members. Seriously, you need to stop attacking people with such bitterness and exaggarated irony just because they're pointing out the obvious cracks in your reasoning - and then whining when the fire's actually returned. I'd suggest you take a step back, cool your head and then come back, Norio. And I'm not just talking in-Temple.
Scubacarrot Posted February 22, 2012 Posted February 22, 2012 Says the person who can't even be bothered to check the gender of other Family members. Seriously, you need to stop attacking people with such bitterness and exaggarated irony just because they're pointing out the obvious cracks in your reasoning - and then whining when the fire's actually returned. I'd suggest you take a step back, cool your head and then come back, Norio. And I'm not just talking in-Temple. I think he is merely pointing out that playing the game, catching scum, mafia game, you know, should be the main priority in this game, if you wanna spice up your posts, fine. No offense, but posts that consist 4/5th of role-playing are kinda annoying.
def Posted February 22, 2012 Posted February 22, 2012 Says the person who can't even be bothered to check the gender of other Family members. Seriously, you need to stop attacking people with such bitterness and exaggarated irony just because they're pointing out the obvious cracks in your reasoning - and then whining when the fire's actually returned. I'd suggest you take a step back, cool your head and then come back, Norio. And I'm not just talking in-Temple. You've given me a week's worth of attitude in thread and in private in just one day. And on top of that, you're entirely wrong That being the case, I've been incredibly polite to you, because attitude from people who are 100% wrong is pretty insufferable. If you check those private messages, my main attitude was politely explaining my situation, with retorts and accusations from you. But I was polite. You need to check yourself first.
Nightshroud99 Posted February 22, 2012 Posted February 22, 2012 I think he is merely pointing out that playing the game, catching scum, mafia game, you know, should be the main priority in this game, if you wanna spice up your posts, fine. No offense, but posts that consist 4/5th of role-playing are kinda annoying. I second this.
MetroiD Posted February 22, 2012 Posted February 22, 2012 I think he is merely pointing out... And since when have my dear wife and grandson become my step-son's staff lawyers? I believe I understand fully well what he's been "merely pointing out" for the larger part of this Day, and I'm none too happy about it - or the way he's been putting it across, which, quite frankly, borders on insulting. Mind you, I find posts that consist 6/5ths of mafia game mechanics discussions much more annoying. I guess it depends which side you're standing on. If it's the same ol' same ol' every time around for you, why have a background story and different characters to begin with? Might as well shuffle the players, roles and allegiances a bit and just restart the generic endless pile of blahblah about metagaming, contingent and impossible roles, and probability of lonely trees being heard upon falling in the forest. Since that's where a lot of players seem to be trying to steer this game of wits anyway. My bunch of yens. Oh, and Norio - I do hope the attitude I've generously extended your way has not in any kind or form been offensive to you. Once again though, you are the one who seems to be in overdrive here. As I hinted above, there might a reason for that, or that might just be the way you conduct yourself in such situations. Either way, .
The Legonater Posted February 22, 2012 Posted February 22, 2012 I think he is merely pointing out that playing the game, catching scum, mafia game, you know, should be the main priority in this game, if you wanna spice up your posts, fine. No offense, but posts that consist 4/5th of role-playing are kinda annoying. As if life were some sort of game I fail to see, however, how spicing inedible poles will help us Nonetheless, I agree. We have a program to run here. As for the Akio situation, I relectuntaly agree to the fact that it is a good point, however our time today would be better spent confirming the alliegance of Yasu, I think.
Eskallon Posted February 22, 2012 Posted February 22, 2012 What have you done so far? Voted with the herd? Check. Insulted Yasu-chan as you did it? Check. Done absolutely nothing else? Check. Looks like there are cracks showing in your glass house yet again Great job, Noriko-chan Oh and what do you expect me to be doing then? I have been looking out today in these 20 pages but to be honest its hard. Incase you have forgotten its day 1 and nobody knows shit apart from the scum. I have done what I can do, if you think that I should be the most hardworking towny of towniest town member on the first day then maybe you too need to sit down and have a serious think about this family and how it operates.
Brickdoctor Posted February 22, 2012 Posted February 22, 2012 ]Mind you, I find posts that consist 6/5ths of mafia game mechanics discussions much more annoying. I guess it depends which side you're standing on. If it's the same ol' same ol' every time around for you, why have a background story and different characters to begin with? Might as well shuffle the players, roles and allegiances a bit and just restart the generic endless pile of blahblah about metagaming, contingent and impossible roles, and probability of lonely trees being heard upon falling in the forest. Since that's where a lot of players seem to be trying to steer this game of wits anyway. My bunch of yens. I'm not sure if I agree that discussions about mechanics are more annoying than roleplaying, but I do agree that they are annoying in general. Discussions concerning the setup of the situation - number of Scum, relevance of pictures, etc. - they're all distractions. They aren't relevant right now, and, in the case of relevance of pictures, probably never will be. Speculating about the setup instead of analyzing behavior is a very sneaky way of appearing helpful when you're really being a distraction, in my opinion.
def Posted February 22, 2012 Posted February 22, 2012 Oh and what do you expect me to be doing then? I have been looking out today in these 20 pages but to be honest its hard. Incase you have forgotten its day 1 and nobody knows shit apart from the scum. I have done what I can do, if you think that I should be the most hardworking towny of towniest town member on the first day then maybe you too need to sit down and have a serious think about this family and how it operates. I'm not expecting you to be useful, but I'm expecting you not to give be attitude when you're being useless. That's a fair request, wouldn't you say
CorneliusMurdock Posted February 23, 2012 Posted February 23, 2012 Whenever someone suggests not lynching on the first day they always garner unwarranted suspicion. I don't really know why I expected this time to be any different. Sure, I haven't added dozens of posts but there really isn't much to go on on Day One. And normally at least one of those pulling for a no-lynch first day is scum. Of course I meant besides Yasu, who clearly has had a massive amount of discussion. Of course.
Capt. Redblade Posted February 23, 2012 Posted February 23, 2012 I'd just like to point out that the above two statements by Maniko are just a bunch of roleplaying acting, and while it looks like she's said a lot and might have thought about what she said, she really just voted for Yasu without providing any real reason. And I don't think the second statement has anything to do with the situation, other than that it includes the really MegaBloky excuse that she can't answer Yoshiko's question because she's too far away for Yoshiko to hear her. Good eye, Mother. Maniko-chan makes it appear that her contributions are well thought-out and constructive, but it's a lot of empty space behind the words. She appears to be contributing to the discussion, but is really saying nothing and staying below the radar. If I'm not mistaken, that's Scumtells 101. Unvote: Yasu (TheBoyWonder) Vote: Maniko (swils)
Brickdoctor Posted February 23, 2012 Posted February 23, 2012 Good eye, Mother. Maniko-chan makes it appear that her contributions are well thought-out and constructive, but it's a lot of empty space behind the words. She appears to be contributing to the discussion, but is really saying nothing and staying below the radar. If I'm not mistaken, that's Scumtells 101. Excessive roleplaying on its own is no reason for a lynch. Not when there's a more suspicious suspect in Yasu right now. Today, you've agreed with three different people in all four of your posts, and you've jumped on three different people as suspects, not following up on your claimed suspicions for any of them. (first Yasu, then Shiro, and now Maniko) You've done no reasoning of your own and you seem to be trying to agree with whoever posts a new accusation or points out something suspicious. Scum trying too hard to win the approval of others by agreeing with them, or just a sheep?
def Posted February 23, 2012 Posted February 23, 2012 Alright, I tried to get info from Yasu-chan if I could, but it seems she's waved the white flag and disappeared. So, as I said I would get to explaining what she said that changed my mind, here it is, plus the combined nonsense that senile old おじさん Nobuo has been spitting out and wasting my time with, thinking he's a detective, when rather it seems he's in an imaginary kabuki play I woke yesterday to private messages from both of them, unsolicited. All my replies were done in the short time as I eat cereal before getting off to my business, and before I had time to go through the public conversation. In fact, private conversation took up so much time yesterday, I still haven't caught up. Check the times to see the order. Japanese time, natch Hey def, *character talk off* Based on your posting so far, I'm pretty sure you too are a Townie. Sooo I guess I'm not suspecting you for the time being, which is why I won't keep roleplaying in PMs, which is something I usually do :) I'm contacting you this early on because who knows - I might not survive Night 1, considering my character's position in the hierarchy of the Family. Considering your logical train of thought and the fact that you could lead Town to a win, I was hoping we could bounce some ideas off each other and see what we've got in terms of leads for the Mutineers. Don't know if the Fellows talk had anything to do with it (actually - sure it does! :P), but BoyWonder seems to be a dead man walking right now. I've done some talking with him in private and I'm even more convinced we're on the right track. There are, however, players who've tried to sidestep us, so that's interesting. I do hope he'll turn out to be a scummie so we can base our future work on the stuff that's happened during Day 1, since there's plenty to be made of some people's activity. I'm happy to bounce ideas, but I won't have time today, I'm working roughly 9 am to 9 pm. I might appear online, skimming the thread from my phone, but I can't be seen writing at work. As for role playing, I can barely keep it up in thread, much less in PM. I am town, and I'll work to solve things, but I'm going to avoid any leadership positions, just because my hectic work schedule isn't leaving me that much time to. More later As you can see, the arrogance Nobuo has claimed of me is in full swing. Well then, here's just a quick note to share how Tamamono has been extremely persistent in trying to persuade me not to lead a lynch against BoyWonder. Sent me no less than 4 messages within the less 15 minutes - at first, he tried to call me out for roleplaying too much and basing my in-game motivation on role-playing, which is definitely not the case - and that's there for all to see? Trying a bit too hard for his own good, I think. I think it's because boywonder is claiming? Still haven't had time to read the threads, too many people "trust" me Luckily Badboy changed the unvote rule, so we can turn things around if we make a mistake Around the same time, I saw Yasu-chan's message to me. I am the town role cop. You can tell me who to investigate, and I will. Well, why are you claiming to me? How do you know I'm not scum? Since you've already done so, here's what you can do: tell me what your role said, and let me see if it seems true. Sorry, that claim is scummy for two reasons: 1) you can't trust me yet 2) cop is an easy fake claim since scum know who's innocent or not, so they can 'investigate' So I'll have to see the role Then I was out the door, and you folks kept up your discussion. In the afternoon, I had a two hours break, and was able to sneak home to catch up on things. Around this time, I was defending Yasu-chan based on a role-claim, and she started sending messages to me. I am the Role Cop. I find out Others Actions. No, I wanted to hear how it was described to see if it was plausible. It wasn't phrased, You are the role cop, you find out other's actions, was it? I can't copy my role pm def. Of course not, but you can paraphrase it, as I did your words. No worries I changed the words, but what I said originally was it. This is when I changed my vote. It seemed pretty clear to me that he didn't know what the role cop actually did. I think he would have stated something like, "I can investigate people at night and find out what their actions are," or something like that if he was telling the truth. I'm sure he doesn't "find out Others Actions." I figured he was coached, and didn't know what he was really supposed to say in this position, and couldn't get any better feedback in that short of a time. So, though I changed my vote, I didn't get hostile or aggressive with him. No bullying or nothing. I personally don't see arrogance in the way I've handled things so far, but I'm not Nobuo. I sent Yasu-chan a last message, in hopes of her giving me some info, something that, if she were revealed scum, might help me in finding other scum-mates. Sorry, it just doesn't sound real to me. I think it would have been described differently to you. It sounds like you're making it up. If you can tell me anything better, let me know, but for now, I need to vote for you. She has read it and chosen not to reply, and the day is ending shortly. So, this is the info I wouldn't share yesterday since it would have cut the little chance I did have to fish some info out to zero. Some people asked me to share, and I said I would. For most, that was enough, but not for Nobuo. No, he had to push it, even when I said to all, All in due time, folks. All in due time It's day one. There were 48 hours left. Yasu-chan was all but guaranteed convicted. There was no advantage in explaining, but there was clear disadvantage. I tried to explain it in private to Nobuo, so that he didn't sabotage the little gambit I was trying. Just to get this over with quickly, since I get the feeling you're going to push it in thread way more than is sensible: I think boywonder lied to me. I want him to feel that he can try to work with me, that maybe I could change my vote if he gives me good reason, so I can fish him for whatever info I can while he is still alive, that could be useful if he turns up scum. If I come out in thread stating a hard case against him, I can't fish him. So, you, Murdock, Cecilie, whoever jumps on your bandwagon after that, you're all bring a hassle to me doing work for the town. It's great that you're into the game, but declaring in thread about what a suspicious day I've had since I don't want to share everything in thread is just a real nuciance, unhelpful on day one, and uncalled for I'm totally fine working with you if your town, but you have to respect that I have very limited time in the day, and that for some reason a lot of people contact me for whatever reason. But from now on, it's a need to know basis. If you and boywonder were working together, the slim chance that I could get anything useful from him would shrink down to zero. Maybe there is arrogance there, but I just see polite frustration that someone is getting in my way of doing work for the town. Nobuo's reply: Well, I guess we can now all just wait and see what's what, eh? I won't be bothering you again, don't worry - but make sure you've got enough inbox storage for the other queries you might be getting. I respond: Trust me, in this case, your scumdar is broken. Maybe you'll be the Zepher this game I think at this point, I'm in good humor, don't you think? You ain't helping repair it, you notice? My reply, getting tired of it, plus his ranting in thread: Oh, should I be holding your hand? Would you like me to tell you my role ? Hmm, I'm the only one who maintained a friendly relationship with a suspected scum, so I'm trying to make use of it while I can. But you think the obvious town move is to burn that bridge as soon as possible in order to satisfy the over-eager townie harrassing me in thread(you). Sorry, but that's a dumb move. Feel free to push it as far as you like, this is just a game. And I'm right, you're wrong. If you want to accuse one of the minority of people who actually play, and is actually playing for town, knock yourself out. His final reply, and one I didn't bother answering: :] Yeah. Just don't pop a vein there. I think what you can see here is this: Nobuo thinks he's doing everyone a favor by not giving my very plausible story the benefit of the doubt when all he would have had to do is wait 24 hours to see if I could get anything. No, rather he wants to stir up shit in public. Even though nothing about this vote would have changed. And then he tries to taunt me in private, and in public somewhat. Not called for. I was being quite straight-forward with him. And then he talks about my arrogance. Maybe he's just playing an arrogant, blinded character You have this guy acting all high and mighty like he solved the case, when he's actually being the one getting in the way of things... Well, 当たり前, it is going to be tiresome. And then he complains that I called Yasu-chan "he" :wall: Nice priorities. Why try to track scum when you can complain about a pronoun? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I'm not calling Nobuo scum, but I do question his ability to think things through. If he carries on this accusation on day two, forgive me if I simply ignore it. If others think my behavior in not pouncing on the n00b who role-claimed way too early is a scummy move, well get in line At the end of the day though, it's just a game, and we're all friends
badboytje88 Posted February 23, 2012 Author Posted February 23, 2012 (edited) Votes so far: Yasu - TheBoyWonder(27): Brickdoctor, Yasuko, Shizuko, Zakura, Jimbutcher, Nightshroud99, VolcanicPanic, Bob, Def, Whitefang, MetroiD, Swils, Iamded, Rufus, Cecilie, Peanuts, Etzel, Rumble Strike, Masked Builder, Alopex, Tamamono, Professor Flitwick, Rick, Eskallon, Fhomess, The Legonator, Scorpiox Akio - Rumble Strike (1): CorneliusMurdock Maniko - Swils (1): Capt.Redblade Thanks Grandfather for not including me 10 votes back. You know I ignore you because you are special to me Edited February 23, 2012 by badboytje88
MetroiD Posted February 23, 2012 Posted February 23, 2012 Your "very plausible story" appears to be the rantings of a scared man, Norio. It's always a cowardly move once people start sharing entire private conversations, especially before Day 1 has even ended, but in this case it's very nice considering how much it shows your attitude - which, once again, is the main factor that lead to my suspicion against you in the first place. An innocent loyal Yakuza would have nothing to be so worked up about, and instead would probably really take a step back, avoid disgracing himself further and wait to see what happens before going on with his self-defence and accusations of other Family memebers. Instead, you keep going on as if you were some sort of divine power and the rest of the Family members should avoid bugging or questioning you, for they might in some way disturb the great saving-the-Townies (?) investigation process that you've got going on. Regardless of your role, there is nothing you could "investigate" and "fish out" of Yasu on Day 1 if she's scum, so please forgive me if I don't buy that load of nonsense. But anyway - you investigated, and what did your awesome reasoning come up with? Zip, just as I would have imagined. You are being persistently arrogant when you could just say you're sorry about this whole fracas (as you, no doubt, should be) and reason your way back into people's circle of trust. What you're doing is very much driving you away from that, and your incessant quarelling is also no sign of a loyal Yakuza having the Family's best interests at heart. Once again - forgive me for being suspicious of everyone, but unlike you, Norio, I'd rather not waste my time discussing game probabilities and mechanics and prefer to instead focus on the way Family members react to different situations - and your reactions have been very one-sided. By the way, I'm actually genuinely concerned about your nerves, not just being ironic there.
Rick Posted February 23, 2012 Posted February 23, 2012 Regardless of your role, there is nothing you could "investigate" and "fish out" of Yasu on Day 1 if she's scum, so please forgive me if I don't buy that load of nonsense. But anyway - you investigated, and what did your awesome reasoning come up with? Zip, just as I would have imagined. After Yasu claimed "role cop" to him, Norio was (supposedly, assuming he's telling the truth, but at least his story in public is consistent with what he told me in private earlier) in a position where he could try to get a better idea of whether Yasu was telling the truth. Yasu's first response was one which shows that she potentially didn't understand what a (standard) "role cop" is. So, pushing Yasu a bit more privately actually sounds like a good idea. Of course, this would not have been very effective if Norio had talked about this publicly. Too bad Yasu has apparently already accepted her fate.
Scubacarrot Posted February 23, 2012 Posted February 23, 2012 Seeing that Yasu now has gone quiet, puts the final nail on her imaginary coffin, for me at least. As I've said before, my vote won't make a difference, at all, but i'll do it anyway, maybe it will speed things up . Vote: Yasu (TheBoyWonder)
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