Missed LotR Polybag Opportunity

[Deathleech]

I know they haven't been released yet, and I know they aren't suppose to be huge flagship sets with a wave, but I was really disappointed with the LotR polybags when I saw them. Specifically the Frodo one. What exactly was the reasoning for giving us another Frodo when he is already available in 3 different sets and he is available in the EXACT same form in one set that also happens to be the cheapest? The ONLY reason I could see that polybag being useful was if someone held out on buying the Gandalf Arrives set and instead got the Bag End for Gandalf and then got the polybag for the Shire attire Frodo. Of course that means waiting 6 more months for a Gandalf minifigure though. Totally not worth it when you can just get Gandalf Arrives right now for a measely $13. Why not, at the very least, include a figure from an expensive set that is only available in one set right now, like Boromir, Legolas, or one of the other hobbits like Pippin or Merry? Heck, even Haldir or Theoden would of been vastly better, despite them being lesser featured characters on screen.

The Uruk-hai polybag isn't near as bad and actually has some decent use. I just feel like they could of given us a polybag for a figure not so readily or plentifully available. We already have the Helm's Deep set which comes with a decent amount of Uruk-hai, as well as the Uruk-Hai Army set that serves as a sort of army builder. For 30 bucks you get 4 Uruk-hai, a Rohan soldier, Eomer, horse, and a nice chunk of wall and bolt thrower. Unless you have no interest in anything but the Uruk-hai (which some actually might not), the Uruk-Hai Army builder is a much better deal than the 4 or 5 dollar polybag. Even if all you want are the orcs, it still gives you the sword and shields which the polybag doesn't, and the hair piece so it has more variety.

Personally I would of LOVED to see a polybag with a Nazgul, a Moria Orc, or a Mordor Orc. If they made a Nazgul poly people could of easily gotten 9 of them without having to get several Weahtertop sets (not that I am anyways, I figure we will get better options in the future to get a full 9 Nazgul). The Moria Orcs are also in a pretty expensive set and you only get 2 so you really have no army building options with them right now. The Mordor Orcs aren't quite as bad since the Orc Forge is only 40 bucks and you get 2 Mordor Orcs in it, but still that's an incredibly inefficient way to army build anything (especially when one of the 4 figs is Lurtz and pretty much worthless beyond the first).

What are your guys thoughts on the matter? Do you feel the LotR polybags are decent, or do you feel as I do and that Lego really missed the target here?

[Only Sinner]

You have valid points, there. The polybags suck. But is that really so unusual? TLG wants to promote the series to a demographic not ordinarily interested in LOTR, not to satisfy the intrests of LOTR fans. They are certain to get our money, already. They know that for sure.

[TheBrickDaddy]

One word: profit.

TLC rarely ever makes any small polybag sets with rare figures. That way, it forces you to buy larger sets that do have those figures. The only exception in recent memory is the recent Thor polybag; until that was released, the cheapest set with Thor was $50, which is fairly expensive.

A Nazgul polybag is an unattainable goal because Lego knows that a true fan needs nine of them, and therefore has to spend a lot of money on Weathertops to get nine. Making a polybag with such a mini fig would cause them to lose money.

Frodo is the central character in the LOTR story, so a polybag with him makes perfect sense. And everyone wants an army of Uruk-Hai, so that polybag will surely be popular, and TLC will probably make a lot of money off of it.

There's your answer

[purpleparadox]

I think Frodo's kitchen makes a great polybag, minifigs aside. I like that we're getting his kitchen. I agree that different figures would be fantastic, but that's highly unlikely.

 The ONLY reason I could see that polybag being useful was if someone held out on buying the Gandalf Arrives set and instead got the Bag End for Gandalf and then got the polybag for the Shire attire Frodo. Of course that means waiting 6 more months for a Gandalf minifigure though. Totally not worth it when you can just get Gandalf Arrives right now for a measely $13.

It seems like you're saying the only reason one would buy any of the sets is for the minifigs. Buying Bag End for Gandalf? I'm gonna be buying Bag End for Bag End. The minifigs are fantastic, the best TLG has ever made, but I can't justify buying a $60 set for one minifig. Lego was smart with what they did, because if you had not bought Gandalf Arrives, but bought only Bag End and the polybag instead, they would've lost approx. $10 in sales. Luckily for them I'm buying all three!

Why not, at the very least, include a figure from an expensive set that is only available in one set right now, like Boromir, Legolas, or one of the other hobbits like Pippin or Merry? Heck, even Haldir or Theoden would of been vastly better, despite them being lesser featured characters on screen

Now, assuming many people do buy sets just for minifigs, as implied by your last quote, TLG made a wise decision by not putting a figure from an expensive set in the polybag. Because then what would your incentive be to buy the large set? You'd just get a polybag instead! 

So regardless of whether or not you buy sets solely for minifigs, TLG made the right decisions. (For their own profits, I mean. I know FOLs would prefer other polybags.) Sorry for debating with you here, but I suppose I just feel differently than you. I understand how much better different figures would be in polybags. I'd prefer them too. But from a business standpoint (as TLG would see it), they made the smarter choices. No hard feelings, I hope!

EDIT: Dangit TheBrickDaddy! Ninja'd me by two minutes!

Edited July 16, 2012 by purpleparadox

[Alex the Great]

I do see why putting rare figures in polybags would be a bad idea for TLG; as they consumers wouldn't buy the sets that have those rare figures. But I think it would've been a lot better of an idea to have a Rohan soldier instead of Frodo. Consumers will only buy one Frodo most likely,if that. Where as with a rohan soldier they would buy many, and they would still get the Uruk-hai army set to get Eomer. But the uruk polybag is a good choice for a polybag.

[HawkLord]

I expected it. As mentioned, sure, a Nazgul would be nice, but then that's an army-builder figure with a specific number (seven if you already have Weathertop or nine if you don't) for people to collect. It's much more pfoitable to offer a couple Nazgul in sets here and there to get you to nine, but after having bought maybe three of four sets.

[Combee]

Remember, we always have a skewed perspective because we're AFOLs. My guess is that if a child was presented with a Rohan soldier polybag or a Frodo polybag they'll pick the Frodo polybag, especially if their parents don't want to spend more money to get an actual set (granted, this example works somewhat poorly since the set with Frodo is the cheapest ).

[Deathleech]

A Nazgul polybag is an unattainable goal because Lego knows that a true fan needs nine of them, and therefore has to spend a lot of money on Weathertops to get nine. Making a polybag with such a mini fig would cause them to lose money.

Frodo is the central character in the LOTR story, so a polybag with him makes perfect sense. And everyone wants an army of Uruk-Hai, so that polybag will surely be popular, and TLC will probably make a lot of money off of it.

I guess so, but why even make a polybag like Frodo? I just don't see anyone buying it other than a few kids or parents. I know I would much rather just get Gandalf Arrives for 13 bucks. Why not instead make an actual useful polybag? I don't think I have seen ANYONE on the forums that are really buying multiple Mines of Moria sets to army build Moria Orcs, or buying multiple Weathertop sets to get 9 Nazgul. These sets are just too expensive to do that. You would have to buy 5 Weathertop sets to get a full 9 Nazgul (+1 extra), and who really is going to do that? Spend 300 bucks + tax for 9 Nazgul? Especially when you get all those extra Aragorn, Frodo, and Merry minifigures with them, plus all those bricks? Most people will buy at least 1 Attack of Weathertop too so they can get the exclusive Merry and the new black horses.

It seems like you're saying the only reason one would buy any of the sets is for the minifigs. Buying Bag End for Gandalf? I'm gonna be buying Bag End for Bag End. The minifigs are fantastic, the best TLG has ever made, but I can't justify buying a $60 set for one minifig. Lego was smart with what they did, because if you had not bought Gandalf Arrives, but bought only Bag End and the polybag instead, they would've lost approx. $10 in sales. Luckily for them I'm buying all three!

No, that's not what I am saying at all! I am saying if someone buys Bag End they get the awesome set, all the dwarves and hobbit, AND they can get Gandalf. That way they can skip Gandalf Arrives and just get Bag Ends (which they would anyways since it has soo much to offer), and the Frodo polybag, and still have all the same minifigs they would want while saving approximately 10 bucks. It's like a bonus, you get all the same minifigs but can cut out buying a set so you save 10 bucks, all the while getting Shire Frodo cheaper and Gandalf in Bag End. I know people buy some sets for the actual building or scenery, but I doubt many people buy Gandalf Arrives just for the wagon (since it's the weakest selling point of that set, imo).

TLG made a wise decision by not putting a figure from an expensive set in the polybag. Because then what would your incentive be to buy the large set? You'd just get a polybag instead! 

Not necessarily. If they offered Legolas in a polybag you still would most likely get Mines of Moria for the exclusive Cave Troll, Moria Orcs, Pippin, and Boromir. And if they offered Theoden as a poly you would get Helm's Deep for Haldir, or vis versa if they offered Haldir in a poly. Plus I would get these sets regardless because I like the set and the minifigures in them (Helm's Deep much more so than Moria).

I just don't understand the logic. I get not offering say a Legolas, for example, in a polybag if the only other way to get him is in an $80+ set and that set doesn't have any other exclusive minifigs. But that's the thing, every current set has at least TWO exclusive minifigs in it! I assume most people will want one of every character. And why even offer something like the Frodo polybag if it's most likely going to sell really poorly? It seems like such a waste.

And even if they don't want exclusive figures in the polys so the expensive sets are more appealing, why not then at least offer army builder type options with the polybag? They did that with the Uruk-hai, but not Frodo. They could of easily made a Mordor or Moria Orc poly and I am sure people would of ate those up in gobs, since I don't see anyone buying multiple Mines of Moria or Orc Forges to army build, they are just buying one of those sets. I would of bought one Mines of Moria and like 20 Moria Orc polybags. As is though, I am only buying 1 Mines of Moria and 1 Frodo polybag (for complete collections sake).

Edited July 16, 2012 by Deathleech

[Logwyn]

I have a feeling that we'll be getting enough sets to have all Nine of the Nazgul without need of a poly bag. We get two with attack on weather top. I bet one set will be the Witch King vs. Ewoyen/Merry. This is 3. All we need is three other sets and bam! All nine!

[SheepEater]

The minifig I would have most wanted to see in a polybag is the Rohan soldier from 9471.

And include some piece of wall or mini catapult so that Hasbro doesn't sue.

[SirBlake]

The minifig I would have most wanted to see in a polybag is the Rohan soldier from 9471.

Totally agree.

And include some piece of wall or mini catapult so that Hasbro doesn't sue.

That's specific to Star Wars. Hasbro doesn't have the license to action figures for LotR or The Hobbit. A company called The Bridge Direct does, and as far as I know, they haven't made public the terms of their contract as far as if releasing just minifigs is a breach of that contract. (which is the issue with SW/Hasbro) That said, I think it's a reasonable assumption that these poly bags will be the bare minimum piece-to-minifig ratio based on past licensed themes. If and when we get true battle pack type sets (hopefully "when"), I would expect we'd get some brick-built element with the figs similar to Star Wars. That's just a guess on my part though.

[Falconer]

Quick question for you guys (not making a point pro or con the main thrust of the thread): Does it look like there’s any spot within the main Bag End set where the actual Cooking Corner could fit?

[SirBlake]

Quick question for you guys (not making a point pro or con the main thrust of the thread): Does it look like there’s any spot within the main Bag End set where the actual Cooking Corner could fit?

I thought the same thing. Looking at the pictures, it appears that there's a minimal cooking area between the door and the writing desk area. Maybe an opportunity to combine parts and customize a bit? I'm not sure.

[Deathleech]

The minifig I would have most wanted to see in a polybag is the Rohan soldier from 9471.

I would of been fine with them just including 2 Rohan soldiers in the Uruk-Hai Army set instead of Eomer. Then Eomer could of replaced one of the orcs in the Helm's Deep set (not the zerker obviously).

Quick question for you guys (not making a point pro or con the main thrust of the thread): Does it look like there’s any spot within the main Bag End set where the actual Cooking Corner could fit?

I'm not sure how useful it will be since Bag End already has the stove in it. I might throw the keg in the left corner though since it looks sort of empty. Who knows.

That reminds me, I also don't really care for the accessory the Uruk-hai polybag came with. I would of much rather seen a ladder piece or something along those lines to assist in the siege of Helm's Deep. This is more nit picky than anything because with the bolt thrower I can at least understand where Lego was coming from. I am sure the kids eat the flick missiles up. To everyone else though, it doesn't really make any sense. You never see ANYTHING like that in the movie and plus you already get the larger bolt thrower with the Uruk-Hai Army set..

[Jimbobulus]

You don't have to buy the sets if you don't want them :)

[Hammerstein NWC]

personally I am hoping they do a set with the Nazgul on giant Carrion a nazgul on an undead beastie would be awesome.

Maybe they will do a set with the monted Nashua chasing Arwen and Frodo? It was a great scene in the movie. :)

[Deathleech]

You don't have to buy the sets if you don't want them :)

I know that, and I am sure I will buy at least 1 or 2 of each of the polybags when they get released. It's just a shame they weren't made into better options. If they would of made a Nazgul polybag I would of bought my Weathertop sets, plus 7 of those polybags. If they would of been Moria or Mordor Orcs, I would of bought 20 of each of the polybag if not more. If they were Rohan Soldiers I would of bought like 10.

Keep in mind I would have bought all these extra polybags and it would of had NO effect on anything else I bought in the LotR line. I still would buy the exact amount of Weathertop sets I did regardless if there would of been a Nazgul polybag. Like I said before, each of the current sets has at least 2 exclusive minifigures so offering one of them in a polybag still leaves you needing the other in the bigger set.

Edited July 16, 2012 by Deathleech

[purpleparadox]

Like I said before, each of the current sets has at least 2 exclusive minifigures so offering one of them in a polybag still leaves you needing the other in the bigger set.

But then you get an extra of one of those 2 figures...I thought having extras was one of your reasons for disliking Frodo's Kitchen! I'm sorry, it just seems like some of your arguments disagree with each other. I too would love exclusive figures in polybags, but I don't see it happening. Perhaps I'm just missing part of what you're saying, but I don't understand how you think TLG missed an oppurtunity with these.

EDIT: Exclusive figures wouldn't be a good idea in polybags for many reasons already discussed. But one idea that I do like that seems feasible, is other army-builder figs like Rohan Soldiers or Moria Orcs.

Edited July 16, 2012 by purpleparadox

[Deathleech]

But then you get an extra of one of those 2 figures...I thought having extras was one of your reasons for disliking Frodo's Kitchen! I'm sorry, it just seems like some of your arguments disagree with each other. I too would love exclusive figures in polybags, but I don't see it happening. Perhaps I'm just missing part of what you're saying, but I don't understand how you think TLG missed an oppurtunity with these.

No, I am fine with having an extra. What I don't like is having 3 Frodos already, and then them putting him in ANOTHER set with the polybag (which polybags, unlike other sets, are mainly just bought for the figs). And not only that, he is already available in 2 of the cheapest LotR sets out right now so why make another cheap option for him? It seems redundant. I just don't see the Frodo polybag selling well at all. What's the point of making the polybag if it won't be a good seller?

Not that Legolas or Theoden in a poly would have been a whole lot better, at least for me, as I already have all the LotR sets. The only reason I would prefer it is so we actually have some variety and options though, not 20 Frodos and only 1 of every other main character. I am sure a kid with say 20 bucks would of much rather bought a Legolas poly and Gandalf Returns. As it's set up now he is only going to buy Gandalf Returns and prolly skip over the Frodo polybag all together. It's not like he could of afforded Mines of Moria anyways so there is no lost sale there. The only thing Lego lost was selling a polybag the way they did it now.

EDIT: Exclusive figures wouldn't be a good idea in polybags for many reasons already discussed. But one idea that I do like that seems feasible, is other army-builder figs like Rohan Soldiers or Moria Orcs.

Ya, that would have been the best option imo and that's really what I would of preferred to of seen done. That way kids will still want it if they can't afford the more expensive set these figures come in (note they wouldn't have the money anyways to get the more expensive set so Lego isn't losing out on that sell), and AFOLs also benefit because they have an option to army build with these figs where there otherwise was no option.

Edited July 16, 2012 by Deathleech

[smitty9999]

You don't have to buy the sets if you don't want them :)

common sense doesn't belong here

[Deathleech]

Ya, I have no common sense. Silly me, wanting Lego to produce appealing sets that will sell really well! Why would a business want to EVER do that?!

[Jimbobulus]

Ya, I have no common sense. Silly me, wanting Lego to produce appealing sets that will sell really well! Why would a business want to EVER do that?!

Sorry, didn't realise you were from Lego themselves.. may I suggest you refer the matter over to your superiors? Although, other people have pointed out good business reasons as to why Lego have done it this way :)

I'm sure Lego have done their research, they are quite a successful company as far as I know. I think these poly bags are more likely aimed at children to buy as pocket money, in which case I'm also sure the children probably aren't too fussed which Froo this is, etc. Whilst there are a lot of us Lego nuts out there who do care about that sort of thing, we don't actually make up Legos' mass market. :(

[Deathleech]

Right, I get that and I already touched on it numerous times now.

What I don't get is why they put Frodo in a polybag when he is already in the cheapest LotR boxed set at $13. If a kid can afford 5 bucks for a polybag surely they would rather spring for Gandalf Arrives at $13. That way they get more bang for their buck with the same Frodo minifig, exclusive Gandalf, and a new horse. I haven't got an allowance in a long time, but I assume nowadays most kids get at least 10 bucks a week so it's not exactly like we are talking about buying Shelob Attacks vs Helm's Deep here. Both Gandalf Arrives and the Frodo poly are in a similar price range.

Can you honestly tell me that you think the way they set it up is a good decision? Do you think it optimizes sales/profit? Do you think kids will actually buy the Frodo polybag a ton and it will be a big hit?

Edited July 16, 2012 by Deathleech

[Jimbobulus]

I think the poly bags are an bottom of the range, cheapest product available, for the most limited budgets. As a child I could never afford any sets over £10, and something about 35 was my absolute budget. So, if I was still a child, yes, I could imagine getting one of these quite easily. If, however, I had more money, I would of course buy the bigger set. I think the poly bags are about trying to maximise sales- as sad as it is, some people can't afford anything but the cheapest sets, and I am sure TLG would rather get a little money than none. I do see where you are coming from, and I do think it's a bit cheap of them not to make the poly bag Frodo unique.

[deskp]

Well giving away the good stuff for cheap isn't a good idea.