Scubacarrot Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 This is driving me nuts.... And this is the last straw. Right or wrong, we got one more day to last it out.... And let's dance! Unvote: Petrus Fire-Starter (Pandora) Vote: Canute Grey-Bush (CallMePie)
Palathadric Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 Okay, some things to say here. If Dragmall truly is town, then that means, as far as I can tell, since he's confirmed all the members of his group, that there can't be more than three scum, well there could be four, but since I know I'm not scum, then I know there can't be more than three. Therefore, I would suggest that we lynch Canute and kill Petrus at night. That would leave us with seven town and two scum, if Dragmall's theory is correct. Of course, there is the chance that they pull off a conversion which would make the numbers 6 to 3. If the night actions are planned well, we would have a pretty good reading of what allegiance either Rurik or Snotra are so we should be able to lynch them no problem. Oh, I've forgotten that the scum could kill which may put the numbers at 5-3. I think it's highly doubtful that if Dragmall is town that we do indeed have that many scum left though. Does anyone see holes in this theory?
Scubacarrot Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 I think you are right, and that would be worst case scenario with this plan.
Dragonator Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 I have an issue with this though. Petrus has been pushing very, very hard for us to kill him at night. Why might that be? He must have something ready to try and cause us problems. Perhaps he will block his own kill so that we are in the same position tomorrow that we are in today? Perhaps he has some kind of bomb ability that will kill whoever targets him? I don't know, but it worries me, and I am morally opposed to lynching someone that is a confirmed tracker and who doesn't appear scummy to me. Has Canute done anything so far that looks scummy? Certainly less than Petrus has, and we have valid reasons to believe Petrus is scum.
Scubacarrot Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 I have an issue with this though. Petrus has been pushing very, very hard for us to kill him at night. Why might that be? He must have something ready to try and cause us problems. Perhaps he will block his own kill so that we are in the same position tomorrow that we are in today? Perhaps he has some kind of bomb ability that will kill whoever targets him? I don't know, but it worries me, and I am morally opposed to lynching someone that is a confirmed tracker and who doesn't appear scummy to me. Has Canute done anything so far that looks scummy? Certainly less than Petrus has, and we have valid reasons to believe Petrus is scum. Isn't it obvious? if we don't get a conviction and Petrus does not get killed, what do you think will happen? And what does it prove, or better yet not prove, if Petrus is not killed? And now suddenly it's your morals why you don't want to give in to this. Oh please.
Capt. Redblade Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 Apologies. Carl must have misinterpreted your bizarre theory somewhere along the way. Again, apologies if this is incorrect, but Carl is starting to get a splitting headache from all this. Again, if Carl has misinterpreted this nonsense in any way, he genuinely apologizes. The fact is, it isn't easy to follow. It's absolutely incorrect, don't play dumber than you already look now. And you are just spewing lies now. You can't be sure of Petrus because your only evidence is the word of a dead scum, you can't get anyone lynched because you don't participate. You suck. So you say you'll probably be blocked? Then have Carl Dumbfuck watch you. Seriously, it's as simple as that. It's not that complicated. I had to endure insults, having to repeat everything multiple times, had to deal with complete idiocy (Carl, I mean you)... What kind of Valhalla is it where a man is persecuted for mishearing something? Don't give Carl grief because he can't understand what the hell you're talking about, and don't expect to get anywhere in this afterlife talking to people like that. Carl refers you once again to his previous statement: Seriously, Snotra, Carl does hope you will learn from this. Pretty much all you've done so far is attack people of both alignments for the mildest of infractions, real or otherwise. You've made no discernible effort to truly help us, you've tried to blackmail people into telling you what they know, you've made some very frenetic and off-the-wall accusations, and you've been very aggressive and antagonistic this whole time. Your company is not particularly enjoyable and, looking at how you interact with others, Carl understands why you have not been let into the town block. What honest, Tohstre-fearing Townie would want to put up with this? If Carl weren't so sure of Petrus, Carl would be willing to lynch you just to silence you for good. Verily, get stuffed, sweetheart.
Scubacarrot Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 But whatever, nothing new's going to be said, it seems. Sveinn, Cranebeinn and/or Patrekr, vote, if there's no conviction, I will spell it out right now, tomorrow will be a shitstorm and I will cry. Voting off Canute is the right thing to do.
Dragonator Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 But whatever, nothing new's going to be said, it seems. Sveinn, Cranebeinn and/or Patrekr, vote, if there's no conviction, I will spell it out right now, tomorrow will be a shitstorm and I will cry. Voting off Canute is the right thing to do. You'll be crying anyway at how wrong you are Snotra, but yes, do vote gentlemen! For Petrus, of course.
Scubacarrot Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 snip I'll keep this short: I think it's a distinct possibility you are town and tricked by Dragmall and co. Your statements however, were really, really dumb, they were. I can't turn that another way. I haven't blackmailed anyone, that was Hervi's saying, which he retracted later, plus he was scum. Even then, blackmailing? If it helps catch scum, sure. I am most of the time a cool enough guy, until I smell BS, that happened on three different occasions here. With Hervi, with the "town block" and with Dragmall now. When this is over, it will show that I was right to act like a dick in order to ask questions. If you are town, which I don't know, you need to be far more critically and far less reliant on others. I don't want to be in the town block, this is a misconception, not only is it stupid, because I am vanilla, it's also a disfunctional townblock. Townblocks very often do more harm than good, I've found. If you think I'm antagonistic? That's totally cool with me. I act like a dick and I don't play nice, it's absolutely true. Is it a problem for me? Not anymore. It sucks if people take offense, but that's their problem. I have no issues with anyone, even if their game behaviour was not the smartest, if they are bullshitting me or whatever. It's totally cool. You say I did not get anywhere, but that's where you're wrong. I think I would not have gotten half as far if I acted nice. You'll be crying anyway at how wrong you are Snotra, but yes, do vote gentlemen! For Petrus, of course. We'll see.
Palathadric Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 Honestly, I still am unsure what to do. I don't think the argument against Petrus seems more likely than vice versa, but I'm I'm still not willing to concede that they are both not possibly loyalists. The problem I see is that if we vote off Petrus and then Wary kills Rurik or Snotra, and both of the dead come up town, then we won't really know where to start looking tomorrow. Is Dragmall a Servant of Loki, or was Wary converted or what. I feel that there will be too many questions left unanswered tomorrow, if there is a tomorrow, which I'm not yet willing to believe that there will not be.
Rick Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 I feel that there will be too many questions left unanswered tomorrow, if there is a tomorrow, which I'm not yet willing to believe that there will not be. It's quite simple. As has been spelled out quite a few times before, there won't be a tomorrow if we lynch Petrus, but if we lynch Canute and let Wary kill Petrus there will be a tomorrow and we'll have our answers.
Palathadric Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 That's not entirely true. It would depend on how many scum there are remaining. It is not necessarily true that if Petrus is a loyalist that Dragmall is a servant. Furthermore, there is no telling, even if Dragmall is a servant how many of his gang are actually servants as well. Some are, likely enough, mislead loyalists.
Scubacarrot Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 True, but how is that a problem? We'll have something tangible to go on then, and it's pretty easy by then to just pick them off one by one, in order of probability of being scum. Anyways, can you PLEASE vote. I can predict what will happen if there is conviction, and it just seems very annoying to me. Although for the town it isn't so, I'd rather have Petrus voted off and we instantly lose than that being the case. For the slow people: There's likely no kill or a kill by a weapon we haven't seen before (Gofraid's stolen spear, anyone?), on a mislead towny, probably either Sveinn, Cranebeinn or Carl. We will also have a Canute that has seen one of Rurik, Petrus or me see something, and possibly Carl too or some other BS.
Waterbrick Down Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 Looking at everything, to me it is obvious that Petrus is scum, I was the one who spent so much time under that assumption with Dragrun. Canute was under my suspcions earlier in the game as well as Petrus due to their somewhat hesitant and quiet nature (aside from the scuffle with Hervi earlier on), however I can understand the reasoning for Canute acting like that as his power is quite an important one to keep discreet. However falling back onto my original suspicions of Canute would mean distrusting everything Dragmall has done thus far and right now I can't bring myself to opperate under that assumption. I get the point that it's best to make sure we cover all of our bases just in case and considering that we have a team win style to depend on, sacrificing Canute seems like it might just solve our problem. I'm still not sure yet...
Palathadric Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 At the end of this lengthy dickscussion I can't help but follow my gut which tells me that Petrus is the more likely scum. If I'm wrong then I think I won't involve myself in any Mafia situations for a while, but my gut has been right in quite a few other situations, and I think it's the best thing I can follow here. So though I hate to do it, with a great degree of dread I vote: Petrus Fire-Starter (Pandora). I think in the odd case that neither Dragmall nor Petrus are scum then it would be a bad idea to lose our Tracker. We also need a majority for someone No hard feelings, I hope. I will ask Ragnar to give you a quick death.
Scubacarrot Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 Your gut lies. Patrekr, see how Canute and Wary have no choice but to admit there is no problem with the compromise of killing Canute! It solves any trouble that Petrus may be converting someone tonight, YET they don't switch their vote. They won't since with the grip they hold now. Between the doubting townies, they. only. need. one. PLEASE don't be that one. Either Sveinn or Carl is innocent too, but they only see what they want to see. It sucks if you work with someone for a while and then realize he's been betraying you all along. You don't want to see it, because it means you missed something you think should have been obvious to you. I say here, with that in mind, that Dragmall's obviously done a pretty good job (or you are just way too trusting, possibility), but think. Think. It can still happen. Wilhalm saw the light. You can too. Remember back to the question I said earlier? What answers do you still need? How can I convince you, what do you need to know. You might think tomorrow won't be the final day. But is the risk worth that for you? PLEASE. Just trust me. You don't have to trust Petrus, or even Rurik. Just trust me. Give me one day. One more day. And you will see, that I was right. That it all fits, and that we CAN win. I believe in you, Patrekr, that you will see the light, would you believe in me?
Rick Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 I think in the odd case that neither Dragmall nor Petrus are scum then it would be a bad idea to lose our Tracker. Surely losing 'our' Tracker can't be worse than losing to the Servants? This is exactly what will happen if we're right and you lynch Petrus. What happens if Dragmall is right, is that 'scummy' Petrus dies tonight and we win this tomorrow. If you have any doubt left, you'll help us lynch Canute, and we'll all have our answers in the morning. Trust me, if we lynch Petrus there won't be a tomorrow. But, as I said, you don't need to believe us right now. Even Dragmall can't convince anyone we will lose if we lynch Canute, which he thinks is Einherjar. So, if you want answers, vote Canute.
Pandora Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 I would assume that if I am blocked, both of my actions will be blocked, Cranebeinn. That's a risk we shouldn't be taking. That would be the world's most pointless ascetic role then. What is the point of being unblockable if you can be blocked from even becoming unblockable? Nobody could ever use a role like that because the only time they'd be successful in using it they'd have to not be blocked anyway. You really should know better, and I'm sure you do. Do you know that Petrus is Einherjar? No you do not. You have no reason to believe he is. He has not been confirmed as having an action, he has not been verified with any sort of night action as not being up to things at night. But you blocked me at night, and every night there's been a scum-kill. So that's about as verified as anyone else in your "Town Block". My god, your entire theory is based on so many assumptions we could sink a ship with them. My god, your entire case against me is based on the (possibly faked) spoutings of a dead scummo. Clearly, it worked. I figured they couldn't possibly be on the same side. So when Hervi came up scum, Sveinn and I determined that Petrus probably wasn't converted. Except, she was, just later on, night 2 or 3. The perfect cover wouldn't you say? Yes, my perfect cover was to act so incredibly town, that I was too town to be true. You were also considered so vocal in lynching Hervi that you were able to take up the mantle of town leader; wouldn't you have been a faaaaar better conversion candidate than me? Especially with all these people claiming to you. All of us that are voting for Petrus are confirmed townies, so I can be glad in the knowledge that we must be doing the right thing. They have only been 'confirmed' by you, in the most dubious ways, and I am no less confirmed than they are. As for not being helpful Snotra, I've killed 6 scum. Surely that should be pretty telling. Killed them personally? Or just wandered along to vote because things "seem to be heading that way" as you said in the case of Beorn, the scummy role-cop that you didn't think sounded like a scum action and wanted to keep around just that little bit longer whilst you tried to lynch yet more obvious townies with paper-thin accusations? So though I hate to do it, with a great degree of dread I vote: Petrus Fire-Starter (Pandora). You want to listen to your gut? Then listen to that great degree of dread. Please go and read my posts and see what I've said and done. I have stood in the way of Dragmall trying to lynch obvious sheepy townies again and again, yourself included. Look back at Cunute's behaviour at the beginning of the day, where he and Dragmall and Carl were gloating because they all thought they had their scum win sewn up, and look back over the days and see the patterns of behaviour. My actions have always been townie simply because I'm town. It's so easy to say that even Dragmall can say it, but in my case it's actually true. His entire case is based on the supposed words of a confirmed scum, and you've been considering the possibility that we're both town. Well, if you have any shred of doubt that I'm scum, then you need to unvote me and vote for Cunute, because the entire fate of the town (and possibly the world, given the whole Ragnarok thing) rests on this. I will still be killed at night; there's no way Dragmall can be blocked with an ascetic role, and with the full force of the 'Town Block' to ensure my death, there's no excuse for it not to happen. I've already laid out how in previous posts. So unvote me, let me be killed at night and prove to you I'm town in my death, but lynch a scummy scummo first. If you still have reservations, lay them out and I'll try to answer them, but the day is drawing to a close and you are currently sealing the town's doom.
Palathadric Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 But how can you both be so convinced that you are right, unless you know something that we don't? I don't understand how you can be so convinced. Of course I don't like the lynch on Petrus, but in these situations we sometimes have to lynch when we don't like it because it's our best option. The fact is that the situation could be much worse than we think if we lose Canute and he turns up town. I really am not certain what to think, but I believe I made the right decision. I'm just not sure though. Somehow I just don't think lynching Canute would be the right thing to do. I would feel much more comfortable lynching Wary, if he really is the one being converted, but the fact is the we don't know whether that's even true or not. It could be, possibly, but we don't know. For all we know they could have started converting someone else but were just using this plan to infilitrate us and get us to lynch two of the most powerful town members in the form of Petrus and Dragmall. We don't have a clue as to how much Dagrun said was true. For all we know, it could be that Petrus is not the scum but that either Rurik or Snotra are or that the scum converted one of Draggy's gang or are working on Dragmall himself. The fact is that we don't know anything about what Dagrun said and whether it is true or not. Still every time Petrus talks I feel guilty considering him as my lynch candidate. But taking everything into consideration, I don't think it can be too bad for me to unvote: Petrus Fire-Starter (Pandora) and vote: Canute Grey-Bush (CallMePie). This will leave the lynch into my son's hands. The only problem that I have is that if he doesn't come along in time, we will be left with no lynch and that would suck seriously. I think I should be going for a nap myself, but can I trust that if I leave this into your hands you will vote off Petrus if we can't secure enough votes for Canute?
Palathadric Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 And now everyone goes, eh? Well, I'm off to have a nap as well. I think I'm just as deserving as many here, but to ensure that we have a lynch today I will unvote: Canute Grey-Bush (CallMePie) and vote: Petrus Fire-Starter (Pandora). But I will give the last word to my son like I did before so that if new information comes up he will be able to react accordingly. Therefore, after having set my vote thus, I will proxy: Cranebeinn (Chromeknight). Just in case it's not clear, on the odd chance of Cranebeinn not turning up, my vote for Petrus will still stand if Ragnar permits it. I really need to get some sleep though.
MagPiesRUs Posted November 7, 2012 Author Posted November 7, 2012 Vote Count Petrus Fire-Starter - 6 votes (CallMePie, Dragonator, Scouty, Waterbrick Down, Capt. Redblade, Palathadric) Canute Grey-Bush (CallMePie) - 4 votes (Scubacarrot, Rick, Pandora, WhiteFang) With 11 players remaining, 6 votes are required to lynch. There are 4 hours left in the day.
Chromeknight Posted November 7, 2012 Posted November 7, 2012 I am here. I am collating information. I will vote before the deadline.
Scouty Posted November 8, 2012 Posted November 8, 2012 It is a very difficult decision to make, and it's unfortunate my time is very limited today that does not allow me to analyze in complete regard everything that has happened. However, I will be sure to make my decision of who to believe before the deadline based on what I have seen so far.
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