Heroica RPG Rules & FAQ

[Lind Whisperer]

So wait, now you're saying all dwarves are craftsmen? I believe that's stereotyping.

Seriously though, there's a difference between crafting a sword and crafting a flintlock pistol. I can see certain dwarven blacksmiths being masters at crafting swords and axes and other melee items, but not flintlocks, since they haven't been exposed to it. It takes years to master a trade, let alone the creation of weapons. If I handed a dwarf a flintlock, I bet he'd be rather confused as to what he was handed.

I think it comes down to a choice for the narrative. What happens when you commercially sell guns? The average citizen can get their hands on it. Now imagine the Wolfgang getting ahold of flintlock weapons and handing them out in the Hovels. A cool scene to imagine, sure, but one that drastically changes Eubric's dynamics. Suddenly the Houses in power are not totally in control as the people have a lethal and game changing weapon. Suddenly we'd be in a French Revolution-esque setting, with angry, restless citizens, and the heads of houses losing their heads. Stuff like this, if not checked, can change the world, and the narrative.

This. Exactly what I was trying to say.

Then as tech advances, combine that with magic so instead of flintlock, you get closer and closer to modern day weapons. The rules that would have to be created to manage something like rounds fired per round would be a major hassle.

My personal solution, is that we should have more space themed quests. There's no reason why you can't drop a lightning-elemental handcannon that "just happens" to be something small enough to carry in one hand. That way, we'd have advanced technology, but the "source" would be obviously limited.

[CMP]

My personal solution, is that we should have more space themed quests.

Yeah, it's the obvious solution to skipping past the enormous social and cultural shifts concerning rapidly changing technology: just have aliens forcibly introduce them into the world.

[Lind Whisperer]

Yeah, it's the obvious solution to skipping past the enormous social and cultural shifts concerning rapidly changing technology: just have aliens forcibly introduce them into the world.

That's not what I'm saying. Obviously if aliens introduced technology to the world it would cause even worse upheaval than if flintlocks were invented. I'm not suggesting that at all. Look at #122 - it was centered around aliens, but they didn't introduce any technology, despite bringing a giant tri-walker with them. It's fully possible to write quests in which aliens drop technology, but it doesn't get passed on to the rest of the world.

I've actually got two quests planned that would illustrate this perfectly. One is a ways off, because I was hoping to use it to introduce

a perfected Pyrokinetic class

, but the other one is slated for either my next quest, or the one after it. (It involves similar mechanics to Brickdoctor's Pongcanis quest, and after my showing in #131 so far, I almost certainly need more practice QMing before I try anything too complicated)

Edited April 15, 2015 by Lind Whisperer

[LordoftheNoobs]

It's ok to stereotype dwarves, though. They're from the earth, they have no feelings!

[CMP]

That's not what I'm saying. Obviously if aliens introduced technology to the world it would cause even worse upheaval than if flintlocks were invented. I'm not suggesting that at all. Look at #122 - it was centered around aliens, but they didn't introduce any technology, despite bringing a giant tri-walker with them. It's fully possible to write quests in which aliens drop technology, but it doesn't get passed on to the rest of the world.

I've actually got two quests planned that would illustrate this perfectly. One is a ways off, because I was hoping to use it to introduce

a perfected Pyrokinetic class

, but the other one is slated for either my next quest, or the one after it. (It involves similar mechanics to Brickdoctor's Pongcanis quest, and after my showing in #131 so far, I almost certainly need more practice QMing before I try anything too complicated)

My point is that it shouldn't be this difficult to figure out the technology bounds of a medieval fantasy setting and it doesn't need to be broken to create interesting items.

Technology is the wrong word. Atmosphere is what I'm looking for. I really don't think the world of Heroica should have regular contact with aliens. Again...medieval fantasy.

[Lind Whisperer]

My point is that it shouldn't be this difficult to figure out the technology bounds of a medieval fantasy setting and it doesn't need to be broken to create interesting items.

Agreed.

[CMP]

I liked how it was a weird one-off thing in Quest #122. Space is not the theme of Heroica.

[Yzalirk]

I did not intend for such chatter about early guns and what not but it really did get me thinking.

Clearly Heroica takes place in a fantasy realm with Dwarves, Orcs, Goblins, Humans, Elves and so on but there are Science Fictional elements that have been pointed out. A good example I'll use are the automatons. Typically they are like robots. So if this could be done, how could early guns not be a thing? I strongly disagree that guns would be superior over swords. Guns leave holes, swords leave large cuts but could dismember. Both are effective but despite they can't do that in Heroica, both are effective in their own way. Rangers have low health compared to Knights and other melee fighters. That makes a perfect balance, in my opinion. I still do believe that there are boundaries that shouldn't be crossed though. Things like space travel just seem too advanced.

More about guns, I don't mind if in a few years the variety of types of expands but the sooner the better! I'm like guns so I guess I can be considered a gun-buff but things like machine guns and assault rifles are just insane for this setting! The only thing I could see somewhat acceptable is a crank gun, like the early Gatling gun but even that may be too much. Guns that are either cylinder based or single and double fire guns would be more reasonable if not overstepping the boundary. The bottom line for me is that I'm fine with how Heroica is but I would really love to see slight advancements to things in the future, nothing more.

As I was typing this, I forget who mentioned aliens but I'll definitely say that would be interesting but people may not agree with having them since they always depicted as small gray humanoid beings with flying saucers and energy-based weapons. However, maybe not all aliens are highly advanced.

Last thing, Dwarves are people too! Sure, they may be hairy and love to invent and forge things but they are the rulers beneath the surface!

[K-Nut]

Automatons are really only in the hands of the select few, and really only the Ji Pei have them. Whereas they are advanced in the technology aspect of the world, none of the other houses are, and certainly they would obtain this technology before the common people of the city. At this point, technology is very steampunkish minus the use of guns. In my humble opinion, guns don't really fit in the world of Heroica, especially not as common items.

[Lind Whisperer]

As I was typing this, I forget who mentioned aliens but I'll definitely say that would be interesting but people may not agree with having them since they always depicted as small gray humanoid beings with flying saucers and energy-based weapons. However, maybe not all aliens are highly advanced.

Not always. So far, the only appearance(#122, although from the Space Armor that one character(I forget who) has in his inventory, I wouldn't be surprised if there has been at least one reference besides #122) of aliens was of what were clearly LEGO's Alien Conquest Hypaxxi.

[K-Nut]

Not always. So far, the only appearance(#122, although from the Space Armor that one character(I forget who) has in his inventory, I wouldn't be surprised if there has been at least one reference besides #122) of aliens was of what were clearly LEGO's Alien Conquest Hypaxxi.

Atramors has the Galactic Armor, though I don't know if that's associated with Aliens. I think there are some aliens hiding somewhere in the Fields, though. I recall Sandy saying that once.

[Waterbrick Down]

I did not intend for such chatter about early guns and what not but it really did get me thinking.

Clearly Heroica takes place in a fantasy realm with Dwarves, Orcs, Goblins, Humans, Elves and so on but there are Science Fictional elements that have been pointed out. A good example I'll use are the automatons. Typically they are like robots. So if this could be done, how could early guns not be a thing? I strongly disagree that guns would be superior over swords. Guns leave holes, swords leave large cuts but could dismember. Both are effective but despite they can't do that in Heroica, both are effective in their own way. Rangers have low health compared to Knights and other melee fighters. That makes a perfect balance, in my opinion. I still do believe that there are boundaries that shouldn't be crossed though. Things like space travel just seem too advanced.

More about guns, I don't mind if in a few years the variety of types of expands but the sooner the better! I'm like guns so I guess I can be considered a gun-buff but things like machine guns and assault rifles are just insane for this setting! The only thing I could see somewhat acceptable is a crank gun, like the early Gatling gun but even that may be too much. Guns that are either cylinder based or single and double fire guns would be more reasonable if not overstepping the boundary. The bottom line for me is that I'm fine with how Heroica is but I would really love to see slight advancements to things in the future, nothing more.

As I was typing this, I forget who mentioned aliens but I'll definitely say that would be interesting but people may not agree with having them since they always depicted as small gray humanoid beings with flying saucers and energy-based weapons. However, maybe not all aliens are highly advanced.

Last thing, Dwarves are people too! Sure, they may be hairy and love to invent and forge things but they are the rulers beneath the surface!

I understand where you're coming from, I've seen high fantasy games that incorporate flintlocks and they work fine and don't throw the balance of the game off. The issue is that the majority of the player base does not currently believe that the technology fits with their vision of the game world. Automatons have been accepted because the majority of the player base has consented for them to belong in the hands of the technologically superior Ji Pei and that is all. It's not a matter of logically arguing the fact that if technology for automatons exists then so must firearms, it's a matter of perception of the world. Perhaps in a few years we will indeed see a shift, but not at this time.

[Lind Whisperer]

Atramors has the Galactic Armor, though I don't know if that's associated with Aliens.

Thanks - it looks like one of the Stars from #75 Falling Stars dropped it. I'll need to read through it to see if the "Falling" part has any extra-terrestrial significance.

I think there are some aliens hiding somewhere in the Fields, though. I recall Sandy saying that once.

He did! I can't believe I forgot about that.

[Yzalirk]

Automatons are really only in the hands of the select few, and really only the Ji Pei have them. Whereas they are advanced in the technology aspect of the world, none of the other houses are, and certainly they would obtain this technology before the common people of the city. At this point, technology is very steampunkish minus the use of guns. In my humble opinion, guns don't really fit in the world of Heroica, especially not as common items.

I didn't want to openly mention Steampunk in the case I might get some funny looks but I genuinely believe that Steampunk should be the only method of technology. It's quite simple but it has that Science Fiction aspect that makes it fun and enjoyable. Things like modern technology or very advanced fictional technology should just be avoided.

Not always. So far, the only appearance(#122, although from the Space Armor that one character(I forget who) has in his inventory, I wouldn't be surprised if there has been at least one reference besides #122) of aliens was of what were clearly LEGO's Alien Conquest Hypaxxi.

Atramors has the Galactic Armor, though I don't know if that's associated with Aliens. I think there are some aliens hiding somewhere in the Fields, though. I recall Sandy saying that once.

Really? For me, it depends on what sort of advantage it gives if it's an actual player item but if it's an NPC item that can't be given to players, that's a different story.

I understand where you're coming from, I've seen high fantasy games that incorporate flintlocks and they work fine and don't throw the balance of the game off. The issue is that the majority of the player base does not currently believe that the technology fits with their vision of the game world. Automatons have been accepted because the majority of the player base has consented for them to belong in the hands of the technologically superior Ji Pei and that is all. It's not a matter of logically arguing the fact that if technology for automatons exists then so must firearms, it's a matter of perception of the world. Perhaps in a few years we will indeed see a shift, but not at this time.

I see your point but if a mechanical person can be created, I don't see the reason for there to not be some sort of flintlock or matchlock weapons. That's what I'm trying to get at. Even if these said weapons are rare or exclusive to a faction, I would very well be fine with that. I really just hope that Heroica's technology advances in the upcoming years to actually allow these said weapons and hopefully any types of revolvers.

Besides that little stick that peppers enemies, what else would be acceptable for a Hand Cannon?

[Asphalt]

From what I have read on the discussions I don't see there being any pistols, rifles, revolvers being used in the foreseeable future and I have to say I think that is a good idea. As far as hand cannons go, what do you mean by what is acceptable? One of the best illustrations of them I can think of is from the movie Mulan. The dragon headed hand held cannons in that are excellent examples. Just be creative design wise. Keep cobbling pieces together till you get something interesting looking. Then if you think it looks right, run it past the boss and see if it fits. Use your imagination. Don't limit yourself to what "guns" come molded.

[Lind Whisperer]

Besides that little stick that peppers enemies, what else would be acceptable for a Hand Cannon?

A big stick that peppers enemies.

[Waterbrick Down]

I see your point but if a mechanical person can be created, I don't see the reason for there to not be some sort of flintlock or matchlock weapons. That's what I'm trying to get at. Even if these said weapons are rare or exclusive to a faction, I would very well be fine with that. I really just hope that Heroica's technology advances in the upcoming years to actually allow these said weapons and hopefully any types of revolvers.

Besides that little stick that peppers enemies, what else would be acceptable for a Hand Cannon?

Again I don't think anyone is arguing the reasonableness of the issue with you, I for one think it is personally logical. However that's not the point, in my perception of the world of Heroica and the perception of the majority of the player base, small handheld firearms are not preferable at this time. As far as what would be acceptable take a look at the treasury topic, if you're simply asking so you can figure out how close you can toe the line then I think you probably know what the answer will be.

[Lind Whisperer]

You just could have your character find out that he's partially Munchkin. That'd work too.

(That'd probably require too many hours of RPing him discovering his culture, though, since Munchkin knowledge isn't freely shared with just anyone...)

Edited April 15, 2015 by Lind Whisperer

[Asphalt]

When that pesky hammer gets stuck Thor needs a little firepower.

[Yzalirk]

Again I don't think anyone is arguing the reasonableness of the issue with you, I for one think it is personally logical. However that's not the point, in my perception of the world of Heroica and the perception of the majority of the player base, small handheld firearms are not preferable at this time. As far as what would be acceptable take a look at the treasury topic, if you're simply asking so you can figure out how close you can toe the line then I think you probably know what the answer will be.

I took a look at the Treasury and noticed a lot of the weapons are Crossbows and I don't know why I don't just use of of those. I'll actual do some experimenting with brick built Hand Cannons I could use and I'll give you guys a peek, if that is not a problem.

[Chromeknight]

Arguably, a world with magic wouldn't even develop firearms since a mage can do the same thing with just a gem. And any development of chemical combustion powered metal projectiles would be offset by magical shielding development.

Edited April 16, 2015 by Chromeknight

[Flipz]

It's also a fairly major plot point that most people in the world are superstitiously distrustful of advanced technology, even more so than they are about mages.

[Cutcobra]

Here's a possible solution for all of you science fiction fans: We shall create a Space Heroica as soon as this one is over with blackjack and hookers aliens and stuff! Or we could just make it a vote for Heroica 2 or Space Heroica, since I myself prefer the former.

[Lind Whisperer]

Here's a possible solution for all of you science fiction fans: We shall create a Space Heroica as soon as this one is over with blackjack and hookers aliens and stuff! Or we could just make it a vote for Heroica 2 or Space Heroica, since I myself prefer the former.

Herospace.

It's been nearly a year since I proposed it, and I still haven't come up with a better name yet*.

*I've been working on that exact sort of project ever since I first joined Heroica. It's basically Heroica in space, with M-Tron, Futuron, Spyrius, etc., instead of the houses. And there's a giant space station instead of the hall. Tiny little differences like that.

[Kintobor]

You'd need more than tiny little differences. The classes would need to be heavily retooled, the weapons would need to be updated for the campaign, and the world would need to be rebuilt. If someone did a space variant with this system, I'd prefer it to not be just a reskin of Heroica. I'd want it to be it's own story and conflicts.