Generic Contest Discussion

[Good old Lego builder]

That is correct and in the end, the same creation will probably win then too. Of course on the other hand, with a system like F1, for creators (and others perhaps) it is perhaps nice to see that 'my creation didn't win, but got a reasonable amount of points, it is not a winner but still good' , if you get what I mean. That would be nice with the f1 system.

And to conclude, one could also argue that in the WIP topics you can tell a designer that or what you like about a creation (instead of giving 10 people 1 point, to show you liked it.

Oh well, there will allways be discussion like this, which is fun. And after all, it is al about these creations and the contests really bring great results. In the end, it is having fun to create all these things ( and admire them) what it is all about. Not? (Noooo, stupid old Lego builder, it is all about winning, shut up you fool). :-)

Edited August 4, 2014 by Good old Lego builder

[m0dulo]

_{During my education to become a teacher (...)}

_{When using a 3 point scale, they have to have an opinion (good, mediocre, bad) for example.}

One time I had a class evaluate everyone else's projects for a contest. They each had to pick the three best projects. They could not pick their own. The first would receive three points, the second would receive two points, and the third would receive one point.

Rubrics could work well too except that would probably get too complicated in a situation like this. But the idea isn't bad. Have a few criteria (followed rules, aesthetics, etc.) and then grade it on the three point scale like Good old Lego builder mentioned.

[Lipko]

(Noooo, stupid old Lego builder, it is all about winning, shut up you fool). :-)

Wrong. It's about the fame. It doesn't matter if you win if you don't get the fame.

[Good old Lego builder]

I was just joking, you are absolutely correct Lipko!

[hrontos]

It is may be not that important, if we use "F1" system or traditional "distribute 10 or 20" system.

Statistically with that many voters results will show nicely using both systems.

Distribute 10 or 20 seems to be more flexible, since one can decide if he clearly selects his personal winner or rewards more creations.

Looking at the voting results, it looks like it is difficult for people to decide and so they reward more creations.

"Distribute 10 or 20" also somehow eliminates slightly voting for friends or more famous builders, since you are not forced to decide which is the best. When somebody is forced to decide, he will do it based on many factors, not only model itself.

Since many people cannot decide and they distribute the points among many entries, it looks like it is more important to eliminate huge difference between min. and max. number of allocated points. The reason is simple: when difference is too big, one "decisive" voter may actually completely change results of contest by assigning max. number of points.

Taking into account these points, "distribute 10" seems to be best for me, may be with higher minimum (like 2), to force people to choose max. 5 entries. So even entry on the 5th place would get 2 points. This is also 2.5times less points than the 1st place, which is the same as in F1 (25 for 1st and 10 for 5th).

Edited August 4, 2014 by hrontos

[BusterHaus]

On the topic of contest length: wouldn't a variable time limit work better? For example, if you have a "sequel" to the Mini contest called Micro, it could be two weeks. If it's a contest to build a flagship model, it could be six or eight weeks.

[hrontos]

On the topic of contest length: wouldn't a variable time limit work better? For example, if you have a "sequel" to the Mini contest called Micro, it could be two weeks. If it's a contest to build a flagship model, it could be six or eight weeks.

I think the key reason for longer period are the Bricklink orders. Since it is necessary to build the model physically in the right colors, people are using BL to get the parts and it takes some time. It is not that much about the size of the build, missing micro model part will arrive after the same number of days as complete flagship. Of course, it probability of missing part on micro build is lower.

It would be nice to have some speed building contest - something like 24hours contest. What can you build in 24 hours from 200 parts. Or what C-model can you design from parts of some standard model in 24hours.

[jorgeopesi]

Or what C-model can you design from parts of some standard model in 24hours.

I second that, what a real challenge! .

[hrontos]

I second that, what a real challenge! .

I am just not sure how to tell people, which standard model to buy, without telling them too early.

May be a color schema match would not be obligatory to allow building from in-house bricks or digital entries acceptance would resolve this.

[Moz]

It would be nice to have some speed building contest - something like 24hours contest. What can you build in 24 hours from 200 parts. Or what C-model can you design from parts of some standard model in 24hours.

Those can be a bit hard on people in bad timezones. For Australia it's likely that the contest will start and finish at an unreasonable hour of the morning, and possibly not a weekend one. If it was 12 hours, using EU time 8am Saturday to 8pm Saturday thats going to put the USA people at 4pm-4am overnight on Saturday and Australia 8pm Friday to 8am Saturday. So "speed build" might have to mean "3 days" not "4 hours"...

I'm also wondering whether the SBrick has any chance of being accepted. It would somewhat advantage people who have one (or two), and I suspect once we get them we're not going to be too keen on the existing PF controllers :)

Edited August 5, 2014 by Moz

[Jim]

A speed build competition....I like it (we will do this at some point)

I am planning on doing an SBrick contest once the product has been launched. Whether SBrick will be accepted in contests where PF is allowed too....I need to think about it.

@hrontos: I can relate to your opinion about the voting

[Bzroom]

I'm sorry I asked for 20 points. :( Next time!

I still need to vote. Not enough coffee to make the decision.

p.s. 24hrs. Nooo i'm not worthy. Plus all my bricks are consumed. It would take 24hrs to disassemble everything. It's ZBLJ over here every day. :(

Edited August 5, 2014 by Bzroom

[Zerobricks]

I'm sorry I asked for 20 points. :( Next time!

I still need to vote. Not enough coffee to make the decision.

p.s. 24hrs. Nooo i'm not worthy. Plus all my bricks are consumed. It would take 24hrs to disassemble everything. It's ZBLJ over here every day. :(

Huh?

[Jim]

Huh?

I don't speak Bzroom. Maybe Goodle Translate can help you out

[Bzroom]

I'm constantly out of bricks and it always makes me think of your username.

[Zerobricks]

I'm constantly out of bricks and it always makes me think of your username.

Thats interesting... I always low on vricks too

Back to topic I think in the next competition there should be pictures with entries because here it seems people just look at names and not really the models themselves when they vote...

[Jim]

Back to topic I think in the next competition there should be pictures with entries because here it seems people just look at names and not really the models themselves when they vote...

I can omit the entry list, so people are forced to go throught the entry topic.

Your opinion might be based on a feeling though.

[Erik Leppen]

I think the next competition should force entrants to supplyh a picture-without-fuss (just the final model by itself) which can be used to take a miniature of for a compilation picture.

A second reason for this is that I fear that the current setup fof requiring advertisement imagery puts ahead those that are better with image software and design (which I don't think is a fair way of winning). There are some really good pictures out there and I know how hard it can be to look through the editing and only to the model by itself.

(In that regard, having a digital file would mean a more even playing field where everyone uses the exact same presentation, so that the only deciding factor could be the model itself. Not saying one should pursue that, just mentioning it for the argument.)

Another issue that I'd like to address is voting-for-oneself. Currently this is not allowed. Is anyone aware that this means that the very act of voting puts the voter at a disadvantage? If we were even allowed to allot 1 of the 20 points to oneself, then at least voting wouldn't be disadvantagious to oneself. (or any other way that wouldn't put the voter at a disadvantage) I know it's good sportsmanship to not vote oneself, but I think people could be left with a sore feeling when they turn out to be the guy that lost by one point because he showed good sportsmanship.

[Jim]

Another issue that I'd like to address is voting-for-oneself. Currently this is not allowed. Is anyone aware that this means that the very act of voting puts the voter at a disadvantage?

Of course. It's even better for contestants not to vote at all

With F1 voting we could allow voting for your own entry. That will result in most of the contestants getting 10 points, but they still need to allot the other 8, 6, 4, 3, 2 and 1.

I need to think about the promo image, although I don't think winning or losing the contest depends on your skills to create a nice promo image.

[Cumulonimbus]

What about LDD files as deliverable? It is a very good way to judge the technical aspects of a MOC such as (illegal) shortcuts, part count, techniques used, functionality, mechanisms and even structural rigidity (for a trained eye).

On the other hand, not all builders use LDD as a tool or have proficient skills. Additionally, judging +50 LDD files can be time-consuming.

[Lipko]

I need to think about the promo image, although I don't think winning or losing the contest depends on your skills to create a nice promo image.

Plus usually if someone is good at model design (s)he is probably okay with basic advertising image design too. And the latter is more about effort and some level of standard than talent. Making a winner entry takes time and effort.

Edited August 5, 2014 by Lipko

[Alasdair Ryan]

Of course. It's even better for contestants not to vote at all

With F1 voting we could allow voting for your own entry. That will result in most of the contestants getting 10 points, but they still need to allot the other 8, 6, 4, 3, 2 and 1.

I need to think about the promo image, although I don't think winning or losing the contest depends on your skills to create a nice promo image.

I am not a fan of the F1 voting system.

People also need to read the rules on the date they joined Eurobricks.

[Zerobricks]

What about voting with a simple poll where multiple voting options are allowed?

[legomuppet9]

What about voting with a simple poll where multiple voting options are allowed?

And then you could have it as open OR closed, which is good, and its a lot easier to see how your model's doing. I like this idea, although I think you'd have to cap how many you can vote for

[Zerobricks]

And then you could have it as open OR closed, which is good, and its a lot easier to see how your model's doing. I like this idea, although I think you'd have to cap how many you can vote for

Yeah you can only vote once and cant change votes later... Simple.