Sweden Posted March 16, 2005 Posted March 16, 2005 Isn't it hilarious?! When thinking about and looking through the "What's Ultimate Collector Series or not?" post that I made and all the answers I got the very general opinnion is that "Ultimate Collector Series" is NOT about scale at all even though it actually is and that the very same thing seem to apply to the System or Mini Figure sets. However... From time to time most people "still" complain about sets not being in scale with the mini figures and that the sets aren't in scale with each other as well as some sets being heavily <insert that tiresome argument> but when all this is brought up most of the people who whined and moaned about it seem to have forgotten what they said. And now... The subject of scale and accuracy is brought up once again this time regarding the "Mini Sets" that as far as I know "isn't" a series of sets that are scale mini models of the ships and vehicles seen in the films but actually none scale mini interputations of them made in one single size made and aimed at young children. Can someone please explain this contradiction? This is great fun to me. ;) Sweden... The One... And only. Quote
stan Posted March 17, 2005 Posted March 17, 2005 I just re-read the "UCS" posts, way too long man. I dont think there is a contradiction in what people said, i think that they were trying to explain that to be labelled as UCS the sets dont needed to be in scale with each other, the label of UCS is just a label of exclusivity or collectabilty that Lego is trying to market. However, like you, most people think it would be nice for all similar sized UCS ships to be in scale with each other, and all similar sized systems sets to be in scale with each other, and all similar sized mini sets to be in scale with each other. So i think the two subjects of "what is UCS" and "wanting ships in the same size scale" are completely seperate, so there cant be a contradiction. This is my longest post yet........it's catching. Quote
xwingyoda Posted March 17, 2005 Posted March 17, 2005 Sweden, Stan, There are never posts that are too long ;) Face the "harsh" reality of TLC, it is impossible for every ship to be at the same scale (minis, systems & UCS). The same scale can only be used on quite small ships like the Ties, Shuttle (more or less though), X-Wings, Snowspeeders.... It is also impossible to have a lot less <insert that tiresome argument> sets because it represents the bigger part of TLC's market, and us, AFOLs are lot less important (in terms of market...) Quote
Sweden Posted March 17, 2005 Posted March 17, 2005 stan I'll try and explain it one more time... Over the years I've seen "lots" of people on AFOL communities whining and moaning about spaceship and vehicle sets not being in scale with the mini figures and not being in scale with each other as well as being heavily <insert that tiresome argument> and how much better this Star Wars line could've been if only The LEGO Group had etc... Then I start a new topic about all this to try and contribute with what I can to get away from the ever so typical "I've got $10000.00 this month in spending money so what sets should I buy guys?" posts and all of a sudden this whole thing about scale is nothing people can remember whining and moaning about!? In this topic scale and accuracy is brought up once again by other people saying it's important and a thing they want or even demand from The LEGO Group so why is it that when I make a post about wanting it I'm totally wrong and when someone else does it's totally right so does what's right depend on who says it? If that's not a contradiction then I don't know what a contradiction is. :| xwingyoda Right. There's nothing wrong with a long and intelligent conversation. Yes, it's impossible for The LEGO Group to make all the spaceships and vehicles in one single scale because it's just not possible wether it's UCS, System or Mini scale but that was never ever the issue with the scale topic and where the heck people got that idea from is a complete mystery because I never ever said that. What I actually said was that it's "totally possible" for The LEGO Group to make all of the "smaller" one or two man fighters or vehicles in one single scale simply because it's POSSIBLE for them to do so just like a whole lot of people want them to be and that's what I've been talking about the whole time but heck no... People love to comment on what I say but they don't even bother to read what I just wrote. :| I'll try and explain it one more time... The X-Wing Fighter, Y-Wing Fighter, A-Wing Fighter, B-Wing Fighter, Snowspeeder, Standard T.I.E. Fighter, T.I.E. Interceptor, T.I.E. Bomber and Darth Vader's T.I.E. Fighter to name most of them CAN be made in the same scale in System scale and CAN be made in the same scale in 1:28 scale so what's the problem now? The Millennium Falcon, Imperial Shuttle and Slave 1 CAN'T be made in the same scale as the above ships in System scale because they would be freaking HUGE and cost a bloody furtune and the same goes for the 1:28 scale idea so these have to be <insert that tiresome argument> in both scales but still they could be rather huge model sets. The Rebel Blockade Runner and Imperial Star Destroyer... Jesus, people got to be damn stupid if I also had to explain that part as well... But... The capitol spaceships of this "enormous" type of size have to be made in induvidual scales even if some could be made in the same scale as each other because that's realistic... The ones who didn't understand me the first time maybe will do so now. Or don't you? *wacko* Wrong, every piece of the market or markets ARE important for them unless they're brain dead. :| Sweden... The One... And only. Quote
mutley777 Posted March 17, 2005 Posted March 17, 2005 sweden you make a lot of good points, but god do you need to get out more. ;) Quote
stan Posted March 17, 2005 Posted March 17, 2005 My point was that in the topic of "what's Ultimate Collectors Series or not?" people were not against the suggestion that similiar sized ships should be to the same scale, but were saying that to be labelled as UCS they dont neccassarily have to be to one scale, as the UCS line includes scale models, sculptures and, dare i say it, even system scale sets. So within the UCS topic i dont see anyone being against your idea of wanting the sets to scale, therefore there are no contradictions, simply misunderstandings of meanings. Quote
Sweden Posted March 18, 2005 Posted March 18, 2005 mutley777 I need to get out more huh? *Laughs* I think I know what you've imagined me to be in real life but I'll disappoint you. *Laughs* I'm 6' 3" tall (190 cm). My weight is around 280 Ibs (135 kg). My upper arms are 20" and my chest is 52" around. I'm built like a wrestler. Been into body building and power lifting most of my life. Been playing American Fotball as well. I've got long blond hair and most of the time I've got a beard thing going or a 5 o'clock shadow. I look like a biker which isn't completely untrue. I get drunk everyonce in a while and I like Whiskey. A brawl doesn't scare me off. Not muppets either. So I'm nothing like people imagine me to be. *Laughs* Still I'm a gentle gigant unless really pissed off. Got a girlfriend that I love dearly and that loves me just as much. I'm a helpful kind of guy and I always stand up for the weak. My girlfriend calls me an angel without wings. Therefore I treat her like a little Princess. Got four kids in the deal when I met her as well and I love her kids as well. I love my family and my friends. I work as a cab driver. I love movies and especially Science Fiction, Horror, Fantasy and Action. I build and collect model kits as well as the Star Wars and Harry Potter LEGO lines. I've got a huge collection of railway model kits as well as a huge collection of DVD titles. My new passion (except for my girlfriend) is McFarlane Toys action figures that I've started to collect. I like mother nature so I go fishing at times. I love all the good stuff in life. So with other words I'm NO Harry Potter that needs to get out more. *Laughs* stan Okay, that's what I've been trying to say the whole time that similar sized ships should be in one scale and other huge ones in another or several different scales wether it's spaceships or vehicles because that's a realistic approach to it so you and some others actually understood me and got it right unlike some other. But there's no UCS System sets. That's just a myth. UCS is UCS and System is System. The main reason for this is that the Cloud City set happened to be misplaced in the UCS cathegory on Shop at Home when it's just a "plain and simple" Shop at Home Exclusive set with a 5 digit number as another identification mark. Sweden - The One... You thought was a Harry Potter dude when he wasn't. Quote
xwingyoda Posted March 18, 2005 Posted March 18, 2005 Thanks again Sweden for this brilliant thesis :-D ;) Quote
OOM-30 Posted March 19, 2005 Posted March 19, 2005 Over on FBTB, someone said that he had ordered JSF+VD with the catalog quick order, and received his mini JSF, its 38 pieces, set 6966, ages 7+, and in a bag like the mini Tie Quote
snefroe Posted March 19, 2005 Posted March 19, 2005 mutley777But there's no UCS System sets. That's just a myth. UCS is UCS and System is System. The main reason for this is that the Cloud City set happened to be misplaced in the UCS cathegory on Shop at Home when it's just a "plain and simple" Shop at Home Exclusive set with a 5 digit number as another identification mark. i've never undersood this UCS line anyway. it's as if some one from the company said, one morning: "guys, wouldn't it be nice to have large x-wings and tie fighters? let's design those for the rest of the day..." there was no clear strategy behind it, it just seemed like a great idea. and it is a great idea if you, as a company, have a clear mission statement behind it. if you know, as a company, what to do with it. And it seems to me that tlc never did that... that is why it lacks cohesion and credibility. i mean, sculptures (yoda, darth maul) and real models (x-wing, tie fighter) are two different things. They shouldn't be in one line. And cloud city was probably a mistake... Or let's hope that it was... it simply confuses customers... As Sweden says, they should have set up series of craft scale 1:28 and perhaps another series for larger craft, like the SDI. TLC should have gone to the world of model kit builders with these lines, heavily supported by marketing campaigns and TLC should be producing at least 6-10 sets a year. the reason why is simple, in the world of model builders, scale rules! All major producers in that world set up production lines on different scales: 1:72, 1:144, 1:48,... If you want to attract model kit builders with lego sets, than you're going to have to play by their rules. it's just that simple. i don't think they should have created the sculptures. i'm not sure if they were very succesfull, i don't think so. perhaps they could have published the construction book on their website so that people could build the sculptures if they wanted to. instead, tlc mixed everything together in just one huge category: ucs Sure, they indicated that it's an "Ultimate Collector Series". that basically means "everything that doesn't fit into the System themes" not really smart, is it? Quote
xwingyoda Posted March 19, 2005 Posted March 19, 2005 Snefroe1, I don't get your point on the UCS line. UCS are just much larger and detailed sets (that do or do not exist in minifig scale - system) designed for more experienced builders who want to have as "decoration" large scale models of ships... I just love my UCS Snowspeeder troning on my office ;). Basically its not the same market target as systems. Unfortunatly the UCS line is not that very succesful (I think) due to its pricing and S@H exclusivity. Off course you can have models going from Ships to sculptures in one UCS line. I don't see where that is confusing. As an analogy take the Designer line for instance: it varies from small models like the mini robots, to bigger sculptures like the T-Rex, to much larger sculptures like the 4X4 or helicopter (which could nearly be a UCS in term of size) and I don't see anyone complaining on its diversity. You could say its a "fits all" line, maybe but so what. I do agree with you on the scaling: if TLC wants to attract new customers (or keep some after the end of licences) it should pay a lot more attetion on scaling of some lines (lets not go again on the problems of SW scaling) Quote
snefroe Posted March 19, 2005 Posted March 19, 2005 Snefroe1,I don't get your point on the UCS line. UCS are just much larger and detailed sets (that do or do not exist in minifig scale - system) designed for more experienced builders who want to have as "decoration" large scale models of ships... I just love my UCS Snowspeeder troning on my office ;). Basically its not the same market target as systems. Unfortunatly the UCS line is not that very succesful (I think) due to its pricing and S@H exclusivity. Off course you can have models going from Ships to sculptures in one UCS line. I don't see where that is confusing. As an analogy take the Designer line for instance: it varies from small models like the mini robots, to bigger sculptures like the T-Rex, to much larger sculptures like the 4X4 or helicopter (which could nearly be a UCS in term of size) and I don't see anyone complaining on its diversity. You could say its a "fits all" line, maybe but so what. I do agree with you on the scaling: if TLC wants to attract new customers (or keep some after the end of licences) it should pay a lot more attetion on scaling of some lines (lets not go again on the problems of SW scaling) well, i guess it's marketing. it's how you're marketing your products and who your intended audience is. my point is that: there is a case to be made to seperate models and sculptures; sure, you're a lego fan, so, for you, it's not a problem to have all products in one line. what these sets have in common, for you, is lego. For a model kit builder, it's not necessarily lego, it's building realistic models of craft (dioramas,...) on a certain scale. in the case of lego models, they use bricks instead of molded pieces and paint; for them, one line of lego sets including sculptures, cloud cities,.. is probably not the right strategy. if you want to reach out to model kit builders, and i'm not sure if that's what TLC wants to do, (After all, i do not see any clear mission statement behind the UCS) then you should set up a consistent line of scale models, and only models. it seems to me that TLC tries to produce sets and themes for all sorts of different people, hoping they will all be satisfied with the products they get, instead of setting up branches of themes/sets for different audiences... the designer theme is not quite the same, because there is just one audience (lego fans), perhaps of a variety of ages. i don't see model kit builders buying designer sets, tho. These sets are simply not up to their level or unattractive,... i guess... by the way, i'm not speaking for any group of model kit builders. I've built models in the past, that's it... So if there are angry model kit builders who totally disagree with this, then we'll probably hear about it... it's difficult, as an individual to say, predict,... what an entire group thinks or does... Quote
xwingyoda Posted March 19, 2005 Posted March 19, 2005 Snefroe1, OK, I get your point on line separation ;) . Like you say, its all a question of marketing strategies. One of the problem TLC is facing is to target the right audience, especially because the AFOL & KFOL communities are so diverse. Pleasing one category could get another one angry... Tough calls there. One suggestion (I don't know how practicable this is though) is to have (like the Designer line) a new line dedicated to "real" Lego fans - more sophisticated models (ranging from minifig scale to "sculpture" scale). Its all a question of pleasing a much broader audience of consumers. Quote
yoda601 Posted April 1, 2005 Posted April 1, 2005 They are all available. I didnt see a topic about this so I mad eone. But, the clone turbo tank costs 101 euros! :'( Quote
The Middleman Posted April 1, 2005 Posted April 1, 2005 Just 15 hours left for me! :P And with NORMAL cost too! Still, at least you European blighters are GETTING the sets. :-D Quote
xwingyoda Posted April 1, 2005 Posted April 1, 2005 They are all available. I didnt see a topic about this so I mad eone. But, the clone turbo tank costs 101 euros! :'( Ha, ha, Nice april fool's joke there buddy :-D :-D :-D Wait, you're right its 110 Quote
lucasanakin Posted April 1, 2005 Posted April 1, 2005 i get two new sets (JSF and ARC) in my local (austria) TRU after asking for it. |-D a nice woman went in there depot and came back with the new sets. :-D after asking the shop-manager, they selled this two sets to me :D GREAT !!!!!! and......they are cheaper than on the s@h Quote
jonfett Posted April 1, 2005 Posted April 1, 2005 I ordered the turbo tank and clone walker off S@H but I'll wait a while for the rest. Oh and here is a nice picture I got in an email from S@H. Jon. Quote
xwingyoda Posted April 1, 2005 Posted April 1, 2005 Excellent choice Jon, I really love the walker *satis* *satis* As to the tank, I have to wait till monday *devil* Thanks for the pic, good view of the minifigs ;) Quote
The Middleman Posted April 2, 2005 Posted April 2, 2005 Walker is one of the best small sets ever produced for LSW. Quote
yoda601 Posted April 2, 2005 Posted April 2, 2005 :'( I have to wait til may to get the CTT... Not enough available money... And i'm too young to get a job... :'( Quote
mutley777 Posted April 7, 2005 Posted April 7, 2005 2 poeple are selling these on bricklink in the uk(a bit pricy). any ideas where they got them? http://www.bricklink.com/search.asp?invXre...61815&invType=F Quote
xwingyoda Posted April 7, 2005 Posted April 7, 2005 Yep, in the UK after a certain amount when you bought ROTS sets you had one free ;) Quote
The Middleman Posted April 7, 2005 Posted April 7, 2005 It's coming to the US soon, too, along with MINI ARC-170. Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.