Ragnarök Now Redux - Day Three

[def]

... or was it convenient that the town (possible scum tell emphasised, even though you did that yourself) did that for you?

Sorry, the town and scum did. The group did. The majority of people placing votes did. Are those more natural townie English? Would any townie write that? How would you have phrased it differently?

[Hinckley]

-Helga. Repeating accusations of others, looking busy, not actually doing much.

What exactly would you like to hear? I can tell you that I say "us" and I ignore Baulf until I'm told not to. Anything in particular concerning you? It's hard to answer to you want to hear more about me. I'm so interesting I could just go on for days.

[Rick]

Cautioned strongly against reading things into Sigrid's allegiance. Wondering if he's a SK.

So, what did we learn? It's likely Mursi is Einherjar. I agree, it's likely, and I said so before. But that's about it. And because I clearly wasn't pre-empting Sigrid coming up a Servant today, you now think I'm the SK?

[Hinckley]

No. It appears he was just plain old stubborn and bull-headed. Easy to confuse those things though. My apologies, Mursi.

Too convenient of you to find issue with this now. You had no issue with it because it was a townie thing to do, and you voted along with that. Nobody was under any obligation to follow it, and they were welcome to disagree. There were 12 hours to get a split town together. I wasn't suggesting that 24 hours before, 48 hours before, much less at the start of the day (see below). If you want to keep bringing it up, it's reflecting on you. It's pretty clear to me what I was doing.

Sorry. I forgot there was a statute of limitations on the Scummy things you've done.

You honestly think Gofraid was a target for the vig? That's far-fetched. I could think of others more likely (Naemr, for one). He was one of the more active townies. I agree that Jarni would be a good SK target, unlikely to be watched.

Yes, several Townies mentioned him as suspect. Enough that he would make a weird Scum target. So you think the Scum killed Gofraid, Jarni was killed by a SK and we didn't see a vig kill?

[Waterbrick Down]

Vote Count

Petr Half-Troll (Piratedave84): 12 votes (Captain Nemo, jamesn, Cornelius Murdock, Hinckley, CallMePie, Rick, Fugazi, LegoDad, Waterbrick Down, Palathadric, Captain Genaro, Darkdragon)

Sigrid (Sisco): 8 votes (Piratedave84, Bob, def, Scubacarrot, fhomess, Trumpetking, WhiteFang, Mencot)

Non-voters: 2 (Sisco, Kristel)

With a majority of 12 votes, Petr Half-Troll (Piratedave84) has been convicted. A conclusion will be posted soon.

It is now night time. You have 24 hours to send in your night actions.

This isn't going well, though seeing as how we've probably got ~5-6 scum out there, we'll at least have a better chance at taking one down today. Alright, looking at the votes from Day 1, we now know that both suspects were Einherjar which means that the scum would have sat on either lynch comfortably. Due to this fact, Mursi seems like an unlikely servant since he helped sway the initial bandwagon away from Sigrid. Just as a theory, would it be fair to consider that those who jumped on the bandwagon at the end of the day such as Dagstyr and possibly Patrekr might be Einjerhar? Since both suspects were Einherhar, I would think the servants would have voted earlier in the day and were fine with letting the town either lynch one of their own or end the day with a no lynch. I still intend on following up on Naemr what I started yesterday, but I want to process everything given what we know today first to see if there's anything more compelling.

[CMP]

You think the vig would have claimed to get Wilhalm lynched?

If Wilhalm was protected, it could mean the SK targeted him last night. It would still not lead us to the SK though. So, why are you suggesting the protector comes forward? Also, if the SK targeted Wilhalm and he was protected, that would make last night's kills the Servant's and the vig's.

You missed the important parts of what I said. I said a compulsive vig, a one-shot vig, whatever role could explain why there are three kills instead of two in the case we didn't have an SK, like last time. Obviously if that person was not an SK and is the third killer (they'd know since they wouldn't be a normal vig or the scum killer) it would mean Wilhalm lied about his claim and he's almost sure to be scum.

And yes, that's exactly what I'm thinking happened. I said if the town protector did NOT protect Wilhalm to figure out some way to tell us that (I'm not remotely suggesting they do so themselves), since like you say, it's probably the SK targeted him, and if Wilhalm survived that and the town protector's not responsible, it means either a blocker got lucky or Wilhalm is scum and had the scum protector on him.

I still am super uneasy about his claim. It's really convenient.

Yes... More on that.

Any particular reason you're answering for him?

-Rurik. He's cagey. Cautioned strongly against reading things into Sigrid's allegiance. Wondering if he's a SK.

And any particular reason it looks to me like it's contradicting this?

[def]

So, what did we learn? It's likely Mursi is Einherjar. I agree, it's likely, and I said so before. But that's about it. And because I clearly wasn't pre-empting Sigrid coming up a Servant today, you now think I'm the SK?

I'm wondering about it. Who do you think it could be?

Sorry. I forgot there was a statute of limitations on the Scummy things you've done.

I think it's more likely that you saw I had proposed them as lynchees, said, "Hey, great! Goo goo, ga ga!" then voted for Petr. Then, when the chance came up, you throw it at me, saying it was suspicious at the time. It was that last part, where you pushed your story too far. Finding it suspicious in retrospect, maybe, but finding it suspicious at the time and keeping your mouth shut? No way. Doesn't happen.

Yes, several Townies mentioned him as suspect. Enough that he would make a weird Scum target. So you think the Scum killed Gofraid, Jarni was killed by a SK and we didn't see a vig kill?

I think Gofraid was a pretty clear townie. Whether his theories were right or not, it appeared he was working for the town... Sorry, us. I wrote us.

[Darkdragon]

Tell me how it's interesting. You think I was told to post about Bob and then I used the word "us" and that makes me Scum. Does that sound about right? A lot has been said regarding your and other's activity. Do you have any opinions on it? It'd be nice if you would contribute more to our Scum hunt.

I think you being scum makes you scum. When you said "us" even in the context you used it, it sounded as if it was the scum point of view.

What do I need to have an opinion on my own quietness? That doesn't even make sense. I did suspect Sigrid slightly for her quietness though never enough to lynch, but now we know that meant nothing anyway. Generally speaking it seems there is usually one scum hiding in quiet group and it's usually someone that is new to the games.

So, ignoring Baulf would've been Scummy?

No, and you know that's not what I meant. More like, it's not like you to ignore anyone so if you did then it might look scummy. Experianced scum teammates could have reminded you of this.

Said the person who has said and done next to nothing. I suppose you wouldn't suggest looking at some of the people being far quieter than usual and flying under the radar?

Sure go ahead and look at quiet people. Look at everyone. I've nothing to hide.

[def]

Any particular reason you're answering for him?

Sorry, I meant I would elaborate my thoughts on Wilhalm later in the post, as I did in the end.

And any particular reason it looks to me like it's contradicting this?

What? Maybe there's a SK, maybe there isn't. I'm on the fence and looking both ways.

I will now. Unfortunately, it takes a heck of a lot more time to figure out what you're saying about others whose allegiance I don't know than it is to explain about myself.

Sorry, not going to do this now. I've been at this over an hour, reading and writing, and real life is coming back into play.

[CMP]

Sorry, I meant I would elaborate my thoughts on Wilhalm later in the post, as I did in the end.

What? Maybe there's a SK, maybe there isn't. I'm on the fence and looking both ways.

Damn, I thought you were saying Wilhalm cured the SK.

I think Gofraid was a pretty clear townie. Whether his theories were right or not, it appeared he was working for the town... Sorry, us. I wrote us.

To you, maybe...I'm surprised you can call him a clear-cut townie. Finn, Wary, and Rurik all seemed at least somewhat suspicious of him. All he seemed to be doing yesterday was defend himself. I wouldn't be surprised if it was the vig that killed him.

[Rick]

You missed the important parts of what I said. I said a compulsive vig, a one-shot vig, whatever role could explain why there are three kills instead of two in the case we didn't have an SK, like last time.

One-shot, ok, but do you think he was confident enough to use his action on night one? If we have a compulsive vig, why would he claim and make himself a target instead of taking out Wilhalm himself (he can kill after all) at night?

And yes, that's exactly what I'm thinking happened. I said if the town protector did NOT protect Wilhalm to figure out some way to tell us that (I'm not remotely suggesting they do so themselves), since like you say, it's probably the SK targeted him, and if Wilhalm survived that and the town protector's not responsible, it means either a blocker got lucky or Wilhalm is scum and had the scum protector on him.

Yes, if the SK targeted Wilhalm, which I doubt he did, as I explained earlier.

I still am super uneasy about his claim. It's really convenient.

I agree with you on that.

I'm wondering about it. Who do you think it could be?

I have no idea. SKs generally blend in relatively easily.

[CMP]

One-shot, ok, but do you think he was confident enough to use his action on night one? If we have a compulsive vig, why would he claim and make himself a target instead of taking out Wilhalm himself (he can kill after all) at night?

Yes, if the SK targeted Wilhalm, which I doubt he did, as I explained earlier.

I'm just listing examples of weird vigs. As to a reason why a compulsive vig wouldn't take him out, well, probably for the same reason you doubt an SK would, he'd have a chance at getting caught. And again when I say claim, I mean through word of mouth or something....in very, very few circumstances do I consider claiming in public a good idea.

I must've cut the bit where you doubt the SK targeted him out of your quote. That really just turns into a game of WIFOM between the third killer and the watcher. And, well, if the third killer isn't even willing to target him, that just makes the claim all the more convenient for Wilhalm.

Can someone verify/debunk this at some point?? I feel like I'm getting tunnel vision and I don't want to end up distracted from whatever other discussions are flying around.

[Scubacarrot]

Well.

Yeah I'm going to leave it at Well.

If we'd use common sense. Wilhalm was the obvious candidate to kill for the Serial Killer, any protective actions I doubt would have gone to Wilhalm, Wilhalm's claim was convenient already, Serial Killer wasn't worried, maybe he's not even a Serial Killer -> Wilhalm is scum? Unless he converted the Serial Killer?

Dagstyrr's kinda suspicious. Is that seriously a thing you're going after Helga for? I mean, nothing against that, I think Helga is a suspicious little boy as well, but that? At this moment I'd say Baulf is more suspicious and Helga's comment was justified two out of three times.

[WhiteFang]

Last night results, were plain chaotic, like everyone has pointed out. It's a sad day for me as well, to see my fellow friend, Gofraid depart and my communication with one ally is lesser. We will avenge you, my friend...

It is obvious that I see the missing third killer, and I suspect for some reason, this third killer did not use the night action for some unknown reasons, and if the third killer was blocked, I believe we should be seeing a successful action results based on last night description, but there aren't. So, I am not sure what must have happened last night...

Wilhalm, did you cure the SK?

I don't quite think so.

You missed the important parts of what I said. I said a compulsive vig, a one-shot vig, whatever role could explain why there are three kills instead of two in the case we didn't have an SK, like last time. Obviously if that person was not an SK and is the third killer (they'd know since they wouldn't be a normal vig or the scum killer) it would mean Wilhalm lied about his claim and he's almost sure to be scum.

This is a very imaginative tall tale.. I didn't expect to even see a compulsive vignette claim, like an one-off action? Anyone care to debunk this myth? What kind of strategy will this person be thinking to use his/her single shot at one random target? Sorry, I am not buying this. It is reckless, and for some reason, if there is truly such a role, then why did the person use it so randomly and recklessly.

[LegoDad]

Well, last night sucked. Gofraid being loyal confused me a bit. I had penciled him in leaning towards scum. Nobody can honestly say that they knew that guy was town. Sigrid, well, I had assumed quiet Town, and was right. Jarni being Town is no surprise as I had been in contact with him quite a bit. Even more unfortunate for the town, he had a role to play in our success. I'm going to hold onto information that I know for now as I would hate to divulge anything incorrectly and at possibly the wrong time. I also know who Jarni had been in a lot of contact with other than me, so I will be interested to see what he has to say today. Keep in mind, Jarni trusted him, but Jarni is also dead today.

Also, I know that Wilhalm was not protected last night, since that seems to be a hot topic of conversation right now.

I will be back in a bit, but I need to continue to help my village dig out from the recent snowstorm. I've been at it almost non-stop since yesterday morning, but will be around in a little while. I'm hoping if I do this right, they'll give me some horns for my helmet. Maybe a coat, too, this little red shirt doesn't keep out the cold very well.

[CorneliusMurdock]

Well.

That's a deep subject.

Dufa, (spellcheck hilariously wants to change your name to Sugar so don't be confused if I call you that later) I can't see how you can totally dismiss Gofraid being the vig kill. People suspected him. Only way you could be so sure is if you were one of the killers.

[CorneliusMurdock]

Wilhalm, I see no reason for you not to tell us who you targeted last night. Might help us narrow down who might be the possible SK.

Naemr, are you going to say anything today? You've been in the room at least once. What do you think of this whole thing?

[Captain Nemo]

Naemr, are you going to say anything today? You've been in the room at least once. What do you think of this whole thing?

I am; I'm just not sure of when I will say what, or if I should say it at all. I am happy to see that we only had two night kills, though we are now down three more town (Counting Sigri too). To me, Jarni seems to have been killed by the SK, while Gofraid seems to have been vig--though I'm not really sure why; he wasn't really coming off as suspicious to me, and I feel like there would have been better targets (Frainkly I'm surprised I wasn't vigged to be honest) And I and I am happy I wasn't lynched yesterday, since I got something out of the night.

Jarni being Town is no surprise as I had been in contact with him quite a bit. Even more unfortunate for the town, he had a role to play in our success. I'm going to hold onto information that I know for now as I would hate to divulge anything incorrectly and at possibly the wrong time. I also know who Jarni had been in a lot of contact with other than me, so I will be interested to see what he has to say today. Keep in mind, Jarni trusted him, but Jarni is also dead today.

It sucks to know Jarni had an abilitiy--if he was randomly killed by the SK, then it's unlikely the killer knew he had an ability; unless the killer is the other contact of his and Jarni told him--I would like to know who this contact was.

[CorneliusMurdock]

There is quite honestly no time like the present for you to contribute. There's is a lot of suspicion on you as you say and not talking won't make it go away. If you're here with us, be with us.

Is it a hunch that Jarni was killed by an SK? What makes you say that?

[fhomess]

Jarni contacted me yesterday and while I assume that Lefsi is talking about me, I don't know if that's accurate as Jarni didn't tell me if he shared with Lefsi that I was in touch with him. I did know that Jarni suspected Lefsi and was in touch with him. I was also aware of Jarni's claimed role, and knew that Lefsi was aware of it, too. The last I heard from Jarni, he was still suspicious of Lefsi even after being in discussion with him and told me Lefsi should be a prime suspect if he (Jarni) died last night. He was concerned that Lefsi was buddying up to him. I had no contact with Lefsi, and at this point, find him highly suspicious for the possible role he played in Jarni's death.

[CorneliusMurdock]

Was there a reason he claimed to either of you? I don't find either of you particularly trustworthy, what did he see in you?

[CMP]

I also know who Jarni had been in a lot of contact with other than me, so I will be interested to see what he has to say today. Keep in mind, Jarni trusted him, but Jarni is also dead today.

I did know that Jarni suspected Lefsi and was in touch with him. I was also aware of Jarni's claimed role, and knew that Lefsi was aware of it, too. The last I heard from Jarni, he was still suspicious of Lefsi even after being in discussion with him and told me Lefsi should be a prime suspect if he (Jarni) died last night.

Now we're getting somewhere. This sounds interesting. Can you grab us a quote from him saying as much, Finn?

[fhomess]

Was there a reason he claimed to either of you? I don't find either of you particularly trustworthy, what did he see in you?

There's always a reason people claim to anyone. Whether it's related to night actions, a townie read, or simply longing for a friend. I'm not sure sharing the specifics publicly at this point are really in our best interests right now given how poorly we're doing.

I have some things I want to discuss behind the scenes before I present more detail.

To Canute, here's the quote:

No time to go really in-depth on votig right now (essays to write...) but it's just you and LegoDad that know I'm the ************. You're right, if I end up dead tomorrow, he should be a prime suspect.

I'm not sure what that's going to tell you, though. It wouldn't surprise me at all if he sent the same thing to Lefsi about me.

[LegoDad]

"If I had to choose a scum team, it'd be Fugazi, def, Nemo, Palathadric and someone else (Bob?). It's implicit that I think you and fhomess are townies. I am concerned that Palathadric immediately jumped to watching/tracking Wilhalm (WhiteFang) when you said someone should confirm his claim. If I die unexpectedly, fhomess could have been taking me for a ride, so keep an eye on him."

Finn, I pretty much got the same thing. He stated more than once that he trusted us both. This was his quote from a pm. (I'm not sure how you make a pm copy/paste look good like you did it, maybe a more powerful Valhallan(mod) can help me out with that)

[CorneliusMurdock]

You hit "quote" on the one you want and then copy paste what appears in the text box here.

As I've corrected in PM, it is "reply" not "quote".