Cost of LEGO sets...

[Vee]

Dang, the weight was RIGHT THERE!

But I have a problem. I was researching this weight, API thing and found this application. I installed it for tests (in a VM) and right away found that it is a paid application, if you want to use all of its features. But it runs in a "private mode", crippled, but anyway when I select a set inside the application, there is a status bar that shows apparently the "min weight" of a set and it does not match. For the Haunted House, it shows 2230g. For 75017 it shows 342g, Sidney Opera House = 4193g, so on. No matches! Also, Brickset has no weight for the Haunted House or Sidney O.H. as easily accessible as 75017, so I am confused. The numbers don't match, what is the method being used here?

[DrJB]

Dang, the weight was RIGHT THERE!

But I have a problem. I was researching this weight, API thing and found this application. I installed it for tests (in a VM) and right away found that it is a paid application, if you want to use all of its features. But it runs in a "private mode", crippled, but anyway when I select a set inside the application, there is a status bar that shows apparently the "min weight" of a set and it does not match. For the Haunted House, it shows 2230g. For 75017 it shows 342g, Sidney Opera House = 4193g, so on. No matches! Also, Brickset has no weight for the Haunted House or Sidney O.H. as easily accessible as 75017, so I am confused. The numbers don't match, what is the method being used here?

Could it be a simple weight/mass units ... Ounces v. Grams ?

[Vee]

For these three sets:

75017 - weight 342g, pieces 391, retail $40 => 8.55 g/$

10234 - weight 4193g, pieces 2989, retail $320 => 13.1 g/$

10228 - weight 2230g, pieces 2064, retail $180 => 12.4 g/$

Number of items in the application does not match number of pieces so something is still off. Anyway we measure, 75017 _is_ above average: less plastic for each dollar spent.

Could it be a simple weight/mass units ... Ounces v. Grams ?

I don't think so. Dreadful and ugly ounces vs. beautiful and useful grams is just a matter of conversion.

[DrJB]

As some May have suggested above, perhaps a combination of weight/parts/cost in some fashion might be a better metric. Granted, some parts cost much more than others: for example, the large container from the Pick-a-Brick wall costs $16.00 and yet you can fill it with over 30 mini figs. Now, the mini figs however sell for $10 for a pack of 3. Possibly the paint job / detailing is a very expensive process.

We can go very detailed as in, develop a cost equation based on special parts ( eg PF electrical), mini figs, and remaining plastic ... Some sort of least-squares fit can be attempted, and one would be able to develop a cost estimate ... Very doable in Excel ...

[Vee]

Just to correct some information, I found that the application I mentioned (BrickStore) does not add the weight of the minifigures to the total, it does not carry them (its data comes frmo Bricklink databases it says), so the weight of 5 minifigures from 10228 and 4 minifigures for 75017 are not accounted for, which should make them more similar to 10234 that has no minifigure.

Edited December 22, 2013 by Vee

[Andy D]

... Snip

Value of a set should in my opinion still be seen as a total price. If you're willing to pay the total for the set, great, if not, then price per part never convinces me to pay it anyway.

This is how I value a set I want. Is it worth the asking price to me? Do I want the set?

I started this thread just as an exercise just for fun and to show folks that there is anoher way to break down the price of a set beside the total set cost or PPP.

I do agree that the PPP is a good way to figure what the small to large piece ratio and thus the building time/enjoyment. For me, time equals enjoyment LEGO is first about building and scond about display.

I am glad that so many have gotten involved and added so much to the discussion.

Andy D

Edited December 23, 2013 by Andy D

[L@go]

Who in this world would be fool enough to pay such a price for such a set with only common pieces except for the 2 printed tiles?

Who in this world would be fool enough to pay millions of dollars for an old stamp from the 1850s, when you could just print a copy of it on a piece of paper? It would even look brand new!

The answer is astonishingly simple: A collector :)

[Vee]

From Wikipedia:

"Collecting for most people is a choice, but for some it can be a compulsion, sharing characteristics with obsessive hoarding. When collecting is passed between generations, it might sometimes be that children have inherited symptoms of obsessive-compulsive disorder."

Extremes are 99% of the time dangerous.

[technicmad]

I guess the steps to calculate the weight of a set is to go to Rebrickable, build the set, upload the full material list to Bricklink in a temporary wanted list (usually there will be errors during the conversion Rebrickable->Bricklink that are a PITA to correct)

I try to fix conversion problems as I come across them, so please if you are getting them let me know, or post to the Rebrickable forum and we will get those parts fixed up!

[Vee]

I try to fix conversion problems as I come across them, so please if you are getting them let me know, or post to the Rebrickable forum and we will get those parts fixed up!

Set 75017 is one example. Parts 73983, 90266 and sw471/472/473/474 come up as errors. These last four (sw???) are complete minifigures. IDK if the conversion is supposed to work on minifigures. 73983 = 2429c01 @ Rebrickable: it is an assembly so maybe its two parts need to be listed separately, 90266 = 99206 @ Rebrickable.

There are a few more that I came across but I can't remember ATM. I'll let you know if I find more.

[Vee]

Since I like numbers and this idea of weight, I came up with this now:

$ grams g/$ Set 200 2873 14.4 10224 Town Hall 150 2059 13.7 10232 Palace Cinema 150 2133 14.2 10197 Fire Brigade 150 2194 14.6 10211 Grand Emporium 180 2244 12.5 10228 Haunted House 150 2151 14.3 10218 Pet Shop 150 1353 9.0 21050 Architecture Studio 140 1995 14.2 10182 Café Corner 90 1405 15.6 10190 Market Street 150 2285 15.2 10185 Green Grocery 300 4932 16.4 10198 Taj Mahal 200 5095 25.5 3450 Statue of Liberty 200 3769 18.8 10181 Eiffel Tower 320 4193 13.1 10234 Sydney O. H. 240 3828 16.0 10214 Tower Bridge 35 224 6.4 21015 Tower of Pisa

GREAT! I copied and pasted my Excel sheet here, preview showed me a beautiful formatted table, but when I saved, it was this unreadable way. Well, there is a screenshot here.

To be fair, we shoud account for inflation... The question is, inflation where? USA, Denmark, ...?

Edited December 23, 2013 by Vee

[antp]

For example the Robie House, it is NOT a parts pack - exept for dark red 1x2 plates lovers.

I bought it as a parts pack, as I needed these dark red plates for two MOCs, and I find they look nice for building/houses walls :)

[LEGO Historian]

For whatever it's worth in the greater scheme of things... all those minifigs that you folks pay $10 for (3 of)... our good Danish LEGO friend and owner Kjeld Kirk Kristiansen is RAKING IN THE KRONER... He bought out his sister's share of Kirkbi/AG (owner of TLG) back in 2007... and so owns the LEGO brand alone. In March 2013 Forbes Magazine listed him as one of the richest men in the world... at $7.3 Billion.

Keep buying those minifigs!!

Edited December 23, 2013 by LEGO Historian

[Vee]

... and so owns the LEGO brand alone. In March 2013 Forbes Magazine listed him as one of the richest men in the world... at $7.3 Billion....

I had read this news too which made me amazed! And now every time I spend a dollar in Lego plastic, I know that an unknown % of it is going to his pockets. Anyway, I think it is nice that Lego is still a business in the hands of one family. This guys surely deserves what he's got. And now I have two heroes: Bill Gates and KKK!

[Faefrost]

According to Brickset this set weighs 0.6 kg and has a retail price of $39.99 USD. That comes to $.067 per gram, which is quite a bit higher than the average Andy calculated.

Yes, that seems to be the case with all the weight information I can find. The weights given on amazon seem to be the same as those given at Brickset (but amazon rounds them up to the nearest tenth of an ounce.

To get only the weight of the pieces, you'd have to do something like you suggested earlier. Because almost every set comes in a box with an instruction book, though, it is fairly constant across all sets. It would make up a larger proportion of the weight of smaller sets.

The packaging and inclusion rate is probably fairly negligable excepting a very few specialized sets, such as Architecture or the largest of the UCS sets. The packaging and documentation will maintain a fairly constant ratio across most sets. It may increase the calculated price per gram slightly. But the increase will be consistent across the spread. So the ratios of pricing between sets will remain. Basically there is probably a fairly constant link between weight of plastic in box vs weight of the materials. As plastic goes up the manual needs more pages and more box.

[Vee]

I am using this application, Brickstore, and it provides an easy way to get the total weight of only the plastic, no paper, which I think is a lot better. All I have to do is to look at the status bar, that sums up the total weight of the set minus the figurines, and then I adjust it by adding 3.5g for each figurine since they have no weights (but are shown as part of the set). There are a few things that may be wrong, like a few parts of the figurines are maybe being counted twice, but then it is too much preciosity and I still don't know exactly some things.

I am having fun doing this for all my sets. Architecture sets seem to be the ones with the lowest ratio of grams per dollar.

[HawkLord]

Granted, I mostly collect licensed sets, but for me, I can't go by brick count or weight - there's too many other abstract variables.

[Deathleech]

As plastic goes up the manual needs more pages and more box.

Right, I think it all evens out in the end. Small sets only have 1 instruction manual with several pages while bigger sets can have 3+ instruction books.