Mr. Cube Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 Maybe they just want to sell more Hobbit sets, without canibalism effect caused by LotR? Quote
deskp Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 So Erebor will be the biggest set in wave three? That means 8-9 minifigures and the molded Smaug, right? If it's based off the last scenes we see in DoS, the minifigures are most likely going to be Thorin, blue coat Bilbo, and 6-7 other dwarves who accompanied them to the Lonely Mountain. Sounds like a super boring selection Hopefully they include some bo5a guys instead of so many old dwarves. Maybe they just want to sell more Hobbit sets, without canibalism effect caused by LotR? Thats barely possible when each theme only gets 4 sets in a year, msot themes gets like 6 or so right? Quote
Deathleech Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 (edited) I can think of a number of reasons why Lego would split the second LotR wave in half. Maybe they wanted to keep consistency with the smaller Hobbit waves? Maybe their data shows sets sell better individually when they offer them spaced out more through several waves rather than offer a ton of sets in a single wave? Maybe they wanted a Middle-Earth wave to go along with the big Hobbit finale boxed set when its released on DVD? Maybe they had Orthanc planned as the sending off set and just switched it and the third LotR wave around? Maybe Lego just wants to have two Middle-Earth waves released near the TABA film because they wanted to capitalize on it's release (one a few months before in October and one a few after in Feb-Apr)? Maybe Lego looked at their 2014 release schedule for all their themes and figured it was too crowded to give us a full 7-8 set LotR wave? There are literally dozens of possible explanations. Edited January 23, 2014 by Deathleech Quote
Mr. Cube Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 deskp: I think it doesn´t depends on the quantity of the sets, but on their atractivity. Imagine this situation: The Hobbit sets are more atractive and appealing to the customers (AFOLs, kids, movie fans, Tolkien fans), they are buying them in big amounts, and LotR sets stay on the shelves (and vice versa). If there are just Hobbit (or LotR) sets, what would you buy? Hobbit (LotR), or Chima or something? Quote
BrickBob Studpants Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 The Erebor set sounds great I have to say But going by TLG's unwritten rules, a 130$ has to feature at least 2-3 exclusive minifigs and I guess new variations don't really count So they probably merge it with Bo5A stuff, which would be a great solution (more new minifigs > strict movie accuracy) Personally, I hope 79017 is based on the Bo5A instead of Laketown, I know most of you probably prefer a 30$ battle pack over a 60$ one, but that option has more potential I think since the bigger set could give us soldiers from all factions and still feature named characters like Bolg Quote
Blazej_Holen Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 So Erebor will be the biggest set in wave three? That means 8-9 minifigures and the molded Smaug, right? If it's based off the last scenes we see in DoS, the minifigures are most likely going to be Thorin, blue coat Bilbo, and 6-7 other dwarves who accompanied them to the Lonely Mountain. There are really no other possibilities since these are the only characters we see inside Erebor. They could possibly leave Thorin or Bilbo out since we just got them in the last wave and focus on all the other dwarves, but I don't think that's very likely since they are the main characters. Lake-town sounds to be about a $50-60 set which puts it at 5 minifigures. Bain was pretty much confirmed. I could see a number of other characters taking up the other slots. We could get the rest of the dwarves here like Fili, Kili, Bofur, etc. We could also get Bard's two daughters to go with the son. Yet another possibility is Bolg, Legolas and Tauriel. Of course last but not least is Braga and Alfrid. We already pretty much know for sure the smallest $12-20 set will have Galadriel, Elrond, and the twilight Witch King. That just leaves the $30-40 set. I am hoping it's an army builder, but who knows at this point. If Bolg isn't in Lake-town, they need to still fit him in another set. We also need Dain, and preferably Beorn in bear form. That's a possible three characters that need to be covered. I am hoping Bolg is in Lake-town though and that leaves the $30 set a standard army builder like we have seen thus far. Dain, an armored dwarf, an armored elf, a Lake-town militia, and maybe two armored Gundabad Orcs would be perfect. I am not crazy about the molded creature being Beorn, but I think I would rather have him in an army builder and get him then not have him at all. If Lego doesn't do Beorn in bear form in any set I think it will be a missed opportunity. Sure you can use the City bear, but what kid wouldn't love to have a cool printed Beorn bear? We dont need to have another verson of all company of Thorin Oakenshield. Recycled 13 minifigs will be a huge waste... Main Characters are Thorin Bilbo and possibly Fili and Killi and maybe Balin. We dont need the rest, becaouse we already have them (Why create new torso prints - armour? Dwarven beards covers it anyway :D ) So If Erebor set will be the largest one, I will be disapointed because it will depict only interior which is kinda useless. What I want is big Lake Town add on not some garbage like Mines of Moria :) Quote
Preuss Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 I have to admit, Lego has made some rather odd minifigure choices with their Middle-earth sets. We've gotten (or will be getting) Mouth of Sauron, King of the Dead, Twilight Ringwraith, and pirate of Umbar, but haven't gotten Faramir, Eowyn, a normal Witchking, or old Bilbo. That's the complete opposite of what I was expecting when the line started! Not only the King of the Dead, but two other oathbreakers, all with different prints. I still don't get why they would do that for a single set and keep reusing the same mordor orc print throughout the rest of the theme! Sure they look nice, but for me this was the biggest waste of prints ever. Quote
AFOLguy1970 Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 Interesting information from London. Although it has been said that Smaug will be included with the Lonely Mountain set, I have some doubts. SPOILER alert Since these are supposed to be TABA sets, it seems like the final wave would be based on that movie. Most of us know that when Smaug left Erebor to attack Lake Town, that he will never return to Erebor. His final scenes are going to be in Lake Town. If Smaug were left out of Lake Town #2 set, then what action will we have left for the set? Another prison cell for Bard to break out of? The windlass tower would be kind of useless without something attacking the town. I think it would be cruel of Lego to force kids to buy both Erebor and Lake Town to reenact the scene we are all waiting for. Also, like others have said, if Erebor is based on the end of DOS, then it will really be a wasted opportunity with the minifigs. An Erebor based on BO5A would allow both the treasure hoard and new minifigs to be produced. Hopefully, Dain and the Iron Hills dwarves could make an appearance. As for the BOFA set, it will hopefully have army builder potential. If it had Bolg, Thranduil, Thorin, Bard, Gandalf, Bilbo, and Azog, it would be the mother of all disappointment. Ideally, it will have some more generic factions that can be purchased in mulitiples for those who desire a larger conflict. Again, I am hoping the Smaug placement was simply just to get the point across that he will appear in a set. How they could miss putting him in Lake Town against Bard and the windlass is beyond me. But then again, we did get that pirate ship.... Quote
deskp Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 (edited) Theres 11 new characters we need + smaug. Hopefully Lego manages this, along with new battle prints for Thorin Fili, kili and possibly new bilbo. that leaves us with 15. In that regard the Erebor set sounds like it could be a huge disadvantage towards that. If lego puts in too many dos dwarves, and too little new stuff. For comparison: wave 2 of hobbit gave us 14 new printed figures 13 new characters (including the statue) and they planned a 15th figure Bolg, wich got cut for obvious reasons. Wave 2 of lotr gave us 11 new printed figures 9 new characters (if you count either ganddalf the white or elrond as new) Also hobbit wave 2 had 7 new molds, wave 3 needs 7 new molds + smaug. If Lego were to follow my "math" we'd be all good in the minifig department x] (we'd only be missing 7 minor characthers, 2 soldier types and 3 trolls out of everyone) ___________ lotr wave 2 had 7 new modls including the 3 parts for the eagle. But Hobbit wave 1 had 12 new molds spread across 3 sets. (the 2 DOS sets and gollum set didn't include new molds) Lotr wave 1 had 14 new molds. Minifig distribution across sets: -Bilbo, thorin, Fili, Kili, Dain, Dwarf soldier x2, orc soldier or Azog -Bard, Bain, Alfrid, laketown guard, villager -Elf soldier x3, orc soldier x2 Bolg -Galadriel, witch king, Elrond Edited January 23, 2014 by deskp Quote
Darth Punk Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 Interesting information from London. Although it has been said that Smaug will be included with the Lonely Mountain set, I have some doubts. SPOILER alert Since these are supposed to be TABA sets, it seems like the final wave would be based on that movie. Most of us know that when Smaug left Erebor to attack Lake Town, that he will never return to Erebor. His final scenes are going to be in Lake Town. If Smaug were left out of Lake Town #2 set, then what action will we have left for the set? Another prison cell for Bard to break out of? The windlass tower would be kind of useless without something attacking the town. I think it would be cruel of Lego to force kids to buy both Erebor and Lake Town to reenact the scene we are all waiting for. Also, like others have said, if Erebor is based on the end of DOS, then it will really be a wasted opportunity with the minifigs. An Erebor based on BO5A would allow both the treasure hoard and new minifigs to be produced. Hopefully, Dain and the Iron Hills dwarves could make an appearance. As for the BOFA set, it will hopefully have army builder potential. If it had Bolg, Thranduil, Thorin, Bard, Gandalf, Bilbo, and Azog, it would be the mother of all disappointment. Ideally, it will have some more generic factions that can be purchased in mulitiples for those who desire a larger conflict. Again, I am hoping the Smaug placement was simply just to get the point across that he will appear in a set. How they could miss putting him in Lake Town against Bard and the windlass is beyond me. But then again, we did get that pirate ship.... Smaug with the lake town set makes the most sense to me too. I think the problem with the London toy fair display is for,one these sets are not finalized. And because they are not finalized they were not displayed as sets. Everything was just layed out and people made assumptions based on groupings which were not organized. Having seen a photo of the city sets its easy to understand the trouble that people might have had coming up,with sets. I imagine we are not going to know for sure until the New York show. Quote
BrickBob Studpants Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 (edited) Smaug being in the Erebor set wouldn't make much sense for a TABA set, but don't forget that TLG initially designed the sets with two movies in mind I think a Smaug related set had a pretty high priority for the design team and was thus likely among the first Hobbit sets to be designed. As I've said, a set of this magnitude needs several exclusive minifigs so they'll probably throw in some Bo5A minifigs to make it more TABA related (thus hitting two birds with one stone) It wouldn't be the first time they've merged two scenes that took place in the same location *cough* Radagast in Dol Guldur *cough* They could include some named characters here (Bolg, Dain) and let the minifig selection for the other Bo5A set consist of regular soldiers. As we've seen plenty of times, the minifigs are not unlikely to be changed/added/replaced relatively late in the production process Edited January 23, 2014 by Lego-Freak Quote
deskp Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 (edited) Smaug being in the Erebor set wouldn't make much sense for a TABA set, but don't forget that TLG initially designed the sets with two movies in mind Well, the melted gold and stuff that is said to be in the lego set was something added in the movie AFTER the trilogy split. If they designed the set when it was 2 movies the laketown set would be the set they made for smaug. Edited January 23, 2014 by deskp Quote
kevkipo Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 Does someone think we'll see Dain or/and Smaug at Nuremberg? or just the Castle Dragon replacement Quote
Darth Punk Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 Smaug being in the Erebor set wouldn't make much sense for a TABA set, but don't forget that TLG initially designed the sets with two movies in mind I think a Smaug related set had a pretty high priority for the design team and was thus likely among the first Hobbit sets to be designed. As I've said, a set of this magnitude needs several exclusive minifigs so they'll probably throw in some Bo5A minifigs to make it more TABA related (thus hitting two birds with one stone) It wouldn't be the first time they've merged two scenes that took place in the same location *cough* Radagast in Dol Guldur *cough* They could include some named characters here (Bolg, Dain) and let the minifig selection for the other Bo5A set consist of regular soldiers. As we've seen plenty of times, the minifigs are not unlikely to be changed/added/replaced relatively late in the production process But are assuming that Smaug would have been in a Erebor set before the split. It could be that TLG always planned to have Smaug in a lake town set. Unless of course you know something we don't. Quote
BrickBob Studpants Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 Yes, that's just an assumption of course I simply figured that an Erebor set without Smaug would be pretty pointless since that's what most people immediately associate with it You're right though, they also could have planned a Laketown attack set before the split occurred Quote
deskp Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 Does someone think we'll see Dain or/and Smaug at Nuremberg? or just the Castle Dragon replacement Hard to say, we've seen prototypes at new york toy fair before. so maybe nuremberg is too soon. Lego won't of had alot of time to work on smaug so I guess we won't see him, if Dain is there they proapbly won't be allowed to take photos of him, due to the fact the movie marketing has not revealed him yet. Quote
Albus Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 (edited) Maybe Smaug is in both sets? Being a moulded creature, it's not that unreasonable (since it's not like they are including the same build in two sets as if it were brick-built). And to those worrying that they won't do a new mould for Smaug because they'd only use it once... well, here they'd be using it twice! Personally, I agree that the Lake-Town set HAS to have Smaug in it. It is only the vague and contradictory reports from the Toy Fair that we are getting that are putting doubt on that idea. And Smaug is obviously very important for Erebor as well. It would be a pretty plain set if it were just the mountain/halls with the dwarven company. I do think they'll throw in some TABA elements to make it a bit more exciting, but maybe they can both feature Smaug. Does anyone have any good reason why he couldn't appear in both sets? LEGO has used the same dragon mould in two different sets from the same wave before (Castle 2007, albeit in different colours)... maybe they could have (slight DOS SPOILER here???)... a golden dragon in the Erebor set!!! Edited January 23, 2014 by Albus Quote
Blakstone Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 If LEGO was going to use the same Smaug mold for both sets, I suspect they would want different printing on each. I had been considering that possibility too but wouldn't that hurt sells of each? Us AFOLs would be impressed and buy both if we were able. But I could see kids getting the cheaper of the two sets with Smaug in it. Quote
Darth Punk Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 Yes, that's just an assumption of course I simply figured that an Erebor set without Smaug would be pretty pointless since that's what most people immediately associate with it You're right though, they also could have planned a Laketown attack set before the split occurred That was my first thought as well. But Smaug is going to be extremely popular with children who may or may not care about,Erebor. They would care more about having a dragon to battle it out with Bard and the lake town people. A lower price set with Smaug is going to sell like hot cakes. A higher priced set might be a bit much for some parents to swallow just so their children can get a dragon. Quote
Lego Spy Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 (edited) Maybe Smaug is in both sets? If LEGO was going to use the same Smaug mold for both sets, I suspect they would want different printing on each. I had been considering that possibility too but wouldn't that hurt sells of each? Us AFOLs would be impressed and buy both if we were able. But I could see kids getting the cheaper of the two sets with Smaug in it. I see the inclusion of a molded Smaug in two sets, even with different printing, very unlikely. I think each wave of any theme needs an "attractant", and including him in two sets, in my opinion, would decrease the overall draw to a less expensive set, that more people can afford. For example: (similar to what Blakstone said) If there were two sets, one around $60, and one $90 or more, which would you buy? Probably the more expensive one, and since Lego would have had to double production of the molded Smaug, the would probably end up losing money. (I hope that made some sense. ) ...witch king... Kind of a random thing to say, but when I saw the picture of the Witch King in the Lego LotR video game, and the word "Hobbiton" in the same place, the first thing that came out of my mouth was, "What is this? Lego Hobbitron?" I don't even know why. Edited January 23, 2014 by Lego Spy Quote
Sarah Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 But Lego made him in his Necromancer form so surely they could make him in his armored form. I gotta agree with Dr. Cogg, I would have MUCH prefered a Sauron over a twilight Witch King. If it was the normal black garb Witch King that might be another story, but the twilight version is just kind of "meh" in my mind. I am guessing Lego did it because the glow in the dark feature will be big with kids and he must have a big role against Elrond and Galadriel in TABA. I'm pretty excited for a Glow in the Dark figure at a low price point. Might get it for my son and grab Galadriel for myself. I LOVED the Pirate ship but haven't yet been able to justify the price Quote
Fives Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 So the Erebor set is based on the scene in the furnace room from the end of DOS... strange move by LEGO. But, it does sound like a good set, especially if its goons be over $100. Yet while it will be a cool set, it leaves a bitter taste in my mouth. Its just a shame that LEGO seems to be avoiding the exterior of Erebor. If LOTR and The Hobbit end without us having gotten the two major cities in the story (Minas Tirith and Erebor), I'll feel slightly robbed of a complete theme. Also, it seems strange that LEGO is releasing a DOS set in the TABA wave. Sure, this theme has had a particularly tough time with all the changes in the film and everything, but the DOS wave only featured DOS scenes (although, only two sets really represented anything shown on screen). But maybe this was their plan all along. They obviously wouldn't have been allowed to release any Erebor stuff for their DOS wave because they were likely under some contract to not reveal Smaug. But it still seems weird. To have an Esgaroth set obviously based on Smaug's attack, and not have Smaug in the set! That makes no sense! It'd be like making a Barad-Dur set and leaving the Eye out of the set. I really wish I could talk to the design team and find out what motivated them to make the choices they've made. Quote
Deathleech Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 (edited) I thought it was already reported that the Erebor set was the inside of the mountain and included piles of gold and the forge? That's why I guessed most of the dwarves would be in the set, they are the only ones in that scene at the end of DoS. If it were a Bo5A Erebor I figured Lego would focus more on the front gates and outside rather than the inside. In the book, only the 13 dwarves are inside Erebor during the Bo5A and they are only barricaded near the front gate for a short while before they come out and help fight the goblins. It would be weird to focus on the forge and gold if it's a Bo5A based set considering none of that will even be shown in TABA (unless PJ made some huge changes). I hope I am wrong because personally I would love to get new Bo5A characters over the dwarves, even dwarves with new prints. Maybe Erebor with a forge and gold piles was just someone's wish, not the actual set though? It's hard to keep facts and wish lists straight. I think including Smaug in Lake-town makes MUCH more sense, as others have pointed out. You get Smaug and Bard to do battle and plus Smaug will only be seen in Lake-town during TABA before he dies. This would leave the biggest Erebor set to give us more new exclusive figures for the Bo5A. Maybe it would allow Lego to include a bear form Beorn in the Erebor set too? I could see the set having Bolg, Thorin, Fili, Kili (all new prints in armor), Dain, and a few armored orcs. The last couple spots could be taken up by elf/human/dwarf soldiers, or other characters that take part in the battle like Thranduil, Gandalf, and Bilbo (really don't want anymore of those two though). This would leave the smaller $30 set to focus strictly on the soldiers and not be cluttered with unique characters. Not only the King of the Dead, but two other oathbreakers, all with different prints. I still don't get why they would do that for a single set and keep reusing the same mordor orc print throughout the rest of the theme! Sure they look nice, but for me this was the biggest waste of prints ever. They have done this a few times. The goblins in the Goblin King Battle set had three different torso prints and a two sided head yet they only have appeared in ONE set so far. Not sure what Lego's logic is there.. why do two prints for figures only in one set yet have the Mordor Orc in four sets and all share the one and only print for them? Edited January 23, 2014 by Deathleech Quote
Ridge Montante Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 (edited) Maybe they decided to make the Erebor set the inside cause otherwise it would be similar to the Dol Guldur sets with their outside structures. Edited January 23, 2014 by Ridge Montante Quote
deskp Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 (edited) Maybe they decided to make the Erebor set the inside cause otherwise it would be similar to the Dol Guldur sets with their outside structures. I think its the inside that is more similar to dol guldur. The outside of Erebor is distinct. the set is also said to incldue the throne of erebor. so its very porapbly a mixed movie set. And why not include Dain, when hes the next person to sit on it. Edited January 23, 2014 by deskp Quote
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