LEGO Ideas Discussion

[lightningtiger]

Lego wouldn't be Lego if they didn't contradict themselves !

[Xyver]

Well, I should comment on here about delays more often.

Now, I really am surprised by the result. Sure, birds was a no brainer, but Big Bang Theory? I love the show, but it definitely is not suitable for children, though the marketing this will open up for the LEGO is huge. I can just picture it, Wolowitz makes LEGO versions of everyone, and somehow manages to get the set made by LEGO. They will base a whole episode on it, I sure hope enough get made and we don't suffer the shortages like we did with Research Institute.

Apple Store was never going to happen, there is no way they'd want to alienate the Android users by forcing Apple onto them.

BTTF train I am disappointed in, that would be great, though I guess the higher price point struggled to fit the business case.

And Dr Who? still waiting? are BBC really that hard to deal with? Probably not a big seller for the kids, but the number of adults who ask for Dr Who stuff, and they amount of AFOLs that incorporate the CB sets into their displays would create demand, at least for a small batch. Maybe that's the problem, licencing fees are too high for the number of sets they think they can sell.

[SandMirror38]

Well, I should comment on here about delays more often.

Now, I really am surprised by the result. Sure, birds was a no brainer, but Big Bang Theory? I love the show, but it definitely is not suitable for children, though the marketing this will open up for the LEGO is huge. I can just picture it, Wolowitz makes LEGO versions of everyone, and somehow manages to get the set made by LEGO. They will base a whole episode on it, I sure hope enough get made and we don't suffer the shortages like we did with Research Institute.

Apple Store was never going to happen, there is no way they'd want to alienate the Android users by forcing Apple onto them.

BTTF train I am disappointed in, that would be great, though I guess the higher price point struggled to fit the business case.

And Dr Who? still waiting? are BBC really that hard to deal with? Probably not a big seller for the kids, but the number of adults who ask for Dr Who stuff, and they amount of AFOLs that incorporate the CB sets into their displays would create demand, at least for a small batch. Maybe that's the problem, licencing fees are too high for the number of sets they think they can sell.

Really? Are you trying to tell me TBBT is more of a big seller for kids then Doctor Who?

[Faefrost]

And Dr Who? still waiting? are BBC really that hard to deal with?

In a word? Yes! They are legendarily difficult for an outside partner to deal with. Particularly a non British partner. Heck have you ever wondered why Dr. Who was so difficult to find on US television in the 70's through the 90's? It wasn't lack of fan interest. It was typically one of the highest rated shows on The American PBS systems when they could get it. Based on the American ratings alone the show should not have been cancelled when it was. But the BBC isn't a business. It is a government beuracracy. They have few if any actual profit motives (being supported by British television licensing taxes) they are not subject to natural market forces, and as a result they tend to be very very bad at assigning actual reasonable value to their products or drawing reasonable return from them. They are a nightmare for outside for profit licensors to deal with. Have you ever wondered why dVD's of BBC programming cost 5x as much per minute as any other shows? This is why.

Really? Are you trying to tell me TBBT is more of a big seller for kids then Doctor Who?

Remember Ideas is designed for a one shot limited edition sets, which use very limited licensing. Dr. Who is just coming off a full blown retail license. The licensor may wish to reserve the license for a similar sized usage. Or Lego may have looked at the data from Character Builders use of the license and made the determination that there just was not enough of a market there at this time. The channel is still saturated with leftover CB product. Fans do not always equate to toy sales. Especially adult fans. Etc. there are a host of reasons that Lego may or may not got with Dr. Who.

The business case of a product is never as simple as "fans want it". And weirdly a relatively new and untried product such as BBT probably has a much simpler business case to get through than Dr. Who. For BBT the lack of pre existing data helps vs Dr. Who where they have much more to critically analyze.

At the end of the day I still suspect that any Dr. Who decision comes down to difficulties in working with the BBC. It will be interesting to see how that plays out.

[BrickG]

Well Lego is obviously throwing out the "suitable for kids" rule. Someone submit Game of Thrones Lego and lets vote it up.

[BrickBob Studpants]

@Faefrost: That sounds nightmarish, hopefully TLG will manage to arrange a deal with BBC despite that tricky situation I got into Doctor Who recently (about a month ago) and I absolutely wouldn't want to miss the chance of getting a set based on it Come on TLG and BCC, make it happen!

The approval of both the birds and the Big Bang Theory sets on the other hand took me by surprise I have to say... A LEGO set based on a sitcom? Still, color me intrigued, I can't wait to see how this one turns out despite me not being interested in the show. My disinterest pretty much stems from one reason and one reason alone: in terms of TV, there's not much I HATE more than canned laughter If your show features it, I'm out

Edited November 8, 2014 by Lego-Freak

[BirdOPrey5]

Well Lego is obviously throwing out the "suitable for kids" rule. Someone submit Game of Thrones Lego and lets vote it up.

LEGO Ideas has repeatedly rejected my set based on the TV show Pawn Stars on the History Channel. Doubt HBO series have a shot- joking or not.

[Faefrost]

Well Lego is obviously throwing out the "suitable for kids" rule. Someone submit Game of Thrones Lego and lets vote it up.

Nah. It is a matter of context and nuance. They (and most media and pop culture companies) tend to be a little more forgiving of minor adult content in comedies and particularly sitcoms. They judge dramas and more serious shows and subjects by a higher standard. This is not limited to Lego, look at when shows go into Syndication. TBBT is a great example. It is syndicated widely into prime children viewing hours around the world. As have many other shows over the years. Cheers? Fraiser? MASH? Married With Children? And of course the big one, the prime example of all The Simpsons. So why would they do a TBBT set while turning down the Serenity for being too adult and not a good brand fit? Two words. "Space Hooker".

Personally I don't think TBBT is a great choice. I suspect it is more of an experiment in fan market. (The Birds set is the safe traditional Lego type project). But TBBT still remains an interesting decision for them. One worth digging into and watching a bit.

[Blondie-Wan]

I was just reading this board yesterday and was wondering why everyone thinks the TBBT is such an unlikely set to be approved. To me it looked like potentially the most popular set of all. The birds however do come as a surprise to me, I was thinking one of the Dr. Who would get priority.

I am happy with the results so far.

I'm one of the naysayers who was sure The Big Bang Theory would never pass (which shows how much I know, obviously), and it was never an issue of the show's popularity - it had entirely to do with the show's content, which is arguably less "kid-friendly" / "family-friendly" than any other licensed theme they've done (and a few they've declined to do for themselves being insufficiently "kid-friendly", such as Firefly / Serenity). LEGO has always opted against doing various themes they consider inappropriate for kids in their core demographic (even if the sets / themes would be clearly intended for adults, and even if they would likely be popular sellers). I just would never have expected The Big Bang Theory to pass the "brand fit" portion of the review criteria. That it made it through (combined with other recent, once-unlikely licenses such as The Simpsons) strongly suggests to me that they've recently amended and relaxed their brand fit guidelines by a much greater extent than I'd ever have foreseen.

So... Wow. I'm amazed, and not just for that reason - this is also the first time they've approved multiple projects at once, as well as the first time they've approved a project by the submitter of a previous approved project, finally settling the questions of whether either of those events was a real possibility. All in all, I think this particular review result announcement really expands what's possible with the Ideas program, and that's a good thing.

Congrats to the approved projects' creators. I can't wait to see the final sets (even if I'm not much of a fan of The Big Bang Theory), as well as the decision on the Doctor Who projects (which I hope will pass at least one of them).

[Blondie-Wan]

Apple Store was never going to happen, there is no way they'd want to alienate the Android users by forcing Apple onto them.

BTTF train I am disappointed in, that would be great, though I guess the higher price point struggled to fit the business case.

I don't think alienating Android users had anything to do with the Apple Store decision. I suspect Apple simply flat-out refused. Apple really retreated from allowing any sort of licensed third-party merchandise based on their brand in the late '90s, and probably just wouldn't let LEGO do a set of one of their stores even if LEGO came to them really wanting to do it.

I'm disappointed in the rejection of the Back to the Future Jules Verne train as well, but it obviously would have been a much larger, more expensive set than any other Ideas set to date, and that probably was indeed a / the deciding factor in the decision. It's not even just a matter of the business case for the set on its own - it would have required a parts allotment that was both much larger and much more diverse than that of any other CUUSOO / Ideas set so far, meaning it would have tied up that much more production capacity than any other set in the line.

[XAxles]

Now what will Alatariel do next?

[Sven F]

I'm one of the naysayers who was sure The Big Bang Theory would never pass (which shows how much I know, obviously), and it was never an issue of the show's popularity - it had entirely to do with the show's content, which is arguably less "kid-friendly" / "family-friendly" than any other licensed theme they've done (and a few they've declined to do for themselves being insufficiently "kid-friendly", such as Firefly / Serenity). LEGO has always opted against doing various themes they consider inappropriate for kids in their core demographic (even if the sets / themes would be clearly intended for adults, and even if they would likely be popular sellers). I just would never have expected The Big Bang Theory to pass the "brand fit" portion of the review criteria. That it made it through (combined with other recent, once-unlikely licenses such as The Simpsons) strongly suggests to me that they've recently amended and relaxed their brand fit guidelines by a much greater extent than I'd ever have foreseen.

I probably have much less insight into what is "appropriate" for kids, as we don't really have too many censorships or parental guidances here in Europe, and if we do, nobody pays any attention to them unless it is clearly pornographic or extreme. It may vary (I think UK is more rigorous with it), but you can basically show Pulp Fiction to a 6-year old, and in the worst case would get frowned upon from a sensitive parent. So when you say Big Bang Theory contains adult content, I have to really struggle to see what could even remotely be an issue. I suppose sex talk and references?

[Dorayaki]

as well as the decision on the Doctor Who projects (which I hope will pass at least one of them).

I'd like to see either two or none in this case, not one. For zero, the whole Doctor Who fever was purposely initiated by team Ideas so I think a zero can be a good warning to both FOLs and Ideas (sorry DW fans). Two is also a good number since GB was a literal "competition" instead of considering making two projects at once, which also displeased me. Edited November 8, 2014 by Dorayaki

[jonwil]

I probably have much less insight into what is "appropriate" for kids, as we don't really have too many censorships or parental guidances here in Europe

I dont know about most of Europe but the German Index (which lists materials deemed harmful to children and restricts those materials) certainly counts (it has resulted in a number of video games being banned from Germany or heavily censored, either for the German release only or more generally)

[Super Goblin]

I just hope we get multiple super hero torso's for Sheldon.

[Faefrost]

I'd like to see either two or none in this case, not one. For zero, the whole Doctor Who fever was purposely initiated by team Ideas so I think a zero can be a good warning to both FOLs and Ideas (sorry DW fans). Two is also a good number since GB was a literal "competition" instead of considering making two projects at once, which also displeased me.

They have said that when 2 extremely similar projects end up in the same review they will not make both. It came out of the GB mess. Figure it might also apply to the Wayne Manor and X Mansion. While not the same they are similar enough that they will likely only make one or the other.

[jonwil]

They have said that when 2 extremely similar projects end up in the same review they will not make both. It came out of the GB mess. Figure it might also apply to the Wayne Manor and X Mansion. While not the same they are similar enough that they will likely only make one or the other.

I suspect they will make neither of those 2 because they already have a big D2C DC set (Tumbler) and rumors say they are going to release a Marvel D2C set soon. Plus those sets (like the Jules Verne Train) are likely too big for an Ideas set.

[tomdobs55]

Here's my conspiracy theory, they announced two for this review because everything in the next review is too big for an Ideas set.

[greenalfonzo]

@Faefrost: That sounds nightmarish, hopefully TLG will manage to arrange a deal with BBC despite that tricky situation I got into Doctor Who recently (about a month ago) and I absolutely wouldn't want to miss the chance of getting a set based on it Come on TLG and BCC, make it happen!

The approval of both the birds and the Big Bang Theory sets on the other hand took me by surprise I have to say... A LEGO set based on a sitcom? Still, color me intrigued, I can't wait to see how this one turns out despite me not being interested in the show. My disinterest pretty much stems from one reason and one reason alone: in terms of TV, there's not much I HATE more than canned laughter If your show features it, I'm out

The Big Bang Theory uses a live studio audience. I know, because I once got lucky and got tickets to a filming!

[Aanchir]

I probably have much less insight into what is "appropriate" for kids, as we don't really have too many censorships or parental guidances here in Europe, and if we do, nobody pays any attention to them unless it is clearly pornographic or extreme. It may vary (I think UK is more rigorous with it), but you can basically show Pulp Fiction to a 6-year old, and in the worst case would get frowned upon from a sensitive parent. So when you say Big Bang Theory contains adult content, I have to really struggle to see what could even remotely be an issue. I suppose sex talk and references?

Generally, yeah. That's also something I've tried to explain to other people — that kind of thing is not considered nearly as inappropriate in all cultures as it is in the United States.

I really like The Big Bang Theory. It's not something I watch religiously, but I enjoy it and find it funny when my parents have it on. I think the idea that it's "picking on" nerds and it's supposed to make non-nerdy viewers feel like they're better than the characters on the show is a little bit overblown. I find a lot of the jokes funny in part because as a socially awkward nerd, I identify with and relate to the cast, and I'm not above a little bit of self-deprecating humor. There's nothing wrong with laughing at oneself, so why should I feel like I'm being picked on or bullied when a character like me is the butt of a joke? I'd wager I'm hardly the only person who feels this way, because I've encountered plenty of other people who like the show because they consider themselves nerdy and identify with the characters on that level. You can't complain that the show talks down to nerds and then insinuate that actual nerds and intellectuals who enjoy the show are too woefully oblivious to realize when they're the butt of a joke.

Besides, in the episodes I've seen, the show's less nerdy characters like Penny are just as often the butt of jokes as its nerdier characters. A lot of the criticisms I've seen of the show seem to think that Penny is supposed to be the "normal" character that the audience relates to. And that's a gross oversimplification. She's not defined by her normalcy, but rather by her mediocrity. She has spent her life bouncing between dead-end jobs and dead-end relationships, and in most situations where the main cast is all together, she's the real oddball among them. The rest of the characters regularly have to dumb things down for her, and you'll hear the same laugh track for every one of her faux pas as for those of Leonard, Sheldon, Howard, or Raj. So how is it that so many viewers seem to think that the show singularly targets only people with nerdy interests with its usual biting wit?

The show does better than a lot of sitcoms in actually not only making nerds the main characters (rather than some social pariah the main character is forced to interact with), but showing that there are many kinds of nerd instead of just rolling up as many nerdy stereotypes as it can and piling them all on one character. And it has a lot of good character development, rather than just relying on a consistent status quo like many of the sitcoms I grew up with.

I am, of course, surprised it passed review. I would have thought its humor would have been considered far too adult. But I think a lot of the people who think the show is discriminating against people with nerdy interests really need to get it into their heads that nerdy is rapidly becoming the new normal, and the show reflects that. That doesn't mean that any of the characters, no matter what their interests or social status, deserve some kind of special protection from its particular brand of humor. Now, I've heard allegations of other kinds of discrimination (homophobia, sexism, etc). that might deserve a little bit more criticism, because those are discrimination against groups that have genuinely faced decades if not centuries of systematic discrimination. But I have been lucky enough not to encounter that kind of nastiness in any of the episodes I've seen, so hopefully that might mean the show has grown past those kinds of mistakes.

[Artanis I]

Well I wasn't surprised when the birds were announced, and I'm happy with that. Not something I want, but it's nice. I'd buy it.

I was definitely surprised when Big Bang passed, for reasons already brought up. I don't know why people find it funny, I don't. But then most American (and other) sitcoms use that formula of person A says something stupid followed by person B points out that it was stupid. (And that, apparently, is "a joke".) I will reserve judgement on the set until we see what bits it comes with.

Not surprised that Doctor Who is still under review. Hope something good comes of it.

Not surprised that the others failed. They either didn't look good or were too big to be viable.

The next review period is probably going to be fruitless (they're all too big), but maybe Doctor Who isn't being rushed through so that it can be the passing project next time. (In addition to the whole BBC thing, and solving the 2 project problem.)

Imagine the confusion between LEGO Friends and LEGO Friends

Edited November 10, 2014 by Artanis I

[Dorayaki]

Not surprised that the others failed. They either didn't look good or were too big to be viable.

Not agree with that, of course I mean the train. We don't know what's the specific reason but I believe it was not an obvious choice of rejection in previous predictions.

I'm disappointed in the rejection of the Back to the Future Jules Verne train as well, but it obviously would have been a much larger, more expensive set than any other Ideas set to date, and that probably was indeed a / the deciding factor in the decision.

There are some other popular train projects that could hit the number in the future, so I wonder if train is the only reason for rejection as you mean. I think this may boost the other BTTF train project. Also, if it's rejected for its size, those mansions in next reviews would have no hopes. I think the scale of product could have been a codified rule or hint.

The other theory is that BTTF isn't as popular as LEGO thought so they won't make other BTTF cars too....?

They have said that when 2 extremely similar projects end up in the same review they will not make both. It came out of the GB mess. Figure it might also apply to the Wayne Manor and X Mansion. While not the same they are similar enough that they will likely only make one or the other.

Both GB project featured the vehicle and the main team, so there are some similiarities despite the office was totally neglected. Now yeah, the two projects both feature box though the included characters can be different, I don't think LEGO would make two versions of the box.

The mansions are just different and were made by the same person, so I absolutely believe that he doesn't want his own ideas become a competition. It's almost like early "each review cycle only decide one project" saying. I only think the license is the major concern in this case.

Edited November 10, 2014 by Dorayaki

[Sarah]

@Faefrost: That sounds nightmarish, hopefully TLG will manage to arrange a deal with BBC despite that tricky situation I got into Doctor Who recently (about a month ago) and I absolutely wouldn't want to miss the chance of getting a set based on it Come on TLG and BCC, make it happen!

The approval of both the birds and the Big Bang Theory sets on the other hand took me by surprise I have to say... A LEGO set based on a sitcom? Still, color me intrigued, I can't wait to see how this one turns out despite me not being interested in the show. My disinterest pretty much stems from one reason and one reason alone: in terms of TV, there's not much I HATE more than canned laughter If your show features it, I'm out

The one thing about the Big Bang Theory set that is perhaps interesting to me, who knows NOTHING about the licensing. I've never seen the show and haven't heard enough to know anything about it.

BUT!

1) Lots of minifigs

2) telescope

3) Whiteboard

4) Globe

5) Lots of other doodads in an interesting living room setup

My favorite Birds project made it, I have room to be charitable with the other set that made it :)

Edited November 10, 2014 by Sarah

[Artanis I]

Not agree with that, of course I mean the train. We don't know what's the specific reason but I believe it was not an obvious choice of rejection in previous predictions.

There are some other popular train projects that could hit the number in the future, so I wonder if train is the only reason for rejection as you mean. I think this may boost the other BTTF train project. Also, if it's rejected for its size, those mansions in next reviews would have no hopes. I think the scale of product could have been a codified rule or hint.

The other theory is that BTTF isn't as popular as LEGO thought so they won't make other BTTF cars too....?

In addition to any other reason you can come up with, the train was too big for an Ideas set.

[Faefrost]

I sat and thought through the TBBT set a little more, and I think I have worked out why it surprised us and passed. What the key benefit to the set is. It's synergistic marketing. Perfect product placement. BBT's use of Lego sets and the concept of AFOL's in the show is much to good an opportunity for Lego not to feed it a bit if you will. Creating a Lego set about the show, that shows off Lego fans and normalizes the product as a somewhat nerdy but acceptable hobby is better than any ad campaign they could ever dream up. By making the set they both draw attention to the show and themselves gain more attention from the show. It is unbelievably cost effective mass marketing, and extremely effective on many levels. And even better, the fans asked for it.

Heck part of the reason for them springing for 2 sets in one review / manufacturing period could be that they are quietly getting the Marketing department to kick in. It will not even matter how the set sells. It makes up its costs in other ways. From a business sense it is strikingly brilliant, and my hat is off to them.